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View Full Version : Kushnapup Poll, or "what did you expect"


daveinwoodland
02-10-2012, 7:49 AM
I'm curious how many others have invested their money into what so far is a non existent product that gives more promises then a politician.

If you've been tracking the issue their number of "sold" units has been pretty much unchanged over time from "997" which is three less then the "when we hit 1000 we're shipping" statement.

I guess for those of us that invested our 200.00 we helped someone possibly keep a job for awhile.

They do answer their emails though as I have sent many but get the same answer "Any day now" thanks for being patient.

Mesa Tactical
02-10-2012, 8:31 AM
As someone who started a business myself, I'd like to suggest that collecting money in advance from customers is a poor, even dodgy, way to bootstrap a manufacturing company. I'd advise everyone against falling for this pitch in the future. Legitimate entrepreneurs don't fund themselves that way, and here is why:

When planning a business, best practice is to take your carefully calculated start-up budget and DOUBLE it. That is, it will cost you twice as much (at least) to get the business off the ground as you think. So neophyte entrepreneurs (such as myself, once upon a time) will almost invariably underestimate the required cash flow for the business and will run out of money. This is the number one reason new businesses fail. Many of them might have been viable businesses with good products and great owners/managers, but they run out of money before the business is self-sustaining.

If you are collecting your start-up funds from customers based on your careful planning calculations, you will run out of money before your product comes to market, or soon after. All your customers will lose their money and will be very unhappy with you.

A traditional business has investors. Hopefully these investors know the risks, but if your business fails only your investors will be unhappy with you instead of hundreds or thousands of strangers whose money you accepted.*

Anyway, I'm not referring specifically to Kushnapup. I don't know much about this guy and for all I know his product might be the best thing since sliced bread. I doubt he was entirely funded by advance orders since according to the Utah Secretary of State website they seemed to have gotten a bank loan as well. He is clearly having teething pains with the new products and believe me I know how that goes.

But I see a lot of this in the gun industry, where firms or individuals accept advance orders to help get a new idea off the ground. Just don't do it when you see that. It is rarely the way legitimate manufacturers work, and as I pointed out above even 100% straight-arrow guys will usually still fail with this approach. Bjorn might be a 100% straight-arrow guy who chose the wrong financing model to get his product to market.

Or not. You might yet see your Kushnapups, and they might well be awesome.




* Something I wish more people understood about the nature of a start-up business, especially when they are *****ing over the phone at a manufacturer about his prices or how he's not making something they think the company ought to be making: a legitimate manufacturer puts his nuts out on the line when he starts a new business or a new product line. He finances the development, buys all the tooling (which with injection molded plastic is incredibly expensive), orders a big initial inventory of products in the hope that someone buys the stuff. He spends all this money, sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars, before seeing dollar one in return. There are no guarantees, except for big Wall Street banks. No one else is risking anything in the bet, just the manufacturer.

m16
02-10-2012, 6:25 PM
Never even heard of it until just now.

Looks like a neat design, minus the 1911 trigger.

I don't understand the fascination with bullpups, but it looks cool.

daveinwoodland
02-11-2012, 7:13 AM
As someone who started a business myself, I'd like to suggest that collecting money in advance from customers is a poor, even dodgy, way to bootstrap a manufacturing company. I'd advise everyone against falling for this pitch in the future. Legitimate entrepreneurs don't fund themselves that way, and here is why:

When planning a business, best practice is to take your carefully calculated start-up budget and DOUBLE it. That is, it will cost you twice as much (at least) to get the business off the ground as you think. So neophyte entrepreneurs (such as myself, once upon a time) will almost invariably underestimate the required cash flow for the business and will run out of money. This is the number one reason new businesses fail. Many of them might have been viable businesses with good products and great owners/managers, but they run out of money before the business is self-sustaining.

If you are collecting your start-up funds from customers based on your careful planning calculations, you will run out of money before your product comes to market, or soon after. All your customers will lose their money and will be very unhappy with you.

A traditional business has investors. Hopefully these investors know the risks, but if your business fails only your investors will be unhappy with you instead of hundreds or thousands of strangers whose money you accepted.*

Anyway, I'm not referring specifically to Kushnapup. I don't know much about this guy and for all I know his product might be the best thing since sliced bread. I doubt he was entirely funded by advance orders since according to the Utah Secretary of State website they seemed to have gotten a bank loan as well. He is clearly having teething pains with the new products and believe me I know how that goes.

But I see a lot of this in the gun industry, where firms or individuals accept advance orders to help get a new idea off the ground. Just don't do it when you see that. It is rarely the way legitimate manufacturers work, and as I pointed out above even 100% straight-arrow guys will usually still fail with this approach. Bjorn might be a 100% straight-arrow guy who chose the wrong financing model to get his product to market.

Or not. You might yet see your Kushnapups, and they might well be awesome.




* Something I wish more people understood about the nature of a start-up business, especially when they are *****ing over the phone at a manufacturer about his prices or how he's not making something they think the company ought to be making: a legitimate manufacturer puts his nuts out on the line when he starts a new business or a new product line. He finances the development, buys all the tooling (which with injection molded plastic is incredibly expensive), orders a big initial inventory of products in the hope that someone buys the stuff. He spends all this money, sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars, before seeing dollar one in return. There are no guarantees, except for big Wall Street banks. No one else is risking anything in the bet, just the manufacturer.
All great points.