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6172crew
03-28-2007, 10:41 AM
Ive been looking for a new scope to go on top of a SPR Im planning on building and I see the military uses a Leupold Mark4 which is about twice what I have to spend so I started digging around and have come up with other scopes that dont break the bank but I havent seen them yet so I thought Id start a thread.

The AR15 platform works well for just about any range so varible powered scopes seem to be the way to go but they have the CQB 1-5 and the 2-7 or you can move into the middle range stuff which is 3-9 or 4-14, I noticed the military likes the 3-9 tp 10 power so that was the way I was leaning, I want to punch paper but Im really looking into a rifle that will also work well on varmint so that kinda backed up the higher powered glass like the 3-9s or so.

Now the price seems to set the whole thing so I thought $400 bucks would be my goal and in that range Ive found some scopes that might not win in the internet tacticool contest but might still do the job well and I wouldnt be looking to upgrade as soon as I had the thing mounted.

I have a Leupold scout scope already and the glass is clean and is really bright and crystal clear (as far as my eyes can tell). I looked through a Jeff Cooper Steyr Scout and had to have one so it was mounted on a M1A scout and now my R22 so I do like the "Leupys" and so you will see those alot in my selection, I also have Super Snipers which are ok but a fixed powered scope isnt what I need and the glass is fuzzy which Im trying to stay away from. Ive looked throught the Bushnell Elites and they are a bit more clear and have a great price so I migth even look into them.

Anyhow here is my list (well kinda)...

Leupold VX1-3's the VX1 doesnt have click type adjustments and are built on a 1 inch tube like the bushnells but the price is right I just dont know if they are as clear and as eye relief friendly as my other leupold. The VX2 series looks like the VX1 but has the click type adjustments and then the VX3s are the 30mm setups and look nice but are pushing my $400 goal. It seems that if you want target knobs or a lit reticle then you have to double your price which is why Ive stayed away from anything in the miltary section as far as leupold has to offer.

I really like the long range reticle one the VX2 3-9x40 http://www.swfa.com/pc-6212-86-leupold-3-9x40-vx-ii-riflescope.aspx but I havent been able to look through one yet. The price is right and after I buy a one piece mount from armalite or whatever I think it would do its job well but I dont want to be short sighted (no pun) and over look other scopes that might spank this one for that amount of $$$ or in the same price range as my budget.:)

The

maxicon
03-28-2007, 2:44 PM
I have a few VX1 and Vari-X II (friction adjust like the VX1), and they're fine on brightness and eye relief. I've never had any issues with the Leupold friction adjusts shifting or moving unevenly. The clicks will be good if you're going to using them for adjustments while shooting, but you'd probably want target turrets for that, and you're back into bigger $$.

The VX2 used to have a better coating than the VX1, but I think they may have upgraded the VX1 - have to check with Leupold on that.

There's a couple of nice deals on Nikon Monarchs over at www.samplelist.com that are right around your limit, and the Monarchs are great scopes too:
Nikon Monarch UCC 3.5-10x50 - Item 6974, model 6604, Matte finish, Illuminated Mil-Dot reticle, 1" tube, fast focus eye piece, light ring marks - $400

chickenfried
03-28-2007, 2:52 PM
Also a lot of the monarchs are on sale on their main site
http://www.swfa.com/c-218-nikon-monarch-ucc-riflescopes.aspx

There's a couple of nice deals on Nikon Monarchs over at www.samplelist.com that are right around your limit, and the Monarchs are great scopes too:
Nikon Monarch UCC 3.5-10x50 - Item 6974, model 6604, Matte finish, Illuminated Mil-Dot reticle, 1" tube, fast focus eye piece, light ring marks - $400

Prospector
03-28-2007, 3:01 PM
Also a lot of the monarchs are on sale on their main site
http://www.swfa.com/c-218-nikon-monarch-ucc-riflescopes.aspx

or this

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=937299

chickenfried
03-28-2007, 3:03 PM
$11 cheaper at the SWFA sale plus you get a free lens pen.:p :p or this

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=937299

6172crew
03-28-2007, 4:25 PM
Would you guys put the Nikon and Leupold on the same playing field as far as quality, warranty, etc?

chickenfried
03-28-2007, 4:35 PM
I'm far from an optics expert. But I recently made a scope purchase and sorted through a lot of threads on the subject. Most agreed that the Leupold lifetime warranty and customer service was better than Nikon's. But the quality of the monarchs was better than the vx-1 and vx-ii lines.

Would you guys put the Nikon and Leupold on the same playing field as far as quality, warranty, etc?

damon1272
03-28-2007, 5:40 PM
I own both Nikon and leupold scopes and I like the Nikon much better. In fact the scope I just ordered for my next varmint is a Nikon 6.5x20 ill mil dot scope. Most scopes are fine for what most people use them for but when you spend literally days looking through a scope you need something with good glass. Spend your money wisly. Leupold makes a good scope I just prefer the Nikon.

6172crew
03-29-2007, 9:14 AM
Hate to do this but I just found a Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 for $400, would that baby do anything to sway the folks pointing towards the Nikon line?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&kw=ZE39X40ZPM&is=USA&Q=&O=productlist&sku=217802

chickenfried
03-29-2007, 9:22 AM
That's what I ended up ordering for a hunting rifle. I didn't find anyone unhappy with their zeiss. The happy owners, the little bit of extra eye relief, and being made in the USA swayed my purchase. Many stores have it for $400 with free shipping. After I get it mounted. We could meet at a range for you to check it out.

Hate to do this but I just found a Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 for $400, would that baby do anything to sway the folks pointing towards the Nikon line?
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&kw=ZE39X40ZPM&is=USA&Q=&O=productlist&sku=217802

50 Freak
03-29-2007, 10:07 AM
Personally I like the shorter scopes for the AR rifles.

I really like the IOR Valdada 2x12x32. Valdada's have freaking clear optics and reticles etched on the glass.

I'd put them superior to the Leupolds, but Leupold does have a better warrantee.

Only downside of Valdadas is the price (they used to be a lot cheaper) and the heavy weight.

6172crew
03-29-2007, 11:18 AM
Personally I like the shorter scopes for the AR rifles.

I really like the IOR Valdada 2x12x32. Valdada's have freaking clear optics and reticles etched on the glass.

I'd put them superior to the Leupolds, but Leupold does have a better warrantee.

Only downside of Valdadas is the price (they used to be a lot cheaper) and the heavy weight.


I looked through a few Valdadas and thought they looked kinda fuzzy, almost like the Super Sniper line. They look bullet proof but not as clean as my leupold m8 eer scout scope....but thats really all i have as far as clear glass to compare with.

50 Freak
03-29-2007, 5:02 PM
Wow...that's the first I've heard "fuzzy" and IOR in the same sentence.

IOR's glass is made by Schotts which is considered some of the finest glass makers in the world. Then they go through the same coating as Zeiss does on their scopes....Again another top dollar company.

I would compare the IOR's glass to the Leupold anyday. I'd say they are on par with the Nightforce.

6172crew
03-29-2007, 7:40 PM
Wow...that's the first I've heard "fuzzy" and IOR in the same sentence.

IOR's glass is made by Schotts which is considered some of the finest glass makers in the world. Then they go through the same coating as Zeiss does on their scopes....Again another top dollar company.

I would compare the IOR's glass to the Leupold anyday. I'd say they are on par with the Nightforce.

The Nightforces Ive looked through have been nice but around the edges they had a kinda unusable area which I thought weird but after reading snipers hide for the last couple years I think even the most expensive scope arent perfect. The IORs I looked through were at a gun show and I was looking through all kinds of stuff and just didnt think it was that great, maybe cloudy was a better word...like the super sniper.

Jicko
03-31-2007, 10:29 PM
Try the Leupold Mark 4 PR 3-9x40mm Mil-dot. It is mid $400. It is a Leupold, it is a 3-9, it is a mil-dot, and you get target knobs too (all these are just like the Mk4 MR/T 3-9 that is on the real SPRs); the only thing you don't get is the 30mm tube, and the target knobs are not as nice. I've this scope, and I liked it.

Leupold seems to be coming out with a new line - Tactical Mark 2, and it may be replacing the Mark 4 PR line. Price-wise, it is similar to the Mark 4 PR line.

My work in progress SPR, w/ the Leupold Mark 4 PR 3-9x40mm on it.

http://images21.fotki.com/v758/photos/2/26966/4762546/IMG_9870-vi.jpg

Ive been looking for a new scope to go on top of a SPR Im planning on building and I see the military uses a Leupold Mark4 which is about twice what I have to spend so I started digging around and have come up with other scopes that dont break the bank but I havent seen them yet so I thought Id start a thread.

The AR15 platform works well for just about any range so varible powered scopes seem to be the way to go but they have the CQB 1-5 and the 2-7 or you can move into the middle range stuff which is 3-9 or 4-14, I noticed the military likes the 3-9 tp 10 power so that was the way I was leaning, I want to punch paper but Im really looking into a rifle that will also work well on varmint so that kinda backed up the higher powered glass like the 3-9s or so.

Now the price seems to set the whole thing so I thought $400 bucks would be my goal and in that range Ive found some scopes that might not win in the internet tacticool contest but might still do the job well and I wouldnt be looking to upgrade as soon as I had the thing mounted.

I have a Leupold scout scope already and the glass is clean and is really bright and crystal clear (as far as my eyes can tell). I looked through a Jeff Cooper Steyr Scout and had to have one so it was mounted on a M1A scout and now my R22 so I do like the "Leupys" and so you will see those alot in my selection, I also have Super Snipers which are ok but a fixed powered scope isnt what I need and the glass is fuzzy which Im trying to stay away from. Ive looked throught the Bushnell Elites and they are a bit more clear and have a great price so I migth even look into them.

Anyhow here is my list (well kinda)...

Leupold VX1-3's the VX1 doesnt have click type adjustments and are built on a 1 inch tube like the bushnells but the price is right I just dont know if they are as clear and as eye relief friendly as my other leupold. The VX2 series looks like the VX1 but has the click type adjustments and then the VX3s are the 30mm setups and look nice but are pushing my $400 goal. It seems that if you want target knobs or a lit reticle then you have to double your price which is why Ive stayed away from anything in the miltary section as far as leupold has to offer.

I really like the long range reticle one the VX2 3-9x40 http://www.swfa.com/pc-6212-86-leupold-3-9x40-vx-ii-riflescope.aspx but I havent been able to look through one yet. The price is right and after I buy a one piece mount from armalite or whatever I think it would do its job well but I dont want to be short sighted (no pun) and over look other scopes that might spank this one for that amount of $$$ or in the same price range as my budget.:)

The

6172crew
04-01-2007, 8:15 AM
Could I get a link to that scope? I dont see a PR in 3-9x40?:confused:

Jicko
04-01-2007, 3:45 PM
Could I get a link to that scope? I dont see a PR in 3-9x40?:confused:

I briefly searched w/ google:
http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-mark-4-3-9x40mm-pr-rifle-scope.html

Leupold '07 Mark 2 line is coming out, I have seen that their brand new Tactical Mark 2 3-9x40 Mil-dot w/ T2-knob(very cool, looks like M1 knob) is priced @ $499.

6172crew
04-03-2007, 5:10 PM
Without trying to beat the dead horse, I just havr to ask whats the dif between the Mark4 and Mark2? I didnt see any info on the website but I sure like the price.

I will probably just save my dough and buy the Mark2 or even the PR you showed me, thanks JR!:)

Jicko
04-03-2007, 5:23 PM
Mark 2 is a brand new thing..... Leupold Tactical's webstie is being updated w/ an estimated launch date of Apr 12. So, stay tuned.... I bet you will see more info there by then.

I personally think that they are just gonna discontinue their Mark 4 PR line, and call a lower cost Tactical line of scopes Mark 2. And save the Mark 4 name for their higher $$ scopes....

Personally, there are a couple features I seriously want on my scopes:
1) good glass (I am totally satisfied with my Leupold)
2) mil-dot (so that i can hold over etc.... mil-dots are just GREAT to use... once u know how...)
3) target knobs (so that you can dial in drops etc...) with 1/2 or 1/4 MOA clicks (I don't like the ones that only have 1 MOA clicks....)

Then some tacticool features that I can skip are:
1) 30mm tube (I don't think I'll be banging my scope in the jungle etc...)
2) illumination (I don't think I will be shooting in the dark)


Without trying to beat the dead horse, I just havr to ask whats the dif between the Mark4 and Mark2? I didnt see any info on the website but I sure like the price.

I will probably just save my dough and buy the Mark2 or even the PR you showed me, thanks JR!:)