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View Full Version : BudsGunShop refuses to ship Saiga to CA???


68Datsun510
12-20-2011, 1:44 PM
The saiga rifles meet every requirement for CA, yet some places refuse to send them here, and the CA DOJ refuses to admit they are legal, or so i read...

Whats up with that???

Merc1138
12-20-2011, 1:47 PM
Find another place to buy them, Bud's isn't the only place that stocks them.

zfields
12-20-2011, 1:48 PM
check out arms of america. Great company.

68Datsun510
12-20-2011, 2:00 PM
Buds has the awesome layaway deal... =(

hondamanr
12-20-2011, 2:03 PM
FYI guys, all CA FFLs now collect tax on out of state transfers (unless a private party sale) so it is almost never better to buy a gun out of state if it is available locally.

zfields
12-20-2011, 2:04 PM
When I got mine, they let me pay it off in 45 days. Not exactly lay away, but not exactly an expensive gun either.

Press Check
12-20-2011, 2:10 PM
FYI guys, all CA FFLs now collect tax on out of state transfers (unless a private party sale) so it is almost never better to buy a gun out of state if it is available locally.

+1.

Interstate tax, and the transfer fee to receive the firearm.

jben
12-20-2011, 2:19 PM
Give Atlantic Firearms a try. They offer Calguns discounts.

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/

shortround1
12-20-2011, 2:30 PM
They maybe see appendix "C" on the ban list: Kalashnikov USA: hunter rifle/Saiga.

zfields
12-20-2011, 2:36 PM
They maybe see appendix "C" on the ban list: Kalashnikov USA: hunter rifle/Saiga.

And they should also know that they are not imported by "Kalashnikov USA"

chead
12-20-2011, 2:38 PM
Give Atlantic Firearms a try. They offer Calguns discounts.

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/

How do you take advantage of the discount?

shortround1
12-20-2011, 2:41 PM
And they should also know that they are not imported by "Kalashnikov USA"

Simply seeing the Saiga name on the list may scare off some vendors.

CSACANNONEER
12-20-2011, 2:57 PM
It is their RIGHT to run their bussiness as they see fit. I love the fact that they have that right and use it even if I don't agree with their bussiness decisions. Just find a vendor who wants to do bussiness with you and don't worry about those who don't.

triggs75
12-20-2011, 3:02 PM
The saiga rifles meet every requirement for CA, yet some places refuse to send them here, and the CA DOJ refuses to admit they are legal, or so i read...

Whats up with that???

Nothing new, I will not purchase anything from them.

mnguyen84
12-20-2011, 3:04 PM
no they dont. they can, but not all do.

FYI guys, all CA FFLs now collect tax on out of state transfers (unless a private party sale) so it is almost never better to buy a gun out of state if it is available locally.

bwiese
12-20-2011, 3:23 PM
no they dont. they can, but not all do.

They will. If they're not they're stupid and are gonna be owing a huge back-tax payment to Board of Equalization

jben
12-20-2011, 3:23 PM
How do you take advantage of the discount?

As far as I know, when you email them to inquire about availability, let them know you are a member and give them your username.

I don't think I've ever used the discount, but they are members here and have posted about it in more than a few threads.

I have bought a few Saigas from them in the past. Everything was good to go.

HK Dave
12-20-2011, 4:48 PM
They will. If they're not they're stupid and are gonna be owing a huge back-tax payment to Board of Equalization

From the gun shop owners I've spoken to, it seems the letter they received requiring the collection of tax was vague and didn't seem too official. I truly hope Uncle Sam doesn't actually try to collect.

ZX-10R
12-20-2011, 6:22 PM
It is there RIGHT to run their bussiness as they see fit. I love the fact that they have that right and use it even if I don't agree with their bussiness decisions. Just find a vendor who wants to do bussiness with you and don't worry about those who don't.

Winner.

We have this same thread going on and yeah we blame YOU Californians...Start voting right and maybe you will have REAL change one day.

defcon
12-20-2011, 6:28 PM
i got mine from Carolina Shooters Supply

http://store.carolinashooterssupply.com/servlet/StoreFront

they will ship to a CA FFL.

my transfer went through Michael at EBR Works in Thousand Oaks. EBR works also sells Saiga 12's himself. Check if he has any in stock.

visit saiga-12.com and look at the vendors

Retzius
12-20-2011, 6:39 PM
Just go to Riflegear and buy one.

fendter
12-20-2011, 6:49 PM
Parallax Tactical in San Diego sells them for $399 (.223, 7.62, 5.45) Great service and they give cash discounts. Support you local Ffl

aghauler
12-20-2011, 7:11 PM
Parallax Tactical in San Diego sells them for $399 (.223, 7.62, 5.45) Great service and they give cash discounts. Support you local Ffl

What about J&G Sales in Prescott, AZ? Their recent flyer has them in it.

Merc1138
12-20-2011, 7:17 PM
What about J&G Sales in Prescott, AZ? Their recent flyer has them in it.

Unless you live in AZ, you'd still have to get it transferred through an FFL here(paying FFL fees) and pay sales tax anyway. Considering that saigas are available just about everywhere for a decent price, there's no point in buying one online.

arsilva32
12-20-2011, 8:39 PM
Winner.

We have this same thread going on and yeah we blame YOU Californians...Start voting right and maybe you will have REAL change one day.





we did vote right! its the influx of lame treehuggers and liberals that came in the last 10 or 15 years that didn't

tuna quesadilla
12-20-2011, 8:55 PM
FYI, Bud's clearly states on their website that they do not ship semi-autos to California...

luckystrike
12-20-2011, 10:06 PM
It is there RIGHT to run their bussiness as they see fit. I love the fact that they have that right and use it even if I don't agree with their bussiness decisions. Just find a vendor who wants to do bussiness with you and don't worry about those who don't.

Lulz. So why hate on arsenal so much? Atlantic gave me a rude response, buds is the same way, same with 1 million other gun mfgs and shops

MajorMalphunction
12-20-2011, 10:16 PM
+1.

Interstate tax, and the transfer fee to receive the firearm.

When was this?

Merc1138
12-21-2011, 1:11 AM
When was this?

It's been like this the entire time. Literally for decades. You are supposed to have been reporting all of your online purchases on your state tax return and pay the equivalent sales tax as "use tax". The BoE(Board of Equalization, the state agency that demands tax money) realized that all they had to do was ask the DoJ nicely to audit FFLs since there are records of the transfers, in the event that the FFL doesn't pay up the tax on the firearm you purchased.

CA is broke and runs a deficit, they will use anything they can get away with to get their money. The issue of the BoE demanding money from FFLs has been going on for months, "use tax" has existed for a long time.

Buy a new laptop on amazon for $1000? You're supposed to report that. Bought $500 in ammo from an out of state website? Supposed to report that too. The BoE chasing down amazon(because the state knows that the buyers aren't reporting it) is the entire reason for that whole amazon sales tax mess that made the news.

68Datsun510
12-21-2011, 9:56 AM
All the more reason for me to move to a free state... Hell, my registration for my 46 year old car went from $50 to $84...to help Jerry brown close the deficit...

HBrebel
12-21-2011, 1:39 PM
The saiga rifles meet every requirement for CA, yet some places refuse to send them here, and the CA DOJ refuses to admit they are legal, or so i read...

Whats up with that??? I had a tough time getting my saiga here in orange county. Turners and fieldtime sports both treated me like a leper. ended up going thru anFFL/security trainer guy shipping from armsofamerica in AZ

aghauler
12-21-2011, 2:00 PM
FYI, Bud's clearly states on their website that they do not ship semi-autos to California...

Is that pistols, rifles or shotguns or all three? I musta missed it on Buds but I don't spend alot of time there anyway even though my local FFL tells me to order from Buds.

CSACANNONEER
12-21-2011, 2:25 PM
Lulz. So why hate on arsenal so much? Atlantic gave me a rude response, buds is the same way, same with 1 million other gun mfgs and shops

Arsenal went past CTD and SG in trying to keep their products out of California. In fact, they went so far as to threaten to cut off any supplier who was caught shipping their products to Ca. They have hung up on many CGN members as soon as they found out they were calling from Ca. What is ruder than that? Then, after the '08 gun buying boom died, they decided that they needed the California market and hoped that all the dumb Californian's would not remember or care about how Arsenal had treated them for over a decade. It's a sad commentary on California gun owners but, it looks like Arsenal was right and many California gun owners are their own worst enemies. So, how many Arsenal products do you own again?:p

aghauler
12-21-2011, 2:30 PM
Winner.

We have this same thread going on and yeah we blame YOU Californians...Start voting right and maybe you will have REAL change one day.

Apparently there are MORE NON gun owners in Calif than there are Gun Owners. So even if we "Vote Right" how do you expect the Gun Owners to win? Being a "free country" CA can't close its borders to people who are NON Gun Owners just to facilitate "Change" or whatever. Anytime you want to stand up and educate the NON Gun owners to the error of their ways you are certainly welcome to do so. Been tried and it hasn't worked. If I was you I'd be working with all the FFLS outside of Calif to legally ship as many guns INTO CA as possible. To NOT do so only defeats legal gun owners and empowers the NON gun owners. You want "Real Change" educate the FFLS and Distributors outside of Calif.;)

SURVIVOR619
12-21-2011, 2:43 PM
HBrebel, Turners did the same thing to me.. As such I've found a much better store who values my business and shows that each time I'm there.

vincewarde
12-21-2011, 3:02 PM
FYI, Bud's clearly states on their website that they do not ship semi-autos to California...

Yep, and for all out of state vendors there are three realities:

1) California is a huge market - perhaps the biggest in the country - so they all would like to sell here

2) To sell in California, you have to learn a whole new set of laws that do not apply in your state and do not really make sense.

3) You are only as good at following our crazy laws as your dumbest employee

Given these realities, some out of state vendors decide to sell everything they can in California, other decide to sell in California and avoid anything that even comes close to being illegal (like Bud's) and others decide that it is not worth it and refuse to sell anything in CA.

BTW, remember when the requirement for vendors to e-verify CA FFLs licenses was passed? There was almost no opposition (or even knowledge) before it passed - and shortly thereafter many out of state FFLs stopped shipping here. Why did the NRA and NSSF keep their mouths shut? I think the answer is obvious: This law helps CA local FFLs by "encouraging" more people to buy local.

stix213
12-21-2011, 3:49 PM
If Bud's is too good for your commie California dollars, that's fine. Spend them with someone who wants your business.

zfields
12-21-2011, 4:13 PM
Lulz. So why hate on arsenal so much? Atlantic gave me a rude response, buds is the same way, same with 1 million other gun mfgs and shops

Try arms of america out next time if your looking for AKs. They were some of the best, non CA FFLs I have dealt with.

68Datsun510
12-21-2011, 10:35 PM
we did vote right! its the influx of lame treehuggers and liberals that came in the last 10 or 15 years that didn't

So true!

Anywho, i have made two purchases in the past with buds, and they were great about it, i cant actually BLAME them for fearing retaliation from CA. Such is life in the PRK.

I shot my FFL an email (no pun intended) asking if he knew where to get them. Hes a small out of house business so he has no "storefront".

Merc1138
12-22-2011, 12:11 AM
I have seen the Saiga's online for $299 + $22 ship + $26 tax + FFl fee $55 = $402. Local FFL have them for that? I called a few and was told $600 + tax + DROS! Can someone point me in the right direction? I would like to get a few.

I've seen $350 before tax+DROS from local shops. If you post what part of CA you're in, people might be able to suggest some places.

awall919
12-22-2011, 1:03 AM
I had a gun shop refuse to ship a yugo sks confirmed Cali legal. Gotta play by their rules when in there turf. For some shops I assume that they are just unsure of the legality and would prefer to play the safe card.
Regardless I hope you can acquire your Saiga.

chrisf
12-22-2011, 2:49 AM
Buds has the awesome layaway deal... =(
They sure do, And ever since I found out about it, Ive had a new gun on layaway every 60 days (I usually get impatient and pay it off in 60 days or less) hell my new sigma 40 purchase I put on layaway got inpatient and wanted to see what the fuss about the trigger was and paid it off 4 hours later lol. I must say most underrated handgun in history.

personalsecurityzone
01-06-2012, 7:49 PM
Customers from California are always telling me about other dealers have just rudely hung up on them when they say they are looking for a California legal (bullet buttoned) firearm!

It does require some extra attention and desire to help Californians get a modern sporting rifle or shotgun, to stock the right bullet button and put it on the gun, and to help customers find a local FFL dealer who will transfer their firearm. But we find it is not that much trouble and really worth it - after all Californians should be able to get a good gun too!

http://personalsecurityzone.com/California_Legal_AR15_and_AK_Rifles.htm

Mary Kay at PersonalSecurityZone.com

Calplinker
01-06-2012, 8:08 PM
Customers from California are always telling me about other dealers have just rudely hung up on them when they say they are looking for a California legal (bullet buttoned) firearm!

It does require some extra attention and desire to help Californians get a modern sporting rifle or shotgun, to stock the right bullet button and put it on the gun, and to help customers find a local FFL dealer who will transfer their firearm. But we find it is not that much trouble and really worth it - after all Californians should be able to get a good gun too!

http://personalsecurityzone.com/California_Legal_AR15_and_AK_Rifles.htm

Mary Kay at PersonalSecurityZone.com

Its no secret that the CalDoJ is not above making threatening phone calls to FFL's to try and scare them off.

In many cases, it works, kind of like Cheaper than Dirt.....:rolleyes:

When vendors like PersonalSecurityZone offer to step up and sell to us, I say we support them!!

Black Tiger
01-06-2012, 8:12 PM
You're totally RIGHT. I've been with FFLs for a while but now I have to come back Target Masters West (Milpitas, CA) because of this issue.

FYI guys, all CA FFLs now collect tax on out of state transfers (unless a private party sale) so it is almost never better to buy a gun out of state if it is available locally.

personalsecurityzone
11-14-2012, 2:50 PM
We have all the same suppliers as Bud's does (although we can't afford to sell anything below dealer cost like they do - I can not figure out what's up with that) so anyway if they refuse you, please give us a chance at your business...

http://personalsecurityzone.com/

John3:16
11-14-2012, 2:55 PM
I got a saiga in 5.45x39 for sale asking 450 in san diego

chrisf
11-14-2012, 3:21 PM
Buds has the awesome layaway deal... =(
That they do... That they do....

AleksandreCz
11-14-2012, 4:50 PM
It's been like this the entire time. Literally for decades. You are supposed to have been reporting all of your online purchases on your state tax return and pay the equivalent sales tax as "use tax". The BoE(Board of Equalization, the state agency that demands tax money) realized that all they had to do was ask the DoJ nicely to audit FFLs since there are records of the transfers, in the event that the FFL doesn't pay up the tax on the firearm you purchased.

CA is broke and runs a deficit, they will use anything they can get away with to get their money. The issue of the BoE demanding money from FFLs has been going on for months, "use tax" has existed for a long time.

Buy a new laptop on amazon for $1000? You're supposed to report that. Bought $500 in ammo from an out of state website? Supposed to report that too. The BoE chasing down amazon(because the state knows that the buyers aren't reporting it) is the entire reason for that whole amazon sales tax mess that made the news.
Every one keeps saying its been there the whole time. But what Law/bill instituted it can anyone actually tell me ?

762.DEFENSE
11-14-2012, 5:01 PM
The saiga rifles meet every requirement for CA, yet some places refuse to send them here, and the CA DOJ refuses to admit they are legal, or so i read...

Whats up with that???

They did that to me 2 years ago. So I just received my funds back, and went elsewhere.

762.DEFENSE
11-14-2012, 5:04 PM
We have this same thread going on and yeah we blame YOU Californians...Start voting right and maybe you will have REAL change one day.

Agreed.

kajvid
11-14-2012, 5:34 PM
I have always found Bud's to be very California friendly. They have had buttoned rifles to ship to CA in the past. I think the name "Saiga" is just too scary. I am sure that if they were to call the CADOJ they'd get a resounding "NO" from them <because they are idiots>.

Merc1138
11-14-2012, 5:40 PM
Every one keeps saying its been there the whole time. But what Law/bill instituted it can anyone actually tell me ?

Tell you what? Look up "CA use tax" on google, you'll find plenty of info. We've had a use tax since since the 1930's so it's nothing new, the only change is that the state wants it's(your) money. Same reason they jumped all over amazon.com.

Librarian
11-14-2012, 7:32 PM
Every one keeps saying its been there the whole time. But what Law/bill instituted it can anyone actually tell me ?

Start with Revenue and Taxation Code 6001 (http://law.onecle.com/california/taxation/6001.html).

In particular, the date is in R&T 6201 An excise tax is hereby imposed on the storage, use, or other
consumption in this state of tangible personal property purchased
from any retailer on or after July 1, 1935, for storage, use, or
other consumption in this state at the rate of 3 percent of the sales
price of the property,
and at the rate of 2 1/2 percent on and after July 1, 1943, and to and including June 30, 1949,
and at the rate of 3 percent on and after July 1, 1949, and to and including July 31, 1967,
and at the rate of 4 percent on and after August 1, 1967, and to and including June 30, 1972,
and at the rate of 3 3/4 percent on and after July 1, 1972, and to and including June 30, 1973,
and at the rate of 4 3/4 percent on and after July 1, 1973, and to and including September 30, 1973,
and at the rate of 3 3/4 percent on and after October 1, 1973, and to and including March 31, 1974,
and at the rate of 4 3/4 percent thereafter.

68Datsun510
11-14-2012, 8:11 PM
http://i27.servimg.com/u/f27/15/57/54/46/saiga10.jpg

Definitely too scary of a name...

AleksandreCz
11-14-2012, 9:32 PM
Start with Revenue and Taxation Code 6001 (http://law.onecle.com/california/taxation/6001.html).

In particular, the date is in R&T 6201

Thank you that is exactly what I was Looking for.

Tell you what? Look up "CA use tax" on google, you'll find plenty of info. We've had a use tax since since the 1930's so it's nothing new, the only change is that the state wants it's(your) money. Same reason they jumped all over amazon.com.

I have Googled the $#!+ out of it and all I could ever come up with is that its been on the Books since 1935. Even the State of CA website states that its Been a law since 1935 but has no mention of what Law.

tenpercentfirearms
11-15-2012, 7:15 AM
Thank you that is exactly what I was Looking for.



I have Googled the $#!+ out of it and all I could ever come up with is that its been on the Books since 1935. Even the State of CA website states that its Been a law since 1935 but has no mention of what Law.

Here you go.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=366781

Basically it boils down to since you have to pay Use Tax anyway and the BOE has a lot more money than I do, it isn't worth it to me to not collect the tax since the only person I am benefitting is the consumer who plans on not paying the Use Tax at the end of the year. If I do not collect the tax and the BOE says I owe it, it will cost me a lot of my money to fight for your right to not have to claim your Use Tax until tax time. If I am wrong and the BOE wins the expensive legal battle, then I am liable for that Sales Tax, plus interest and penalties.

Call up Gusslers in Santee. He actually had a BOE audit for not paying the transfer Sales Tax and ended up paying 5 figures in back taxes. No thank you.

Anyone wanting to fight this, please feel free. Let us know how it goes.

lemans
11-29-2012, 1:40 PM
I had a similar experience with Buds. They would not sell me the Saiga 7.62 Sporter. If you are going to sell to California, which they do, you should know the California laws.

Schutzman
11-29-2012, 3:45 PM
Merc, though it's been damn near a year, I'd love to know where to pick up aks's for $350. In in Sac county.

Schutz

Merc1138
11-29-2012, 3:56 PM
Merc, though it's been damn near a year, I'd love to know where to pick up aks's for $350. In in Sac county.

Schutz

A year later, after the election, in this economy? Good luck trying to find one for $350 now.

Schutzman
11-29-2012, 3:57 PM
Mofo double post. Anyhow don't see any difference from last yr to this year.
Schutz

Merc1138
11-29-2012, 4:01 PM
Merc, though it's been damn near a year, I'd love to know where to pick up aks's for $350. Im in Sac county.

Schutz

I just told you, probably not going to happen.

You do understand that the price has gone up on Saigas and that I wasn't talking about a converted AK, right?

Chaozu
11-29-2012, 4:09 PM
It is their RIGHT to run their bussiness as they see fit. I love the fact that they have that right and use it even if I don't agree with their bussiness decisions. Just find a vendor who wants to do bussiness with you and don't worry about those who don't.

THIS! Best post so far. I hate the fact that business are scared to sell to us in California but I take it as their loss.

Schutzman
11-29-2012, 4:14 PM
Ah gotcha, well Atlantic has unconverted Saiga's for 4 something.

Schutz

artimious7
11-29-2012, 4:56 PM
The saiga rifles meet every requirement for CA, yet some places refuse to send them here, and the CA DOJ refuses to admit they are legal, or so i read...

Whats up with that???

I see that you are in Placerville. You should just drive down to River City Gun Exchange. They are a huge store with over 600 guns in stock. The have the Saiga 16 in stock in several calibers. We bought 3 of them there, 3 months ago. They were 440.00 each. Great place to deal with. They are located @ 2370 Fruitridge Road Sacramento, CA 95822
(916) 428-0377

peppermintman
11-29-2012, 4:57 PM
Give Atlantic Firearms a try. They offer Calguns discounts.

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/

I tried to do business with them too and had the same problem so I told them to keep it and I ain't gonna do business with them and I'll tell everyone Not to do business with them. So I did see something I wanted and Atlantic was more than happy to send a Cali legal rifle to me. The tax doesn't bother me. I'd gladly pay that as long as I get what I want. I do recommend Atlantic though.
When there was something I had to have I looked in Calguns and there's always help with licensed Cali dealers that will ship to Cali.
Tell them and everyone you know not do any kind of business with them.

Belvedere
11-29-2012, 8:58 PM
I was in Riflegear today and they had Saiga's in stock.

JDW67
11-30-2012, 9:32 AM
Welcome to California...

janus408
11-30-2012, 11:28 AM
check out arms of america. Great company.

Seconded, this is where I got mine from.