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jemrey81
12-16-2011, 3:44 PM
I was looking at a friends AR15 today... he built it early-mid 90's I think. He hasn't used it for atleast 10 years and didn't realize that it's no longer a legal configuration and is wanting to get that taken care of.

Looking at it, it doesn't have a bullet button / raddlock setup (just push the button and the mag drops). I know that a bb / raddlock can be purchased and installed for this and it's fairly inexpensive. Correct?

The other thing is that the lower says
DPMS
Becker, MN
Cal. 223
Mod. A-15
and a serial #

I see that list of illegal lowers says:
DPMS: Panther (all)

His doesn't say "Panther" anywhere on it.

Does that mean that all lowers stamped "Panther" are illegal, or all DPMS lowers are illegal?

If all DPMS lowers are illegal, he can just get a new lower and switch this one out right? Obviously need to dros on a new lower, but can he switch out the internals of this lower to a new one?

If all DPMS are illegal why wouldn't he have been notified or something?

What are the lengths that I need to look for to see if it is legal length-wise? Where do I measure?

I am just trying to help a friend out so that he doesn't get into any trouble he didn't realize he could get into.

thanks guys!

AeroEngi
12-16-2011, 3:48 PM
Did he register it as an assault weapon before the ban? If he did, then he doesn't have to worry about anything.

jemrey81
12-16-2011, 3:51 PM
Did he register it as an assault weapon before the ban? If he did, then he doesn't have to worry about anything.

Unknown....

Is there a way to find out?

roushstage2
12-16-2011, 3:51 PM
Raddlock is ~$35. Simple install. Convertible Prince 50 (similar to Raddlock) is the same, though IME, harder to find locally.

If that lower is on the ban-list and not registered (the big no-no), he can move everything over to a legal one, yes. The lower receiver is the "actual" firearm. The lower will say Panther on it (read that in another thread I just searched for).

Length is measured from end of the barrel to the end of the [collapsed] buttstock.

jemrey81
12-16-2011, 3:59 PM
Raddlock is ~$35. Simple install. Convertible Prince 50 (similar to Raddlock) is the same, though IME, harder to find locally.

If that lower is on the ban-list and not registered (the big no-no), he can move everything over to a legal one, yes. The lower receiver is the "actual" firearm. The lower will say Panther on it (read that in another thread I just searched for).

Length is measured from end of the barrel to the end of the [collapsed] buttstock.

Yeah, doesn't say Panther on it anywhere... Model is A-15. Does it matter that it doesn't have a collapsable stock? What is the overall length supposed to be? What about the barrel, where do I measure from for the barrel length? Is the barrel supposed to be 16"+?

AeroEngi
12-16-2011, 4:01 PM
Yeah, doesn't say Panther on it anywhere... Model is A-15. Does it matter that it doesn't have a collapsable stock? What is the overall length supposed to be? What about the barrel, where do I measure from for the barrel length? Is the barrel supposed to be 16"+?

Yes, the barrel is supposed to be a minumum of 16" and the overall length of the rifle can be no less than 30".

cmace22
12-16-2011, 4:08 PM
Id look again. The "Panther" would be directly below the DPMS engraving.

http://www.airsoftcore.com/files/Images/Reviews/A15_4.gif

jemrey81
12-16-2011, 4:12 PM
Id look again. The "Panther" would be directly below the DPMS engraving.

http://www.airsoftcore.com/files/Images/Reviews/A15_4.gif

Do I need to get a photo showing that "panther" is not one the lower anywhere? Will that help you guys? No letters saying panther, no logo of a panther, no panther arms logo either.... I have been reading through google seaches and DPMS manufactured these in the early 90's (they were the early models that don't have any mention of Panther Arms... seems rare).

stix213
12-16-2011, 4:31 PM
He would know if he went out of his way to register his rifle as an AW with the state. If he "doesn't know" then he certainly did not.

If he has had the rifle since the 90's he almost certainly has large-capacity mags. Even if he installs a bullet button on his rifle, using his large capacity mags with it is the same crime as not even bothering to install the bullet button in the first place.

I'd suggest he reconfigures his rifle for featureless, then he doesn't need to worry about mag capacity. Plenty of threads on it here.

jemrey81
12-16-2011, 4:34 PM
OK just got these for you guys... might help? I painted over the serial number in the photos.

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a462/jemrey81/Friends%20AR/1.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a462/jemrey81/Friends%20AR/2.jpg

http://i1038.photobucket.com/albums/a462/jemrey81/Friends%20AR/3.jpg

Seesm
12-17-2011, 12:55 AM
Without looking at it closer I would ask Oaklander or Gen Hoffman or Wildhawker on here... It does not say PANTHER which is GOOD... With looking at the flow charts... If you put a bullet button and 10 round mag it "appears" legal for your "buddy" But I would check with a CGN lawyer or brain man... Just sayin.

freonr22
12-17-2011, 1:02 AM
I know seesm is very knowledgable, but to me it looks features less except for pistol grip. Put a monster man or kydex grip and keep the 30 rounders? Unless I am missing something? Looks like no flash hider..no collapsible stock

roushstage2
12-17-2011, 1:18 AM
Good point.

slo5oh
12-17-2011, 1:19 AM
http://calnra.com/cgi-bin/flowchart.cgi

jemrey81
12-19-2011, 11:04 AM
http://calnra.com/cgi-bin/flowchart.cgi
Thanks - been there.

Thanks for the input to the rest of you guys. I guess he'll have to dive a little deeper with his setup (sounds like featureless might be the best option for him)..... The whole DPMS thing is troubling though.