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View Full Version : Stock mock-up #3


trfcrugby
03-05-2007, 2:27 PM
Took some advice and ideas from the previous thread, and created this new rendition. No more airplane vertical stab stock, length has been adjusted, and a few cosmetic changes were made.

The overall length is shown in the image overlayed on the U15.

So how would one go about trying to actually make something like this? What materials would I use, and where can I get them?

http://thealphageeks.com/img/ar5.jpg

http://thealphageeks.com/img/ar7.jpg

http://thealphageeks.com/img/AR8.JPG

schizrade2
03-05-2007, 2:46 PM
Maybe you should come up with your own design, instead of hacking somebody else's.

MonsterMan
03-05-2007, 2:48 PM
Yeah, I think Grant has this one covered.

trfcrugby
03-05-2007, 2:54 PM
Dude, I'm not hacking anything. This is the third revision I've done of this, and given that ALL rifle stocks are variations of each other, to say I am hacking something would be like saying Chevy hacked Ford's steering wheels.

In an earlier thread I mentioned that I preferred a more industrial look to that of the U15, and played around with the computer and came up with this. There are very few ways you can actually connect a stock to this gun, so unless you can think of some other location to attach it....

The reason for the U15 pic is because someone said mine looked to long. I compared it to the U15 for reference. If the guy that made the U15 wanted to work with me to make this a reality, I would be more than happy to help out. I want a different stock, but I'm not sold on the U15 design.

And above all, I am stuck here in Cali like the rest of you, and would love to see some options for us out there. Right now there are three; MM, U15 and fixed mags.

soopafly
03-05-2007, 2:59 PM
I don't think trfcrugby can make this available commercially since it would most likely be in violation of the patent on the U15. That said...

perhaps Grant can make and sell this version as a "2nd generation" U15...

or the "U15 MkII, Mod 0"...

howzabout the "U15 tactical" model...

maybe "U15, Type B*"


















*"B"- Baddasss

Prc329
03-05-2007, 2:59 PM
Why leave the exposed opening between the buffer and the stock?

soopafly
03-05-2007, 3:03 PM
Why leave the exposed opening between the buffer and the stock?

that would be a thumbhole stock then, no?

Prc329
03-05-2007, 3:04 PM
Close it off all the way. It would be an oar type stock.

Prc329
03-05-2007, 3:06 PM
http://www.clarkcustomguns.com/images/stocks/bcar15sm.jpg

Something like this but with the hole filled.

trfcrugby
03-05-2007, 3:06 PM
Like I said before, I have no way of making this. I'd love to try a prototype, and if someone can help out, that would be great. I'm sure the guys making the MM and U15 aren't rolling in dough, but instead designed their products because it was something they wanted, and it turned out other people wanted it, too.

Mainly, I want a more tactical looking stock for my Cali restricted AR. Not trying to make anyone mad, infringe on a patent, or anything. Throwing ideas out there, maybe one will stick.

Cali-V
03-05-2007, 3:08 PM
Great Design... with functional improvements!

proraptor
03-05-2007, 3:18 PM
That looks 1000 times better than the u15....Id probably buy one of those

shark92651
03-05-2007, 3:26 PM
The first couple of comments on this thread seem a bit unnecessarily harsh. What, because a couple people have created products for the CA market we should stifle innovation? As I recall the design that ultimately became the U-15 was not an original idea either. Chances are this stock idea will never see the light of day as a commercial product, but perhaps he wants to make one in his garage for his own use. What is wrong with that?

PLINK
03-05-2007, 3:29 PM
The U15 is more for functionality than looks.

trfcrugby
03-05-2007, 3:42 PM
The U15 is more for functionality than looks.

Agreed. Now we need something that looks like it belongs on the AR.

No offence to the U15, of course, it was/is a fantastic idea. Hopefully more people will get ideas after seeing it, and perhaps even a big name stock maker, who could actually bring something to market that not only functions great, but looks great, too.

MonsterMan
03-05-2007, 3:49 PM
I wasn't being harsh. I was just saying that maybe he should investigate new designs. He obviously has the software to do the job. I am all for this stuff. That is why I did it.

Rather than a straight up redesign of someone else's product, lets see some new ideas.

Wow, give one comment and people think you are being harsh. :rolleyes:

shark92651
03-05-2007, 4:01 PM
I mean no offense. Yeah, it was more this quote that I thought was kind of harsh:

"Maybe you should come up with your own design, instead of hacking somebody else's."

Improving on existing designs, sparking ideas, and creating competition is what leads to better products. I mean how many variations of the 6 position carbine stock are on the market?

I think both the MMG and U-15 are great products. When I look at this stock design, it sort of looks like those two were merged into one.

Diablo
03-05-2007, 4:55 PM
I like it. You make it....I buy it....:D

MilSpec.45
03-05-2007, 5:21 PM
I like it, it looks good.

Who cares if it is similar to the u15? There are tons of different brands of collapsable stocks out there and no one is freaking out. :rolleyes:

stator
03-05-2007, 5:29 PM
Keep at it as it is looking good.

Also, be aware of the U-15 limitation of having to use a pistol buffer. This is not good for rifle barrels with higher pressures and longer dwell times. I would suggest trying to solve that puzzle.

Wulf
03-05-2007, 5:32 PM
I think your design has great merit for the crowd that value highly how a gun looks and doesn't think an AR is sufficiently customized if they haven't contributed significantly to the snagability of an already snagprone design.

Quite frankly one of the things I like about he U15 design is that its very clean. I wish the rest of the AR looked more like the U15 stock.

paradox
03-05-2007, 5:45 PM
I wasn't being harsh. I was just saying that maybe he should investigate new designs. He obviously has the software to do the job. I am all for this stuff. That is why I did it.


Hey man, you of all people should remember that the “good ol’ days” weren’t all so good. Back then, posting a Quasi-Cali-Legal photoshop bastardization would not only get a bunch of “that’s ugly, you suck!” posts but a bunch of “that’s illegal, you suck!” posts as well.

I agree with your sentiment though, the more creativity applied by our community, the better.

But then again, I’m probably biased; I still prefer my backyard bastardized grip to anything else... :D

James R.
03-05-2007, 5:46 PM
One thing I'd like to see improved on the U15 or any stock that follows in its footsteps is the mounting bracket. While everyone says it's strong enough I'd get a more warm and fuzzing feeling if there was some feature that came in and derived strength from where the receiver extension threads into the receiver.

I know this would have made the bracket the U15 uses a lot more complicated and expensive to make say nothing of the wood, but it'd also make it much more bulletproof.

Before anyone pounces, yes I've handled the U15, it's nice. I didn't try smashing anyones head in with the butt of the rifle so I can't say how strong it is or not, but it was the only thing that stood out to me as an area that could really be improved.

Regards,

James R.

MonsterMan
03-05-2007, 5:47 PM
But then again, I’m probably biased; I still prefer my backyard bastardized grip to anything else... :D

Thats because you haven't tried my new AR grip. :D

Directshot
03-05-2007, 5:50 PM
Unusual... different... functional (?)... I like it !

SigShooter
03-05-2007, 6:40 PM
Unusual... different... functional (?)... I like it !

Hmmmm... a new definition for FUD?!? Functional... Unusual... Different

I kinda like it.

If people didn't "expand" on other people's ideas then we'd still be driving a model "T", still be listening to wax records, using Bell's original telephone and probably not be reading about a new stock designed for the CA market on a web forum...

Variety is the spice of life and we all like to live right. Since trfcrugby doesn't have to ability to prototype this stock, maybe he could work with Matt and Grant on the (as stated prior) the U-15 MII tactical CA rifle stock.

PLINK
03-05-2007, 8:48 PM
Keep at it as it is looking good.

Also, be aware of the U-15 limitation of having to use a pistol buffer. This is not good for rifle barrels with higher pressures and longer dwell times. I would suggest trying to solve that puzzle.

Actually it is a pistol buffer tube with a CAR buffer and spring.

I would like to see an example of the limitation you are talking about though.

Q
03-05-2007, 9:24 PM
I for one would like to see the u-15 in plastic maybe it will be the second version. It's still kinda pricey to me but I plan on getting one. I haven't had the pleasure of trying one out yet.

if you don't mind going the leapers route (made in china) you can get ANYTHING made CHEAP! Or even mexico since it is closer but probably more expensive. After some capitol growth I would then invest in domestic production.

The SoCal Gunner
03-05-2007, 10:28 PM
Nice mock up but the design seems pointless to me. The style resembles a MonsterMan style grip with a stock attached similar to the U15.

Why not just get a MMG and A2?

If you're after an industrial style look, I'd rather be able to grasp it similar to how the U15 allows.

Toolbox X
03-06-2007, 12:37 AM
Thanks for looking out for me guys. This community is beyond cool to be a part of.

trfcrugby, I think your design is sweet! It definitely matches the look of the railed uppers. I've been thinking about different U-15 designs that would incorporate more aluminum and less wood, but the main problem is the grip. It took me 8 months and all 5 prototypes just to get the grip comfortable. That was by far the hardest part of the design.

Additionally, I learned how critical it is to design something to be manufactured. Simple injection molds cost tens of thousands of dollars, so having parts made out of polymer is usually not an option for a market this small. I can't seem to get away from requiring a wood grip to capture the ergonomics I need, regardless of the stock design.

Your spirit behind your ideas and models comes from the same ingenuity that makes America the strongest country in the world. Personally, I think you should be a little more cautious about about publicly overlaying someone else's design like that, without their permission, but I understand exactly where you are coming from and I take no offense from it.

If there is anything I can do to help you out please email me.

-Grant

trfcrugby
03-06-2007, 3:03 PM
Grant, thanks for jumping in.

Just wanted to clarify why I laid my image over your stock. Someone mentioned that mine was too long, so I adjusted the length, and used the U15 to prove the length was the same, as is the level of the top of the stock to keep it legal, but still clears the buffer tube, etc. I suppose I could have laid it over a standard carbine for the same effect.

Anyway, I am still throwing ideas around on the computer, but I will be more cautious in the future, since I don't want to come out and offend or infringe on anything. We are all on the same team here, and I seriously doubt the market is so huge here that something like this would make anyone a rich man. I am trying to make something I would want, and if it works, great, if not, so be it.

-badcredit-
03-06-2007, 5:47 PM
Very nice!.. I'd but one..

Diablo
03-06-2007, 8:34 PM
Thanks for looking out for me guys. This community is beyond cool to be a part of.

trfcrugby, I think your design is sweet! It definitely matches the look of the railed uppers. I've been thinking about different U-15 designs that would incorporate more aluminum and less wood, but the main problem is the grip. It took me 8 months and all 5 prototypes just to get the grip comfortable. That was by far the hardest part of the design.

Additionally, I learned how critical it is to design something to be manufactured. Simple injection molds cost tens of thousands of dollars, so having parts made out of polymer is usually not an option for a market this small. I can't seem to get away from requiring a wood grip to capture the ergonomics I need, regardless of the stock design.

Your spirit behind your ideas and models comes from the same ingenuity that makes America the strongest country in the world. Personally, I think you should be a little more cautious about about publicly overlaying someone else's design like that, without their permission, but I understand exactly where you are coming from and I take no offense from it.

If there is anything I can do to help you out please email me.

-Grant




WOW, that's a lot of class and sportsmanship...I hope you sell more U15's...:cool: