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View Full Version : AAC brakeout installed. Need to rezero irons?


JDPhx501
12-11-2011, 1:22 PM
For those who upgraded their standard A2 flash hider to a new muzzle device, have you noticed any changes in the way your M4/AR15 fires that you would need to rezero the iron sights?

glenntuc
12-11-2011, 1:31 PM
no need to rezero less muzzle rise follow shot munch faster

tomd1584
12-11-2011, 1:40 PM
Next time you shoot you might just want to confirm your zero. It may not need any adjustments, or it may need a click or two.

nickyrr
12-11-2011, 2:29 PM
Yeah maN I don't think muzzle breaks affect accuracy..

MrPlink
12-11-2011, 4:10 PM
Yeah maN I don't think muzzle breaks affect accuracy..

are you guys serious?

Of course they do!

Anything that touches your barrel can effect things. This general concept is one of the reasons people free float their barrels.


Nevermind the design of the thing, a difference or increase in mass alone can change harmonics on the barrel which can create a shift in POI. There is nothing saying that it is guaranteed to happen, but rather very likely. May be minor or major, depends on what is being switched to what and just the particulars of your firearm in general.

Every now and then you run into somebody who actually not only experiences a shift in POI but a shift in precision and accuracy because of how drastic a muzzle device can have on harmonics

1911ZENSHOOTER
12-11-2011, 4:27 PM
are you guys serious?

Of course they do!

Anything that touches your barrel can effect things. This general concept is one of the reasons people free float their barrels.


Nevermind the design of the thing, a difference or increase in mass alone can change harmonics on the barrel which can create a shift in POI. There is nothing saying that it is guaranteed to happen, but rather very likely. May be minor or major, depends on what is being switched to what and just the particulars of your firearm in general.

Every now and then you run into somebody who actually not only experiences a shift in POI but a shift in precision and accuracy because of how drastic a muzzle device can have on harmonics

Yup. What he said. Harmonics, harmonics, harmonics.

JDPhx501
12-11-2011, 6:58 PM
Exactly what I was thinking! The brake also increases overall length of the gun by almost a full inch. Looks like I will be print out more of the 25m Army zeroing targets for next time and rezero accordingly if I have trouble hitting the 100 yard rightside steel plates at Angeles.

nickyrr
12-11-2011, 7:02 PM
How much does it really affect accuracy? Before we got issued free float 16s I qualified with plastic hand guards m16s... I shot no prob... There's thistalk about harmonics this and that... When accuracy was never an issue



are you guys serious?

Of course they do!

Anything that touches your barrel can effect things. This general concept is one of the reasons people free float their barrels.


Nevermind the design of the thing, a difference or increase in mass alone can change harmonics on the barrel which can create a shift in POI. There is nothing saying that it is guaranteed to happen, but rather very likely. May be minor or major, depends on what is being switched to what and just the particulars of your firearm in general.

Every now and then you run into somebody who actually not only experiences a shift in POI but a shift in precision and accuracy because of how drastic a muzzle device can have on harmonics

nickyrr
12-11-2011, 7:05 PM
Exactly what I was thinking! The brake also increases overall length of the gun by almost a full inch. Looks like I will be print out more of the 25m Army zeroing targets for next time and rezero accordingly if I have trouble hitting the 100 yard rightside steel plates at Angeles.

Brakes add an inch but there is no rifling in it.. and for the most part its wider than barrel so i dont think the bullet actually touches any part of the brake... It's meant to direct gas not provide accuracy

Mrbasslips
12-11-2011, 7:55 PM
When I installed my battlecomp my POI shifted 3" low. That was my experience, ymmv

MrPlink
12-11-2011, 8:05 PM
How much does it really affect accuracy? Before we got issued free float 16s I qualified with plastic hand guards m16s... I shot no prob... There's thistalk about harmonics this and that... When accuracy was never an issue

There are far too many variables to give anybody a concrete answer for a specific example. The language used in my first post indicates this.

Using two identical setups your results could differ. But I assure you harmonics are a VERY real thing. Basic physics.

Take a M4 barrel profile. Why do you think it ended up with that shape?
It wasnt based on random decisions

Im not going to get into the whole spiel about FF barrels, but as Im sure you know precision shooting is all about CONSISTENCY. That goes for the shooter AND the gear. This particular example tends to apply to competition shooters more so than your average rifle man, as the center mass of a baddy tends to measure more than 1/4moa. Snipers and DMs are a dif story,,,
but for competitions, where the smallest of margins determine the winner from the losers, the smallest advantages can make all the difference.

And since you mention it, who is issuing M16s with FF rails?
Ive seen the newer FF Mk18s and related SF stuff, but not M16s?
Maybe I missed something here

Merc1138
12-11-2011, 8:30 PM
Brakes add an inch but there is no rifling in it.. and for the most part its wider than barrel so i dont think the bullet actually touches any part of the brake... It's meant to direct gas not provide accuracy

Depending on how it's directing the gas, it could make a shift in the point of impact. The distribution of gas being even around the bullet as it leaves the barrel is why the muzzle crown is so important.

Yes, free floating a barrel is to aid in consistency. But if your rifle or the shooter isn't capable of being precise enough to notice a small change in consistency then it wouldn't matter.

Reductio
12-11-2011, 8:32 PM
Why don't you just shoot it and find out?

MrPlink
12-11-2011, 9:08 PM
Why don't you just shoot it and find out?

thats the bottom line.

All Im saying is do not be surprised if there is one!

Rock_Islander
12-11-2011, 9:13 PM
Whenever you attach a different muzzle device:

YOU MUST ABSOLUTELY RE-ZERO YOUR RIFLE.

Reasons:

1. The torque used to attach your new muzzle device has likely changed from the torque previously applied to attach your old muzzle device. Your barrel harmonics have changed.

2. The gas spitting out of your muzzle has changed dramatically which DEFINITELY affects where your point of impact will now be at downrange. When a muzzle brake is attached (after previously using a flash hider, like an A2) the new point of impact with the brake will likely be lower. You probably will have to click a few times up to get back on zero.

Hope this helps.

Rock_Islander
12-11-2011, 9:22 PM
I installed the Miculek Muzzle-Brake this past Friday, and zeroed it at my local shooting range the same day. The Miculek Brake and the AAC Brakeout are very similar in design, in that they port the gas to the sides to eliminate recoil. Just like Mrbasslips up there said, his point of impact shifted 3 inches lower when he installed his new Battlecomp, so did my point of impact change with the Miculek Brake. It was 3 inches low, and about an inch or slightly less to the left. So I had to click a little up, and to the right to get my AR-15 sighted in.

JDPhx501
12-12-2011, 5:57 AM
Thanks for the input.

I'm still at school right now in the Midwest and won't get any range time till I'm home.

Just wanted some input before range time and to know if I need to bring extra rounds and targets for zeroing. :)

I'm excited to shoot it with a brake on vs. the flash hider.

rero360
12-12-2011, 6:09 AM
Another example is my savage, I had HateCA thread my muzzle and install one of his RAD brakes, having the brake installed lowered my poi at 100 yards by a bit, don't have my data book handy, probably about an inch and a half, but it was repeatable, I shot multiple times with and without it on and produced two distinct and very respectable groups.