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View Full Version : CMMG .22 Conversion Kit - why everyone should buy one.


rimfireman
11-26-2011, 4:35 AM
-I'm sure there is other threads like this one, I had to post because I just like the conversions so much

Let me start by saying, I own a M&P15-22 and I originally pissed on the idea that CMMG, Ciener, and Spikes kits were all junk and that you'd damage your barrel using some junk conversion.

Don't get me wrong the M&p15-22 is a fine, reliable .22 AR that I enjoy greatly.

My attitude changed however, when I purchased an H-1 for my AR. I didn't really want to go to the trouble of re-mounting it over and over again.

I met a fellow enthusiast at burro canyon and I was remarking about his LWRC shooting .22lr *(i noticed him using those off color blackdog mags in a FDE SPR, it was pretty noticable) He educated me on the function and myths of barrel wear. I made a comment about accuracy and he offered to let me use it in my AR.

Ran 3 mags, no problems whatsoever @ 50 yards I shot a pretty good ragged hole, 6 inches south of bullseye - windage was solid, elevation needed to be adjusted.

I love the conversion kit to death now, it lets me spend time on my AR that I was missing + let me use all my gear, .223/5.56 at 300 dollars a case starts to weigh on your head.

If you have a M&P15-22, don't worry to much on the conversion kit

If you don't have a M&P15-22 and own a AR, a conversion kit is definitely something to look at.

**Helpful things**
Christies Ar-15 .22LR loader for BlackDog Mags and CMMG
http://www.ar15conversions.com/christie-magazine-loader.html

CMMG also makes a mag loader for .22 conversion magazines
save your thumbs!

If there is something I am missing, or blatantly needs to be corrected - let me know!

Cheers & Safe Shooting Always!

mlevans66
11-26-2011, 5:46 AM
So I guessing you're "awake" now to the truth about the conversion kits? :D

shadow65
11-26-2011, 5:51 AM
I agree. I started out with a Ciener conversion, went to Spikes, and now run the CMMG. There has been a real progression in quality, design, and features.
CMMG has the best going now. The India kit is the best there ever was.
If you don't have one, you are missing out on a lot of fun and trigger time.
Accuracy is acceptable for plinking and training.
Some are getting good accuracy out of them. Just depends on your barrel/ammo combo.
Even a SHTF scenario that lots of people like to talk about.
I can have my 5.56 rifle with a couple mags and a conversion kit/mag/300 rounds of ammo in a bug out bag. Quiet, will take small game and larger with proper sight placement.
Good to teach your kids with that may be recoil and blast shy.
Every AR owner should have one.
Dave N

510GUY
11-26-2011, 6:50 AM
I'm in the market for one too so you guys think the cmmg is the best around also does it make a diffrence if stainless or not?

rimfireman
11-26-2011, 7:13 AM
CDNN is selling the stainless one for 149.99 + a 10 round mag + 5 dollar shipping

stainless is easier to clean** (triple must, because of the dirty ammo you shoot)

the matte black is just as good and reliable, harder to clean*

Gregchico
11-26-2011, 7:22 AM
I'm in the market for one too so you guys think the cmmg is the best around also does it make a diffrence if stainless or not?

Talk to Dave (posted above you) for a good deal on current kits with all the latest improvements. Yes it may cost a few dollars more than CDNN, but in my opinion it is worth it.


PS, just dealt with Chris at CMMG Wednesday, they are replacing my warn out/broken trigger group with 25,000 rounds through it for free. Great customer service.


www.BandECoatings.com

shadow65
11-26-2011, 7:30 AM
In my opinion and testing, the stainless is definetly worth the extra cost. It's stronger, smoother, uses less lube, is easier to clean and stays cleaner longer.
One of the biggest issues I see are bent rails where guys take them apart.
It isn't necessary to take these apart for general cleaning.
This is where the stainless is better than the black bolt. The stainless is much less likely to bend.

The CDNN kits you see and others in that price range are CMMG. But be aware, they are the old, discontinued kits that were bought out and sold cheap. They do not have the features or machining that the Evolution does.

Also for the CA guys, the new Evolution kits come with the Gen ll 10 round modular mags with steel feed tower/lips.
Dave N

big ron
11-26-2011, 7:34 AM
I have a ciener conversion, I got brand new for a $100. best money I've spent on my AR.

rimfireman
11-26-2011, 7:35 AM
In my opinion and testing, the stainless is definetly worth the extra cost. It's stronger, smoother, uses less lube, is easier to clean and stays cleaner longer.
One of the biggest issues I see are bent rails where guys take them apart.
It isn't necessary to take these apart for general cleaning.
This is where the stainless is better than the black bolt. The stainless is much less likely to bend.

The CDNN kits you see and others in that price range are CMMG. But be aware, they are the old, discontinued kits that were bought out and sold cheap. They do not have the features or machining that the Evolution does.

Also for the CA guys, the new Evolution kits come with the Gen ll 10 round modular mags with steel feed tower/lips.
Dave N

besides the machining on top to make clearance for the Op-rod on piston guns + machining under the bolt for a BHOA, Are there functional differences? I looked at them side by side and they looked identical to me, atleast cosmetically.

donw
11-26-2011, 8:40 AM
i have the Spikes ST-22, a dedicated 22lr, M4, AR...it's accurate, reliable and eats ANY fodder i feed it, has a lifetime guarantee...what more do i need?

i have 5.56 upper for it...

mind you...I'm not degrading or bad mouthing any other...I'm just saying I'm satisfied with what i have

shadow65
11-26-2011, 8:59 AM
i have the Spikes ST-22, a dedicated 22lr, M4, AR...it's accurate, reliable and eats ANY fodder i feed it, has a lifetime guarantee...what more do i need?

i have 5.56 upper for it...

mind you...I'm not degrading or bad mouthing any other...I'm just saying I'm satisfied with what i have

Problem you have there is Spikes discontinued the ST22 due to, according to them, "QC Issues with the suppliers" No more ST22.
Dave N

shadow65
11-26-2011, 9:03 AM
besides the machining on top to make clearance for the Op-rod on piston guns + machining under the bolt for a BHOA, Are there functional differences? I looked at them side by side and they looked identical to me, atleast cosmetically.

The Evolution has forward assist
Cotter Pin holds the firing pin
Push pin holds the extractor
(both provide field stripping and repair without tools)
Live round extraction
Machined for use with piston uppers
Machined for optimal use with the BHOA
Slight differences in geometry which result in the reliability

Just depends on what you want.
Dave N

CK_32
11-26-2011, 9:36 AM
Love my cmmg.

Idk what all this talk about then being inaccurate is mine out shoots me.

ohlone
11-26-2011, 10:45 AM
one of my reasons to have it is... for some girls to shoot my AR... some girls are totally ok with 223, but some don't like the recoil

Munny$hot
11-26-2011, 11:47 AM
Cmmg evolution stainless is very easy to clean. Dave is the guy to buy from. I broke my fp by dry firing a bit to much and just ask Dave was it common. I told him I already left a message with cmmg, but Dave went over my head, contacted cmmg and the same day I had a shipping conformation in my email inbox. I've spent hours searching the net for the best deal and no one could be Dave's price. I'm not sure if he's making a nickle in the whole deal or he just too nice of a guy and he's just hooking everyone up.

AR15Kimo
11-26-2011, 11:52 AM
I have one for my ar15. Its fun to shoot and cheap. I did have a problem with the cmmg magazine. Bought two black dog magazine and problem fixed.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk

Don Nguyen
11-26-2011, 1:36 PM
I didn't even know you had to clean these things. Probably shot 3k or so at least rounds through mine without any issues.

bollero
11-26-2011, 1:39 PM
Last weekend i broke my firing pin on my Ciener conversion.. now I'm upgrading to a titanium firing pin.. I'll see how long this once last....

i have put more than 5000+ 22's thought my Ciener kit works like a champ. .. only thing that's broke was 2 firing pins in last 1.5 years..

FatalKitty
11-26-2011, 2:06 PM
Rimfire = all evil features and no bb right?

Mssr. Eleganté
11-26-2011, 2:09 PM
Rimfire = all evil features and no bb right?

Yes, rimfire rifles can have have evil features and no bullet button.

ke6guj
11-26-2011, 2:12 PM
Rimfire = all evil features and no bb right?

correct, but still have to play the name game, no .22LR listed rifles.

Consult the flowchart.

JSCSShooter
01-28-2012, 7:15 AM
Recently purchased the Alpha CMMG kit from Brownell's. I wanted the SS unit, but they had a three mag deal that only came with the alpha. I read that some had trouble, but I lubed the rails and used a drill and barrel brush to smooth the bolt carrier shell chamber before my first use. The closest range to my location is an hour away, so I did not want to wait until I got on range to find out it did not work correctly. Anyway, I put 550 rounds of the recommended Federal Champion 36gr. CPHP (load# 750) through it without a single failure. I was very impressed. The savings from shooting that many .223/5.56 have already paid for the kit! Accuracy at 25 yrds with my M&P 15 Sport was pretty good. Most shots down and to the right a bit, but quick sight adjustment made for pretty good groupings on center.

After my range time, I told the range officer how impressed I was with the CMMG conversion and he said I should not be shooting .22 in my 5.56 or it would "ruin the barrel. If some has more information on this, I would like to hear it. These S&W M&P 15;s are "melonite coated". I would not think there would be any damage of shooting .22 through a .223 barrel?

smle-man
01-28-2012, 10:33 AM
How can shooting soft lead .22 bullets wear out the bore faster than a copper jacketed 5.56mm bullet?

SurfRider19
01-29-2012, 9:05 PM
Question for all:
I read in another thread that the prefered twist rate is somewhere around 1/16. I am curious as to whether someone has a 1/7 twist and if they have had success with the kit or not. I have a BCM 16" carbine (1/7 twist) and am trying to decide between a conversion kit or splurging for a dedicated upper (which I would prefer avoid, however I want something that will work). I figure the difference between a 1/7 and 1/9 is trivial compared to the potential difference between 1/16, however I am still going to probe for answers before I spend the $$$
Thanks in advance.

cwin
01-29-2012, 9:21 PM
My CMMG evolution ran flawlessly in my AR with good accuracy. I would definitely recommend a conversion kit to anyone, although I never use mine anymore. I'm having too much fun going broke shooting .223/5.56

dieselpower
01-30-2012, 7:32 AM
Rimfire = all evil features and no bb right?

On a conversion is not advisable...but yes by the letter of the law the bolt makes the rifle rimfire and not centerfire... its NOT advisable unless you are with LEO and they agree its cool...which I know you do shoot with LEO Fatalkitty. For you it might be ok. For the rest of us, I wouldnt do it with a conversion bolt. The .22lr dedicated upper doesnt need a BB....that is 100% a rimfire firearm.

dieselpower
01-30-2012, 7:33 AM
correct, but still have to play the name game, no .22LR listed rifles.

Consult the flowchart.

dude...thats like playing with fire....

ke6guj
01-30-2012, 7:41 AM
dude...thats like playing with fire....not sure what you mean by that.

I'm reminding people that a listed colt ar-15 is an AW even if it is chambered in .22lr.

the "named" list of AWs only requires that it be semi-auto. whether or not it is centerfire or rimfire does not matter.

dd03
01-30-2012, 7:52 AM
Question for all:
I read in another thread that the prefered twist rate is somewhere around 1/16. I am curious as to whether someone has a 1/7 twist and if they have had success with the kit or not. I have a BCM 16" carbine (1/7 twist) and am trying to decide between a conversion kit or splurging for a dedicated upper (which I would prefer avoid, however I want something that will work). I figure the difference between a 1/7 and 1/9 is trivial compared to the potential difference between 1/16, however I am still going to probe for answers before I spend the $$$
Thanks in advance.

I have CMMG Evolution kit running with BCM 1/7 twist 16" upper. I use a red dot. When I was shooting 40 grain 22LR I was getting about 3 inch groups at 25 yards. It was the same group when I was using Wolf Match ammo.

But when I shot 60 grain Aguila the groups shrank down considerably (25 yards). The black square is one square inch, and it was a windy day too.

dieselpower
01-30-2012, 7:53 AM
not sure what you mean by that.

I'm reminding people that a listed colt ar-15 is an AW even if it is chambered in .22lr.

the "named" list of AWs only requires that it be semi-auto. whether or not it is centerfire or rimfire does not matter.

I was talking about your "correct", not your "check the list" portion of your reply.

a centerfire firearm with a conversion bolt is still a CENTERFIRE FIREARM.... so even though it can only shoot rimfire with the bolt in it...its still a centerfire firearm....

telling someone Yes its cool when its a gray area is playing with fire IMHO..others may disagree.

wash
01-30-2012, 10:18 AM
The issue with conversion kits is the lead and dirty .22lr powder residue that it will leave in the gas port and gas tube.

Some people say firing a single .223 round after using the kit will blow it all out, I'm not so sure.

Barrel twist is another issue.

These kits are neat, just don't expect to shoot 5,000 rounds of .22lr and then go back to .223 with no issue.

It might do it, it might not. If you have a rifle that you expect 100% reliability out of, you probably should get a dedicated upper rather than use a conversion kit.

john doe
01-31-2012, 5:47 PM
CDNN is selling the stainless one for 149.99 + a 10 round mag + 5 dollar shipping

stainless is easier to clean** (triple must, because of the dirty ammo you shoot)

the matte black is just as good and reliable, harder to clean*

i went on the website its says they wont ship to cali..the search continues for a cmmg 22lr bolt

john doe
01-31-2012, 5:51 PM
The issue with conversion kits is the lead and dirty .22lr powder residue that it will leave in the gas port and gas tube.

Some people say firing a single .223 round after using the kit will blow it all out, I'm not so sure.

Barrel twist is another issue.

These kits are neat, just don't expect to shoot 5,000 rounds of .22lr and then go back to .223 with no issue.

It might do it, it might not. If you have a rifle that you expect 100% reliability out of, you probably should get a dedicated upper rather than use a conversion kit.

before reading what u just said i was thinking the same thing..22lr is so dirty id rather get a full upper..

hefedehefe
01-31-2012, 6:09 PM
I got this one for 129.99 CA legal :D

http://www.amazon.com/Target-Master-conversions-5-56mm-rifles/dp/B002X8HVU4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1328065400&sr=8-1

I originally looked at the CMMG, but they were way more expensive and didnt have as good reviews on Amazon. The calguns donation Amazon link gave me an excuse to shop there ;)

johnclark
02-01-2012, 9:10 PM
I got this one for 129.99 CA legal :D
http://nanojpg.com/img/h/R.gif

http://www.amazon.com/Target-Master-conversions-5-56mm-rifles/dp/B002X8HVU4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1328065400&sr=8-1

I originally looked at the CMMG, but they were way more expensive and didnt have as good reviews on Amazon. The calguns donation Amazon link gave me an excuse to shop there ;)

we are very glad to hear that

http://nanojpg.com/img/C/R.gif

hornswaggled
02-04-2012, 8:36 PM
Got my cmmg conversion bolt and love it!

Got it from Brownells btw.

Mr_Monkeywrench
02-04-2012, 9:48 PM
Went the Dedicated upper route. Gonna test it out tomorrow

Ricky808maui
02-05-2012, 7:50 AM
I wanna go 22 conversion but tried my buddies ciener conversion and it got stuck took an hour to take it out.....works perfect out of his Yankee hill ar though.... I want a cmmg evolution cause I heard it's the best but scared same thing mite happen... My upper is a rock river 1/7 twist...

johnclark
02-06-2012, 11:35 AM
Got my cmmg conversion bolt and love it!

Got it from Brownells btw.

could you show us the brownells link?
thanks


http://nanojpg.com/img/C/R.gif http://nanojpg.com/img/h/R.gif

Dean58
03-05-2012, 1:30 PM
looking at conversion bolt options to provide additional training to family on the AR platform, and to toss in my BOB.

question on .22 mags - are greater then 10 rounders "legal" here in CA in this config? I have BB installed.

suggestions and links welcome

hornswaggled
03-05-2012, 1:42 PM
You can't buy/sell >10rd mags in CA anymore since the ban. If you happen to already own a .22 mag you can use it. But you won't be able to buy or import any new ones.

Dean58
03-05-2012, 1:47 PM
crap....putting myself in penalty box with that question.....I had too many tabs and threads open in my research and had 1 site that seemed they would ship the CMMG kit w/ high cap mag (and spares) to CA and others that wouldn't. Further digging....the 1st site wouldn't.

maybe some rebuild kits to assemble at future date....after leaving CA

edited - thanks for the response Hornswaggle....

.45JHP
03-05-2012, 2:00 PM
Can anyone elaborate on these "myths" mentioned in the OP with regards to barrel wear?

Thanks!

NHP1127
03-05-2012, 3:57 PM
Why are some so worried about a conversion being dirtier? Maybe clean the rifle once in a while?

phylo
08-15-2012, 6:44 AM
Well I just plunked down over $350 for the CMMG india kit (I got it from Santa Cruz Armory, those guys are great!) and I have to say that although I do like the fact that I can now shoot 22lr in my AR the accuracy leaves a lot to be desired. Shooting benchrest with a bipod at 25 yards last night I could not get a group tighter than about 6 inches... To me that makes this thing unusable. For a little bit more money I wish I would have gone with a dedicated upper and iron sights. Im going to play around with some different ammo and see but I think Im going to be selling the conversion kit.

TheExiled
08-15-2012, 11:44 AM
Well I just plunked down over $350 for the CMMG india kit (I got it from Santa Cruz Armory, those guys are great!) and I have to say that although I do like the fact that I can now shoot 22lr in my AR the accuracy leaves a lot to be desired. Shooting benchrest with a bipod at 25 yards last night I could not get a group tighter than about 6 inches... To me that makes this thing unusable. For a little bit more money I wish I would have gone with a dedicated upper and iron sights. Im going to play around with some different ammo and see but I think Im going to be selling the conversion kit.

What twist rate is your barrel and what .22 ammo did you use? I have a CMMG kit with my 1x9 AR and with the cheap, dirty federal .22(the 525rd box), the accuracy really is miserable. With CCI Minimags or any round with a heavier bullet, the accuracy improves to 'manageable'. Its no 10/22, but to send some lead downrange and practice the mechanics of the rifle, cant beat the ammo prices or the $150 for the conversion.

Just remember to run a couple rounds of 5.56 after to clear out the gas tube

Lead Waster
08-15-2012, 11:49 AM
CDNN is selling the stainless one for 149.99 + a 10 round mag + 5 dollar shipping

stainless is easier to clean** (triple must, because of the dirty ammo you shoot)

the matte black is just as good and reliable, harder to clean*

Just to toss a wrench in the works, $150 is about the price of a Marlin 795 .22lr!

LOL, yeah yeah, I know, you want to shoot your AR for cheap, not a different .22lr rifle.

Just throwing it out there!

CK_32
08-15-2012, 11:55 AM
I agree with this thread.. I never "sh**" on the idea of the 22lr but I bought one to try it out and this things been amazing.. As long as I don't feed it remigton or the other junk from Wallymart and use federal I don't have a single problem..

I have the SS version and it shoots amazing and out of my cabins 16" and kid length 16" groups are pretty dam good... Reason why I laugh when I see people talk about the accuracy in the conversion vs the deticated.. I know they have never shot one of have a full comp 22 if they complain about the groups from the cmmg.. Does better than I can and usually makes about 1" group at 20 yards or so if I do my part on irons..

I have about 4k+ rounds through mine so far.. Let's me dust off the AF for the indoor local ranges.

watchmen
08-15-2012, 6:15 PM
I've been reading about .22 Conversions for the last few days. This thread helped me decide to bite the bullet and get one. Ended up getting a stainless one, looking forward to putting a brick through it.

gunsarefun
08-15-2012, 8:49 PM
I've got the newer CMMG conversion kit and I hate it. Doesn't matter if I run the bolt wet or dry, it jams like crazy.

Tjfearl
08-15-2012, 9:03 PM
Well I just plunked down over $350 for the CMMG india kit (I got it from Santa Cruz Armory, those guys are great!) and I have to say that although I do like the fact that I can now shoot 22lr in my AR the accuracy leaves a lot to be desired. Shooting benchrest with a bipod at 25 yards last night I could not get a group tighter than about 6 inches... To me that makes this thing unusable. For a little bit more money I wish I would have gone with a dedicated upper and iron sights. Im going to play around with some different ammo and see but I think Im going to be selling the conversion kit.

Oh man you should have went for the CMMG complete upper. I paid 365 shipped for mine and I added a Troy fixed read sight. I was shooting 4" groups standing 10 rd rapid fire at 25yds. I have it set up on a QD 80% PSA moe build with a standard mag release. It was well worth the money. I added a MOE carbine handguard and foregrip too it as well.

smle-man
08-15-2012, 9:40 PM
My Ciener kit shoots just fine from my 1-9 twist with a chrome lined barrel. it will group about 2" at 50 yds which is good enough for practice for me.

CK_32
08-15-2012, 9:46 PM
I don't know how you guys can't get groups with your conversions.. I've gotten sub 2" at 25 yards on the bench.. That's way more than I expected from a simple kit.

My trial video I made a while back..

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0JeCum702Qg

On part 2 about 3/4 in the video you can see a group of us trying shooting at 25 yards off hand iron sights. And then at the end the small target has a big hold just low left and that's with rapid fire and just messing around.

I just mounted my bushnel 3200 from my 700 on my AR to test out the accuracy of it and get the full potential and see what she can really do.

phylo
08-16-2012, 6:14 AM
What ammo are you guys using?

Im going to the range again today and going to run a bunch of different ammo through it and see if I can get better results.

I ran about 80 rounds of 223 through it after running about 50 round of fed bulk 22lr and decided not to clean it afterwards. Ill try the federal again and see if its any better with a slightly dirty barrel. Im also going to try that new CCI tactical 22 and a few other heavier loads and see if that makes things better... But at this point I don't really have high hopes..

CK_32
08-16-2012, 6:36 AM
The only ammo I use is federal bulk from Wally.. The Remington and blazer stuff wouldn't fire from my gun and gave me FTF/FTE like one out of every 5 rounds..

Been through 2 to 3k of federal and have had about 1 of 2 FTF with it that's about it.

Munny$hot
08-16-2012, 7:07 AM
CDNN is selling the stainless one for 149.99 + a 10 round mag + 5 dollar shipping

stainless is easier to clean** (triple must, because of the dirty ammo you shoot)

the matte black is just as good and reliable, harder to clean*

IIRC CDNN did sell the older style CMMG w/o live round extraction etc for 149, but no longer carry it. Dave (Shadow65) has the lowest price any where on the net/stores I've seen and his attention to his customers in unbelievable. CMMG prices have gone up due to all the upgrades/mods they have made and IMHO it's worth every penny. I just ordered on for someone and I'm envious that he will have the latest and greatest from CMMG.

phylo
08-16-2012, 5:01 PM
All the local shops were out of the bullets I wanted to get so I didnt get to try it out again today.. And tomorrow's range sesion involves an 8year old shooting for the first time so I wont have time to get to it then... Looks like its going to have to be Saturday's range session that I put it through its paces...

gunsarefun
08-17-2012, 3:58 PM
I've got the newer CMMG conversion kit and I hate it. Doesn't matter if I run the bolt wet or dry, it jams like crazy.

I see that a lot of people are having good luck with their CMMG kits. Anyone have any advice for me?

I'm not interested in a dedicated 22 upper because I'd like to practice while using my quality optics that I run on my 5.56 uppers and would like to get this conversion kit to work right.

phylo
08-17-2012, 4:18 PM
I see that a lot of people are having good luck with their CMMG kits. Anyone have any advice for me?

I'm not interested in a dedicated 22 upper because I'd like to practice while using my quality optics that I run on my 5.56 uppers and would like to get this conversion kit to work right.

I ran some 40grain low velocity stuff through mine today and the groups were much tighter than with the Fed bulk I use in my 10-22. Im headed to the range tomorrow with some 40grain high velocity stuff to see how that shoots..

Today at 25 yards all shots were about 2 inches low. Im going to try the HV stuff at 50 yards tomorrow and see how things go.. Just wish I could get my hands on some of the CCI Tactical 22lr ammo.. All the stores in my area are out.

I think Ill bring a video camera and record the process tomorrow as well (maybe)...

If you are in my neck of the woods Ill be at the Los Altos Rod and Gun club range tomorrow at around 10am if you want to check it out for yourself.

jingerale
08-17-2012, 4:32 PM
would you guys run the conversion kit on an AR pistol?

I never thought about running a kit because I've always thought it would damage the barrel. I have DD 10.3" in my pistol and am less protective of it. But it seems the consensus is there is no damage when shooting .22 out of a .223.

gunsarefun
08-18-2012, 6:51 AM
I ran some 40grain low velocity stuff through mine today and the groups were much tighter than with the Fed bulk I use in my 10-22. Im headed to the range tomorrow with some 40grain high velocity stuff to see how that shoots..

Today at 25 yards all shots were about 2 inches low. Im going to try the HV stuff at 50 yards tomorrow and see how things go.. Just wish I could get my hands on some of the CCI Tactical 22lr ammo.. All the stores in my area are out.

I think Ill bring a video camera and record the process tomorrow as well (maybe)...

If you are in my neck of the woods Ill be at the Los Altos Rod and Gun club range tomorrow at around 10am if you want to check it out for yourself.

My question was if anyone had some advise on what could be the issue with my conversion kit that constantly jams.

phylo
08-18-2012, 7:15 AM
My question was if anyone had some advise on what could be the issue with my conversion kit that constantly jams.


What ammo are you running through it? Which conversion kit is it? How is it jamming?

Also how long have you had it? from what I have heard CMMG treats there customers really well and if it is a problem with the kit itself they will probably fix/replace it for you.

ejhc11
08-18-2012, 7:20 AM
My question was if anyone had some advise on what could be the issue with my conversion kit that constantly jams.

You shouldn't have any problems with a kit from Dave/Shadow65.

You mentioned about shooting thru your quality optics, I think trigger/practice time w/your 556 lower and a CMMG dedicated 22LR upper is more valuable since the accuracy of a dedicated rimfire upper shows better results. The twist rate of your 556 upper is at least 1:9 while a rimfire is 1:16, corrected for rimfire ammo.

Oh you can put quality optics on your rimfire upper too.
My CMMG rimfire upper (purchased from Dave/Shadow65) w/Eotech 517 on Palmetto lower/lpks. It happens to be my favorite AR out of the bunch I own - the rest are centerfire....
http://i915.photobucket.com/albums/ac352/ejhc11/AR15/ARRFM4.jpg

Sunday
08-18-2012, 7:44 AM
The drop in conversion kits? the barrel twist 1 in 12 and 1 in 7 is not optimum for a 22 lr.

Sunday
08-18-2012, 7:46 AM
would you guys run the conversion kit on an AR pistol?

I never thought about running a kit because I've always thought it would damage the barrel. I have DD 10.3" in my pistol and am less protective of it. But it seems the consensus is there is no damage when shooting .22 out of a .223.

The 22 lr will not in itself wear out a barrel . A soft lead well lubricated bullet at 1200 fps more or less has almost 0 barrel wear. Most wear in a 22 lr barrel comes from cleaning it.

gunsarefun
08-18-2012, 8:55 PM
What ammo are you running through it? Which conversion kit is it? How is it jamming?

Also how long have you had it? from what I have heard CMMG treats there customers really well and if it is a problem with the kit itself they will probably fix/replace it for you.

I've tried Winchester, Remington, Federal, and hyper velocity by that brand made in Mexico ( can't remember the name). I bought this kit: https://www.primaryarms.com/CMMG_Drop_In_22_LR_Conversion_Kit_with_CMMG_25_Ro_ p/10200.htm

It fails to feed properly, the next new round gets caught in a near vertical position jammed into the bolt. I have to actually pull the pin, flip the gun open, and remove the bolt to get the stuck round out of the action/bolt. I've had it for about 6 months, and it's done it right out of the box when it was new, not a problem that developed. I've also tried it in about 4 different AR's with the same results.

jingerale
08-22-2012, 4:18 PM
The 22 lr will not in itself wear out a barrel . A soft lead well lubricated bullet at 1200 fps more or less has almost 0 barrel wear. Most wear in a 22 lr barrel comes from cleaning it.

thanks! well, I definitely want one now. Looking at the CMMG India. Too bad Buds probably won't ship to CA due to the 25 round mag.
only $229 (http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/83223/CMMG+22BA68D+INDIA+SS+.22+ARC+KIT+25RD)

wild_weasel
11-06-2012, 6:40 AM
I just got a SS CMMG kit from Bass Pro. Looking forward to shooting it.

technique
11-06-2012, 6:54 AM
I think another neat feature of the CMMG kit is that you can make it a dedicated or conversion kit. Like someone has mentioned, it's great to
have in a BOB just in case you want to use it as a conversion, but you can also swap the bolt face to a dedicated. CMMG dedicated barrels are pretty inexpensive too.

CMMG really took this .22 thing to the next level too. Bolt hold open options, forward assist options, FA kits, all kinds of good stuff.

I mostly use mine as a conversion, but I purchased a 6.5in. dedicated barrel too.

gat
11-06-2012, 1:59 PM
I have a dedicated CMMG 22lr upper and even with the newest mags and BHO adapter my bolt holds open a little more than half the time. It looks like the follower just barely contacts the BHO adapter, which causes the follower to tilt backwards rather than lift up. If the BHO had a longer piece to be lifted up by the follower I bet this wouldn't be a problem.

I've also had two OOBs caused by the bolt not going fully into battery. They were a little scary but no damage to anyone or anything. Keep it clean, check the bolt is closing 100% every now and then, and always wear eyepro is the best you can do.

Overall I'm not thrilled with the kit, but it is pretty fun. If not for those flaws I'd probably love it, but as it is I just don't trust it.

evidens83
11-06-2012, 2:20 PM
I had the CMMG conversion. Thought it was fun for the first brick of ammo. Pretty finicky and FTE/FTFs a plenty. Great investment but I got bored of it. No recoil. Went back to centerfire and been a happy camper since.

Enfield47
11-06-2012, 8:59 PM
I just bought a CMMG conversion from Bass Pro Shops. I am having a terrible time with it jamming. It jams the bullet into the feed ramp and I have to hold open the bolt and pry out the round. I have tried Winchester bulk and Federal, same problem with both although it runs better with the Federal. When it works, it's great. I am going to have to contact CMMG to see if they can help.

TheExiled
11-06-2012, 9:01 PM
Make sure you arent riding the charging handle. You really have to let it fly on mine or it will ftf every time

Enfield47
11-06-2012, 9:08 PM
It's weird because it jams after 5-6 rounds, right in the middle of the mag. Sometimes the bullet is bent at an angle other times it just smashes the tip straight into the feed ramp.

Bull's_eye
11-06-2012, 9:53 PM
one of my reasons to have it is... for some girls to shoot my AR... some girls are totally ok with 223, but some don't like the recoil

What recoil?

Lead Waster
11-07-2012, 9:11 AM
It's nice to know there is a quality conversion kit available!

Personally, I bought a Marlin 795 for about that price so I have no need/desire for a kit, but it's good to know there is one that works.

Also a good point about having the AR in .223 mode in a bug out bag as well as the kit and some .22 ammo.

carb1a4h
11-07-2012, 11:35 AM
It's weird because it jams after 5-6 rounds, right in the middle of the mag. Sometimes the bullet is bent at an angle other times it just smashes the tip straight into the feed ramp.

came across this video last week when researching the CMMG 22 conversion.

HBnUXYkIE6I

I think the BassPro conversion is non-stainless, but the video addresses the issue you are talking about.

I opted with the full stainless steel conversion... some shop from AZ had it this past weekend at the Cow Palace gun show for $200 cash with 25round rebuild kit mag. I bought the "upgrades" from CMMG to make the "India" kit and also got 4 10round mags to be legit at the range

Hope that helps

shooting4life
11-07-2012, 12:14 PM
I built a dedicated spikes 22 AR. That way I can drop mags all I want without worryin about a bullit button. Got some mags on order. The plastic lip mags deformed at the lips causing FTF.
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/uu30/shooting4life/jordangunstuff002.jpg

Enfield47
11-07-2012, 8:39 PM
came across this video last week when researching the CMMG 22 conversion.

HBnUXYkIE6I

I think the BassPro conversion is non-stainless, but the video addresses the issue you are talking about.

I opted with the full stainless steel conversion... some shop from AZ had it this past weekend at the Cow Palace gun show for $200 cash with 25round rebuild kit mag. I bought the "upgrades" from CMMG to make the "India" kit and also got 4 10round mags to be legit at the range

Hope that helps
Thanks for the video carb1a4h. I have the stainless steel version and it is amazingly smooth. I don't know if it is a mag problem since I only have the one I can't test it. I might buy another 10 round one soon just to see.

Enfield47
11-07-2012, 8:43 PM
I built a dedicated spikes 22 AR. That way I can drop mags all I want without worryin about a bullit button. Got some mags on order. The plastic lip mags deformed at the lips causing FTF.
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/uu30/shooting4life/jordangunstuff002.jpg
How are getting around not having a bullet button? Is because rim fire rifles are exempt?

Pistool Jan
11-07-2012, 8:58 PM
How are getting around not having a bullet button? Is because rim fire rifles are exempt?

I am curious about this also. Does this mean when I am running a .22 Conversion I can slap on a magnetic button "tool".......doesn't seem right.

I also have the CMMG .22 Conversion in stainless and it works awesome. It does not like the Remington Gold ammo......Federal works all day long and accuracy is very acceptable at closer ranges. Of course the gun get's DIRTY!!! But hey........after you burned through a ton of 5.56 and you are eyeing your ammo box depleting......slap in the conversion and have fun all over again. Maybe take it out and fire a few regular .223/5.56 to "get the lead out".

I don't run mine a heck of a lot but when I do it is in my LMT CQB MRP 16" DI, as does my friend in his (same gun) and his Stag Arms also. No problems.

Get the stainless kit.

Enfield47
11-07-2012, 9:23 PM
I just saw the answer in another thread. If it is a dedicated upper for .22 then it isn't an assault weapon and no BB required. I don't know if the conversion unit counts as a dediacted upper though.

Don't use the magnet tool in CA. Save it for trips to a free state where you can leave it ached to your rifle and drop mags like normal.

Pistool Jan
11-07-2012, 10:15 PM
I'm down with that Enfield47. I can be a loose cannon and hell on wheels......but the older I get, the more responsible I get and I have two young daughter's....6 and 11......I don't want to tear up the family by getting a felony over some stupid issue like a BB or magazine violation.

BTW..... the Lee Enfield is my favorite boltie of all time. I remember when I was a kid, I was on a forced holiday with my cousins who lived in Sasolburg, South Africa. I was raised under the English system, and I was failing Afrikaans miserably in junior high school. So my parents in desperation sent me to relatives up country who hardly spoke English at all. They figured after a summer I'd have a better clue of the language. We traveled all over the Karoo and went into South West Africa, Namibia now. Wild country. It was very cool. Weeks on the road.....lot's of dirt road time in the Kalahari desert.

In the room I was initially given in their home there was a beautiful old Lee Enfield in the closet. My uncle's old service rifle...WWII.....I couldn't tell you what Mk.....model it was prolly a MkIV. I was friggen drooling man...... I asked my uncle if I could touch it and he said it was okay and cleared it...it was not loaded. So I got to fondle it a lot. Better than Playboy....I tell ya.:D

Later my own military service rifle was an FN-FAL in 7.62X51NATO (we just called them FN's...later they evolved into the R1) and I got to know it very well......all 10-11lbs of the danged thing. Shooting it was a dream....drilling and carrying it were a PITA. When drilling we used to hook the carrying handle in our web belt to take some of the weight...but were not supposed to.


I keep wanting to buy a Lee Enfield. I like Lee Metford's as well but not as much as Enfield's.

I seriously love.......

Lee Enfield's
Bren gun's
Sten gun's
Sterling SMG's
FN FAL's
Thompson SMG's

Sorry to go off. Enfield's have the reminiscing effect on me.

shadow65
11-08-2012, 3:35 AM
10 round only, at least on new mags.
CMMG does offer 10 round long bodied mags.
Dave N

wild_weasel
11-08-2012, 5:32 AM
Team,

Just ordered a couple 10x Black Dog w/steel lips (ouch!) for the CMMG SS 22 convertion kit I bought for my S&W MP-15 Sport. Since I do not get out to Angeles that often I'll be able to enjoy it at the FiringLine in HB.

Cheers,
W-W

Enfield47
11-08-2012, 8:53 PM
Wld_weasel, are the Black Dog 10 rounders or did you convert them? I have only seen the 25 round mags.

technique
11-09-2012, 12:19 PM
So far I've put a healthy amount of ammo downrange with the stainless kit without issue. I've been using mostly Gemtech 42gr. Subsonic ammo
Today the sear trip/anti-bounce weight came in and I'll see how well it works run FA. Awesome just got cheaper!
http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll42/technique408/photo_zps72cc731c.jpg

coldwater
11-12-2012, 9:54 PM
I been eyeing the S&W MP15-22 and then I read this thread. What's is the status on these 22 conversion kits? Which ones has good long term reviews and with which magazines? I don't mind spending a little more for a nicer kit. In the end I will be saving so much dough in ammo. Thanks calgunners.

wild_weasel
11-13-2012, 6:36 AM
Engield47,

They are 10 round magazines that look like 20 round 223 Magazines. Midway has them.

Wld_weasel, are the Black Dog 10 rounders or did you convert them? I have only seen the 25 round mags.

Cheers,
W-W

wild_weasel
11-13-2012, 6:39 AM
Coldwater,

Have a look at the reviews of the CMMG 22lr kit on YouTube. almost everything I have read is +.

I been eyeing the S&W MP15-22 and then I read this thread. What's is the status on these 22 conversion kits? Which ones has good long term reviews and with which magazines? I don't mind spending a little more for a nicer kit. In the end I will be saving so much dough in ammo. Thanks calgunners.

Cheers,
W-W

coldwater
11-13-2012, 9:42 AM
Coldwater,

Have a look at the reviews of the CMMG 22lr kit on YouTube. almost everything I have read is +.



Cheers,
W-W

I'm beating myself up on a 22lr, I cant believe it. I read in another post that my 1/7 twist rate is not correct for 22lr. Now I'm looking at complete a 22lr upper. CMMG has completes for 400 retail. So I'm back to the drawing board, SW MP15-22, CMMG dedicated upper, or Ruger 10/22. Its the gun madness.

wild_weasel
11-13-2012, 12:51 PM
I already have a pimped out Ruger 10/22. I want the conversion kit so I can use my new MP-15 Sport at the Firing Line. I have a Ciener 22 conversion for my 1911A1 too.

ufcfan83
11-13-2012, 12:57 PM
M&P 15-22. $429 - $469. Well worth it in my opinion. I enjoy mine when my daughter lets me shoot it lol.

TheExiled
11-13-2012, 12:58 PM
Today the sear trip/anti-bounce weight came in and I'll see how well it works run FA. Awesome just got cheaper!


Did you mean what I think you meant?

91 whiskey 209
11-13-2012, 2:29 PM
Sub.

Lifeon2whls
11-13-2012, 2:36 PM
Long term...I have the CMMG conversion. It was a bit rough during the beginning but its smoothed out quite a bit and once it did there have been no issues. The only problem I still have is that I don't have a loader for the mag so I have problems getting the last 1 or 2 rounds in and sometimes just run a 8 round mag.

defcon
11-13-2012, 8:08 PM
anybody selling theirs?

Enfield47
11-13-2012, 8:23 PM
Just order one, they aren't hard to find. Get the stainless steel version since they are supposed to run a little smoother than the phosphated ones. Bass Pro Shops has the SS kit for about $200.

sharxbyte
11-13-2012, 8:55 PM
One thing I dont like about my AR... it wont let me shoot .22 :(

Blacktail 8541
11-14-2012, 3:00 AM
How are getting around not having a bullet button? Is because rim fire rifles are exempt?

You got it, rim fires are exempt

Ninety
11-18-2012, 3:43 PM
Correct my if I am wrong but These WILL work on a piston system gun correct? I got into a little bit of a "discussion" today about it at my LFAS.

Just needs a little bit of grinding correct?

Paul053
11-18-2012, 6:33 PM
I recently bought a cmmg ar22 upper and absolutely love it. Now is there a way I can take the bolt in my 22 upper and slap on a part to get it to work in my ar15?

Losd619
11-19-2012, 4:26 AM
I recently bought a cmmg ar22 upper and absolutely love it. Now is there a way I can take the bolt in my 22 upper and slap on a part to get it to work in my ar15?

Yes, just remove the collar from the two arm things on the bolt and replace it with something like this

http://www.cmmginc.com/product_p/22ba4f1.htm

Dirty Monkey
11-19-2012, 6:54 AM
CMMG has awesome customer service. One part cracked and I emailed them, a couple of days later. They said send it in,will send you a replacement part. I have shoot over 2k rounds of 22lr in my BCM. Never a issue, love every minute of it.

Diskrete
11-19-2012, 7:35 AM
I am thinking of building my at with an upper from Taccom, dedicated .22lr uppers and lightweight too!

plug ugly1
12-24-2012, 7:11 PM
Does the cmmg work on any 556 barrel? Any further reports on a 1:7? Seems some say it works and others dont

Enfield47
12-24-2012, 7:21 PM
Does the cmmg work on any 556 barrel? Any further reports on a 1:7? Seems some say it works and others dont

If you are referring to the .22 conversion, then yes it will work just fine.

plug ugly1
12-24-2012, 10:48 PM
Yes the conversion. Was wondering if it would work specifically on my new to me franklin armory hsc-15

plug ugly1
01-02-2013, 1:14 PM
So anyone have any further info regarding a 1:7 twist with the .22's?

jchen76@gmail.com
01-02-2013, 2:23 PM
So anyone have any further info regarding a 1:7 twist with the .22's?

It depends on ammo. Have both 1 in 9 and 1 in 7 uppers. With wolf match, they are about 1 inch group with both twist rates. With federal bulk, both about 1.5 inch to 2 inch grouping. The 1 in 9 grouped better of the two all hitting with couple inches, with 1 in 7 was decent pattern with couple of fliers about 3 inches off. Shot on bench at 25 yrd target using 10 shot groups.

Edwood
05-29-2013, 6:06 PM
Just jailed an LWRC M6A2 SPR (1 in 7 barrel) and would like to use a CMMG Evolution 22LR bolt kit in it since I can't find reasonably priced .223 / 5.56 anywhere.

Problem is, no one seems to have it in stock with 10 Rnd mag or no mag, only the "high" Capacity ones that I can't have shipped to CA. :(