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gunsandrockets
10-21-2011, 12:41 AM
WTH?:eek:

I thought I was up to speed about pro-gun litigation, but I just heard about the case of Wilson vs Cook County which is an ongoing challenge to a nasty AW ban.

http://www.iml.org/files/pages/1733/1-08-1202.pdf

I had heard about the NRA challenge to the Washington D.C. AW ban but I hadn't heard about the Cook County case.

Silverlake223
10-21-2011, 2:32 PM
"and assault weapons are 20 times more likely to be used in
the commission of a crime than other kinds of weapons"

I think this is extremely incorrect! I think nation wide its like .5% or something low like that! Perhaps in Chicago they have a better class of criminal, but here in LA according to my LAPD friends, the only "assault weapons" they usually recover pertaining to the commission of a crime is a cheap SKS every once in awhile.

I was born and raised in Chicago, and would never go back there. Its a violent City, and the residents (in city limits) are unprotected except for the reactive thin blue line.

m03
10-21-2011, 2:43 PM
"and assault weapons are 20 times more likely to be used in
the commission of a crime than other kinds of weapons"

I think this is extremely incorrect! I think nation wide its like .5% or something low like that! Perhaps in Chicago they have a better class of criminal, but here in LA according to my LAPD friends, the only "assault weapons" they usually recover pertaining to the commission of a crime is a cheap SKS every once in awhile.

I was born and raised in Chicago, and would never go back there. Its a violent City, and the residents (in city limits) are unprotected except for the reactive thin blue line.

At the height of the AW FUD, AWs represented less than 3% of all guns used in crimes according to the FBI. It's been several years since I looked at it myself, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was 0.5% these days.

Nick Justice
10-21-2011, 3:24 PM
This was decided prior to McDonald. I hope the good guys get the chance to refute the hopelessly inaccurate statistics quoted in the decision.

safewaysecurity
10-21-2011, 3:30 PM
"and assault weapons are 20 times more likely to be used in
the commission of a crime than other kinds of weapons"

I think this is extremely incorrect! I think nation wide its like .5% or something low like that! Perhaps in Chicago they have a better class of criminal, but here in LA according to my LAPD friends, the only "assault weapons" they usually recover pertaining to the commission of a crime is a cheap SKS every once in awhile.

I was born and raised in Chicago, and would never go back there. Its a violent City, and the residents (in city limits) are unprotected except for the reactive thin blue line.

Well we first have to know wtf they mean by assault weapons. Also they probably manipulated the statistic so that they are more used as a percentage of the weapons of that type available if that makes sense. For example if in there statistic there are 1 million handguns and 100,000 are used in crime then 10% of all handguns are used in crimes. But if there are 10,000 "assault weapons" and 2,000 of them are used in crimes then 20% of all assault weapons are used in crimes and are therefore twice as likely to be used in crime. It's a complete bull**** statistic if you look at it that way but that's the way it is. They make it sound like most people being shot these days are getting shot with " assault weapons " when in fact it's a handgun over 80% of the time.

Stonewalker
10-21-2011, 3:33 PM
Looking for the data... but I'm at work and a bit limited. On average, 3% of crimes committed with a gun are committed with a rifle. The FBI does not keep records on AW-related crimes because there aren't enough to be statistically significant.

Nick Justice
10-21-2011, 3:36 PM
Well we first have to know wtf they mean by assault weapons. Also they probably manipulated the statistic so that they are more used as a percentage of the weapons of that type available if that makes sense. For example if in there statistic there are 1 million handguns and 100,000 are used in crime then 10% of all handguns are used in crimes. But if there are 10,000 "assault weapons" and 2,000 of them are used in crimes then 20% of all assault weapons are used in crimes and are therefore twice as likely to be used in crime. It's a complete bull**** statistic if you look at it that way but that's the way it is. They make it sound like most people being shot these days are getting shot with " assault weapons " when in fact it's a handgun over 80% of the time.

Right. Zimring tried to say that gun attacks were 20 times more deadly than knife attacks because 5% of gunshot victims died while 1% of knife victims died. It's dishonest statistic manipulation. Dishonest because it is not the whole truth.

krucam
10-21-2011, 3:41 PM
"and assault weapons are 20 times more likely to be used in
the commission of a crime than other kinds of weapons"

I think this is extremely incorrect! I think nation wide its like .5% or something low like that! Perhaps in Chicago they have a better class of criminal, but here in LA according to my LAPD friends, the only "assault weapons" they usually recover pertaining to the commission of a crime is a cheap SKS every once in awhile.

I was born and raised in Chicago, and would never go back there. Its a violent City, and the residents (in city limits) are unprotected except for the reactive thin blue line.

Misrepresentations like that abound in Chicago's response. They selectively term "assault weapons" as anything with more than 10 rounds. That means almost every Glock ever made...the "vs other kinds of weapons" would logically follow to be all the non-Glock (or Sig/M&P) handguns and legit bolt action Remingtons allowed.

I lived in Chicago for many years and get back there often to visit family there. I rarely feel unsafe in the Wicker Park/Humboldt Park/Lakeview areas. I would still pack if given the opportunity.

hoffmang
10-21-2011, 6:28 PM
This case is currently before the Illinois Supreme Court and many of us have very high hopes for the outcome.

-Gene

Dreaded Claymore
10-21-2011, 6:35 PM
This case is currently before the Illinois Supreme Court and many of us have very high hopes for the outcome.

If Gene and his fellows can have high hopes for a case in the Illinois Supreme Court, well then there must be good cause for optimism. :)

Andy Taylor
10-21-2011, 6:47 PM
If Gene and his fellows can have high hopes for a case in the Illinois Supreme Court, well then there must be good cause for optimism. :)

this :cool2:

hoffmang
10-21-2011, 7:06 PM
If Gene and his fellows can have high hopes for a case in the Illinois Supreme Court, well then there must be good cause for optimism. :)

Remember that the IL Supremes are not just Chicago.

-Gene

oni.dori
10-21-2011, 7:59 PM
"and assault weapons are 20 times more likely to be used in
the commission of a crime than other kinds of weapons"

I think this is extremely incorrect! I think nation wide its like .5% or something low like that! Perhaps in Chicago they have a better class of criminal, but here in LA according to my LAPD friends, the only "assault weapons" they usually recover pertaining to the commission of a crime is a cheap SKS every once in awhile.

I was born and raised in Chicago, and would never go back there. Its a violent City, and the residents (in city limits) are unprotected except for the reactive thin blue line.

At the height of the AW FUD, AWs represented less than 3% of all guns used in crimes according to the FBI. It's been several years since I looked at it myself, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was 0.5% these days.

I have seen sources citing that they represent >.07%, that's less than POINT-ZERO-SEVEN PERCENT. Less than ONE PERCENT of all violent crimes commited in the U.S. I can't remember exactly where I saw that, but I will see if I can find it again.

oni.dori
10-21-2011, 8:02 PM
Misrepresentations like that abound in Chicago's response. They selectively term "assault weapons" as anything with more than 10 rounds. That means almost every Glock ever made...the "vs other kinds of weapons" would logically follow to be all the non-Glock (or Sig/M&P) handguns and legit bolt action Remingtons allowed.

I lived in Chicago for many years and get back there often to visit family there. I rarely feel unsafe in the Wicker Park/Humboldt Park/Lakeview areas. I would still pack if given the opportunity.

You are right. The term "assault weapon" has been so convoluted, overused, misquoted, perverted, and inbred, that it can essentially mean anything they feel like twisting it in to being.

Ubermcoupe
10-21-2011, 8:13 PM
This case is currently before the Illinois Supreme Court and many of us have very high hopes for the outcome.

-Gene

Translatable outcome to help CA along? :)

ALSystems
10-21-2011, 11:36 PM
You are right. The term "assault weapon" has been so convoluted, overused, misquoted, perverted, and inbred, that it can essentially mean anything they feel like twisting it in to being.
Who really knows the definition...
http://www.ntsystemscal.com/download/other/firearms-identification-guide.jpg