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Ripon83
10-18-2011, 7:50 PM
Those of you preparing because you fear economic collapse I am sure pay attention to the crisis in Greece and their likely default. I don't know how to prove this, or where to look it up but I was told emphatically today that the Greek Government is offering a 180% ROI for its bonds - for one year - right now. Does anyone know if that is hyperbole or true? If you bought a "bond" for $1,000 of their dollars that in 12 months they'd return your $1,000 of their dollars and $1,800 of their dollars in interest? That sounds incredibly - bad - and eventually that is our fate in this country?

Taidaisher
10-18-2011, 7:54 PM
I think your math may be off a bit. If you pay $1000 for a bond, in 12 months, you would get $1800 back.
That's assuming that in 12 months they have the $1800 to pay you with.

smle-man
10-18-2011, 9:35 PM
Greece has been on the downhill slide for decades. It is an example of the entitlement mentality run wild. It has been trying to go communist since the civil war in the late 40s. Maybe they should have, they would have gotten it out of their system and emerged to be a truly modern country.

Ripon83
10-18-2011, 10:02 PM
Not if the stated interest is 180%. If the total return is 180 then yes, but I was told the interest offered was 180?


I think your math may be off a bit. If you pay $1000 for a bond, in 12 months, you would get $1800 back.
That's assuming that in 12 months they have the $1800 to pay you with.

EL_NinO619
10-19-2011, 12:43 AM
Ripon, I read your "are you ready" Kinda. Damn man you shop at Wal Mart a lot. I cant stand that place. It really has to be an extreme deal or need for me to go into that 3rd world country.

Kid Stanislaus
10-19-2011, 7:51 AM
I think your math may be off a bit. If you pay $1000 for a bond, in 12 months, you would get $1800 back.
That's assuming that in 12 months they have the $1800 to pay you with.

That's assuming there's any such thing as "Greece" left in 18 months!:rolleyes:

Kid Stanislaus
10-19-2011, 7:53 AM
Ripon, I read your "are you ready" Kinda. Damn man you shop at Wal Mart a lot. I cant stand that place. It really has to be an extreme deal or need for me to go into that 3rd world country.

Can't be as bad as going to Greece!:D

Ripon83
10-19-2011, 8:21 AM
Well thanks for reading. I hear you, I never shopped their till I retired last year, and started living on a fixed budget that had little room for things I like - like guns, ammo, and preparing. Shopping at Wal Mart has helped me obtain more preps then I otherwise would and save more money for good ammo buys and a few new guns this year. I get a lot of people can't stand them. They got their faults ( mostly incredibly poor quality junk stuff ) but in a bad situation even junk stuff might be better then no stuff.

Greece violence and protests made the news today. Its been going on for weeks but rarely gets coverage. 100,000 protesters out mid week.....that place is messed up. I wish those who want more more and more government would take a look a Greece right now and recognize there is a limit to what government can take - and still keep the private sector viable. My contact in Greece said the "elites" have been fleeing the country for three years and have left it behind - and thus are not paying the government any more taxes.


Ripon, I read your "are you ready" Kinda. Damn man you shop at Wal Mart a lot. I cant stand that place. It really has to be an extreme deal or need for me to go into that 3rd world country.

mcsoupman
10-19-2011, 9:45 AM
I think your math may be off a bit. If you pay $1000 for a bond, in 12 months, you would get $1800 back.
That's assuming that in 12 months they have the $1800 to pay you with.

No his math is correct but the info could be bad. $1000 with $800 return would be a 80% return. 180% return would be $1000 plus $1800.

Remember that is debt based printing. The way to pay you $1800 "profit" is to just print more paper money which will then make the $1800 worthless. Once we start talking thousands instead of tens and hundreds we are big trouble. Have you guys seen this video?

Secret of Oz (http://youtu.be/swkq2E8mswI)

Californio
10-19-2011, 9:58 AM
Greece is a Perfect example of Socialism. Once you create an Entitled Class, whether it is government workers, welfare recipients or crony capitalists - they are going to riot when you reduce their OPM (other peoples money) because it is human nature to rationalize that they are entitled and that you are stealing from them. OPM is addicting.

problemchild
10-19-2011, 10:40 AM
Funny

I cant , under threat of ban, post anything to do with the economy.

glockman19
10-19-2011, 10:42 AM
It's a game of "Chicken" Who will flinch first?

Germany & France or Greece....Both have lots to loose.

Value of Euro will get hammered either way IMHO.

IF, Greece fails then Spain, Italy & Portugal are not far behind...It's always been a game of "Kick-the-Can"...now we are all approaching a day of reconing.

Can you believe the price of Platinum? $1,520...Gold $1,645....Silver $31.30

Industrial metals are taking a hit today.

http://www.kitco.com/lfgif/pt0365lf_ma.gif
http://www.kitco.com/lfgif/au0365lf_ma.gif
http://www.kitco.com/lfgif/ag0365lf_ma.gif

nick
10-19-2011, 10:49 AM
No his math is correct but the info could be bad. $1000 with $800 return would be a 80% return. 180% return would be $1000 plus $1800.

Remember that is debt based printing. The way to pay you $1800 "profit" is to just print more paper money which will then make the $1800 worthless. Once we start talking thousands instead of tens and hundreds we are big trouble. Have you guys seen this video?

Secret of Oz (http://youtu.be/swkq2E8mswI)

Except for Greece can't print its own money, as it uses euro. That's one of the things many of the protesters there demand - that Greece starts printing its own money. That'll solve all of its problems... :rolleyes:

Vacaville
10-19-2011, 10:55 AM
Greece is going to default. It's just a matter of time before everyone stops bailing them out.

glockman19
10-19-2011, 11:01 AM
No his math is correct but the info could be bad. $1000 with $800 return would be a 80% return. 180% return would be $1000 plus $1800.

Remember that is debt based printing. The way to pay you $1800 "profit" is to just print more paper money which will then make the $1800 worthless. Once we start talking thousands instead of tens and hundreds we are big trouble. Have you guys seen this video?

Secret of Oz (http://youtu.be/swkq2E8mswI)

or....

you give them $1,000 and in return get $800...:D

Ripon83
10-19-2011, 11:47 AM
Well I hope this is more about "Survival" then "economy." I mean the people in Greece are rioting today, there is violence in the streets, and according to MSM a 100,000 marching on Athens. This is mid week. The unions are shutting the government down and all in all I think watching how people survive and maybe even prosper / or fail is intriguing to me - I would think anyone concerned about economic collapse as an issue for prepping would want to pay attention, discuss, and learn from this....hope that is an appropriate topic under "survival."


Funny

I cant , under threat of ban, post anything to do with the economy.

Maltese Falcon
10-19-2011, 11:59 AM
Greece is going to default. It's just a matter of time before everyone stops bailing them out.

The are just buying time to prepare the European banks (Read: German, French) who are owed all the money. Caveat emptor!

.

Maltese Falcon
10-19-2011, 12:01 PM
Our time will come soon enough...

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2011/10/20111019_Chart%20of%20Day%20IMF.png

chris
10-19-2011, 12:45 PM
IMO nothing will happen the Europeans won't allow it no matter what happens. there will some tricky scheme that will so called "prevent default" and Greece will repay all it's debts and so on. some loan guarentee from the IMF to prevent the default. and yes the entitlement mentality has caught up with them but will anything seriously happen to them i seriously doubt it.

and for the Euro nothing will happen to that overvauled currency. it should go the way of the do do bird and die but it won't the Europeans enjoy their dominance over our Dollar they can't let that go. and our FED is playing into that plan as well.

i say let the Euro die a fiery death and let the European countries return to their respective currencies before the Euro.

i read on Drudge that there will be a metting to save the Eurozone on sunday and that is the do or die day for them. we will see if Greece defaults and the Eurozone goes into the crapper.

chris
10-19-2011, 12:46 PM
Our time will come soon enough...

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2011/10/20111019_Chart%20of%20Day%20IMF.png

remember it's all Bush's fault and not Obama's.

ExAcHog
10-19-2011, 2:59 PM
Grease is the word
It's got groove, it's got meaning
Grease is the time, is the place, is the motion
Grease is the way we are feeling
...oh hell.....Is this thread not about the movie with John Travolta????

mcsoupman
10-19-2011, 7:24 PM
Except for Greece can't print its own money, as it uses euro. That's one of the things many of the protesters there demand - that Greece starts printing its own money. That'll solve all of its problems... :rolleyes:

Ok, I should have realized that :facepalm: In that case it would be near impossible for them to promise a yield that high. It could only happen as part of a scheme and not normal economics.

wheels
10-19-2011, 8:55 PM
Greece is going to default. It's just a matter of time before everyone stops bailing them out.

Germany may be preparing to bail on the Euro (http://www.moneynews.com/StreetTalk/Ex-BushAdviserGermanyPrintsOldCurrencyinCaseEuroDitch ed/2011/10/04/id/413225) as currency

DrRobert
10-19-2011, 9:01 PM
Ok, math is not everyone's strong suit I can see. If you invest $1000 in a bond and you receive 50% return=$500, a 100% return is $1000 back. A 180% is 100% =$1000 plus 80%=$800 which equals $1800. Not $2800, $3600 or anything else. To double check use the simple math equation $1000 x1.80 (180%) which equals $1800.

-Dr

cavemanlrrp
10-19-2011, 9:14 PM
Gee, maybe the EU could get some money from the discount window at the Fed. They could print a little $$$ and make every thing all better.

I wounder who owns all the that European debt that they been borrowing all these years?

Perhaps economic catastrophe is more predictable than a major earth quake or EMP etc.

Stay tuned.

Best luck
caveman

chris
10-19-2011, 9:20 PM
Germany may be preparing to bail on the Euro (http://www.moneynews.com/StreetTalk/Ex-BushAdviserGermanyPrintsOldCurrencyinCaseEuroDitch ed/2011/10/04/id/413225) as currency

hopefully the Euro will die with the Germans leaving it.

cpl_dan
10-20-2011, 12:21 AM
I took a trip back in June to London,France, Italy and Spain and all but London there were protests in the streets about the middle class disappearing ,shortage in jobs, politicians taking bribes, elitess/entitled mentality etc.. COUGH COUGH... I personally don't think SHTF to the scale that it will destroy the world economy but i do believe they all might go back to there own currency before the euro. The Euro is artificially over inflated by all the countries in the Eurozone. In theory the euro is great , being able to move currency around from one country to another without problems but as we can see ALL countries put themselves in a position that compromises good spending habits and soon puts themselves into a down hill spiral that they cant get themselves out of and then rely on other countries to pick up the slack. I never believed the euro would work and we can see that is it not. Like others say our time is coming if our government doesn't pull its head out its A** we will end up in a similar situation if not already.

problemchild
10-20-2011, 4:16 AM
remember it's all Bush's fault and not Obama's.

Guess who will be in office when we crash.

Secret plan:

Get a Marxist elected (D)(sacrificial Soros lamb) who will put the country into a crash mode
Allow Marxist (D) to lose run/vote for next term
(R) Gets elected and economy crashes completely
(D) All D's along with state run TV go on a 24/7 blitz blaming (R's) for destroying USA
(D's) Take over all elected offices and finish the USA forever with amnesty,supreme court nominees, gun bans, complete socialism etc.

ExAcHog
10-20-2011, 9:23 AM
Guess who will be in office when we crash.

Secret plan:

Get a Marxist elected (D)(sacrificial Soros lamb) who will put the country into a crash mode
Allow Marxist (D) to lose run/vote for next term
(R) Gets elected and economy crashes completely
(D) All D's along with state run TV go on a 24/7 blitz blaming (R's) for destroying USA
(D's) Take over all elected offices and finish the USA forever with amnesty,supreme court nominees, gun bans, complete socialism etc.

+1 So possible that it is scary!

Ripon83
10-20-2011, 10:05 AM
Or....Greece defaults which is a first domino. It takes down Italy and the Euro is cancelled as each nation goes back to its own form of currency, and the UN steps in to "HELP" out with its own new money - the green back - they have already studied it and are ready to issue any time they get a majority vote to do so. Its now the "Green Back" or the dollar as the worlds reserve currency, and as nations switch off the dollar to the GB between now and next November we fall into such a state of economic collapse that a constitutional convention is necessary for the "senate" and "white house" to issue a new constitution and put off elections.

Kid Stanislaus
10-20-2011, 11:02 AM
I cant , under threat of ban, post anything to do with the economy.

TSK! TSK! TSK! :D

Kid Stanislaus
10-20-2011, 11:06 AM
Well I hope this is more about "Survival" then "economy." I mean the people in Greece are rioting today, there is violence in the streets, and according to MSM a 100,000 marching on Athens. This is mid week. The unions are shutting the government down and all in all I think watching how people survive and maybe even prosper.............."

YES! It seems that even in the worst of times there are people who prosper. That's an intriquing subject for sure.

Kid Stanislaus
10-20-2011, 11:12 AM
Grease is the word
It's got groove, it's got meaning
Grease is the time, is the place, is the motion
Grease is the way we are feeling
...oh hell.....Is this thread not about the movie with John Travolta????

I'd heard there was sumpt'n wrong with the water up at Elk Grove, and now I'm convinced of it!!:eek:

chris
10-27-2011, 5:26 PM
anyone not surprised the Europeans saved themselves today? i'm not. they won't let it happen even though it should it didn't.