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Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 7:03 PM
Scenario: My mom is anti-gun. She believes guns are better off banned and nobody should be allowed to have a gun. Probably based off all the new reports she's seen about someone being shot and killed by either gang bangers or police. Or Innocent people being killed. I just received my exposed firearm permit to be an armed guard. Before receiving this permit and doing the training my mom didn't want anything to do with guns in her home or to hear about them. She's just barely gotten okay with the concept of me being an armed guard and possibly owning a gun at home. She's stressed plenty of times that safety is her primary concern. I understand that. She wants me to buy a safe, bolt it to the floor of my closet and make sure the safe has either a finger print lock or numeric keypad. She also wants the gun lock on the gun inside the safe. I told her the finger print safe is over kill. I have no problem buying a combination safe and bolting it to my floor.

Question: How do I get my mom relaxed with the concept of owning a gun. I'd like to take her to a Firing Range and see if she'll fire a gun, but she just doesn't want anything to do with it. So how can I get my mom more involved in guns and at least try to shoot one and get her more open? I'm not trying to get her to totally change her views on guns but not everyone with a gun is out to commit crimes and murder people. I just want her to not be so closed minded on them. Trying to word this as best as possible so you understand what I mean. I am all about safety. I've fired multiple handguns and performed e-checks/safety checks on each gun I've fired to make sure when I'm first handling it I don't shoot myself.

I hope I've explained this clearly and with enough information as I can.

Thanks, Steve

Maddog5150
10-15-2011, 7:07 PM
Try to educate her but some people just flat out refuse to be educated. There is an old saying, "A liberal is a Republican who hasnt been mugged yet."
Sad to say but if she doesnt budge but you are old enough to buy firearms you have two choices. Start stamp collecting or move out.
Women are funny though. They will not listen to boyfriends, husbands, sons or dads but if a total stranger tells them the same exact thing, they tend to listen. I used to work for FTA several years ago and we had a womens self defense course. You could try to sign her up for something like that or see if you can get a very pro gun female to just talk to her. Either way, good luck

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 7:14 PM
Thanks. I don't intend on changing her views on them, just trying to make her more accepting or open to the idea. She can have her views on guns are dangerous. For instance, she was just watching on the news about that Dekraai guy that killed 9 People at a Seal Beach Salon. She said thats why guns need to be banned to prevent things like this from happening. Yeah theres some crazy people out there, but whether guns are banned or not, someone will managed to get a hold of a gun one way or another. It's all in the eye of the gun holder. I'd consider myself a Smart Gun Owner (once I do get my gun). I'm gonna have it locked up and in my closet. It will be unloaded. Once I move into my own place, theres this gun safe I saw at the Ontario Gun Expo. It has a 4 digit combo and a quick release and a separate clip holder.

CSACANNONEER
10-15-2011, 7:21 PM
You've preformed e-checks? I really don't think so. e-checks are slang for a very specific reason that an LEO can physically verify if a firearm is loaded. If you are not a LEO, you do not have the authority to preform an e-check.

That said, I'm glad your mom is warming up to the idea that guns are not to blame for anything and that her previous thoughts were just those that were programed into her by the liberal media. Now, find some else, NOT YOU, to take her to the range and let her fire a few different types of firearms. You can be with her but, let someone else instruct her. Most people take instruction better from a non family member and it sounds like you are young and have extremely limited experience with firearms yourself. Why don't you post what part of the state you're in? I'm willing to bet that someone here might be able to take the time to give your mom a lesson or two.

Just ignore all the posts asking if she is single? Is she hot? etc.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 7:28 PM
I'm in California. I assumed e-check was a general term for making sure a gun was clear even though I know that LEO's perform P.C. 12031(e) Checks (or at least used to now that AB144 is in effect). I just meant an Empty Check/Safety Check. I'm 24. I have roughly a year in handguns (basic and safety mainly). I've fired Springfield 9mm, Glock 17 9mm, Glock 21 45, S&W 9mm & 45, Springfield XD45. That's pretty much it

CSACANNONEER
10-15-2011, 7:42 PM
Yea, a year, even if it's 8 hours a day, is very little firearms experience. California is a big state, I know I looked at your profile before asking for a general location. Did you just add it? Or, am I going crazy? Anyway, if she's up for it, I'm willing to meet the both of you at Angeles sometime and let her shoot a few different types of guns and several examples of each. If you want to take me up on this, talk to her first then, shoot me a PM and we can try to work out a time and day that will fit into all of our scheduals.

coyotebait
10-15-2011, 7:48 PM
I'm in California. I assumed e-check was a general term for making sure a gun was clear even though I know that LEO's perform P.C. 12031(e) Checks (or at least used to now that AB144 is in effect). I just meant an Empty Check/Safety Check. I'm 24. I have roughly a year in handguns (basic and safety mainly). I've fired Springfield 9mm, Glock 17 9mm, Glock 21 45, S&W 9mm & 45, Springfield XD45. That's pretty much it

What part of Cali? What city?


Oh, never mind.

Lone_Gunman
10-15-2011, 7:53 PM
Um, move out of Mommy's house, and let her be anti-gun. Move into your own house or apartment and be as (legally) pro-gun as you want to be.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 7:59 PM
Yes I just updated it along with my age. @Coyote: I'm about 35-40 miles from you.

@Cannoneer: Yes I agree. I never stated that I was an expert. I will definitely have to talk to her to let her know about it, even that she might be very hesitant as she might say "I don't know them, they could be crazy" or something like that. I would like to see her actually just shoot a gun to see what its like. I went to the Ontario Gun Expo last weekend and she made excuses just why she didn't want to go with me. She said $11 was too much and she didn't want to be bored while I looked around.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 8:01 PM
@Lone Gunman: Yes I agree I need to move out but I need a job first which ive been looking for. I'm still looking into expanding her mind about guns, regardless whether I continue to live with her or not.

johnthomas
10-15-2011, 8:11 PM
Scenario: My mom is anti-gun. She believes guns are better off banned and nobody should be allowed to have a gun. Probably based off all the new reports she's seen about someone being shot and killed by either gang bangers or police. Or Innocent people being killed. I just received my exposed firearm permit to be an armed guard. Before receiving this permit and doing the training my mom didn't want anything to do with guns in her home or to hear about them. She's just barely gotten okay with the concept of me being an armed guard and possibly owning a gun at home. She's stressed plenty of times that safety is her primary concern. I understand that. She wants me to buy a safe, bolt it to the floor of my closet and make sure the safe has either a finger print lock or numeric keypad. She also wants the gun lock on the gun inside the safe. I told her the finger print safe is over kill. I have no problem buying a combination safe and bolting it to my floor.

Question: How do I get my mom relaxed with the concept of owning a gun. I'd like to take her to a Firing Range and see if she'll fire a gun, but she just doesn't want anything to do with it. So how can I get my mom more involved in guns and at least try to shoot one and get her more open? I'm not trying to get her to totally change her views on guns but not everyone with a gun is out to commit crimes and murder people. I just want her to not be so closed minded on them. Trying to word this as best as possible so you understand what I mean. I am all about safety. I've fired multiple handguns and performed e-checks/safety checks on each gun I've fired to make sure when I'm first handling it I don't shoot myself.

I hope I've explained this clearly and with enough information as I can.

Thanks, Steve

In her mind, her baby boy is putting himself in harms way, with the job and the gun. If your job requires a gun, it would make sense to a "Mom" that if it were not dangerous, you wouldn't need a gun. You may want to look up some articles about home invasions, both ones that turned out bad for the home owners and the ones that turned good because of a home defense weapon.

CSACANNONEER
10-15-2011, 8:14 PM
I suggested meeting at a very public range for a reason. I could have suggested meeting at my place but, that would have made her nervous since, I live 3 miles behind a locked gate and up dirt roads. Hell, I don't know her either and we all know that all women ARE crazy. Anyway, I could bring a few different .22 handguns and rifles and a shotgun or two for her to try. Or, should we start her out with a 50BMG at 600 yards and a belt fed gun? Then again, I could always start her out with a flintlock.

bsg
10-15-2011, 8:21 PM
despite your mom's strong views against gun ownership... she appears to be more flexible than many parents that we read about here on the forum; she's instructing you on what her terms are in her home... regarding you having a gun in that home. she's told you to bolt a safe to the floor in your room, with the gun in safe. correct? it seems to me that you and gun ownership at home are moving right along. don't push the issue on your mom; she's already "budged" substantially on this issue imo. if anything... thank her for her understanding and trust she has in you. i believe this approach, rather than pressure... will keep your home a happy one. let your mom get used to having a gun in the house for awhile before trying to make her feel more "relaxed" about gun ownership.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 8:28 PM
I totally respect her in her home and her safety concerns are concerns of mine too. We have two grandkids (not my grandkids lol) that visit and I understand her worries. Thats not that issue, I guess I just want her to be more accepting and I just want her to support my hobbies and the stuff I like to do, Which has always been an issue ever since my parents divorced and my mom is remarried. I totally agree with you bsg, I think once I do own a gun, maybe she might even ask me about my gun and how it works. I'll lax' on any pressure and hope that she opens up and asks me some stuff on guns or would like to participate when I go to the gun range. Since my dad has never been around, theres that void where I would've asked my dad to go shooting with me, you know? Thanks again guys, I appreciate all your feedback (even criticism too).

MrPlink
10-15-2011, 8:31 PM
despite your mom's strong views against gun ownership... she appears to be more flexible than many parents that we read about here on the forum; she's instructing you on what her terms are in her home... regarding you having a gun in that home. she's told you to bolt a safe to the floor in your room, with the gun in safe. correct? it seems to me that you and gun ownership at home are moving right along. don't push the issue on your mom; she's already "budged" substantially on this issue imo. if anything... thank her for her understanding and trust she has in you. i believe this approach, rather than pressure... will keep your home a happy one. let your mom get used to having a gun in the house for awhile before trying to make her feel more "relaxed" about gun ownership.

this is the answer right here.

You are better off than most with "anti-moms"

My best friend bought a Mosin and Enfield the minute he turned 18 and had to hide them from his mother until he moved out.

Apec
10-15-2011, 9:02 PM
I saw a story in a comment in a long discussion on someone's facebook status. Someone sold a young man a Beretta 92FS, his dad found out and forced him to sell it to a cop - at a huge loss relative to what he paid.

Agreed that you're better off than most people with anti-parents. You can at least keep the gun at home, in the worst case, you'd be forced to keep it outside or dispose of it.

Rogue187
10-15-2011, 10:25 PM
Get a new mom....
I grew up in a household that was very anti-gun.
My parents wouldn't even allow me to have water guns..anything gun related.
After they found out my grandparents had guns and after my Grandfather explained why he had guns..my folks let up a bit..
Once I got old enough to purchase a gun, I did..then I became a armed alarm responder they had to relent. I moved out and never looked back..it was until someone tried to break into their house and them hearing it and my fathers yelling didn't scare them off did they realize that a gun may not be such a bad idea.
Some people need a rude awakening. I'm just glad nothing happened..
My dad is passed on now and my mom lives with my family now..she told me that she is well protected now..she knows that I have guns and knows how to use them along with my wife..that and the fact that we have a trained protection dog that likes to sit by her side..that dog somehow has an understanding and realizes she is afraid ..
But remember your mileage may vary..good luck and in time hopefully she will accept it, she may not like it but accept it..

JSolie
10-15-2011, 11:11 PM
Got Netflix? Start watching TopShot seasons 1 & 2. There are several posts in the TopShot thread about anti's becoming interested, and I personally know two people whose wives have swung from the position of "No guns!" to "Hey, that looks like fun!" because of that show.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-15-2011, 11:19 PM
No, But I have ThePirateBay! :D I have the first season of Top Shot on my 1TB and I have Sons of Guns Season 1. Just started watching American Guns on Discovery.

@Rogue Good to know! Thanks :) Should I post a personal's ad on craigslist seeking New Mom open to firearms? ;) haha My mom is cool but a conservative Christian and too liberal. Not that theres anything wrong with being Christian.

Anchors
10-16-2011, 2:14 AM
Just get her to go shooting any way you can. Make a deal with her about something else (I'll do this, if you come shooting. I promise it will be fun AND safe). Let her start on a .22lr. Once she loves it, she'll change her mind (I bet). :)

voiceofreason
10-16-2011, 4:07 AM
Get a GunVault type safe that holds more than one gun. About $110 or so.

The NanoVault is around $25. Only holds one, but is portable.

Do not allow ANYONE access to your key/code. You are responsible for your firearm and who gets a hold of it/how it is used.

Hopalong
10-16-2011, 5:32 AM
My view is that it is silly to think

"I need to expand my mother's mind"

She's entitled to her opinion.

And she already knows what yours is.

Move out, and live your own life

wheels
10-16-2011, 5:45 AM
despite your mom's strong views against gun ownership... she appears to be more flexible than many parents that we read about here on the forum; she's instructing you on what her terms are in her home... regarding you having a gun in that home. she's told you to bolt a safe to the floor in your room, with the gun in safe. correct? it seems to me that you and gun ownership at home are moving right along. don't push the issue on your mom; she's already "budged" substantially on this issue imo. if anything... thank her for her understanding and trust she has in you. i believe this approach, rather than pressure... will keep your home a happy one. let your mom get used to having a gun in the house for awhile before trying to make her feel more "relaxed" about gun ownership.

Great advice here IMHO.

Some things I would add is show your mother how a responsible gun owner behaves. Establish a routine for clearing and storing your weapon when you come home. Make a range trip to practice monthly or as often as you can, make sure she knows you take the responsibility that you carry a weapon seriously. Let her see you cleaning your weapon.

Then just let her curiosity get the better of her, if she has any real interest. It has been mentioned to have an outsider show her how to shoot - good advice, but she will have a distrust of gunnies so do it yourself unless an better option like someone she knows is also a gunnie. I'd caution about an indoor range, I had a close call with a sister once when a guy was shooting some monster handgun in the next lane - almost a non starter - she was almost out the door before the guy stopped with the cannon.

Watching an episode or two of Top Shot is also a good idea, just try not to seem obsessed.

You also may want to point out what happens when someone gets carved up by a knife regarding her idea of banning all guns. Frankly after seeing some graphic knife fight footage I'd rather get in a gunfight than get turned into lunch meat.

You have an opportunity to change an anti - it's possible from within the family circle, much harder from outside.

bruceflinch
10-16-2011, 8:23 AM
Get your Mom an Airpistol for Christmas!

17+1
10-16-2011, 9:11 AM
Can try to convince her, but if she's that far gone (liberal), just give up. She's had a lifetime of indoctrination, you can't change that with 5 minutes of facts.

Should get your own place if she's that anti-gun, since you plan to have a career where you will carry a gun daily.

Just me $.02...

erik_26
10-16-2011, 11:10 AM
Low pressure education.

Just like a shy dog might come out of his dog house a little towards you only to turn around and run back in. This might happen a lot. But each time the dog will get closer as long as you do nothing to jeopardize its trust. Overtime, that dog will make its way to you. (Not implying you mom is a dog... just an analogy.)

People have irrational fears. Everyone does. From spiders, snakes, rats, heights, water.... etc. Often there is no rhyme or reason for these fears other then ignorance.

Ignorance is simply lack of education.

Other fears are developed from a traumatic experience. These fears are must harder to fix as the trust has been broken.

Firearms are especially taboo for several bad reasons.

For starters, from the time we where kids, most of us were taught to stay away from them. If we were to see one, we were to not touch it and find an adult. We were taught that if we touched it, it could kill us or someone else.

Over the course of your lifetime (unless growing up in a household with parents that are firearm enthusiasts) they are only seen in the hands of bad guys on TV, cops in the street, and hunters in the wild.

Since exposure is rare, you are become overly sensitive the sight of one.

Just like a rattlesnake. You only see them on TV, in books, almost never in your day to day life. So in the off chance you encounter one, your adrenalin kicks in and your senses over load (flight or fight).

Now, if properly educated you know that the rattlesnake will not chase you down, bite you, and watch you expire to the wounds it inflicted. If properly educated, you know to leave it be. You will know that if you are in a survival situation, you can kill it and eat it.

The difference between the Rattlesnake and a Firearm is...... the Rattlesnake can think and act on its own will. A Firearm can not. It requires interaction/manipulation with a human. Thus, a Firearm is only as dangerous as the person handling it (like a car, boat, plane, stove, bbq, shower, knife....ect).

With proper education/training, one can successfully handle both a Rattlesnake or a Firearm without negative consequences (though the risk is always there).

Personally, given the choice, I would pick to handle a Firearm because it does not have an instinct for self preservation resulting in a potential bite.

Millions of rounds are fired from Firearms without incident. There are far more good, responsible Firearm owners/users then bad.

Unfortunately, the bad Firearm owners/users get the tube time. Which is a segway into my next part of the rant.

The media doesn't help anything. They are in the business to sell their product. And like a shady used car salesman, they will prey on your emotion to make the sale.

No one wants to read about nothing. Example, Johnny got a LTC at age 24, carried his whole life, never has to use his Firearm, during all his lifetime of shooting never hurts himself or anyone, then passes of natural causes in old age.

People want to read about the gang bangers that are in a turf war shooting up the neighborhood. They want to read how the chief of police and mayor are passing more gun control. They want conflict. That is what sells.

Or to place in another perspective, no one wants to read about how an 'SUV' drove from home to work and back home without crashing and killing anyone day in and day out. They want to read about the scary big gas guzzling late 90's dark blue 'SUV' that loses control and plows into a crowd of people killing a family of 4...... Oh, my god..... the horror. Who is the owner of this 'SUV'? How could they let this inanimate object lose on the streets?

The fact is, there many, many dangerous objects people interact with every day. But because they are not hidden from view or only seen on TV, we become desensitized. When we become desensitized we become complacent. What would normally make us uncomfortable or trigger our flight/fight , doesn't.

Because Firearms are not seen every day, out in the open, the general population is not desensitized.

The best way to debate with someone, is to take something they can relate to and spin it around on them. Always stay calm and cool. Never get excited. Take a hobby they enjoy, mention how you don't like it, but you don't solicit for laws to be passed to control it. Nor do you demand they stop their hobby because you don't like it or are ignorant to it. Point out the part of their hobby that is dangerous (if they like painting for example: getting paint in the eye, fumes, indigestion... etc. How if a child came across their paint supplies and drank the red paint that looks like cool aid would die.)

Just stay calm and cool. You will not win in your first battle with them. Be prepared for many, many small easy calm, low pressure debates.

It took me 1 year with my wife. I was able to go from: "no one needs guns" & my guns under lock and key at my dads, to moving them to our house with a safe, buying more guns, taking her to the range, her wanting her own, and she even debates with others in favor of guns and is advocating for less gun control.

Your results may not be the same. But you should be able to build trust and tolerance if nothing else.

FeelthySanchez
10-16-2011, 4:53 PM
A typical nurturing mom scenario, so pls proceed w/ caution mate, 'cuz "old habits die hard".

Have ya considered:
1) Taking her to the range for some controlled introductory therapy (reactive/fun/mild shooting activity)
2) Electro-shock therapy
3) Moving-out

Merc1138
10-16-2011, 5:33 PM
I guess I'm lucky that my mostly liberal unionized guaranteed to vote democrat never been hunting never been outside of an urban area Mom isn't afraid of guns.

"So Mom, I just picked up a gun from my 10 day wait"
"WHAT?!"
"Uhh, I bought a gun"
"Yeah I got that. What did you get, I wanna see"

If she really is anti gun, either move out or take her to the range on a day that isn't as busy.

Apec
10-16-2011, 5:39 PM
Can try to convince her, but if she's that far gone (liberal), just give up. She's had a lifetime of indoctrination, you can't change that with 5 minutes of facts.

Should get your own place if she's that anti-gun, since you plan to have a career where you will carry a gun daily.

Just me $.02...

This. In the most extreme cases, some people are so far gone that even if they go through a life-threatening experience, they will still distance themselves from guns and embrace the belief that their home alarm system and police are sufficient for their needs.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-16-2011, 5:46 PM
@erik: Good Write Up Man! Lots of great positive input :)

@Feelthy: Definitely going for Number 3. Trying to find a Armed Guard Job that is actively hiring so I can move out. Step dad is kind of a douche anyways.

@Merc: Yeah i'm gonna work on just seeing if she'll go to the Firing Range with me even just to watch if she doesn't wanna to fire, maybe she'll have questions that'll intrigue/peak her interest. Also working on moving out as a definite option :)

She did go to the range to watch as I qualified, so I guess that'd be sorta breaking the ice. She dropped me off but ending up coming in to watch when I qualified towards the beginning of 2011. I didn't do too bad on the shooting either.

First time at the range to qualify (I've shot maybe 3 times before that, I'm left handed however I'd shoot with my right hand then I switched to my left hand and started firing better) As you notice the shots on the outsides were from my right hand:

http://i55.tinypic.com/qq1xld.jpg
Firing range results 235/250. Deducted 15 points for missing three bullets. 50 Bullets were fired.

santacruzstefan
10-16-2011, 8:13 PM
My mom used to be the same way, wouldn't even consider having one in her house. As I got older, and my gun obsession grew, she began to change. When I bought my first AR, I had the upper shipped to her house, and she inspected it with fascination. When I bought my Glock 17, I brought it over there, and she held it, and tried aiming at a plant in the corner. Now, a couple years later, she has changed. We're going shooting on my birthday next month, and she wants we to get her a pistol for Christmas. So the change can happen if you give it time. Also, give her reasons to value firearms. In my mom's case, it was the threat of burglary and the collapse of civilization. For yours, it might be something else.

Syst3m Ov3rrid3
10-16-2011, 8:55 PM
My mom used to be the same way, wouldn't even consider having one in her house. As I got older, and my gun obsession grew, she began to change. When I bought my first AR, I had the upper shipped to her house, and she inspected it with fascination. When I bought my Glock 17, I brought it over there, and she held it, and tried aiming at a plant in the corner. Now, a couple years later, she has changed. We're going shooting on my birthday next month, and she wants we to get her a pistol for Christmas. So the change can happen if you give it time. Also, give her reasons to value firearms. In my mom's case, it was the threat of burglary and the collapse of civilization. For yours, it might be something else.

Dude i totally agree with you. Maybe I can bug her to take me shooting for my birthday. :]

Purple K
10-16-2011, 9:58 PM
Show Mom page 10, The Armed Citizen, in any of the monthly NRA magazines. True stories of good honest folks using guns to defend themselves.

mkkeele
10-16-2011, 10:18 PM
Just show her this video.

wypFgcqHyvc

CrossedRifles
10-16-2011, 10:24 PM
My mom was the same. She thought guns went off by themselves all the time for some reason. So I asked for a calm discussion and asked if I could educate her on how a gun works, what a magazine was and how the firing pin strikes a primer and etc. She still hasn't agreed to come with me to the range and shoot but she's completely fine with me cleaning my firearms on the table. She used to be icky when I even brought a firearm into the room. Hope your situation gets better.