PDA

View Full Version : Amsec Garage RCS Questions


Mael
02-09-2007, 9:31 PM
I'm looking at buying a Amsec BF7240 (http://www.amsecusa.com/gun-safes-BF-main.htm) to put in my garage and I have a couple of questions.

I told the sales guy that I wanted to bolt it down to the floor and he recommended that I put it up on a couple of 4x4's and bolt it through those into the concrete slab. He said it would prevent the bottom from rusting if I ever get water on the floor or if moisture develops. What do you guys think? Is this normal for an RSC installed in a garage?

The other question I had was about the thickness of the side walls of the safe. The sales guy said the sides were composed of 2 layers of 1/8" steel with poured DryLight insulation in between. I know the sides are filled with DryLight insulation, but can anyone confirm the thickness of the steel? The Amsec website is a little vague on this point.

BillCA
02-10-2007, 9:39 AM
Can't answer your question on the wall thickness, but WRT raising the safe off the floor, there are pros & cons.

Raising the safe on 2x4's, where you drill through the wide part of the 2x4 for the bolt holes, will allow air to circulate to dry out moisture which can rust the bottom of the safe over time. It also provides a 1 3/4" gap under the safe where tools and small parts can roll(!). :mad: This gap can also be an inviting "attack point" for theives and they may damage the safe trying to pry it off it's mounting bolts.

If you have your water heater in the garage and the pressure valve pops open, you'll have 40 gallons of hot H2O in your garage. If the safe is anywhere near that, there will be the possibility of water entering the safe. (also consider if it happens while you're away, that hot H2O will turn into cold running water once the tank empties).

When a neighbor's 36" wide safe was installed, it was placed on 2x4's run between the bolt holes (each board had 2 holes in it). To block off the space, two more 2x4's were added between the mounts with about four 1/4" holes drilled through the narrow ends for ventilation. Thus the safe sits on wood all the way around it's base.

Additionally, neoprene squares were cut with holes for the mounting bolts and these glued to the 2x4's before the safe was mounted. Inside, each bolt had a neoprene gasket put over the hole, then a washer, then the mounting bolt or stud was inserted. These neoprene gaskets were used to prevent moisture from entering through the bolt holes. (Neoprene gaskets were hand made by the owner.)

Plan ahead and ask a lot of questions. Pay the extra to have it professionally installed as they will do all of the work, including leveling the safe. Ask your dealer if they have a paper template so you can pre-drill holes in the floor if you want to do that. Be sure of your clearances so your safe can be opened with the car in the garage and that it is not below or near any vents to the outside.

Mael
02-10-2007, 11:21 AM
Bill, Thanks for the great advice.

It's good to know that raising up the safe isn't uncommon. When the sales guy first proposed raising the safe off the floor, my first reaction was the same as yours 'that could be an attack point'. Since my water heater isn't in the garage, I'm not worried about that. I could see water from the hose outside getting into the garage. My other concern is that the garage is brand new and the slab was only poured 6 months ago, so I bet there is still moisture coming off the slab as it continues to slowly cure. I think I will follow their advise and raise the safe. Rather than letting the installers supply the lumber, I will get some nice pressure treated lumber and cut it myself. I also like the idea of putting a piece across the front.

Prying up this safe would probably be pretty difficult given its size and weight (1305 lbs)

surprised
02-10-2007, 4:53 PM
What do people think of plywood? It is not as high, and does not provide ventilation, but I think it would provide a barrier from the concrete floor. It also does not provide an attack point.

If it does get wet, however, I don't see how it can be replaced without moving the safe, whereas the 2x4s could be replaced one at a time by using a jack.

Another solution is using a vapor barrier (plastic sheet) for concrete. I know they are used in the construction industry.

naimad
02-10-2007, 5:13 PM
You could use some thick neoprene mating you can get this stuff cut to size and in differrent thickness using the 2x4s could make it easier to break loose from the mounting points

rkt88edmo
02-10-2007, 5:14 PM
Lots of RSC reading over on thehighroad.org . I would go with a 3/4" piece of plywood trimmed to fit my safe's footprint.

cyberhh
02-10-2007, 10:54 PM
What about pouring a concrete area the size of your safe footprint +15%. That would prevent water damage to the safe. It would also give a secure base without allowing easy tool access.

1SGMAT
02-11-2007, 2:37 AM
I saw a cut out side wall and corner to the AMSEC safes up in Chico. The steel is very thin but it is backed up with the 2" of concrete. I still am not sure this is the way to go. I have heard of the safes rusting from the inside because the concreat (drylite) holds moisture. The safe sure feels and looks like the most sturdy around.

BillCA
02-11-2007, 10:42 PM
I would have thought a neoprene base pad to be a good idea too, but it's not.

Neoprene will form a moisture barrier under the safe itself, between the safe and the neoprene. Neoprene, compressed like this, doesn't breathe very well so moisture could still be a corrosion issue.

The 2x4 solution is inexpensive and will provide good ventilation to keep things dry.

Mael - you might try to find some paint to match the safe (as close as you can) and paint your wood first. Then build your rectangle or square and drill the holes. You can use simple corrugated fasteners to tie the wood together since the load will be vertical. You can add some cross-venting holes in the wood if desired. If spiders & critters are an issue where you live, sprinkle a small bag of cedar shavings in the void under the safe to repel them.

Oh, drill the vent holes an odd size (e.g. 7/16") so few bolts/tools fit the holes easily (leaves marks if someone tries).

Electricity! Don't forget, if you want to power a dehumidifier and/or lights inside your safe you can run wiring under the safe if desired. You may need an electrician's help

socalsteve
02-13-2007, 4:11 PM
I don't think the amsec bf7240 is 2 layers of 1/8th inch steel - The outside is 10 gauge (1/8th) but the inside is thinner - unless you buy an upgrade. I was looking at them a couple months ago. Phone Deans Security in LA (sorry I deleted the link already) they will know.

I like the idea of using 4x4's because you get more clearance for water. I would definetly use treated lumber.

The problem with wood is that it can be chopped away and then the bolt cut or grinded off pretty easily - can you find some metal to reinforce it? Maybe a couple of small I beam pieces?

1305 lbs isn't hard to move when you put a pallet jack under it - Harbor Frieght tools sells a 2 ton jack for around $100 - on a concrete driveway it would be a snap to move.

I recently bought a safe and had it put in a spare bedroom and I put three 4x6's under it so its about 3.5 inches off the ground but it weighs over 3,700 lbs so I'm no too worried about it being carted away.

BTW, 3 guys + myself and a regular 2 ton pallet jack + a 4 ft bar + plywood & metal plates got it moved in. To steal it a pallet jack would be enough because theives don't care if they mess up the floor going out.

If I was a thief I wouldn't even try to break into it in the garage I'd haul it away.