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View Full Version : Gold and Silver getting hammered again.


k1dude
10-04-2011, 12:07 PM
Gold keeps bouncing off resistance at $1,600. If it keeps bouncing it'll eventually penetrate it at this rate.

Silver popped the resistance at $30 and is now in the high $28's.

If it keeps dropping I'm going to have to start buying. But it still has a way to go before I jump back in.

problemchild
10-04-2011, 1:39 PM
People who print Fiat are trying to diminish the value of PM's in order to dissuade the masses from moving away from Fiat.

There is NO solution to the mess these people have made. The only fix is to reboot. When the reboot comes gold and silver will be king and Fiat will be worthless. Greece collapse could trigger the dominos falling.

When silver hits 125/ounce I will trade it for a log cabin in UT/ID

Ripon83
10-04-2011, 1:52 PM
Silver's base I think is $25/$26 right now. It does surprise me that with stocks getting hammered silver would decline, but then again stocks rebounded and then silver went lower today. Gold seems to be set above $1600 though I think $1500 is possible.

There are a lot of people that think deflation is just as possible as "inflation." I'm one of them. If they continue to print money of course inflation will result some time, but if they stop the value of the dollar will increase and cause metals to decline. This is even more true with the dollar being needed by those carrying debt - to pay it off. The Euro is adding pressure to this - the dollar is stronger than the Euro and the later is in trouble due to bank woes there and Greece leading the collapse.

So long as the world has no other currency but the dollar as a reserve I think we are economically viable; once that change occurs $125 silver will be cheapo.

scarville
10-04-2011, 2:02 PM
I think this drop is from highly leveraged investors taking profits and the recent "panic" to buy dollars. Au and Ag were liquidated because they were among the few winning investments for the year. Hopefully, getting the weak investors out will encourage more stability in the PM markets.

wheels
10-04-2011, 3:27 PM
Anyone want to share who they use to buy gold & silver? Recommendations?

Ripon83
10-04-2011, 3:51 PM
Over the past year I have purchased bullion from Apmex, Craigslist, and eBay.



Anyone want to share who they use to buy gold & silver? Recommendations?

SMOKEYMOUNTAIN
10-04-2011, 3:53 PM
Anyone want to share who they use to buy gold & silver? Recommendations?

I have the same question. I tried to order some off kitco, but the min purchase is $1,000. I still may use kitco, but I would like some feedback from others who have purchased from that site.

Yesterday I was calling pawn and coin shops in my local area (west los angeles), and it seems like they are charging between $3.50 - $5.00 above spot for Silver Eagles and Maples. Is that the average going rate?

SMOKEYMOUNTAIN
10-04-2011, 4:03 PM
Found this site: www.apmex.com

$50 min order.

Chaparral
10-04-2011, 4:57 PM
I've bought from APMEX, Kitco and for those in So Cal, there's California Numismatic Inc on Manchester Blvd a few blocks east of the 405 in Inglewood.

Palladium is starting to look pretty interesting...it had hit 810 earlier in the year and now its down in the mid 5's...hard to believe that's what I used to pay for Au..

Ripon83
10-04-2011, 5:03 PM
To me apmex.com is the best mail order retailer. I have seen them routinely offer silver at $1.00 over. You will notice however they charge less in premiums per ounce if you can manage a 20 ounce or larger order. Still - get on their free email list and once in a while they send out an offer of silver a .99 over on any quantity.

I advertise on craiglist that I'm paying 88% of coinflation.com for pre 1964 coins and I get a few inquiries once in a while; when I advertise 90% I get more and if I advertise 92% I run out of money buying decent silver pre 1964 coins. I would not pay over spot for these; they are readily available below spot. Some people think that is because coins do loose weight with usage (wear).....I think its because people want to sell bad enough.

eBay....I am careful, won't buy from any buyer without a solid reputation, and typically buy 'sets" of coins that are complete. Sadly its hard to get a value there. I get out bid twenty x to one.



I have the same question. I tried to order some off kitco, but the min purchase is $1,000. I still may use kitco, but I would like some feedback from others who have purchased from that site.

Yesterday I was calling pawn and coin shops in my local area (west los angeles), and it seems like they are charging between $3.50 - $5.00 above spot for Silver Eagles and Maples. Is that the average going rate?

wjc
10-04-2011, 5:18 PM
Make sure you know what the ask/bid prices are before you buy!

I got burned on that once.

btw, if it goes lower I may tap my cash reserve to buy more silver.

problemchild
10-04-2011, 6:09 PM
Anyone want to share who they use to buy gold & silver? Recommendations?

Nice mom and pop run shop. Been there for eons.

http://www.libcoin.com/

Maltese Falcon
10-04-2011, 6:13 PM
Anyone want to share who they use to buy gold & silver? Recommendations?

I have use the Nucleo exchange for years with no problems.

http://www.bulliondirect.com/nucleo.do

.

gnatnoop
10-04-2011, 7:15 PM
Anyone want to share who they use to buy gold & silver? Recommendations?

i like scottsdalesilver.com

GMG
10-04-2011, 7:36 PM
Have delt with this outfit before, no problems.

http://libertycpm.com/

Kid Stanislaus
10-04-2011, 8:18 PM
I think this drop is from highly leveraged investors taking profits and the recent "panic" to buy dollars. Au and Ag were liquidated because they were among the few winning investments for the year. Hopefully, getting the weak investors out will encourage more stability in the PM markets.

^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^

Kid Stanislaus
10-04-2011, 8:20 PM
Over the past year I have purchased bullion from Apmex, Craigslist, and eBay.

I don't know who/what Apmex is but buying PMs from anybody but a reputable dealer sounds risky to me.

Ripon83
10-04-2011, 9:12 PM
http://www.apmex.com/

Pretty sure apmex is reliable. On eBay I stick to coin sets. Sets as a whole haven't been showing up on counterfeit reports just individual coins. There is only one set I covet anyway and apmex is even sold out of it at this moment. There are usually a couple on ebay. Pre 64 silver can be counterfeit ... we all know it's out there but I stick to dimes and quarters mostly. I doubt there are significant numbers of those that are bad in the market, and post SHTF I suspect the date on the coin is what would matter.

NorCalRevolver
10-04-2011, 9:17 PM
Provident metals sells junk silver at $.09 over spot per ounce, with no minimum purchase. Good place to purchase from in my opinion.

k1dude
10-04-2011, 9:17 PM
I don't know who/what Apmex is but buying PMs from anybody but a reputable dealer sounds risky to me.

APMEX is highly reputable. Craigslist and EBay, not so much.

donger
10-04-2011, 9:25 PM
Gold keeps bouncing off resistance at $1,600. If it keeps bouncing it'll eventually penetrate it at this rate.

Silver popped the resistance at $30 and is now in the high $28's.

If it keeps dropping I'm going to have to start buying. But it still has a way to go before I jump back in.

Comex in collusion with the big banks are keeping PMs artificially low. Shake out the weak hands...

Maltese Falcon
10-04-2011, 9:38 PM
Comex in collusion with the big banks are keeping PMs artificially low. Shake out the weak hands...

Yep, scare the sheeple that real money is an "illusion". Read: Buying opportunity. Stack it high and wide. Stay thirsty my friends.

.

xrMike
10-04-2011, 9:46 PM
Au back over $30 (as of this post), but just barely:

http://www.kitconet.com/charts/metals/silver/t24_ag_en_usoz_2.gif

DTOM CA!
10-05-2011, 9:52 AM
I think it is kind of weird that Platinum is over $100 cheaper than gold. It was once twice as expensive as gold.

scarville
10-05-2011, 10:25 AM
I think it is kind of weird that Platinum is over $100 cheaper than gold. It was once twice as expensive as gold.
Platinum (Pt) is perceived primarily as an industrial metal whereas Au and, to a slightly lesser extent, Ag are seen as "money". That perception makes a big difference in hard times.

SMOKEYMOUNTAIN
10-05-2011, 10:53 AM
Great info fellas. Bump it.

paul0660
10-05-2011, 12:51 PM
Make sure you know what the ask/bid prices are before you buy!

ONLY quote worth noting. Tons of money are made every day on the spread, AND IT IS NEGOTIABLE.

Seriously, find some California real estate instead. Thank me in ten years.

Ripon83
10-05-2011, 1:48 PM
Paul is right, CA real estate is getting to the bargain mode. I've just entered escrow on a second condominium and expect a solid 9% ROI from rents and I won't be asking "to much" in rent either. The one I bought in December is making 7.75% right now and will forever - I don't have to care if it drops 50% in value I'm getting my return so long as the rents hold up and I think they will. Eventually, maybe, someday, if SHTF doesn't happen they'll actually go up in value but I don't have to care.

OHOD
10-05-2011, 4:08 PM
The only reason it isn't skyrocketing now is that it is being manipulated. Tsk, tsk.

I'll be back into buying Ag and Au soon enough. I'm actually looking at some good bargains in stocks that I will sell later ...... Just like I did with Ford.:43:

-DJtHL3NV1o

wjc
10-05-2011, 5:31 PM
ONLY quote worth noting. Tons of money are made every day on the spread, AND IT IS NEGOTIABLE.

Seriously, find some California real estate instead. Thank me in ten years.

California land is too expensive for me right now. I also don't expect to stay here forever so I'm hoarding assets for when I bail.

audiophil2
10-05-2011, 8:53 PM
Don't let market prices scare you off from PMs. There is an enormous amount of manipulation going on with paper metals. Soon the link between paper trading and physical will be broken.

Some points to consider:

Qatar just announced plans to invest $10B in gold mining activities in Europe including Greece.

France is now requiring any metals purchases (not just AG and AU) over E450 ($600) to go through an ACH transaction.

Austria has limited its citizens to $15,000 worth of gold purchases per transaction.

The Perth mint vehemently denied accusations that it was out of 2012 1 oz. silver dragons and a few weeks later stated the production run was already sold.


The issue is that paper metals are being suppressed at a time when physical demand is increasing. The day silver dropped to $25/oz dealers were flooded with silver purchases.

Silver has been sitting along the 50% retrace since 9/26/11. It can still fall to the 4 year trendline at around $25. If it reaches that trendline then it is not projected to go back up to $30 until January 2013. If the trend gets broken then the next support is around $18.

dustoff31
10-05-2011, 9:32 PM
Don't let market prices scare you off from PMs. There is an enormous amount of manipulation going on with paper metals. Soon the link between paper trading and physical will be broken.

On a related note, I see that CME has raised margins on copper again today. Do you expect a gold and silver margin increase within the next few days?

audiophil2
10-05-2011, 9:51 PM
On a related note, I see that CME has raised margins on copper again today. Do you expect a gold and silver margin increase within the next few days?

Without a doubt. Eventually gold and silver will be 100% cash only on COMEX. I did some charting the last 30 minutes and actually see potential for a major break out in both gold and silver even with margin hikes.
I am going to update my previous analysis and say with 100% confidence that $26 is the bottom for silver. The daily chart shows indicators that the rise is about to happen.
Gold has even more potential and I am confident in my $250 ($2500/oz) SEP2012 GLD calls.

Also to note, I have purchased an undisclosed number of Bank of America put options. BAC cannot hold <$5pps much longer and will fail soon. THe trendline I drew out weeks ago is showing BAC curving down from the line daily with less upmove strength.

Seriously, a global QE3 is in the works. Fridays NFP could give guidance on how soon it will occur. Wall street and the WH will need to make this happen over the holiday season when no one really cares about the world dumping $2-3 trillion into the garbage chute.

I really want to be wrong on all this. I will gladly take the flames.

dustoff31
10-05-2011, 10:01 PM
Without a doubt. Eventually gold and silver will be 100% cash only on COMEX. I did some charting the last 30 minutes and actually see potential for a major break out in both gold and silver even with margin hikes.
I am going to update my previous analysis and say with 100% confidence that $26 is the bottom for silver. The daily chart shows indicators that the rise is about to happen.
Gold has even more potential and I am confident in my $250 ($2500/oz) SEP2012 GLD calls.

Also to note, I have purchased an undisclosed number of Bank of America put options. BAC cannot hold <$5pps much longer and will fail soon. THe trendline I drew out weeks ago is showing BAC curving down from the line daily with less upmove strength.

Seriously, a global QE3 is in the works. Fridays NFP could give guidance on how soon it will occur. Wall street and the WH will need to make this happen over the holiday season when no one really cares about the world dumping $2-3 trillion into the garbage chute.

I really want to be wrong on all this. I will gladly take the flames.

You'll get no flames from me. I think you are spot on. The holidays would be good timing, assuming that Europe doesn't go belly up before then.

DrRobert
10-05-2011, 10:44 PM
I use the 'Gold Mine' in Irvine great prices (very little mark up) mom and pop and they have a great supply.

the holidays are where **** is going to hit hard, major companies revising hiring, no money equal no Christmas.

Also this could have lead to some of silvers decline, that is a lot of silver http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2011/09/230m-in-silver-found-in-ww2-shipwreck-off-ireland/1?csp=34news

-DR

five.five-six
10-05-2011, 10:52 PM
wheww.... thought I missed my chance to get more silver.... I think I will buy at $22... but tomarrow, i am buying apple

Ripon83
10-05-2011, 11:05 PM
It is a big find, but I don't think it impacts the market much. Not really a silver impact but a copper/gold mine in Alaska is being kicked by the environutjobs and Indians up there in a ballot right now. They predicted about $1.1 billion a year in the metals hitting the market - for 80 years but its likely no one will now touch it. So that "amount" found on the ship (realize were talking gold vs silver but) seems kind of small.

Besides it was reported that S.Korea was buying gold and silver now instead of dollars \ treasury notes. $25 billion worth this year....that's 100x that ship load....and that is ONE country. Mexico, Venezuela (hugo nationalized gold companies in the last 3 months), and others are buying metals big time. Analyst have even noted that Chinese and India "families" now reaching "upper" middle class hood are buying jewelry in such quantity it could impact the gold market....


I use the 'Gold Mine' in Irvine great prices (very little mark up) mom and pop and they have a great supply.

the holidays are where **** is going to hit hard, major companies revising hiring, no money equal no Christmas.

Also this could have lead to some of silvers decline, that is a lot of silver http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2011/09/230m-in-silver-found-in-ww2-shipwreck-off-ireland/1?csp=34news

-DR

chris
10-06-2011, 5:17 PM
People who print Fiat are trying to diminish the value of PM's in order to dissuade the masses from moving away from Fiat.

There is NO solution to the mess these people have made. The only fix is to reboot. When the reboot comes gold and silver will be king and Fiat will be worthless. Greece collapse could trigger the dominos falling.

When silver hits 125/ounce I will trade it for a log cabin in UT/ID

the chance of the roboot that i believe you are hinting will not happen period. people will not resort to violence to reboot this country. and yes i agree with you that this country needs to get back to the Constitution as it is written. we have drifted way off from what the founders intended for this nation.

we know who is directly responsible for this and i need not point them out. they are the ones that are so intrenched in the beauocracy they will all but impossible to get rid of.

Ripon83
10-06-2011, 6:11 PM
Actually a "reboot" is entirely possible but not likely because of the powers that be. I've long argued they need to issue copper, silver and gold coins in dollar currency where the dollar value of the coin is higher than the precious metals. None of this $1.00 Eagle crap that we have today - a one ounce silver coin should be about $100 in present value. They could do smaller silver coins for $50 and $20's. They could do copper coins for $1, $5 and $10's. Gold for $500, $1,000 and $2,500. This would be the equivalent of printing money but what the heck - they are printing money anyway! At least if the dollar is devalued the people holding this will have something, and if the dollar deflates its equal to a piece of paper and works! It would be a win win and help middle America have a chance during monetary swings - especially severe one's.

stix213
10-06-2011, 6:21 PM
http://goldprice.org/charts/history/gold_2_year_o_usd.png

Gold prices appear to have dropped back down to where they should be before resuming their steady controlled climb IMO. You can practically draw a straight line there ignoring the momentary spike that has since receded.

audiophil2
10-06-2011, 10:09 PM
$33.50-33.70 is a very important area in the next few days. If silver breaks above that a big run is very probable. At its current speed this area could be hit by late afternoon tomorrow however the typical London paper shorting at midnite will most likely delay the break until next week.
Either way, my daily chart is showing a setup much bigger than the last run to $49. So much so that $50 may be cracked after several $8 swings by end of year and as early as Turkey day.
This is getting interesting.

audiophil2
10-07-2011, 9:10 AM
Here is some good info for survivalists regarding silver.

The CFTC releases what is called the COT (commitment of traders) every Friday from positions held on the close of trading on Tuesday. There are several categories of traders but the focus is on Large Speculators or the Commercials. Large speculators are hedge funds while commercials are the actual bullion banks such as JPMorgan. The COT looks at who is long (wants silver up) and who is short (wants silver down or is hedging their longs). Right now the net COT (long commitments minus short commitments) is at its lowest since 2008. This occurred after the recent selloff of silver. One can deduce from this observation that the large speculators and banks have considered $26 as the bottom and have liquidated their short positions. Last time this occurred silver was at $11/oz. That floor is long gone and $26 is the new bottom.

Another interesting report is the monthly silver sales by the US Mint. In 2011 the peak was 6mill oz in January. Each month after that was 2-3 mill oz per month until September (when silver fell) which went over 4 million ounces. October is already at 1 million ounces in the first three business days. At this rate October could see 7 million ounces sold and extrapolated it could expect 40 million ounces for the year. The mint struggled to produce 38.5 million ounces of silver in 2010. Either the mint halts sales before 2012 or it imports silver to mint coins.

link to CFTC COT report:
http://www.cftc.gov/dea/futures/deacmxlf.htm

Link to US Mint silver sales:
http://www.usmint.gov/mint_programs/american_eagles/index.cfm?action=sales&year=2011#SilverTotals

Just some food for thought.

TonyKat
10-17-2011, 11:19 AM
So American silver dollars still the best bet to be ready for a devalued US dollar?

Ripon83
10-17-2011, 12:02 PM
Not sure what you mean by "best for" a devalued US Dollar. If the US Dollar devalues any silver item would go up in value. Devalue suggests to me you mean inflationary which is good for silver and gold products. Deflate however would be the opposite - that means the dollar gains value and commodities will lose. Either one - or both - could happen.

US Silver Dollars have a certain amount of silver content, and people trust them for that content - that is good. Check out http://www.coinflation.com for the exact content and current value related to silver prices. I personally don't stock a lot of silver dollars (maybe 50). I prefer either smaller items (dimes/quarters) for trade/barter or silver bullion pieces like the Canadian Maple Leaf or American Eagle

scarville
10-17-2011, 1:09 PM
Gold prices appear to have dropped back down to where they should be before resuming their steady controlled climb IMO. You can practically draw a straight line there ignoring the momentary spike that has since receded.
Yep!

I watch for these spikes as a chance to sell some of my GLD or SLV stock then buy a few days later at the lower price. I usually end up with about a 10% to 20% increase. The trick is recognizing when it's a spike instead of an brief acceleration in the increase.

dave3223
10-17-2011, 7:24 PM
Provident metals sells junk silver at $.09 over spot per ounce, with no minimum purchase. Good place to purchase from in my opinion.

+1000. I used to use APMEX until I found this place. 90% silver coin prices are outstanding and can be purchased in increments of only $1.00. Also, prices of 40% half dollars are UNDER spot. Granted, it's only 40% however this is how I began purchasing silver before moving up to 90% and 1 ounce coins and rounds.

dave3223

SVRider
10-18-2011, 9:30 AM
Silver producers are hedging against price declines?

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/silver-stocks-volatile-as-asian-demand-deteriorates-2011-10-18

problemchild
10-18-2011, 10:15 AM
Originally Posted by NorCalRevolver View Post
Provident metals sells junk silver at $.09 over spot per ounce, with no minimum purchase. Good place to purchase from in my opinion.


Weights of worn coins are not the same as new coins. Are they selling by weight or by coin? If the bags are weighed then its a good price. If weights are guessed based on new coin weight then its bad.