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View Full Version : Bud's Won't Ship Off Roster Handguns to Valkyrie Anymore, FYI


Iggy
09-30-2011, 11:22 AM
I just ordered a midsize M&P45 from Buds to be shipped to Valkyrie for single shot conversion but got denied. I spoken with Lisa at Valkyrie to confirm that they had received off roster pistols from them before, but apparently Bud's just changed their policy not to ship off roster guns to CA unless you are a LEO.

So just a heads up, this is not to talk down on either shop since Buds has really good prices.

Reply from Buds:

Mr. XXX:

Your request is not unreasonable, although at this time we are maintaining
a strict adherence to the California DOJ list of approved firearms in order
to limit liability against infraction to state and federal regulations. W
e have received multiple requests similar to yours, but are not able to acc
ommodate these requests at this time. Hopefully in the future, our policie
s will change with the changing regulations, I apologize about the inconven
ience. Let me know if you would like to change to another item or simply c
ancel the order for a refund in full and I'll be happy to take care of you.

Although it is not illegal to ship non rostered guns to CA, it's their policy.

gotshotgun?
09-30-2011, 2:54 PM
Man this sucks. Such BS. Buds' prices are too good.

mrdd
09-30-2011, 5:06 PM
Can't Valkyrie just do the purchase from Bud's? I.e. you pay the FFL and Bud's ships to the FFL. FFLs are allowed to stock items to sell to LEO off roster.

Colt-45
09-30-2011, 5:13 PM
Misleading title. Bud's wont ship off roster handguns to Valkyrie anymore, but they still will ship on roster guns to them right?

bwiese
09-30-2011, 6:12 PM
I'll have to give them a ring.

zod
09-30-2011, 6:38 PM
Wow. I tried to do the same thing with the same pistol from Buds too. I got denied also. But I ended up buying the M&P 45 midsize from Grabagun. They shipped to Valkyrie with absolutely no problems.

Bigtwin
09-30-2011, 6:39 PM
I'll have to give them a ring.

:D Why do I like reading that statement!

morrcarr67
09-30-2011, 6:55 PM
Go get 'em Bill.

jonzer77
09-30-2011, 6:56 PM
Wow. I tried to do the same thing with the same pistol from Buds too. I got denied also. But I ended up buying the M&P 45 midsize from Grabagun. They shipped to Valkyrie with absolutely no problems.

I had never heard of grabagun. Was it a pretty smooth transaction?

Iggy
09-30-2011, 7:01 PM
Man this sucks. Such BS. Buds' prices are too good.

I know! Their prices are fantastic!

Can't Valkyrie just do the purchase from Bud's? I.e. you pay the FFL and Bud's ships to the FFL. FFLs are allowed to stock items to sell to LEO off roster.

Buds will not ship off roster pistols unless you are an LEO and they have your credentials on file. I was specifically told they will not ship off roster handguns to CA with the intention of being modified to comply with ATF regulations. I told them the roster is part of the CA DOJ and there is nothing illegal about shipping an off roster pistol to Valkyrie, but again was told it was decision of the owners at this time.

Misleading title. Bud's wont ship off roster handguns to Valkyrie anymore, but they still will ship on roster guns to them right?

Sorry fixed that. Yes, on roster pistols are GTG.

Wow. I tried to do the same thing with the same pistol from Buds too. I got denied also. But I ended up buying the M&P 45 midsize from Grabagun. They shipped to Valkyrie with absolutely no problems.

Yeah I just bought a used full-size from someone here on CG since new ones are hard to get. I hope Buds will give me my refund quickly.

Ubermcoupe
09-30-2011, 7:06 PM
I'll have to give them a ring.

I was hoping you'd say that.
I like buds; had nothing but good service thus far.

sammy
09-30-2011, 7:06 PM
:( So which dealers will ship off list guns to California? I am shopping aorund for an off list Baer and have had no luck.

missiondude
09-30-2011, 7:13 PM
Had the exact same issue with Buds last month. I was going to use DAS in San Diego to single shot a M&P 40L. Not only would they not ship the gun to DAS, they would not ship to a middleman FFL in Arizona. Really pissed me off, but I had a friend in PA buy the gun for me. Cost me an extra $70 in FFL fees and shipping, but it was still a good deal on a gun that is impossible to get anywhere at this point.

Cyc Wid It
09-30-2011, 7:39 PM
:( So which dealers will ship off list guns to California? I am shopping aorund for an off list Baer and have had no luck.

Pretty sure both Hammonds and Crazy John ship to CA... dunno why you would buy new from anywhere else.

echang86
09-30-2011, 8:08 PM
Pretty sure both Hammonds and Crazy John ship to CA... dunno why you would buy new from anywhere else.

Got links to either? Google came up with nothing for Hammonds. Found a website cj1911heaven.com for Crazy John, but it doesn't work.

mrdd
09-30-2011, 8:12 PM
Wonder if our lovely DOJ threatened the owners of Buds?

zod
09-30-2011, 8:24 PM
I had never heard of grabagun. Was it a pretty smooth transaction?

Grabagun (http://grabagun.com/)is located in Texas. I had heard good things about them from other CGers, so I gave it a try. I did not explain the single shot process to them. Just gave them Valkyrie's info and everything was good to go. No hitches what so ever. Keep in mind though, you do have to pay shipping, dros, tax and the single shot fee.

Cyc Wid It
09-30-2011, 8:24 PM
Look over @ 1911 forums, username Hammond. If Crazy John's website is down I'm sure it's for maintenance. Hammond is easy to reach via phone or PM. John you pretty much have to call and be prepared for a long conversation. If you get in on one of his sales you won't be sorry... $1750 for TRS with 1.5" guarantee etc.

yzernie
10-01-2011, 8:18 AM
There are a couple distributors that will make us commit to LEO only sales for off roster handguns or they won't ship either for "liability" reasons. I've tried several times to get them to change their policy but to no avail. I tell them it is for an LEO and once I get the gun I ship it to Valkyrie.

yzernie
10-01-2011, 8:49 AM
I'll have to give them a ring.
I doubt you will have any better luck than the hundreds of us California dealers who have already contacted them. They told me (us) they have the new policy and their company policy can be whatever they want it to be. So, if you have any better luck than the rest of us, please let us know!!

MrExel17
10-01-2011, 9:20 AM
Good to know, thanks for sharing. Change the title though it is misleading!

cortayack
10-01-2011, 10:05 AM
Yeap, thanks for the infomation.....

nameless
10-01-2011, 2:51 PM
I've bought from U.S. Firearms Academy (http://www.usfirearmsacademy.com/) in Reno, NV an off roster gun and had it ship to Valkyrie Arms. I didn't mention anything about roaster or sse and it was no problem. They are actually pretty good guys and was very pleasant experience to buy from them.

beetle
10-01-2011, 4:24 PM
usually I just ask if an out of state dealer is set up with CFLC and not mention the roster at all. I've had pretty good luck so far, even getting two or three out of state dealers to get set up and use CFLC.

But recently I tried to order a gun from Top Gun Supply. they had the same policy as Bud's, wouldn't ship an off-roster gun unless I could prove I was LEO.

I found the gun somewhere else (cheaper too!), bought it, and it has already been delivered to Valkyrie. I then took the extra effort to call the original salesperson at Top Gun Supply to let him know that I ended up buying from a competitor who had no issues shipping to California. I wasn't smug or an *** about it, just wanted him to know that they lost a pretty nice sale because of their policy which a competitor was only too happy to scoop up. In the end it probably won't make a difference, but perhaps if they realize how many sales they are loosing it might wake mgmt up.

dcrew1x
10-01-2011, 4:33 PM
I had never heard of grabagun. Was it a pretty smooth transaction?

I ordered an FNH SLP 12 guage shotgun and FN Five Seven from them. Smooth transaction no issues. I had them send the guns to T&A Armory in Santa Ana. I haven't tried off roster guns though

Akers
10-01-2011, 4:40 PM
Depending on how far your willing to travel, there are options in San Diego area.

chiselchst
10-01-2011, 4:40 PM
I'll have to give them a ring.

FWIW, They also would not ship an off-roster to Table Rock Arms, in OR, because as the buyer - I had a CA address.

But Ryan at Table Rock turned me on to grabagun.com, and they did ship to him, and it was $100 less than Buds. I like Buds, and tried to explain to them the sales they were missing out on, but did not seem interested when I attempted to provide more info...

Until Bud's changes their policy, I'd suggest using grabagun.com, and the prices were $100 lower in my recent purchase.

Iggy
10-01-2011, 6:00 PM
I wish I would have known about grabagun before i bought a used one. it would have been cheaper and exactly what I wanted.

:(

carnelianbay
10-01-2011, 6:08 PM
I'll have to give them a ring.

I went through this with Buds before. It had to do with their automated entry order system, not Valkyrie.
My story is here: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=442358

Talk to Nick. They did eventually ship it

CSACANNONEER
10-01-2011, 6:09 PM
At least Bud's is upfront about it being their policy. I'm glad I live in America where both people and bussinesses are FREE to do many things including making policies including ones that I don't agree with. Anyway, if they don't want the bussiness, don't give it to them. It's that simple. Personally, I respect (not like) their right to have this policy and every red blooded American should agree with me.

GoingQuiet
10-01-2011, 10:34 PM
There are plenty of internet retailers (myself included) that will handle a sale like that. Buds just happens to be the most high profile of the bunch.

Just take a look around. I'm sure you'll find someone in the firearm business to take your money.

g17owner
10-02-2011, 1:06 AM
Buds is only good for pictures of guns i want to see before i buy. other than that if they went under tomorrow I could care less.

tvfreakarms
10-02-2011, 1:09 AM
Is it cheaper to buy from a dealer that can convert the pistol for you in cali or have it ordered online and send it to a cali dealer to have it converted? While paying all the fee's?

Munk
10-02-2011, 10:54 AM
this is disappointing. Perhaps someone should get the owners to keep a running tally of all the legal-yet-denied sales they're missing out on so they can see how they're boning themselves.

CSACANNONEER
10-02-2011, 11:03 AM
this is disappointing. Perhaps someone should get the owners to keep a running tally of all the legal-yet-denied sales they're missing out on so they can see how they're boning themselves.

Why? They can crunch their own numbers. Afterall, they were selling off roster guns to Ca so, they know how much they were making. Now that they have CHOOSEN not to, they will have those numbers too. As long as they do not infringe on your rights,, sometimes you just need to respect the rights of others and how they choose to run their bussiness. In this case, Bud's is not infringing on anyone's rights. They are just deciding how they want to run their bussiness and where they want to ship what to. It's their loss, not anyone else's. There are plenty of other dealers who are itching at the chance to make a sale. Just go with one of those dealers and F the rest of them!

ALSystems
10-02-2011, 12:25 PM
Buds has gone to the dark side. :(

Inquirer
10-02-2011, 1:47 PM
I think the reason we're all shaking our fists is cause they had consistently good prices. Guess Grab-A-Gun (http://grabagun.com/) or Gun For All (http://gunforall.com) is getting my business now. Unless, of course, somebody knows of a good shop in LA that has as good a price on CZ SP01's and 75's.

--Inq

GoingQuiet
10-02-2011, 6:17 PM
The other thing to consider here is that when you buy a gun from Buds - in many cases you are actually buying a gun from Sports South, a distributor of firearms. In many cases, Buds will never handle the firearm.

So, the CA sale restriction could be because SS does not want to ship to CA - not that Buds has a problem with it.

Munk
10-02-2011, 9:04 PM
Why? They can crunch their own numbers. Afterall, they were selling off roster guns to Ca so, they know how much they were making. Now that they have CHOOSEN not to, they will have those numbers too. As long as they do not infringe on your rights,, sometimes you just need to respect the rights of others and how they choose to run their bussiness. In this case, Bud's is not infringing on anyone's rights. They are just deciding how they want to run their bussiness and where they want to ship what to. It's their loss, not anyone else's. There are plenty of other dealers who are itching at the chance to make a sale. Just go with one of those dealers and F the rest of them!

I know.

They have a right to do business as they please.

Perhaps the owners just followed some ill-informed advice and cut it off because of some illusory liability for complying with CA's laws. Maybe they never bothered compiling the list of handguns that were sold to CA that are off-roster because it would have been annoying to separate them from OTHER CA-legal sales.

I believe they got some bad advice and that if they knew the scope of the losses in conjunction with the truth of the legality of the issue, they would resume sales.

armygunsmith
10-02-2011, 9:44 PM
I'll have to give them a ring.

This is good.

ironcross
10-02-2011, 10:18 PM
Dude, Buds wouldn't even help with the mag issue. They only had G22 3rd Gen blue label and were not getting any white labels anytime soon. I asked them if they could take out the 3 high caps for 2 10rders for the same price or I had to pay a little more for 2 10rders.

NOPE, didn't want to touch it. They said they CAN'T do that...

GoingQuiet
10-02-2011, 11:43 PM
Dude, Buds wouldn't even help with the mag issue. They only had G22 3rd Gen blue label and were not getting any white labels anytime soon. I asked them if they could take out the 3 high caps for 2 10rders for the same price or I had to pay a little more for 2 10rders.

NOPE, didn't want to touch it. They said they CAN'T do that...

Likely due to my previous post. With large volume outfits like this, special requests are impossible.

Munk
10-03-2011, 3:05 PM
Dude, Buds wouldn't even help with the mag issue. They only had G22 3rd Gen blue label and were not getting any white labels anytime soon. I asked them if they could take out the 3 high caps for 2 10rders for the same price or I had to pay a little more for 2 10rders.

NOPE, didn't want to touch it. They said they CAN'T do that...

I've been told that bud's isn't so much a distributer, as a sales outlet. They take orders, take their cut, then have the item dropshipped to the customer or receiving FFL.( Your local FFL may be able to order from them, then do the swap for you (this would depend on the FFL being willing to, having the mags on hand, and they may charge you extra).

Drop shipping: Basically they maintain a minimal inventory or their own (like most gun stores) but have access to distributors with much larger inventories. Since the distributor has the item in stock, bud's lists themselves as having it. When you buy from bud's, they pay their wholesale price to the distributor, and then the item is shipped from dist. to you (or rather, your FFL.)

Lead Waster
10-03-2011, 3:07 PM
Can't Valkeries order whatever Buds can? Sure it'll cost you more, but since you are willing to do a SSE, you don't mind, right?

hcbr
10-03-2011, 3:44 PM
Damn sorry to hear about that, hopefully they'll have a change of heart and start shipping it again, otherwise, it's a shame they won't , because i'm with everyone, their prices are great!

CSACANNONEER
10-03-2011, 4:21 PM
Dude, Buds wouldn't even help with the mag issue. They only had G22 3rd Gen blue label and were not getting any white labels anytime soon. I asked them if they could take out the 3 high caps for 2 10rders for the same price or I had to pay a little more for 2 10rders.

NOPE, didn't want to touch it. They said they CAN'T do that...

I think blue labels are LEO ONLY guns where the excise tax has not been paid on them. If I'm right about that, Bud's or any other FFL can't sell them to non-LEOs with or without any magazines in them. So, if I'm right, Bud's is correct in telling you that they can't do it and you are wrong for trying to get them to commit a criminal act.

Munk
10-04-2011, 1:17 AM
I think blue labels are LEO ONLY guns where the excise tax has not been paid on them. If I'm right about that, Bud's or any other FFL can't sell them to non-LEOs with or without any magazines in them. So, if I'm right, Bud's is correct in telling you that they can't do it and you are wrong for trying to get them to commit a criminal act.

That is amazingly useful to know.

Would it be possible to pay the excise tax on them as a consumer in order to allow them to be released for public sale?

mrdd
10-04-2011, 2:35 AM
I think blue labels are LEO ONLY guns where the excise tax has not been paid on them. If I'm right about that, Bud's or any other FFL can't sell them to non-LEOs with or without any magazines in them. So, if I'm right, Bud's is correct in telling you that they can't do it and you are wrong for trying to get them to commit a criminal act.

Do you have a reference for that? My understanding is that the blue label program is simply a marketing program offered by Glock for retail sales to certain persons. In order to be exempt from FET, the sale has to be made by the manufacturer directly to a state or local government for the exclusive use of a state or local entity.

CSACANNONEER
10-04-2011, 7:15 AM
Do you have a reference for that? My understanding is that the blue label program is simply a marketing program offered by Glock for retail sales to certain persons. In order to be exempt from FET, the sale has to be made by the manufacturer directly to a state or local government for the exclusive use of a state or local entity.

No I don't. That's wehy I said "I think". Anyway, I was hoping that a FFL would jump in and either confirm or correct my statement.