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View Full Version : Provisions of sub divisions? Intrafamiliar transfer questions


SocalShooterX
09-29-2011, 10:09 AM
First, wtf is provisions of subdivision? It says something along the lines of knowledge of sale,transfer, or loaned to avoid the provisions of subdivision.

Secondly, my sister is moving her with Florida, I want her to do an intrafmiliar handgun transfer up to our father down to me when she gets here. I dont want any weird red flags popping up or her getting in trouble because I missed something in the lawbooks.

Any thoughts, ideas, or suggestions?

Thanks

bwiese
09-29-2011, 10:37 AM
That phrasing is employed to say, in a more formal way, that you just can't bounce a gun up & down your California family tree (say, from cousin->uncle->grandparent->you) to get to a point where an FFL-free intrafamily transfer to you is actually possible.

Now if the family transfers are happening outside CA and between non-CA residents, that's separate and under the laws of that state and generally irrelevant to above.

....when the gun is finally with an out of state person that can transfer it to you (grandparent, parent, child, grandchild) then that person ships the gun to a CA FFL and runs an "interstate intrafamily transfer". This allows non-Rostered handguns to legally get to you.

Sometimes it's just easier to do a single-shot exemption.

SocalShooterX
09-29-2011, 10:41 AM
Ok great! I get the Interstate part, but she's moving here and I was gonna transfer it here rather than do an interstate transfer.
If we transfer it up and down in a few months will that cause any sort of trouble?

bwiese
09-29-2011, 11:17 AM
Ok great! I get the Interstate part, but she's moving here and I was gonna transfer it here rather than do an interstate transfer.
If we transfer it up and down in a few months will that cause any sort of trouble?

Again, my explanation of what that clause said indicates that you shouldn't bobble it up & down the family tree to you within CA/btwn CA residents.

While in theory she could be unhappy with her gun and Dad could get it and then be unhappy and then you get it, it still smells un-kosher.
I didn't realize your dad was in CA, though one step is probably OK.


What kind of gun is this?

Librarian
09-29-2011, 11:17 AM
ETA - no, I didn't see CA father either, I thought it would be FL father.

Cleaner legally to do the sister-father thing out of state.

Otherwise, it's CA-sister to out of state father (interstate transfer), then out of state father to CA-you (a second interstate transfer, using CA intrafamilial).

SocalShooterX
09-29-2011, 1:34 PM
What about doing a intrafamiliar up to him, and then when I turn 21 next year I do a person to person from him?

Librarian
09-29-2011, 1:37 PM
What about doing a intrafamiliar up to him, and then when I turn 21 next year I do a person to person from him?

That would work very well.

SocalShooterX
09-29-2011, 2:00 PM
Ok, and now what about when they move here and haven't set themselves up as cifornia residents yet? They're gonna be staying with our cousin, should we still do regular intrafamiliar transfer?

NealDA
09-29-2011, 2:18 PM
....when the gun is finally with an out of state person that can transfer it to you (grandparent, parent, child, grandchild) then that person ships the gun to a CA FFL and runs an "interstate intrafamily transfer". This allows non-Rostered handguns to legally get to you.

Sometimes it's just easier to do a single-shot exemption.

I called the DOJ on this matter a while back, I was told by them, if I was able to physically receive the weapon from my father (back in Illinois) then I can just drive/fly back with it and file the OPLAW form once I got into the state and not be required to pay any FFL fees or wait the 10 days, only the $19 for the OPLAW.

Librarian
09-29-2011, 2:23 PM
Ok, and now what about when they move here and haven't set themselves up as cifornia residents yet? They're gonna be staying with our cousin, should we still do regular intrafamiliar transfer?

They? Sister and father?

New residents must register their handguns within 60 days of moving here OR they can transfer those handguns via PPT or intrafamilial transfer to a CA resident in lieu of registering. One needs a CA ID to participate in a PPT, and since a PPT uses an FFL, the buyer/receiver/transferee must be 21 for handguns and have the Handgun Safety Certificate.

See the wiki -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Moving_to_California_with_firearms

Mssr. Eleganté
09-29-2011, 8:07 PM
I called the DOJ on this matter a while back, I was told by them, if I was able to physically receive the weapon from my father (back in Illinois) then I can just drive/fly back with it and file the OPLAW form once I got into the state and not be required to pay any FFL fees or wait the 10 days, only the $19 for the OPLAW.

CalDOJ always tells people this. The problem is that following CalDOJ's advice will cause you to violate Federal law. If you drive or fly to Illinois and receive a firearm from your father and then bring it back with you to California then you will have committed a Federal felony. If you file the OpLaw form and pay the $19 then CalDOJ won't be able to touch you because you will 100% in compliance with California law. But ATF can bust you for the Federal violation and use the OpLaw form as proof against you.

SocalShooterX
09-29-2011, 11:39 PM
CalDOJ always tells people this. The problem is that following CalDOJ's advice will cause you to violate Federal law. If you drive or fly to Illinois and receive a firearm from your father and then bring it back with you to California then you will have committed a Federal felony. If you file the OpLaw form and pay the $19 then CalDOJ won't be able to touch you because you will 100% in compliance with California law. But ATF can bust you for the Federal violation and use the OpLaw form as proof against you.
Very good to know.

They? Sister and father?

New residents must register their handguns within 60 days of moving here OR they can transfer those handguns via PPT or intrafamilial transfer to a CA resident in lieu of registering. One needs a CA ID to participate in a PPT, and since a PPT uses an FFL, the buyer/receiver/transferee must be 21 for handguns and have the Handgun Safety Certificate.

See the wiki -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Moving_to_California_with_firearms


They i meant my sister and brother in law, sorry for the confusion, been a long day.

My sister will be in CA soon living with our cousin, she won't have a residency yet or be a "CA resident" I dont want to file an intrafamiliar transfer and it pops up that she doesn't live in CA ya know?