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View Full Version : XDm 9mm 4.5" + 1100 rounds + FrogLube


alex85
09-26-2011, 11:53 PM
I've been following the FrogLube threads for months and the consequent discussions about MSDS info, evangelistic salesmen, the smell and gripes about having to use a hair dryer. I'm a bit tired at the ratio of supposition to actual usage data. So here's mine.


The XDm is my first handgun. I got it in July and have proceeded to shoot 1100 rounds of factory ammo (mainly Sellier & Bellot and Remington UMC) through it. After every other range trip (at least) I thoroughly cleaned it. The gun was "seasoned" and thoroughly cleaned before ever shooting it.


I make no claims as to the efficacy of FrogLube over other products. Other CLPs might be better, and I can safely assume specialty products that focus on cleaning, lubing, or protecting, and only that, probably do it better than an all-around product.


I'm really only concerned with actual field data. MSDS info is nice, good reviews in magazines / blogs are even better, but in reality, seeing shots of wear and tear and hearing stories, first hand, is all that matters. I really don't care how good / bad a marketing campaign is OR who is selling it.


BTW, over this period, ZERO mechanical failures. Only one squib load from the Remington UMC which caused a stovepipe.


I'd love to know how this wear compares to other XD/XDms (and anything else)




All shots have the contrast exaggerated to show wear as clearly as possible. This includes weird reflections from the flash (splotchy SS guide rod)


http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm1.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm2.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm3.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm4.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm5.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm6.jpg

Voo
09-27-2011, 12:15 AM
Wow, your gun looks like it has only 1099 rounds through it! :43:

Seriously though, clean/lube/maintain your firearm regularly and you wont' see any difference between the oils/lubes/chicken feet/rooster head remedies out on the market..

Your money, you spend it how you want..

chim-chim7
09-27-2011, 12:18 AM
1,100 rounds. I have over 5,000 on my 1911 trp and all I do is wipe it down with a dry rag and run a dry snake through it. I still have all my coating on the rails. Looks like its only been fired a few times. I run my own loaded ammo.

alex85
09-27-2011, 12:31 AM
Wow, your gun looks like it has only 1099 rounds through it! :43:

Seriously though, clean/lube/maintain your firearm regularly and you wont' see any difference between the oils/lubes/chicken feet/rooster head remedies out on the market..

Your money, you spend it how you want..

I basically assumed the same thing. I'm a weekly car washer using products that claim months of "protection". RemOil, Hoppers, CLP, etc will probably suit me just as well. But I'm glad, at least, that the gamble to use FrogLube from the get-go hasn't had any adverse effects (unless someone can point it out for me).

1,100 rounds. I have over 5,000 on my 1911 trp and all I do is wipe it down with a dry rag and run a dry snake through it. I still have all my coating on the rails. Looks like its only been fired a few times. I run my own loaded ammo.

I'm definitely not claiming 1100 rounds is a lot. But I consider the 1000 round milestone as a good place to start tracking the wear and tear that FrogLube prevents / perpetuates. The idea being that others can compare their level of wear and tear and make an informed decision.

The TRP sounds lovely. Anything from loading on your own that you think contributes to the ease of your upkeep?

chim-chim7
09-27-2011, 12:43 AM
My ammo is much more consistant than factory and burns much cleaner. I would attest that in fact it does help with keeping the firearm cleaner. I shoot twice a week, so all my guns get used pretty well. I have my safe queens but my runners get pounded. Hey I am the one jealous of your XDM. I am planning on a OD green XDM in. 40 soon. Nice gun you got there, keep doing what your doing.

whitesmile
09-27-2011, 12:54 AM
My ammo is much more consistant than factory and burns much cleaner. I would attest that in fact it does help with keeping the firearm cleaner. I shoot twice a week, so all my guns get used pretty well. I have my safe queens but my runners get pounded. Hey I am the one jealous of your XDM. I am planning on a OD green XDM in. 40 soon. Nice gun you got there, keep doing what your doing.

yup, sounds u got an amazing gun.

Briancnelson
09-27-2011, 4:49 AM
My father's XD has about 12-1300 rounds through it. There's no wear beyond what you'd expect, and he's used FL since he bought it. Don't have pictures of that one, but:

I have a Sigma I just sold with 600 rounds through it, all on FL, the thing basically looks new. http://www.flickr.com/photos/denofiniquity/sets/72157627592711527/

I could post my P89 eventually as well. It has about 10k rounds through it, the last 5 or so being on Froglube. It has only minor wear.

resident-shooter
09-27-2011, 4:53 AM
idk about lube itself, but i sure took time to clean and lube it. Good job :)

alex85
09-27-2011, 8:45 AM
My ammo is much more consistant than factory and burns much cleaner. I would attest that in fact it does help with keeping the firearm cleaner. I shoot twice a week, so all my guns get used pretty well. I have my safe queens but my runners get pounded. Hey I am the one jealous of your XDM. I am planning on a OD green XDM in. 40 soon. Nice gun you got there, keep doing what your doing.

Thanks for the comments chim-chim. I didn't realize loading on your own also equaled cleaner ammo. Definitely something to consider.

I hope you enjoy the OD green addition if you end up getting it.

My father's XD has about 12-1300 rounds through it. There's no wear beyond what you'd expect, and he's used FL since he bought it. Don't have pictures of that one, but:

I have a Sigma I just sold with 600 rounds through it, all on FL, the thing basically looks new. http://www.flickr.com/photos/denofiniquity/sets/72157627592711527/

I could post my P89 eventually as well. It has about 10k rounds through it, the last 5 or so being on Froglube. It has only minor wear.

This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for. Thanks again.

*edit*

Here are some pics in daylight. A little more indicative. As a cleaner, I have no basis of comparison, but I couldn't be happier. Though I'm always tempted to see what some very strong solvent would do for the barrel. Protection wise, still no rust. But, I generally don't give it enough time for rust to even develop between cleanings (cleaning 1-2 times per week).

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm7.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm8.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm9.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm10.jpg

locosway
09-27-2011, 2:09 PM
I have far more rounds through my Glock and I use Froglube. I also show much less wear than your XD, but the XD I had showed a lot of wear on the barrel hood as well, so maybe it's just the way they make their guns.

http://i51.tinypic.com/ir83mw.jpg

BillPear
09-27-2011, 5:07 PM
Have an HK USPc with 1440 rounds through it the first 1300 were with standard type cleaners oils and greases and it doesn't show to much wear, I recently cleaned it thouroughly and treated it to Froglube FWIW i put the slide and barrel on the oven at 170 for an hour to heat set open pores whatever they expect a heatgun to do. My first 140 rounds through it and I am impressed with the froglube. But not enough to use it on my 1911's yet.

YMMV

stormvet
09-27-2011, 5:13 PM
Your XDm wear looks alot like mine, I have 1800 rounds fired and just use REMOIL, 90% of the rounds fired in mine have been my reloads with just a couple ftf, I blame on the ammo not the gun.

cfusionpm
09-27-2011, 6:49 PM
I have far more rounds through my Glock and I use Froglube. I also show much less wear than your XD, but the XD I had showed a lot of wear on the barrel hood as well, so maybe it's just the way they make their guns.

http://i51.tinypic.com/ir83mw.jpg

No one in this thread cares about your Glock.

locosway
09-27-2011, 6:51 PM
No one in this thread cares about your Glock.

I was showing the wear I have with using Froglube. What's your problem?

alex85
09-27-2011, 7:17 PM
I have far more rounds through my Glock and I use Froglube. I also show much less wear than your XD, but the XD I had showed a lot of wear on the barrel hood as well, so maybe it's just the way they make their guns.

http://i51.tinypic.com/ir83mw.jpg

Very interesting. Your wear (or lack thereof) is probably a testament to the glock's design. Certainly doesn't look like the FrogLube hurt though. Thanks for the info.

Have an HK USPc with 1440 rounds through it the first 1300 were with standard type cleaners oils and greases and it doesn't show to much wear, I recently cleaned it thouroughly and treated it to Froglube FWIW i put the slide and barrel on the oven at 170 for an hour to heat set open pores whatever they expect a heatgun to do. My first 140 rounds through it and I am impressed with the froglube. But not enough to use it on my 1911's yet.

YMMV

Anecdotally, I've noticed more positive / neutral comments (and experimentation) for FrogLube with regard to polymer frames. If you ever end up using it on your 1911, I'd be very curious to see how it performs. Especially when the two guns are in the same environment.

Your XDm wear looks alot like mine, I have 1800 rounds fired and just use REMOIL, 90% of the rounds fired in mine have been my reloads with just a couple ftf, I blame on the ammo not the gun.

This was a big variable I was wondering about. I wanted to make sure the wear and tear wasn't any worse when using FrogLube. I'm glad to hear you're seeing similar wear 1800 rounds in.

cfusionpm
09-27-2011, 7:28 PM
I was showing the wear I have with using Froglube. What's your problem?

My mistake. I own an XDM myself and am sick of getting guff from Glock owners about how my inferior pistol copied theirs. That post seemed along those lines of "my Glock is better than your XD."

Norsemen308
09-27-2011, 7:29 PM
thats so interesting, i have the 3.8 xdm 9x19 has about 2000 rounds threw it and my barrel internals look completely different, and i use remioil.. try to get some high definition pictures up soon

stormvet
09-27-2011, 7:33 PM
I also own a few Glocks that show less finish wear with similar number of rounds fired. But be advised that wear on our XDm's is just cosmetic to the finish I see no wear on the metal itself. Glocks have an area on both sides of the inner slide where they like to mare the metal, all guns will wear none are exempt.

locosway
09-27-2011, 7:34 PM
My mistake. I own an XDM myself and am sick of getting guff from Glock owners about how my inferior pistol copied theirs. That post seemed along those lines of "my Glock is better than your XD."

Yeah, I don't do that. Personally I shoot Glocks as my primary gun, and it's my go-to for my own reasons. However, I like the XD line, especially for the price. My one beef with them is their design, but that's from an armorers point of view, not from a shooters pov.

I'm a fan of firearms, pure and simple. I like them all, own a bit of everything, and just like talking guns. ;)

If I had a XD/m that FL on it I would have shown that, but I figured my Glock that is my main gun with runs only FL and has for some time would be a good picture to take, mostly because it shows virtually zero wear.

alex85
09-28-2011, 1:35 AM
thats so interesting, i have the 3.8 xdm 9x19 has about 2000 rounds threw it and my barrel internals look completely different, and i use remioil.. try to get some high definition pictures up soon

WOW the barrel is next to impossible to photograph. I put a cotton patch in the chamber to help reflect some light.

Here are 4 different shots of the barrel interior. BTW, the barrel was wiped down dry with 3 patches before taking the pictures.

Normal wear for the XDm barrel?

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm11.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm12.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm13.jpg

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-12/907135/xdm14.jpg

chim-chim7
09-28-2011, 3:52 AM
Guys dont be afraid to use it on your 1911's. I was the test dummy on that one. 5k rounds in and there is virtually no wear. I rarely lube it anymore, I was doing it once a week, but have since stopped the last 1k rounds or so. I think it's still well lubed at this point. I don't have a great camera for capturing detail, but here you go. As you can see there is only slight wear, but 95% left on the coating. Basically looks the same as it did after the first 1k rounds, that was just frame to side break in. My TRP was very tight from the factory and is still pretty tight. Kudos to FL. I now use it in my AR, Mossberg 930SPX, 1911 Loaded Target, XD45, S&W 500 MAG, CZ SP-01 and HK MP5.


The shiny spot is the reflection from the flash, I could not snap a pic. without it. Too dark.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l137/chim-chim7/003-1.jpg

chim-chim7
09-28-2011, 4:02 AM
Alex85, there is no wear on your barrel. The lands are still very sharp, and I can still see the honing marks. Besides looking dirty in that second pic., the third pic looks like a brand new barrel. Snap a few more pics in another 2k rounds and compare. My barrel still looks brand new as well.

alex85
09-28-2011, 1:32 PM
Guys dont be afraid to use it on your 1911's. I was the test dummy on that one. 5k rounds in and there is virtually no wear. I rarely lube it anymore, I was doing it once a week, but have since stopped the last 1k rounds or so. I think it's still well lubed at this point. I don't have a great camera for capturing detail, but here you go. As you can see there is only slight wear, but 95% left on the coating. Basically looks the same as it did after the first 1k rounds, that was just frame to side break in. My TRP was very tight from the factory and is still pretty tight. Kudos to FL. I now use it in my AR, Mossberg 930SPX, 1911 Loaded Target, XD45, S&W 500 MAG, CZ SP-01 and HK MP5.


The shiny spot is the reflection from the flash, I could not snap a pic. without it. Too dark.
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l137/chim-chim7/003-1.jpg

Awesome collection you've got! I'm glad to hear about the 1911 FL success, but even more impressed with the range of weapons you're using it on. I'm thinking about a CZ SP-01 next, but was hesitant about extraordinary metal frame / metal slide wear with FL. Glad to hear my fears are unfounded.

Alex85, there is no wear on your barrel. The lands are still very sharp, and I can still see the honing marks. Besides looking dirty in that second pic., the third pic looks like a brand new barrel. Snap a few more pics in another 2k rounds and compare. My barrel still looks brand new as well.

Thanks for the assurance. The barrel does seem to have some remaining fouling and carbon. That said, all the pics were taken at the same time, so the fouling / carbon layer must be minute. I'll be sure to take additional pics at 2k.

Briancnelson
09-28-2011, 1:45 PM
One thing I should note is that the P89 I use it on has an aluminum frame and a steel slide. This can result in extraordinary wear if the lubricant fails or you fail to lube it properly. I have seen no such wear with Froglube after 5k (5150 actually, according to the log I keep) shots with it. I'll post pics this week if I get a chance to take some.

alex85
09-28-2011, 11:10 PM
One thing I should note is that the P89 I use it on has an aluminum frame and a steel slide. This can result in extraordinary wear if the lubricant fails or you fail to lube it properly. I have seen no such wear with Froglube after 5k (5150 actually, according to the log I keep) shots with it. I'll post pics this week if I get a chance to take some.

Please do post pics when you can. Steel on aluminum is something I forgot to even consider. It'd make a great data point.

Joe
09-28-2011, 11:17 PM
This thread makes me want an XDm

ExtremeX
09-29-2011, 12:57 AM
This thread makes me want an XDm

+1 , ill take one in .45

Bobby Ricigliano
09-29-2011, 6:07 AM
So am I way behind the times since I still use Breakfree? It was good enough for Uncle Sam's M16's so it's good enough for me.

PanaDP
09-29-2011, 11:11 AM
I use CLP on my XD and it looks roughly the same. I don't know how many rounds, it's more than a thousand at any rate.

BillPear
09-29-2011, 4:28 PM
So am I way behind the times since I still use Breakfree? It was good enough for Uncle Sam's M16's so it's good enough for me.

No your not alone If Baer recomends it for his guns thats what I'll use on them, but I am learry of the FL on my alloy framed 1911 and I dont have any real reason to change the way I clean/lube it.