PDA

View Full Version : Ur thoughts on buying a used handgun on Calguns that was "never fired by the seller"


semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 12:00 PM
What are your thoughts on buying an obviously used handgun, which according to the seller was "never fired by him" but "fired by the first owner"?

I never use to think twice about this issue as I never had any problems buying stuffs from Calguners until recently when I got burned twice.

I think, with the seller claiming that he has never fired this pistol before, he assumes no responsibility on the functionality of the gun at all, even if you find out later that it is a "jam-omatic" paperweight with subtle missing components (not obvious to visual inspection unless you test-fire the pistol), failure to feed at every other round, failure to extract at every third round, failure to ignite primers every 5th round, and also missing firing pin safety detent plunger spring, and when trying to disassemble only to discover that the fire pin retention plate is locked in the slide permanently.... When confronting such sellers afterwards, and they can always hide behind the original statement that he never fired the pistol and thus assumes no responsibility thereafter after the sales.

I think this is just poor ethical practice in general to sell a defective gun under the disguise of "never have fired it so I don't know" clause, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their used guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns...

Just out of curiosity, is there a financial/civil law saying that the seller is inherently responsible for the overall quality of the merchandise even though he/she claims ignorance before the sale?

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

SAS

Mr.1904
09-25-2011, 12:13 PM
After all this is the internet.

One can say, do, or be anything on the internet. Just gotta take everything with a grain of salt and don't trust unless they give you a reason too.

bwiese
09-25-2011, 12:24 PM
Caveat emptor.

I do believe quite a few people buy new guns and then have some setback where they need the money and also have 'buyer's remorse'.

geeknow
09-25-2011, 12:26 PM
For me, 'never fired by me' is a very shaky way of marketing 'used' as something other than that. It lacks clarity. It also lends a false sense of 'new-ness' where no such claim can honestly be made.

Dark Mod
09-25-2011, 12:29 PM
doesnt bother me, i take the same precautions when i buy something regardless of what the seller claims. If hes fired it 10,000 times or never at all it still passes the same inspection.

CK_32
09-25-2011, 12:31 PM
I say jackpot. Getting a new gun for less than store price.

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 12:35 PM
No, I am talking about an obviously used gun that was fired by "first owner" and "never fired by the second owner" who is selling it.

CK_32
09-25-2011, 12:38 PM
For me, 'never fired by me' is a very shaky way of marketing 'used' as something other than that. It lacks clarity. It also lends a false sense of 'new-ness' where no such claim can honestly be made.

Well sorry to burst your bubble but 99% of the classifieds is all smoke and mirrors.

200 rounds down the pipe usually ends up meaning 600+ rounds.

Great condition is good condition.

Fair priced means I'm making some good money just cheaper than the other high priced cheap as*es

Slight wear Means a lot of wear I just take good pictures.

I personally don't ever trust what anyone says down there. I know a few guys who admit to it because it's so common. I go off of inspection when we do FTF. if your sonscared tell him meet you at the range and let you put a box of ammo through her. Other than that it is what it is not what they say.

I have been shocked before and saw a ok rail and got it and it was like new. But like I said that doesn't come around often. Honest people are hard to find these days.

CK_32
09-25-2011, 12:40 PM
No, I am talking about an obviously used gun that was fired by "first owner" and "never fired by the second owner" who is selling it.

If he's so confidant tell him meet you at the range And let you fire a mag or 2 through it.

I know a lot of guys who buy 100 rifles and never go out to shoot any of them. But yet keep buying more rifles when they have a safe full of new guns. So it's not that uncommon for the gun community. Some guys just like buying new toys more than using them.

Oceanbob
09-25-2011, 12:41 PM
I personally own guns that have been Safe Queens for 20 years and I've never fired them. (1911s, HK pistols, a Stainless Beretta 92, some .22 pistols and rifles, a .44 magnum Winchester 94AE, a couple of .357 revolvers, a Marlin 1894 .357, Seecamp.32..a shotgun....etc...)

Some were bought slightly used, some are NIB.

I think some people just buy guns like me, because they are collectors. Later, they decide to sell to put money into another project. I have no problem with buying from these people. Like anything else, check the weapon carefully.

Most Jam-o-matics are well known in the market place anyway. You won't have problems with mainstream weapons usually.

Be well
Bob

OC-Indian
09-25-2011, 12:42 PM
Always assume anything used will need work and pay accordingly

shooterfpga
09-25-2011, 12:44 PM
ive never bought anything that wasnt exactly as described. if i thought otherwise, i walked away. i think the issue here is you guys fail to properly inspect, just like those who failed to inspect at an FFL. dont get hyped up on the deal and forget to check everything out.

NorCal1911Fan
09-25-2011, 12:45 PM
If I buy a used gun I typically try to shoot at least a box if not more within the first week or so of getting it home. I feel if you are selling a used gun that has been previously fired you should shoot at least a box out of the gun so you can represent it with some form of integrity. Unfortunately there are those who would rather pass the buck on a lemon then fix it or own up to it and take the loss with a hard lesson learned.

CK_32
09-25-2011, 1:03 PM
Always assume anything used will need work and pay accordingly

Not necessarily. I inspect and make sure all of my items forehand are ready to go before I throw them up for sale. I've been screwed over enough to not want to pass on that disappointment and be skeeze and ruin slmeones day or week to make a quick buck.

Like I said there are SOME honest people around. Just hard to find sometimes.

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 1:08 PM
Not necessarily. I inspect and make sure all of my items forehand are ready to go before I throw them up for sale. I've been screwed over enough to not want to pass on that disappointment and be skeeze and ruin slmeones day or week to make a quick buck.

Like I said there are SOME honest people around. Just hard to find sometimes.

I completely agree with CK32 100%. When I put something on sale, I will always have fired a box of ammo through it to make sure that it is functioning properly before I sell it. Since I do that for all my transactions, I was stupid enough to assume that most Calguners would do the same for me. But lessons learned...

Btw, some defects are not so obvious to careful visual inspection unless you detail-strip the pistol during the sale, and most sellers won't let you do that... And most sellers won't allow you test-fire the pistol before FTF...

mag360
09-25-2011, 1:13 PM
never had any issues buying used guns. the first time YOU shoot your gun its now USED anyways, so who cares. You think a gun gives a crap if it's been shot once or 1000 times. NO. That said the 1 handgun I did buy "never fired" off the forum classifieds was clearly fired many times when I cleaned it after I brought it home. But again, who cares. It was an off-roster 1911 that I really wanted.

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 1:23 PM
yeah, but I bet your off-roster 1911 never had failure to feed at every other round, failure to extract at every third round, failure to ignite primers every 5th round, and also missing firing pin safety detent plunger spring, and when trying to disassemble only to discover that the fire pin retention plate is locked in the slide permanently... That's what I am talking about... those defects are not obvious until you test-fire it or detail-strip it, which is not possible at FTF. Selling a pistol with this level of problems can only be classified as intentionally hiding behind the statement "I personally have never fired it, and hence you figure it out yourself, sucker!"....

brianm767
09-25-2011, 1:28 PM
I think this is just poor ethical practice in general, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns...



I think this is a pretty hash statement, unless this is only referring to those who have said, well it's not my fault, I told you I never shot it, your on your own buddy, in that case, yes, it's not right. but your saying in general it's unethical, so unless I'm reading this wrong, your saying I have poor ethical practices when I sale a gun I've never shot??

I have bought several guns that were never fired from the seller, and later I resold them and I had never shot them either, so far, I've never had any one say the guns failed to function, if I had, I would have made it right, that is if they told me right away.

If I am selling a used gun that I have never fired, any one who is interested in it is more than welcome to meet me at a range and put some rounds through it, I would encourage it, so the buyer and seller is are both happy.

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 1:31 PM
I think this is a pretty hash statement, unless this is only referring to those who have said, well it's not my fault, I told you I never shot it, your on your own buddy, in that case, yes, it's not right. but your saying in general it's unethical, so unless I'm reading this wrong, your saying I have poor ethical practices when I sale a gun I've never shot??

I have bought several guns that were never fired from the seller, and later I resold them and I had never shot them either, so far, I've never had any one say the guns failed to function.

If I am selling a used gun that I have never fired, any one who is interested in it is more than welcome to meet me a a range and put a few rounds through it, I would encourage it, so the buyer and seller is are both happy.

I am referring to sellers who has told me that "duh, I told you I never fired that gun, and hence you are stuck with those problems yourself, sucker..."

aghauler
09-25-2011, 1:58 PM
What are your thoughts on buying an obviously used handgun, which according to the seller was "never fired by him" but "fired by the first owner"?

I never use to think twice about this issue as I never had any problems buying stuffs from Calguners until recently when I got burned twice.

I think, with the seller claiming that he has never fired this pistol before, he assumes no responsibility on the functionality of the gun at all, even if you find out later that it is a "jam-omatic" paperweight with subtle missing components (not obvious to visual inspection unless you test-fire the pistol), failure to feed at every other round, failure to extract at every third round, failure to ignite primers every 5th round, and also missing firing pin safety detent plunger spring, and when trying to disassemble only to discover that the fire pin retention plate is locked in the slide permanently.... When confronting such sellers afterwards, and they can always hide behind the original statement that he never fired the pistol and thus assumes no responsibility thereafter after the sales.

I think this is just poor ethical practice in general to sell a defective gun under the disguise of "never have fired it so I don't know" clause, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their used guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns...

Just out of curiosity, is there a financial/civil law saying that the seller is inherently responsible for the overall quality of the merchandise even though he/she claims ignorance before the sale?

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

SAS

An "ethical seller" will give you an inspection period from date of delivery, 3-5 days is common. I've sold firearms on the Gunbroker, Auction Arms, and Guns America. I give a 3 day inspection period for "right of return less shipping" if returned in same condition as sent to buyer. I've only had one rifle returned, a Mossberg M44 some fella in Texas won, basically he had the famous "buyers remorse, it just wasn't what I wanted" so he shipped it back and I refunded his money. Put it back on the auction site and it sold for MORE than what he paid, to a fella that had been watching the first auction. The second buyer emailed me and said the first guy was "nuts" to let this one go at the first price as it was in better conditon then described. I try to underate what I sell so the buyer actually gets a better deal than expected. I maintain a positive rating on all the auction sites I deal with.

CSACANNONEER
09-25-2011, 2:04 PM
I own a few older guns that I have never gotten around to shooting. If I added "never fired by me" it would be to clarify that I don't know if the gun actually fires or not.

JoeinLA
09-25-2011, 2:10 PM
This issue comes up when dealong with alot of gear, not just guns. All this risk should be factored into what you're willing to pay, and you should understand that anything used almost certainly (though not always) has more risk than something brand new from a reputable, big box retailer.

Of course, there are always liars and cheaters, but i've bought and sold very expensive gear ALOT over the years, and have only run into one or two issues. The one time when i thought there was very clear misrepresentation, i made the appropriate saber rattles and got my money back. But, normally, if we're talking a "real" amount of money (whatever that threshold means to you), i like to talk to the person, hopefully at his place of work so i know he's a "real" person with has something to lose so he's not interested in all the drama of a sale gone wrong, ask alot of questions about both the item and him, and just get a sense of what i think the risk is and whether the item/price is worth it. Beyond that, not sure what else you can do. Thats why used items are sold for less :P

Ps, i guess one thing i'm saying is that you should get comfortable with the seller as well as the item itself.

MrOrange
09-25-2011, 2:27 PM
doesnt bother me, i take the same precautions when i buy something regardless of what the seller claims. If hes fired it 10,000 times or never at all it still passes the same inspection.
Yeppers, that's me as well. Used is used.

As to the original question, as others have stated, it's highly likely the seller actually never did fire the thing, and he just wanted to let the buyer know so there were no artificial expectations.

The first time I tried to fire my Pocket Nine, I got a click instead of a bang. Found out there was a spring missing that moved the firing pin block out of the way, so there was no way the previous owner could've said it shot okay. Ya know what? He didn't. (Wolff springs to the rescue.)


I am kinda curious about the firing pin retainer (sounds like you have a Series 80 1911?) being "locked in the slide permanently"; is it epoxied in or sumthin? A common mod from the old days is to peen the edges of the retainer to make a tight fit so that it wouldn't drop out of place in recoil and tie up the gun. Yes that has happened, and I've made that mod on every 1911 I've ever owned.

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 2:34 PM
Yeppers, that's me as well. Used is used.

As to the original question, as others have stated, it's highly likely the seller actually never did fire the thing, and he just wanted to let the buyer know so there were no artificial expectations.

The first time I tried to fire my Pocket Nine, I got a click instead of a bang. Found out there was a spring missing that moved the firing pin block out of the way, so there was no way the previous owner could've said it shot okay. Ya know what? He didn't. (Wolff springs to the rescue.)


I am kinda curious about the firing pin retainer (sounds like you have a Series 80 1911?) being "locked in the slide permanently"; is it epoxied in or sumthin? A common mod from the old days is to peen the edges of the retainer to make a tight fit so that it wouldn't drop out of place in recoil and tie up the gun. Yes that has happened, and I've made that mod on every 1911 I've ever owned.

No, man... it's not a 1911. I don't want to mention the firearm by name because I don't want to pinpoint any specific individuals who sold me this paperweight... All I can say that the plunger detent spring was needed to engage the release pin on the firing pin so that it can be pushed all the way in to get the firing pin plate out. But since the spring was missing, there was no way to physically engage that pin and hence the firing pin cannot be pushed back (or fully ignite the primers), and hence the plate is permanently locked in. The only way is to drill out the firing pin plate and replace it with another one, and I don't want to mess with it because the plate is made out of hardened tool steel, and so I am sending it back to the factory for repair at my own cost.

stevie
09-25-2011, 2:43 PM
I have many guns that i have purchased thoughout the years that i have never fired. Some on trades and some on impulse. If i have nevered fired them i say so, same with round counts. I do not keep track of number of rounds fired, so unless i am pretty sure of count i say "unknown".

If i am buying a used firearm, I usually try and give it a good once over before buying.

chiselchst
09-25-2011, 3:43 PM
An "ethical seller" will give you an inspection period from date of delivery, 3-5 days is common. I've sold firearms on the Gunbroker, Auction Arms, and Guns America. I give a 3 day inspection period for "right of return less shipping" if returned in same condition as sent to buyer.

^ Excellent point. I've only sold one used gun that I had not personally fired. It was a Sig "Special Ops" marked P220R, and the buyer was actually the 4th owner, firing it for the first time. Luckily, the gun functioned flawlessly. However, I would have been willing to make it right, had it not have performed as expected.

The above is a good idea, and I plan to add this option should I ever sell a gun I have never fired myself, should that occur. I've always been upfront if the gun has any issues at all, and I've always had very happy buyers...

In the case of the OP, the "seller" should be willing to *make right* the situation just on good faith. If not, perhaps iTrade feedback should reflect this, IMHO.

Perhaps all perspective buyers should condition their "I'll take it" offer pending a range test if in any doubt.

When confronting such sellers afterwards, and they can always hide behind the original statement that he never fired the pistol and thus assumes no responsibility thereafter after the sales.

Provide iTrader feedback reflecting the facts of the case, IMHO. That's the primary method available to help warn future customers of past behavior.

Just out of curiosity, is there a financial/civil law saying that the seller is inherently responsible for the overall quality of the merchandise even though he/she claims ignorance before the sale?

I don't know. However, I'd be willing to bet it's similar to buying a used car - as is with no implied warranty, unless otherwise stipulated.

IMHO, sellers should have 'worked with you' to make it right...

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 3:55 PM
^ Excellent point. I've only sold one used gun that I had not personally fired. It was a Sig "Special Ops" marked P220R, and the buyer was actually the 4th owner, firing it for the first time. Luckily, the gun functioned flawlessly. However, I would have been willing to make it right, had it not have performed as expected.

The above is a good idea, and I plan to add this option should I ever sell a gun I have never fired myself, should that occur. I've always been upfront if the gun has any issues at all, and I've always had very happy buyers...

In the case of the OP, the "seller" should be willing to *make right* the situation just on good faith. If not, perhaps iTrade feedback should reflect this, IMHO.

Perhaps all perspective buyers should condition their "I'll take it" offer pending a range test if in any doubt.



Provide negative iTrader feedback, IMHO. That's the primary method available to help warn future customers of past behavior.



I don't know. However, I'd be willing to bet it's similar to buying a used car - as is with no implied warranty, unless otherwise stipulated.

Ethical? Hell no...

IMHO, sellers should have 'worked with you' to make it right...

Yeah, I thought about that, but the Calgun iTrader is a double-edged sword because the seller can also leave a negative feedback on you for out of revenge, and then it gets into this ugly dispute with the moderators as to who is right and who is wrong, and which negative feedback to remove. It sucks. Frankly, have you seen any negative comments on any iTraders so far...? I have not, for obvious reasons.

bigmark408
09-25-2011, 4:03 PM
Why would you not mention the sellers name if your claim is true?

Reputation is something i look at before making a forum transaction.

If you have been lied to, (IMO) you should inform the other members.

semiautosniper
09-25-2011, 4:51 PM
Why would you not mention the sellers name if your claim is true?

Reputation is something i look at before making a forum transaction.

If you have been lied to, (IMO) you should inform the other members.

The problem is the burden of proof, as there are no way to clearly distinguish an intentional faker vs genuine ignorance of the merchandise. I raised the question as a general question for future transactions. On a personal note, I am still negotiating with the seller to work out a resolution by sending the pistol to a third party for full inspection, and if no resolution is achieved when third party confirms my claim, then I may take up on your offer...

Onlyincali
09-25-2011, 4:56 PM
At least the seller said, "I DONT KNOW if it works". He is basically telling you, "YOU'RE ON YOUR OWN, I DONT KNOW"

Its better than saying everything is perfect when in reality, he doesn't know.

Its better than whats happened to me, with a the seller describing the pistol as "PERFECT" or "FLAWLESS" or "SCRATCH FREE" only to have it come out in pathetic condition.

BajaJames83
09-25-2011, 5:01 PM
i would be suspicious, would want to shoot it before money is transfered... if its used what would the big deal be, i would offer to pay for ammo of course.

chiselchst
09-25-2011, 5:42 PM
Yeah, I thought about that, but the Calgun iTrader is a double-edged sword because the seller can also leave a negative feedback on you for out of revenge, and then it gets into this ugly dispute with the moderators as to who is right and who is wrong, and which negative feedback to remove. It sucks. Frankly, have you seen any negative comments on any iTraders so far...? I have not, for obvious reasons.

When doing a purchase, usually the BUYER has met his obligation when he pays successfully, and His feedback should NORMALLY be left immediately at this point by the SELLER (minus rare situations). For his part (the buyer) has successfully completed his committment.

The SELLER should never WAIT until the buyer leaves feedback prior to postig his own feedback, IMHO. That's an old eBay trick the likes of some scammers on eBay might use, again IMHO...

Through a little transaction knowledge & discipline, I believe the iTrader system is one of the most valuable tools we buyers and sellers have.

Anchors
09-25-2011, 5:46 PM
Look at my signature, the gun I'm selling really does only have 25 rounds through it. I decided I would rather put the funds towards a different gun.
It happens all the time.

The biggest problem is that once you buy a gun, you find out ammo is more expensive than a new gun sometimes. So you just keep buying them instead of ammo. I've had this problem.
I'm going to get into reloading though to help fix it.
I've shot them more than most guns being sold on Craigslist, but still really not much at all. Not enough to wear them out.

The other problem is that guns aren't like VCRs or a pair of shoes. You can't return them within 30 days. You usually can't return them at all (unless they're defective).

I personally own guns that have been Safe Queens for 20 years and I've never fired them. (1911s, HK pistols, a Stainless Beretta 92, some .22 pistols and rifles, a .44 magnum Winchester 94AE, a couple of .357 revolvers, a Marlin 1894 .357, Seecamp.32..a shotgun....etc...)

Some were bought slightly used, some are NIB.

I think some people just buy guns like me, because they are collectors. Later, they decide to sell to put money into another project. I have no problem with buying from these people. Like anything else, check the weapon carefully.

Most Jam-o-matics are well known in the market place anyway. You won't have problems with mainstream weapons usually.

Be well
Bob

So when are we meeting up to PPT a 1911 and that Seecamp? haha :43:

pacifico23
09-25-2011, 5:48 PM
It happens more often than not. Especially on Calguns. There are some users on here that buy a gun like every month cough*Ex-New Yawker* cough

sammy
09-25-2011, 5:52 PM
There are lots os people that buy lots of guns and don't use them. Quite often most of these people will buy older, used guns that are not availible new. I have not had a bad experence with Calguns on a used gun. If you think something looks fishy, just pass.

luckystrike
09-25-2011, 6:07 PM
Happened to me. Sucks but I turned around and sold it but I made it very clear on the post and in person that it wasn't 100%. Lost some money but not a ton. The seller/trader I got it from played dumb and said it worked fine and said too bad

Anchors
09-25-2011, 6:14 PM
There are lots os people that buy lots of guns and don't use them. Quite often most of these people will buy older, used guns that are not availible new. I have not had a bad experence with Calguns on a used gun. If you think something looks fishy, just pass.

Oh that too.
I've never bought or sold anything used on CalGuns that had any issues.
Everyone I've met has been really honest and very straight forward.

A good tip is to check out their iTrader feedback (upper right corner of every post below "post count").

Most people here have 100%, which means no one has given them a negative grade as a buyer or seller.

brianm767
09-25-2011, 6:35 PM
I am referring to sellers who has told me that "duh, I told you I never fired that gun, and hence you are stuck with those problems yourself, sucker..."

OK well reading your post as it was originally written, "" I think this is just poor ethical practice in general, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns... "" the way it was originally written, to me it read as any one who sells a gun without firing it, is poor ethical practices,

Now that you have edited it to now say "" I think this is just poor ethical practice in general to sell a ""defective"" gun under the disguise of "never have fired it so I don't know" clause, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their used guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns... "" but yah, Duh, the way you have edited it to read now, it's a no brainer.

robcoe
09-25-2011, 8:30 PM
Ur thoughts on buying a used handgun on Calguns that was "never fired by the seller"

As a rule, unless it's an antique and I am buying it simply as a collectors item, I get more than a bit suspicious when I see something like that.

If I have questions about it functioning I usualy ask if it's ok if we do the transfer at a shooting range that will do a PPT(Insight comes to mind for me) and I bring some ammo to test it before hand.

wamphyri13
09-26-2011, 2:47 PM
I have bought and sold a few used handguns from other members to other members. Sometimes you buy something you want and never get a chance to shoot it. Then something else tickles your fancy and you decide to part with the ones you haven't shot yet. I've done this at least 3 times for sure. I haven't had any complaints on what I've sold. I also believe in full disclosure on anything I sell. I will tell you everything I can about a piece prior to your handing me money. I want you to know everything I know about it.
A reputation takes a lifetime to build and only a moment to ruin. I do not wish to ruin mine.
Ryan

mag360
09-26-2011, 9:23 PM
yeah, but I bet your off-roster 1911 never had failure to feed at every other round, failure to extract at every third round, failure to ignite primers every 5th round, and also missing firing pin safety detent plunger spring, and when trying to disassemble only to discover that the fire pin retention plate is locked in the slide permanently... That's what I am talking about... those defects are not obvious until you test-fire it or detail-strip it, which is not possible at FTF. Selling a pistol with this level of problems can only be classified as intentionally hiding behind the statement "I personally have never fired it, and hence you figure it out yourself, sucker!"....

yikes, no it's never had a problem actually. Everything from standard .45acp ball to winchester ranger +p hollow points. It's an SW1911pd with the rail, I love this thing. It's quasi roster, the serial isn't listed but by description it is, so Im not sure where it falls now that I think about it.

thefinger
09-26-2011, 9:29 PM
I have bought plenty of used guns that I have ended up selling before I ever had a chance to shoot them myself. Some from buyers remorse, some because I just needed the money to spend on something else.

I wouldn't assume the seller you are describing is a liar or shady person. He might be a dope like me that buys too many guns sometimes, haha.

However, I understand your suspicions. If your suspect the guy isn't being forthcoming about the gun, then simply just don't buy it.

The DRis
09-27-2011, 2:06 PM
Sounds like a Desert Eagle.

E Pluribus Unum
09-27-2011, 2:13 PM
What are your thoughts on buying an obviously used handgun, which according to the seller was "never fired by him" but "fired by the first owner"?

I never use to think twice about this issue as I never had any problems buying stuffs from Calguners until recently when I got burned twice.

I think, with the seller claiming that he has never fired this pistol before, he assumes no responsibility on the functionality of the gun at all, even if you find out later that it is a "jam-omatic" paperweight with subtle missing components (not obvious to visual inspection unless you test-fire the pistol), failure to feed at every other round, failure to extract at every third round, failure to ignite primers every 5th round, and also missing firing pin safety detent plunger spring, and when trying to disassemble only to discover that the fire pin retention plate is locked in the slide permanently.... When confronting such sellers afterwards, and they can always hide behind the original statement that he never fired the pistol and thus assumes no responsibility thereafter after the sales.

I think this is just poor ethical practice in general to sell a defective gun under the disguise of "never have fired it so I don't know" clause, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their used guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns...

Just out of curiosity, is there a financial/civil law saying that the seller is inherently responsible for the overall quality of the merchandise even though he/she claims ignorance before the sale?

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

SAS


That sucks man.... that is why I never buy a gun sight unseen. I feel your pain and I have been burnt many times and refuse to pass that burn to others. It costs me money, but I sleep well at night.

P.S.
If I were you... I would not use the moniker "SAS". It has other... very bad... previous associations... :)

CK_32
09-27-2011, 2:14 PM
OP I doubt you have to worry who ever the seller is after seeing this probably won't be selling to you anyways now haha

:p

nickyrr
09-27-2011, 2:34 PM
I think that is the biggest drawback of buying a used gun. However I recently purchased a s&w 500 online and when I received the gun that was supposed to be brand new. There was no denying ita been fired, fingered and God knows what else it been done to the gun... However since it was new I just didn't accept the transfer and got my money back.

shooterdude
09-27-2011, 2:52 PM
I would only buy a used gun if I could get it for 50% of the cost new. Most people selling used guns are asking nearly what a new one costs and won't accept much less than their asking price so why not just pony up a few more $ and buy new with a warranty?

Quickdraw Mcgraw
09-27-2011, 3:05 PM
I completely agree with CK32 100%. When I put something on sale, I will always have fired a box of ammo through it to make sure that it is functioning properly before I sell it. Since I do that for all my transactions, I was stupid enough to assume that most Calguners would do the same for me. But lessons learned...

Btw, some defects are not so obvious to careful visual inspection unless you detail-strip the pistol during the sale, and most sellers won't let you do that... And most sellers won't allow you test-fire the pistol before FTF...

Personally I'll never buy a used gun I can't field strip and check out, some dude refuses that and I'm thinkin I just saved myself a headach:facepalm:. Do some research, with youtube avalible you can figure how to take down most guns even if you've never seen one in person. Buyer's beware!

Packy14
09-27-2011, 3:08 PM
What are your thoughts on buying an obviously used handgun, which according to the seller was "never fired by him" but "fired by the first owner"?

I never use to think twice about this issue as I never had any problems buying stuffs from Calguners until recently when I got burned twice.

I think, with the seller claiming that he has never fired this pistol before, he assumes no responsibility on the functionality of the gun at all, even if you find out later that it is a "jam-omatic" paperweight with subtle missing components (not obvious to visual inspection unless you test-fire the pistol), failure to feed at every other round, failure to extract at every third round, failure to ignite primers every 5th round, and also missing firing pin safety detent plunger spring, and when trying to disassemble only to discover that the fire pin retention plate is locked in the slide permanently.... When confronting such sellers afterwards, and they can always hide behind the original statement that he never fired the pistol and thus assumes no responsibility thereafter after the sales.

I think this is just poor ethical practice in general to sell a defective gun under the disguise of "never have fired it so I don't know" clause, and therefore, from now on, I am very wary of sellers who advertise their used guns as "never fired by me"... even on Calguns...

Just out of curiosity, is there a financial/civil law saying that the seller is inherently responsible for the overall quality of the merchandise even though he/she claims ignorance before the sale?

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,

SAS


Looking at your recent purchases, I think its the Deagle you recently bought... you should clarify on the seller so we know for sure, I for one would like to block the seller so I never buy something from a shady punk like that. Please provide the seller name.

aermotor
09-27-2011, 5:12 PM
No issues buying used guns, whether fired or not by the seller. Inspect it closely, function test it if you want to, get them to meet you at the range etc. I love guns in perfect condition for a killer price. I think 90% of my guns are used, I rarely ever buy new ones. Bring a brand new snap cap, throw it in there and fire. See if the pin actually struck the primer area.

ETA: I have bought maybe 6 used handguns online without seeing them and I've never had an issue. Check the Gun Broker feedback (or whatever is applicable) and try and see if they have an inspection period. Anyone like that will have nothing to hide. It's the guys with "ABSOLUTELY NO RETURNS" that you should just pass on no matter how good the deal is.

baz152
09-27-2011, 6:08 PM
I would not purchase a firearm from a second owner who states that "they never fired it". The only exception to this is if the owner will meet you at a range and let you test fire the weapon prior to purchase.

EMT John
09-27-2011, 6:44 PM
Buyer beware!!!

sirr6
09-27-2011, 9:17 PM
I just bought a Sig P238 from a Calgunner and everything seemed ok, but still never sure, On the other hand, I bought a Pink Kahr p380 from T.R.A.P (special ordered) everything looked okay when I did DROS, but when I took it home to clean, the inside was covered in black powder as if someone shot 100 rnds thru it, has anyone ever seen that before? I know for sure just from the test fire from the factory cant cause that much powder residue.

Rob454
09-27-2011, 9:49 PM
Buyer beware i guess although its a BS buyer beware. IMO be truthful. i can't stand slithering snake salesmen. Screwing someone over especially liek that is despicable. People like that disgust me.
When I sell something I will tell you everything about the item. Yes I charge for the item and I won't give it away BUT you get exactly what i say you get in the condition stated. If there is something wrong i will work with you although I have never had one item come back with a complaint no matter where I sold it here, other forum or Craiglist.
I got way better things than to screw someone out of a few hundred dollars. The Nancy boy excuse of i never fired it is laughable. I guess we are gonna have to start test firing these guns now in order to purchase them:rolleyes: because of a few shysters. I have one rifle i haven't fired. And its because i don't have a set of sights or scope for it yet. I would have absolutely no problem meeting someone if they wanted to test fire the gun as long as they paid for the ammo and range time.

darkest2000
09-27-2011, 10:09 PM
I've sold plenty of used handguns in the past that I've never actually fired, and state so in my ad.

however, I will post detailed pictures showing various angles, on top of which the prospective buyer can certainly detail inspect the item in person.

And I've had some guy (after waiting for his late *** for 30min at the FFL dealer) trying to get me to drop the price using the same BS excuse: "Since you've never fired it how can you guarantee its function". It was for an pump shotgun.

I said no thanks and left.