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View Full Version : LUCC of an OLL in a truck box


venturasurf
09-07-2011, 3:10 PM
I've been researching this and looking through threads, and this is what I have concluded:

Hypothetical Situation

Say I had one of those locking truck boxes such as this:
http://www.pickupspecialties.com/tool-box=Delta-aluminum_crossovers.htm

Say I weather stripped/siliconed it, sealed everything up, made it water tight...

I should be able to keep a featureless AKM built on an OLL and a couple of loaded 30-round mags in the box with the long gun as long as they're not loaded into the rifle... right?

As long as I don't go driving the truck through a school zone, fed area, other prohibited area, etc?

Or, since it's technically a long gun - I don't even have to lock it up right? It could technically just sit in my front seat with the mags somewhere else inside the cab? I realize such a thing would be irresponsible and would invite theft and all sorts of legal problems, I'm just wondering if I'm correct and these are truly options. I realize that doing such a thing would probably not be a good idea though... as most LEO's (no offense to those here) would most likely see something like that and go "that's an RAW and you're now a felon".

FXR
09-08-2011, 12:23 AM
Locked in the box is GTG federally and state, including in school zones but not on school campus's. The box should be waterproof; if it's not, get a Weatherguard brand - they've kept my tools dry and secure for years and the lock on the outside edge is much easier to use.

venturasurf
09-08-2011, 5:24 AM
get a Weatherguard brand - they've kept my tools dry and secure for years and the lock on the outside edge is much easier to use.

Right on - thanks for the advice, I'll check those out.

repr patriot
09-08-2011, 7:07 AM
Definitely get a WeatherGuard, more expensive but well worth it in the long run.

paul0660
09-08-2011, 7:14 AM
but not on school campus's.

Actually there is no difference between school zones and K-12 school campuses, other than the penalty. You can possess an unloaded rifle on campus, and a handgun in a locked box.

BUT you can't take ammo onto a K-12 campus without permission. (Section 30310)

Crom
09-08-2011, 8:10 AM
Actually there is no difference between school zones and K-12 school campuses, other than the penalty. You can possess an unloaded rifle on campus, and a handgun in a locked box.

BUT you can't take ammo onto a K-12 campus without permission. (Section 30310)

Very interesting. I reread the Wiki article on GFSZ (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Gun_Free_School_Zones), I was not aware that the locked container exemption worked for K-12 campuses. I am fully aware that the locked container exemption DOES NOT PROTECT an individual on college/university campuses. They are special and should be thought of as a sovereign nation. :rolleyes:

lorax3
09-08-2011, 8:17 AM
I am fully aware that the locked container exemption DOES NOT PROTECT an individual on college/university campuses. They are special and should be thought of as a sovereign nation. :rolleyes:

Heh, they sure think they are sovereign nations ;)

Crom
09-08-2011, 9:17 AM
:).

dantodd
09-08-2011, 9:22 AM
Also, no Post Offices. Not even in the parking lot. My local post office has the little "turn out" on their property for dropping off mail. It's an easy mistake to make.

If it were me I'd probably mount the rifle into a gun rack mounted inside the box. This would make it much more accessible in the event you need it without subjecting it to all sorts of sliding around etc. Taking it out of a gun bag could add considerable time to your procedure.

ETA: This is something like what I was thinking.

http://www.bigskyracks.com/products/sporting-racks/bsr/

They make a double and a single rack. Either could be mounted inside the box or on the box top.

http://www.bigskyracks.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/bsr3.jpg

paul0660
09-08-2011, 9:35 AM
Also, no Post Offices.

Post office property has to be posted no guns at entrances, just like all Federal property, although the Post office has a separate code. Except for school zones, we are not expected to be clairvoyant.

Librarian
09-08-2011, 10:23 AM
Actually there is no difference between school zones and K-12 school campuses, other than the penalty. You can possess an unloaded rifle on campus, and a handgun in a locked box.

BUT you can't take ammo onto a K-12 campus without permission. (Section 30310)

Very interesting. I reread the Wiki article on GFSZ (http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Gun_Free_School_Zones), I was not aware that the locked container exemption worked for K-12 campuses.

It's my opinion that it doesn't, but there's some room for argument.

The strict text of the law defines 'zones' to include campuses. I say the later exemption for LTC holders and the explicit ban on university campuses shows that the text was sloppily written, and that it's wiser to act as if locked case is applicable to the 1000' off-campus zone.

But there's no case law on it, and if one might draw a better venue than Theseus, it might be possible to present that argument and win on that technicality. The argument might go 'they know how to ban bringing guns on campus - see, they did it for universities - and since they didn't make that clear for K-12, they didn't mean that'.

That argument structure was used by the court in People v Clark.

Crom
09-08-2011, 12:15 PM
Post office property has to be posted no guns at entrances, just like all Federal property, although the Post office has a separate code. Except for school zones, we are not expected to be clairvoyant.

Paul, Not exactly. The post office has the power to create rules for their real property. They have done so to our detriment. The rule which forbids possession of firearms on their property is: 39 C.F.R. 232.1(l). (http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2008/julqtr/39cfr232.1.htm) and that includes parking lots.

(l) Weapons and explosives. Notwithstanding the provisions of any other law, rule or regulation, no person while on postal property may carry firearms, other dangerous or deadly weapons, or explosives, either openly or concealed, or store the same on postal property, except for official purposes.The Post Office rule is being challenged in Federal Court and it specifically mentions the parking lots. The case is: Bonidy et al v. United States Postal Service et al (http://archive.recapthelaw.org/cod/122068/) See the First Amended Complaint (http://www.archive.org/download/gov.uscourts.cod.122068/gov.uscourts.cod.122068.15.0.pdf) for the legal arguments.


It's my opinion that it doesn't, but there's some room for argument.

The strict text of the law defines 'zones' to include campuses. I say the later exemption for LTC holders and the explicit ban on university campuses shows that the text was sloppily written, and that it's wiser to act as if locked case is applicable to the 1000' off-campus zone.

But there's no case law on it, and if one might draw a better venue than Theseus, it might be possible to present that argument and win on that technicality. The argument might go 'they know how to ban bringing guns on campus - see, they did it for universities - and since they didn't make that clear for K-12, they didn't mean that'.

That argument structure was used by the court in People v Clark.

Right. The letter of the law allows for it. Then that's what should fly. But I agree that nobody should be a test case for it.

hoffmang
09-08-2011, 8:22 PM
BUT you can't take ammo onto a K-12 campus without permission. (Section 30310)

Quoted for emphasis because many people miss this issue!

-Gene

paul0660
09-08-2011, 8:34 PM
crom, what I said is the property has to be posted. The section you linked to mentions that. Note it is AN AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE, meaning you can still get frogwalked to the clink and work it out later at their leisure.

We have, once again, illuminated the can of worms.

jimh
09-08-2011, 9:21 PM
Quoted for emphasis because many people miss this issue!

-Gene

LTC exemption?

hoffmang
09-08-2011, 9:37 PM
LTC exemption?

Yes.

-Gene