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sreiter
08-30-2011, 8:25 PM
Someone on another forum I post on did something stupid in NJ (yeah, I know all about how horrible gun laws are there), but I'm wondering if he has a 2a case.....

His post

So I drove from Virginia to Maine this week. I stopped in New Jersey for the night and stopped in Mass for a two days to see family.

I have a VA conceaIed carry permit. Anyway I brought my handgun with me. While for some reason like a complete dumbass, I forgot my handgun in the hotel room on the closet shelf, loaded. (Mag in, no round in chamber)

I didn't realize until like 2 hours later after struggling through NY traffic with 2 screaming kids in car. I call hotel and they say I gotta come get it or they will just call cops. There is no way I am adding like 5 hours to my already ****ty day by turning around.

So I call Police station and tell them, they go down to hotel and get it, and say they will hold it till i get back. They asked for my name, address, va permit number, etc information.

There's more to it, like he contacted a lawyer, seems like the lawyer's a idiot, etc. (i'll post the link if anyone wants to read more)

My questions are

(1) Forgetting the fact he left his gun behind, which I don't know if its illegal or not, Didn't McDonald give us the right to self defense in our home (aside from elsewhere), and wouldn't a motel be your home for all intents and purposes, like your tent would be when camping. And if so, do you think McDonald would be a viable defense?

This is similar to Revell v. Port Authority of New York & New Jersey. And eventually, the charges were dropped, but it took 3 years to get his gun back, granted, I dont think Revell had the weapon out of its case and loaded. But the Revell case said gun and HP's were accessible, which sounds like the state was saying that was the same as it being loaded.

I further understand the FOPA Section 926A says that "during such transportation" the firearm must be unloaded and not be "readily accessible." , so that's out as a defense.

(2) The hollow points are much stickier, but if we look at Hellers language of "weapons in common usage", can it be successfully applied to ammo as well?


http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/mma.cfm?go=forum.posts&forum=2&thread=1865248&page=1

socalblue
08-30-2011, 9:44 PM
OP is in for a very unpleasant & expensive experience.

stix213
08-30-2011, 10:24 PM
Its legal to have a gun in your home, its legal to have HP's in your home. Does that include a hotel room he no longer is even staying at? I seriously doubt it being NJ. Plus from his posts about how his first reaction was to call the cops on himself and explain the whole thing, I'm sure he's already talked himself into some kind of charge (probably related to him not transporting it in a locked case). Plus now he can't even claim the gun was stolen, since he already gave the police the whole story.

The worst part is after realizing he abandoned his loaded gun, it was more important to him to not be inconvenienced with the two hour drive back to the scene of his stupidity than to be responsible. Hope those few hours of driving he saved were worth it. So he's not only a moron, but he's also just simply irresponsible IMO.

I'd bet money he'll be arrested when he goes to pick up his little LCP.

stix213
08-30-2011, 10:32 PM
Going with lawyer to turn myself in on Friday. Detective said he was sympathetic because of my background and not being a criminal, but its beyond his hands that its going to DA. Detective said he would do his best to make sure i get released on own recog ( RoR, no bail ). They are charging me, and my lawyer is optimistic that he can work something out with the DA and think it will be at worst pti ( pre trial intervention) which basically means probabtion for one year then a clean record. But who knows the DA might get a stick up his *** and wanna throw the book at me. So we will see...

LOL, yep sure enough I was right. What an idiot. :rolleyes:

press1280
08-31-2011, 12:52 AM
Someone on another forum I post on did something stupid in NJ (yeah, I know all about how horrible gun laws are there), but I'm wondering if he has a 2a case.....

His post

So I drove from Virginia to Maine this week. I stopped in New Jersey for the night and stopped in Mass for a two days to see family.

I have a VA conceaIed carry permit. Anyway I brought my handgun with me. While for some reason like a complete dumbass, I forgot my handgun in the hotel room on the closet shelf, loaded. (Mag in, no round in chamber)

I didn't realize until like 2 hours later after struggling through NY traffic with 2 screaming kids in car. I call hotel and they say I gotta come get it or they will just call cops. There is no way I am adding like 5 hours to my already ****ty day by turning around.

So I call Police station and tell them, they go down to hotel and get it, and say they will hold it till i get back. They asked for my name, address, va permit number, etc information.

There's more to it, like he contacted a lawyer, seems like the lawyer's a idiot, etc. (i'll post the link if anyone wants to read more)

My questions are

(1) Forgetting the fact he left his gun behind, which I don't know if its illegal or not, Didn't McDonald give us the right to self defense in our home (aside from elsewhere), and wouldn't a motel be your home for all intents and purposes, like your tent would be when camping. And if so, do you think McDonald would be a viable defense?

This is similar to Revell v. Port Authority of New York & New Jersey. And eventually, the charges were dropped, but it took 3 years to get his gun back, granted, I dont think Revell had the weapon out of its case and loaded. But the Revell case said gun and HP's were accessible, which sounds like the state was saying that was the same as it being loaded.

I further understand the FOPA Section 926A says that "during such transportation" the firearm must be unloaded and not be "readily accessible." , so that's out as a defense.

(2) The hollow points are much stickier, but if we look at Hellers language of "weapons in common usage", can it be successfully applied to ammo as well?


http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/mma.cfm?go=forum.posts&forum=2&thread=1865248&page=1

The hotel as a home has been a gray area and would depend on the state. Since NJ is pretty clear you have to own the property, then I'd say no as far as that goes(at least as far as NJ laws go). As a 2A case it would be interesting considering he's not a NJ resident, he legally can't even use a firearm to defend himself, even at a range or hunting grounds since the statute specifically states "for the purpose of..." and self-defense is not one of the purposes. FOPA is also unclear on this-he made a mistake by leaving it there.
Hollow points could definitely be attacked under the common-use theory IMO.
What exactly is he being charged with? He may want to contact someone like SAF or NRA just to see if he has a case instead of just going with an attorney who's going to throw his client to the wolves and hope they show mercy.

Anchors
08-31-2011, 12:58 AM
What a lame state. I think California is bad and then I look at NJ..

It isn't worth the five extra rounds in the magazine to deal with their other crap.

hoffmang
08-31-2011, 12:59 AM
The hotel is his home if he stayed the night there.

He has the makings of a pretty darn decent 2A challenge assuming he is an otherwise clean individual.

-Gene

cbaer5
08-31-2011, 1:15 AM
off topic but 5 hours or not I'd go get my gun and try not to get the fuzz involved.
Im sorry this guy shouldn't own a firearm.

edit maybe thats too harsh. he might have just lost his common sense. kids can be annoying.

tpuig
08-31-2011, 1:23 AM
His gun was legal in VA, and is legal in Maine. Other than him being a bonehead for leaving it, wouldn't he be fine since NJ wasn't his final destination and it's reasonable to stop overnight?

But that probably makes too much sense. I hope the guy doesn't get hammered.

Connor P Price
08-31-2011, 1:44 AM
The hotel is his home if he stayed the night there.

He has the makings of a pretty darn decent 2A challenge assuming he is an otherwise clean individual.

-Gene

Putting my opposition hat on:

"The moment he checked out he relinquished control of the hotel room and therefore no longer had domicile there. Any 2A protection that would clearly apply 'in the home' was no longer applicable."

Just playing a bit of devils advocate here. That's one opposition argument that seems solid enough.

Wolverine
08-31-2011, 2:22 AM
Putting my opposition hat on:

"The moment he checked out he relinquished control of the hotel room and therefore no longer had domicile there. Any 2A protection that would clearly apply 'in the home' was no longer applicable."

Just playing a bit of devils advocate here. That's one opposition argument that seems solid enough.

I guess it will depend on what they end up charging him with. I think everyone will agree that leaving the loaded gun in the hotel room was irresponsible and there should be some sanction applied to him for that. But it should be proportional to the actual transgression. It seems reasonable that if he no longer had possession of the Hotel room, then he no longer has possession of the handgun within.

From what I read the big problem for him is possession of the gun while he was in the room without a NJ license and possession of hollow points. Now I don't have much of a clue on NJ laws, but a quick check shows that one is permitted to possess hollow points in your home (and range and transport them). So without a confession, it looks like they can really get him only for possession in his temporary home without a NJ license.

So after admitting to some minor negligence for leaving the gun in the room, the real meat of his situation is whether an out-of-stater can be prosecuted for possessing a loaded firearm in his temporary home without a license (that may not be available to out-of-staters). As Gene mentioned above, that might be a reasonable 2nd amendment claim - one that we would all need to see resolved at some point (can't imagine needing to gather 50 different licenses just to travel around the country).

sreiter
08-31-2011, 2:37 AM
Putting my opposition hat on:

"The moment he checked out he relinquished control of the hotel room and therefore no longer had domicile there. Any 2A protection that would clearly apply 'in the home' was no longer applicable."

Just playing a bit of devils advocate here. That's one opposition argument that seems solid enough.

To further that thought though, when he left his weapon behind, he no longer had access to it.

sreiter
08-31-2011, 2:42 AM
The hotel is his home if he stayed the night there.

He has the makings of a pretty darn decent 2A challenge assuming he is an otherwise clean individual.

-Gene

So - my thinking is correct Gene ?

That Mcdonald applies to the gun in the home/motel, and the hollow points would fall under "arms commonly in use"?

Meplat
08-31-2011, 2:42 AM
The hotel as a home has been a gray area and would depend on the state. Since NJ is pretty clear you have to own the property, then I'd say no as far as that goes(at least as far as NJ laws go).

WHAT!! a renter can't have a gun in his home in NJ. I don't see how that could possibly get past Heller or Mc Donald.

sreiter
08-31-2011, 2:49 AM
His gun was legal in VA, and is legal in Maine. Other than him being a bonehead for leaving it, wouldn't he be fine since NJ wasn't his final destination and it's reasonable to stop overnight?

But that probably makes too much sense. I hope the guy doesn't get hammered.

the only problem with your argument is he way you frame it, you're talking FOPA protection, and FOPA goes out the window as soon as you load it, and/or have ready access to it.

sreiter
08-31-2011, 2:51 AM
WHAT!! a renter can't have a gun in his home in NJ. I don't see how that could possibly get past Heller or Mc Donald.

in either case, you need a permit to own/buy (like a hgsc) - there are a few lawsuits currently because obtaining one in most cities/towns, is like trying to get a LTC in LA....to answer the question, renters can have guns.

Meplat
08-31-2011, 2:52 AM
off topic but 5 hours or not I'd go get my gun and try not to get the fuzz involved.
Im sorry this guy shouldn't own a firearm.

edit maybe thats too harsh. he might have just lost his common sense. kids can be annoying.

Man! This is going to involve a lot more than the five hours of aggravation he saved. I think I would have told the clerk to hold the room fore me and then it would continue to be his residence. Even if you had to spend another night there, it's better than spending the night, or thirty, in jail.:rolleyes:

Funtimes
08-31-2011, 2:59 AM
LCP ? He could have picked up a new one in New York for less than a hour of that attorneys time lol.

Wolverine
08-31-2011, 3:09 AM
in either case, you need a permit to own/buy (like a hgsc) - there are a few lawsuits currently because obtaining one in most cities/towns, is like trying to get a LTC in LA....to answer the question, renters can have guns.

Tangentially related question if you know. What are the requirements/limitations for possession of a loaded gun by an out-of-stater like Jason?

stix213
08-31-2011, 6:23 AM
Man! This is going to involve a lot more than the five hours of aggravation he saved. I think I would have told the clerk to hold the room fore me and then it would continue to be his residence. Even if you had to spend another night there, it's better than spending the night, or thirty, in jail.:rolleyes:

Oh yeah ^^^^

Don't get me wrong, whatever NJ is charging him with is going to clearly be a violation of this guy's rights. It's probably not going to be constitutional. But the same could be said for a variety of CA laws that we all follow until they are gone.

I hope he doesn't spend much time in jail, for his kid's sake. The thing about this guy is he knew better than to abandon his loaded gun once he realized he left it behind. If he didn't, and truly didn't realize he did anything wrong, he wouldn't have posted a thread about it.

yellowfin
08-31-2011, 7:34 AM
WHAT!! a renter can't have a gun in his home in NJ. I don't see how that could possibly get past Heller or McDonald.Neither Heller nor McDonald have been applied to directly to NJ yet. Even after such, it will be a repeat of Chicago.

Stonewalker
08-31-2011, 7:37 AM
Man, those MMA deltabravos are pretty elitist about gun ownership. I'm so glad CGN is a *rights*-focused gun forum.

sreiter
08-31-2011, 7:45 AM
Man, those MMA deltabravos are pretty elitist about gun ownership. I'm so glad CGN is a *rights*-focused gun forum.

Nah - its split down the middle. Like life. There are hard core 2a'ers, and idiot anti's

You may have noticed a Bob Ash post (not 100$ sure he posted on that thread). He's one of the design guys at Tromix

Wherryj
08-31-2011, 7:53 AM
Originally Posted by Jason the gun toting moron
Going with lawyer to turn myself in on Friday. Detective said he was sympathetic because of my background and not being a criminal, but its beyond his hands that its going to DA. Detective said he would do his best to make sure i get released on own recog ( RoR, no bail ). They are charging me, and my lawyer is optimistic that he can work something out with the DA and think it will be at worst pti ( pre trial intervention) which basically means probabtion for one year then a clean record. But who knows the DA might get a stick up his *** and wanna throw the book at me. So we will see...

LOL, yep sure enough I was right. What an idiot. :rolleyes:

I assume that the "clean" part of "clean record" in Jersey means "no weapons, ever"?

Wherryj
08-31-2011, 7:56 AM
The hotel is his home if he stayed the night there.

He has the makings of a pretty darn decent 2A challenge assuming he is an otherwise clean individual.

-Gene

...AND has a thick wallet/support of the 2AF.

Stonewalker
08-31-2011, 8:54 AM
Nah - its split down the middle. Like life. There are hard core 2a'ers, and idiot anti's

You may have noticed a Bob Ash post (not 100$ sure he posted on that thread). He's one of the design guys at Tromix

I just noticed a lot of guys saying "you shouldn't have a gun because you're a dumb***". I also noticed a few strong RKBA voices. You were one of them! To be fair, I used think like they did, before I got interested in rights/liberty.

robcoe
08-31-2011, 9:02 AM
Given that it's Jersey, I think this is going to end badly.

Meplat
08-31-2011, 9:28 AM
Neither Heller nor McDonald have been applied to directly to NJ yet. Even after such, it will be a repeat of Chicago.

Sadly, you are correct. But allowing an owner to possess and denying that to a renter would also have 14th amendment issues, would it not?

yellowfin
08-31-2011, 9:46 AM
It might, but again, it'll take a couple years to get far enough up the pipe in the legal system to slap Jersey on the hand and say "No, no, no, you're doing it wrong" and then another lawsuit after that to tell them "THIS MEANS YOU!", then longer after that to make it sting bad enough for them to stop doing what they're doing. We're still at the "Stop! Or I'll say stop again!" phase. :(

sreiter
08-31-2011, 11:10 AM
I just noticed a lot of guys saying "you shouldn't have a gun because you're a dumb***". I also noticed a few strong RKBA voices. You were one of them! To be fair, I used think like they did, before I got interested in rights/liberty.

yeah, part of the dynamics of that board is to F with everyone with some great advise smathered in. i think even the usual pro 2a folks there (and some here) have to chalk it up to "the guy is to dumb to carry(or own) a gun"....

Even if that were the case, there are larger issues then "he's too dumb to have a gun"

choprzrul
08-31-2011, 11:27 AM
A) How do you forget your gun?

B) How do you leave the parking lot without checking for gun?

C) How do you drive over 2 hours without noticing that concealed gun isn't poking you?

D) How do you pass the next exit and NOT turn around to go get your gun?

E) How do you call the cops and report yourself and ever hope to retain your LTC?

F) How do you......

.

FastFinger
08-31-2011, 11:44 AM
A) How do you forget your gun?

B) How do you leave the parking lot without checking for gun?

C) How do you drive over 2 hours without noticing that concealed gun isn't poking you?.

How /why does anyone forget something important? Happens all the time. I read that something like 10 laptops are found at LAX - every day!

D) How do you pass the next exit and NOT turn around to go get your gun?

E) How do you call the cops and report yourself and ever hope to retain your LTC?

F) How do you......



Dang - people make mistakes. At least most of us human ones do. But it's comforting to know that I'm surrounded by perfection.

stix213
08-31-2011, 11:56 AM
Dang - people make mistakes. At least most of us human ones do. But it's comforting to know that I'm surrounded by perfection.

It doesn't require perfection to turn your car around when you realize you left a loaded gun behind in your hotel room. It just takes a level of responsibility.

Wolverine
08-31-2011, 12:20 PM
It doesn't require perfection to turn your car around when you realize you left a loaded gun behind in your hotel room. It just takes a level of responsibility.

True. But if one were to consider it very important that the firearm be recovered one would call the police and ask them to recover it rather than risk the several hour delay it would take for him to drive back. Well, that's what he did even though involving the police opened him up to arrest and conviction. So it seems he took the responsible steps needed to mitigate his original error.

Kind of like forgetting to put out your campfire. The greater risk to the community would be to turn around and drive several hours back to the campsite to put it out. The more responsible thing to do is call the Fire Department/Rangers, confess to your transgression, and get them to put it out even though you will be cited and need to pay a fine.

sreiter
08-31-2011, 12:55 PM
I Remembered this case

http://caselaw.findlaw.com/nj-superior-court-appellate-division/1551955.html

Very similar.

At 2:22 a.m. on November 17, 2007, a police officer in the Town of Clinton encountered defendant attempting to pump his own gas at a closed gas station.   Defendant was not aware that New Jersey does not have self-service gasoline stations.   He explained to the officer that he was on his way from Connecticut to Pennsylvania for a funeral, and his car needed gas.   When questioned as to whether he was in possession of any weapons, defendant answered honestly that he was armed with a handgun.   The officer took a loaded .40 caliber handgun from a holster that defendant was wearing.

Defendant showed the officer that he had permits for the gun from Connecticut and Florida.   He also told the officer that the Florida license was valid in New Jersey.   Uncertain of that claim, the officer checked the status of the New Jersey gun laws and learned that the Florida license is not valid in New Jersey.   He arrested defendant for unlawful possession of a handgun, and also charged him with driving while his driver's license was suspended.

I believe his sentence was two years probation and ordered to forfeit the handgun and ammunition after he pleaded guilty to a third-degree charge of unlawful possession of a handgun without a valid permit.

I hope thats all he gets.

sreiter
08-31-2011, 12:56 PM
True. But if one were to consider it very important that the firearm be recovered one would call the police and ask them to recover it rather than risk the several hour delay it would take for him to drive back. Well, that's what he did even though involving the police opened him up to arrest and conviction. So it seems he took the responsible steps needed to mitigate his original error.

Kind of like forgetting to put out your campfire. The greater risk to the community would be to turn around and drive several hours back to the campsite to put it out. The more responsible thing to do is call the Fire Department/Rangers, confess to your transgression, and get them to put it out even though you will be cited and need to pay a fine.

Good point

HK4113
08-31-2011, 1:00 PM
I wonder what would happen if the defendant, just said screw the handgun, keep it and never came back to Jersey?

paul0660
08-31-2011, 1:23 PM
A) How do you forget your gun?

B) How do you leave the parking lot without checking for gun?

C) How do you drive over 2 hours without noticing that concealed gun isn't poking you?

D) How do you pass the next exit and NOT turn around to go get your gun?

E) How do you call the cops and report yourself and ever hope to retain your LTC?

F) How do you......

.

Yes, I am inclined to believe the story is BS, which is also the predominate conclusion of the most recent posters on that board. It is an interesting hypothetical situation with lots of 2a implications, but as one poster over there said Yea, this is getting to be WAY TOO perfect of a screwup.

Maestro Pistolero
08-31-2011, 1:48 PM
Yes, I am inclined to believe the story is BS, which is also the predominate conclusion of the most recent posters on that board. It is an interesting hypothetical situation with lots of 2a implications, but as one poster over there said

As hard as it may be to imagine, It's possible to leave and forget a gun. It happens for police officers from time to time. I have no reason to disbelieve the story, as who would make up such a dumb thing about themselves that will land them a criminal conviction.

Imagine the "DOH!!!" moment of realization. In friggin' New Jersey, no less. OMG!

I hate to admit this but I left a fanny pack at a Starbucks a few years ago. Realized it 20 minutes later and called but it was already in police custody. It was a stupid mistake made possible by the perfect storm of distractions and being in a hurry.

I picked it up a half hour later at the police sub-station. Showed ID and didn't even get a lecture. They were actually very courteous. I would have really missed that Sig.

press1280
08-31-2011, 2:14 PM
Yes, I am inclined to believe the story is BS, which is also the predominate conclusion of the most recent posters on that board. It is an interesting hypothetical situation with lots of 2a implications, but as one poster over there said

Me too-kind of unusual to call yourself a "gun toting moron" even as a screen name. I wouldn't be suprised if this is that individual's first or second post on that board.
As far as this issue goes theoretically here's the statute:"Nothing in subsections b., c. and d. of N.J.S.2C:39-5 shall be construed to prevent a person keeping or carrying about his place of business, residence, premises or other land owned or possessed by him, any firearm, or from carrying the same, in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section, from any place of purchase to his residence or place of business, between his dwelling and his place of business, between one place of business or residence and another when moving, or between his dwelling or place of business and place where such firearms are repaired, for the purpose of repair. For the purposes of this section, a place of business shall be deemed to be a fixed location." I don't think they've gone as far as busting someone who's renting, but obviously they jailed Revell on a hotel not being a place owned or possessed(but he wasn't charged in the end). It's also widely thought you need a license to possess in NJ-you don't. You need a permit to purchase. If you move into the state with legally owned guns you're OK. That's why it's weird they always try to arrest people for illegal possession when it should be for carrying w/o a permit.

Maestro Pistolero
08-31-2011, 3:15 PM
If an otherwise perfectly law abiding individual had a loaded firearm in his hotel room, it might be defensible on appeal, as the hotel room is a domicile. But once he checked out, it was no longer his domicile, so even that defense might disappear. I realize this is NJ and they would prosecute even a pure, uncolored possession-in-the-home case.

But Heller might be the perfect defense for a pure possession-in-the-home case (without a permit that can't be had by a non-resident)

boxbro
08-31-2011, 4:01 PM
If an otherwise perfectly law abiding individual had a loaded firearm in his hotel room, it might be defensible on appeal, as the hotel room is a domicile. But once he checked out, it was no longer his domicile, so even that defense might disappear. I realize this is NJ and they would prosecute even a pure, uncolored possession-in-the-home case.

But Heller might be the perfect defense for a pure possession-in-the-home case (without a permit that can't be had by a non-resident)

So lets say you rent a house and you have a little shelf that you keep your gun on.
Then lets say you move out and forget said gun.
It's no longer your domicile, but exactly what can they charge you with, especially if you are not even physically there with the gun ?

stix213
08-31-2011, 4:31 PM
True. But if one were to consider it very important that the firearm be recovered one would call the police and ask them to recover it rather than risk the several hour delay it would take for him to drive back. Well, that's what he did even though involving the police opened him up to arrest and conviction. So it seems he took the responsible steps needed to mitigate his original error.

Kind of like forgetting to put out your campfire. The greater risk to the community would be to turn around and drive several hours back to the campsite to put it out. The more responsible thing to do is call the Fire Department/Rangers, confess to your transgression, and get them to put it out even though you will be cited and need to pay a fine.

Yes but he had already previously talked to the hotel, which according to the posts was going to let him come get the handgun, but if he didn't they were going to go to the police.

So its more like forgetting to put out your campfire, contacting someone in a neighboring campsite that can watch the campfire for you so you know temporarily there is no danger (as long as you return immediately), then deciding "screw it" and calling the forest service to inform them that while you could go back and put your fire out, you're letting them know you've decided not to and that you are making it their problem, ala "please clean up my mess, I've got screaming kids and hate to mess up my schedule.". Doesn't sound quite as responsible as your version....

sreiter
08-31-2011, 4:35 PM
Yes, I am inclined to believe the story is BS, which is also the predominate conclusion of the most recent posters on that board. It is an interesting hypothetical situation with lots of 2a implications, but as one poster over there said

The guy is a well respected MOD there

Wolverine
08-31-2011, 5:03 PM
Yes but he had already previously talked to the hotel, which according to the posts was going to let him come get the handgun, but if he didn't they were going to go to the police.

So its more like forgetting to put out your campfire, contacting someone in a neighboring campsite that can watch the campfire for you so you know temporarily there is no danger (as long as you return immediately), then deciding "screw it" and calling the forest service to inform them that while you could go back and put your fire out, you're letting them know you've decided not to and that you are making it their problem, ala "please clean up my mess, I've got screaming kids and hate to mess up my schedule.". Doesn't sound quite as responsible as your version....

I agree that under that set of facts he should have returned to the hotel and picked up his gun.

Mulay El Raisuli
09-01-2011, 7:56 AM
Its legal to have a gun in your home, its legal to have HP's in your home. Does that include a hotel room he no longer is even staying at? I seriously doubt it being NJ. Plus from his posts about how his first reaction was to call the cops on himself and explain the whole thing, I'm sure he's already talked himself into some kind of charge (probably related to him not transporting it in a locked case). Plus now he can't even claim the gun was stolen, since he already gave the police the whole story.

The worst part is after realizing he abandoned his loaded gun, it was more important to him to not be inconvenienced with the two hour drive back to the scene of his stupidity than to be responsible. Hope those few hours of driving he saved were worth it. So he's not only a moron, but he's also just simply irresponsible IMO.

I'd bet money he'll be arrested when he goes to pick up his little LCP.


The part in bold pretty much says it all. Yes, a 4hr. detour is going to seriously screw up his itinerary, & 2 screaming kids surely won't make things easier. But, RESPP0NSIBILITY matters & this is something this guy is seriously short of.

In spite of that...


The hotel is his home if he stayed the night there.

He has the makings of a pretty darn decent 2A challenge assuming he is an otherwise clean individual.

-Gene


The motel room counts as "domicile" in other respects, & so should count as such here. So, yes, does have the makings of a decent 2A defense. One I hope he goes for & wins at.

But he's still not the sharpest tool in the shed.


The Raisuli