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lehn20
08-24-2011, 11:03 AM
Can anyone point me in the right direction for paperwork to fill out to apply for a permit that would allow me to order flashbangs in CA.
It is for training purposes.

Do I need a FFL Type 9?

Thanks,

OCArmory
08-24-2011, 1:28 PM
You would need a destructive device permit. Without an FFL there is a $200 tax stamp per unit. You would need a type 10 FFL.
mike

lehn20
08-26-2011, 11:22 AM
Ok, so you can get a destructive device permit on its own, but would have to pay $200 per flashbang for the tax stamp not to mention the wait!!?

Let me look into FFL Type 10.....

I still dont know why a Type 9 wouldnt do it, if I just wanna buy myself for training?

6172crew
08-26-2011, 12:45 PM
Ok, so you can get a destructive device permit on its own, but would have to pay $200 per flashbang for the tax stamp not to mention the wait!!?

Let me look into FFL Type 10.....

I still dont know why a Type 9 wouldnt do it, if I just wanna buy myself for training?

Im tracking down some de-watt [a[erwork with the batfe and the serial number comes up as a flashbang at a PD. Even the Cops have to do paperwork on them. Can you do one yourself on a Form 1 that doesnt ruin the can and can be re-packed?

Closest thing Ive seen to a Flas Bang was a Arty Sim....that thing blew my wig back.

lehn20
08-26-2011, 12:49 PM
I know cops have to do paperwork and they usually keep the "spoons" after they throw them, so they can keep the serial numbers.

The Deftechs are "rechargeable".

CHS
08-26-2011, 1:39 PM
You would need a destructive device permit. Without an FFL there is a $200 tax stamp per unit. You would need a type 10 FFL.
mike

I thought CA only required DD permits on devices with a bore diameter greater than .60cal?

Since a flash bang doesn't actually have a bore or bore diameter, would it therefore be exempt from the CA permitting process?

blackbox
08-26-2011, 10:56 PM
There's lots of alternatives that aren't considered DD's. Even agencies don't want to deal with the paperwork:

http://trainingflashbang.com/ - CO2 cartridge powered
http://www.alstechnologies.com/index.php?page=ALSDDTS - Pyrotechnic Fuze
http://www.afmo.com/CTS_Flash_Bang_Training_System_p/cts_flashbangtrain.htm - Pyrotechnic Fuze

OCArmory
08-27-2011, 8:30 AM
They are registered DD's with the feds. When you fill out your form 4 for transfer they are going to ask you for your DD permit.

Quiet
08-28-2011, 8:04 AM
I thought CA only required DD permits on devices with a bore diameter greater than .60cal?

Since a flash bang doesn't actually have a bore or bore diameter, would it therefore be exempt from the CA permitting process?

CA considers them to be DDs due to being "grenades". [PC 12301(a)(2)]

You will need a Dangerous Weapons Permit/License for DDs, in order to legally acquire/possess/transport them in CA. [PC 12305]



Penal Code 12301
(a) The term "destructive device," as used in this chapter, shall include any of the following weapons:
(2) Any bomb, grenade, explosive missile, or similar device or any launching device therefor.

Penal Code 12305
(a) Every dealer, manufacturer, importer, and exporter of any destructive device, or any motion picture or television studio using destructive devices in the conduct of its business, shall obtain a permit for the conduct of that business from the Department of Justice.
(b) Any person, firm, or corporation not mentioned in subdivision (a) shall obtain a permit from the Department of Justice in order to possess or transport any destructive device. No permit shall be issued to any person who meets any of the following criteria:
(1) Has been convicted of any felony.
(2) Is addicted to the use of any narcotic drug.
(3) Is a person in a class prohibited by Section 8100 or 8103 of the Welfare and Institutions Code or Section 12021 or 12021.1 of this code.
(c) Applications for permits shall be filed in writing, signed by the applicant if an individual, or by a member or officer qualified to sign if the applicant is a firm or corporation, and shall state the name, business in which engaged, business address and a full description of the use to which the destructive devices are to be put.
(d) Applications and permits shall be uniform throughout the state on forms prescribed by the Department of Justice.
(e) Each applicant for a permit shall pay at the time of filing his or her application a fee not to exceed the application processing costs of the Department of Justice. A permit granted pursuant to this article may be renewed one year from the date of issuance, and annually thereafter, upon the filing of a renewal application and the payment of a permit renewal fee not to exceed the application processing costs of the Department of Justice. After the department establishes fees sufficient in amount to cover processing costs, the amount of the fees shall only increase at a rate not to exceed the legislatively approved cost-of-living adjustment for the department.
(f) Except as provided in subdivision (g), the Department of Justice shall, for every person, firm, or corporation to whom a permit is issued pursuant to this article, annually conduct an inspection for security and safe storage purposes, and to reconcile the inventory of destructive devices.
(g) A person, firm, or corporation with an inventory of fewer than five devices that require any Department of Justice permit shall be subject to an inspection for security and safe storage purposes, and to reconcile inventory, once every five years, or more frequently if determined by the department.

lehn20
08-28-2011, 11:56 PM
So if I contact ALS or Deftec, all they will ask for before shipping is the Dangerous Weapons Permit for DD?

The application doesn't look bad.
Is there any chance they will approve it though?

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/FD030DWApp.pdf

Anchors
08-29-2011, 12:40 AM
I don't even see how they are destructive devices federally (I know they are, I just think it is dumb).

It isn't a true explosive hand grenade as much as they want to call it one.

Falconis
08-29-2011, 12:43 AM
I don't even see how they are destructive devices federally (I know they are, I just think it is dumb).

It isn't a true explosive hand grenade as much as they want to call it one.

That may be true, but they sure do suck if you're in the vicinity of one going off. I did role playing for our entry team once a long time ago, I still don't think my eyes and ears ever recovered from that.