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View Full Version : gun lock needed if safe owned


awall919
08-23-2011, 1:11 PM
Hello, I was just curious as to if you needed to buy a new gun lock everytime you purchase a new firearm if you own a CA DOJ certified safe?

I am aware that some counties require a lock purchase regardless, but i am mainly curious about the city limits of Fremont ( believe Alameda co.). Does the safe affidavit not apply in this city/county?

All info appreciated, Thank you.

gotsig
08-23-2011, 1:22 PM
I'm not sure if its law, but I am always forced to buy a lock for handgun purchase.For long guns, the safe affidavit works.YMMV

awall919
08-23-2011, 1:36 PM
Thanks gotsig, I assumed that to be the case, but wanted to confirm from a few other sources as well.
Anyone else with an opinion on the subject?

socal2310
08-23-2011, 2:03 PM
Yes, the safe affidavit only applies to long guns. However, you don't need to purchase a new gun lock, you can simply bring in one of your old ones (you don't even need a key since the law doesn't compel you to actually use it - though I wouldn't volunteer that particular fact if you were indeed missing the key).

spdrcr
08-23-2011, 2:08 PM
Yes, the safe affidavit only applies to long guns. However, you don't need to purchase a new gun lock, you can simply bring in one of your old ones (you don't even need a key since the law doesn't compel you to actually use it - though I wouldn't volunteer that particular fact if you were indeed missing the key).

I was told it must be an approved lock though, so not just any lock will do.

For handgun purchases I've re-used included factory locks and I've bought new ones. It all kind of depends where you do the transfer and what the FFL requires.

For long guns I always use the safe affidavit.

Librarian
08-23-2011, 2:11 PM
See the wiki article for the long explanation -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Buying_and_selling_firearms_in_California#Locks.2C _Safes.2C_and_Laws

bohoki
08-23-2011, 2:41 PM
handguns need to be sold with a lock per the ffls agreement with the BATF

california has its own requirements sometimes they overlap but with different requirements

like if you bought a handgun and it came with a non ca approved lock you should be able to have the one lock qualify for the batf the and to a safe affidavit for CA but most ffls dont want to have to fuss with 2 things so they just make you buy a lock

Army
08-23-2011, 2:57 PM
Buy the lock, take it to your car, secure firearm, bring defective lock back into store for refund.

awall919
08-23-2011, 4:41 PM
Thank you all for the information. I was pretty sure that the safe affidavit only applied to long guns, and handguns still needed a CA DOJ approved lock upon purchase if one was not included, but while in a gun shop the other day the employee insisted that a gun lock needed to be purchased, (i was DROsing a stripped AR lower), as it was irrelevant weather or not I had a safe. They also required me to purchase a magazine with the lower stating since when the rifle was complete it had to have a "Fixed magazine" to be legal even as a stripped receiver. I asked if it was store policy that a lock and magazine purchase was necessary with the purchase of a stripped lower, but they insisted that it was state law. They were not rude while explaining this to me and listened to my understanding of the law, but most of what they told me about the purchase of stripped lowers seemed a bit fishy to me.
I sucked it up paid the 10 bucks for the lock and the 20 bucks for the magazine (figure you could always use an extra), but id still like to know weather his info was true or not. Thanks Librarian, il check out that link asap. Just wanted to see if anybody else has has a similar experience buying a stripped lower?

Mike's Custom
08-23-2011, 4:47 PM
The Federal law requires all handguns sold must have a gun lock. The FEDs don't care about CAs gun safe law. Long guns are not required by federal law to have a gun lock but CA says you have to have a lock or CA approved type gun safe. So, for FFLs it is kind of a pain since we must make sure every hand gun has a lock.

Librarian
08-23-2011, 5:26 PM
They also required me to purchase a magazine with the lower stating since when the rifle was complete it had to have a "Fixed magazine" to be legal even as a stripped receiver. I asked if it was store policy that a lock and magazine purchase was necessary with the purchase of a stripped lower, but they insisted that it was state law.

Not that I expect the shop to have thought this through, but the counter argument is 'what if I intend to build a bolt-action weapon out of this lower?' Their concern is clearly 'banned semi-automatic centerfire rifles', but lowers are far more flexible in application than just a semi-automatic upper.

Librarian
08-23-2011, 5:30 PM
The Federal law requires all handguns sold must have a gun lock.

Strictly speaking, no.

The requirement is for " a secure gun storage or safety device (as defined in section 921 (a)(34)) for that handgun. "

If BATFE will ever get off their collective sitting-places and either accept the CA safe-affidavit, or create a redundant version that they like better, a safe also satisfies that requirement.

Until BATFE actually decides to do its job, however, as applied your statement is correct.

S.A.
08-23-2011, 7:07 PM
If the handgun comes with manufacturers lock, you do not need to buy stores lock. I just went thru this last week as the "buyer" in ppt. Store said I need to buy a lock per state rules,"seller", who is a ffl,politely said no, not needed because gun has manufacturers lock,(still in wrapper) . Store did not agree. Seller requested store call "Bonnie" at DOJ which store agreed to.
DOJ said guns with manufactuers lock "a gray area" so store said no lock needed.Store was very professional and polite about it.
Store is Ammo bros in Cerritos.

ETD1010
08-23-2011, 10:20 PM
Safe satisfies DOJ, but for handguns, fed law requires a lock be supplied with it.

awall919
08-23-2011, 11:01 PM
response to Librarian post #11:
I was thinking the same thing. there are other things you can build from a stripped AR lower, like you stated bolt guns, im sure most of us have seen the AR cross bow, even a .22LR ARs or an AR57 ca legal. no standard .223 magazine needed for any of these so why would you have to buy one. It would be different if i was registering a lower for an AR pistol (i assume), than pistol regulations would apply, i.e lock. But for a standard AR stripped lower being registered as a rifle i think i was swindled into buying a lock and magazine. But I suppose you can never have enough mags.. Cant say the same for the gun lock.Not angry at the store just thought it was weird "Law". Maby a new sales pitch?

Fictitious Simily
08-24-2011, 12:11 AM
Turners gives me locks for my handguns :D, long guns I fill out the safe affidavit.

Dlevi03
08-24-2011, 12:31 AM
If the handgun comes with manufacturers lock, you do not need to buy stores lock. I just went thru this last week as the "buyer" in ppt. Store said I need to buy a lock per state rules,"seller", who is a ffl,politely said no, not needed because gun has manufacturers lock,(still in wrapper) . Store did not agree. Seller requested store call "Bonnie" at DOJ which store agreed to.
DOJ said guns with manufactuers lock "a gray area" so store said no lock needed.Store was very professional and polite about it.
Store is Ammo bros in Cerritos.


Its been many years since I bought a new gun but I have been very frustrated with my experiences in the last couple of months.
Just bought a handgun and expected to have to buy a lock but the clerk said not needed cause the manufacture provided one. This was at the Stockade in Westminster. A month before Big 5 told me that if I used my own lock that I had to bring in a receipt that showed I bought it within 30 days. Since I feel like this law is a scam I went to a different company bought the lock and showed the gut my receipt. It seems like even gun sellers have a hard time interpreting the law.

Flintlock Tom
08-24-2011, 10:14 AM
My most recent handgun purchase online was a Ruger. I asked the seller if he had the Ruger lock that came with it when it was new. He said he would look around and stick "a lock" in the case.
When my FFL received it he saw that there was a generic lock in the case which was obviously purchased with the gun. That was good enough for him to satisfy the lock requirement.
It was just one of those no-name, generic, $2 cable locks.

diginit
08-24-2011, 6:02 PM
Just sign the safe affadavit and carry the handgun out of the store and put it, unloaded, on the front seat. If you put it into a case it is concieled and has to be locked. Otherwise it is openly carried.

jwkincal
08-24-2011, 6:27 PM
Just sign the safe affadavit and carry the handgun out of the store and put it, unloaded, on the front seat. If you put it into a case it is concieled and has to be locked. Otherwise it is openly carried.

To be transported it must be locked. What you describe here is a crime, IIRC.

Others will probably concur...

Librarian
08-24-2011, 6:32 PM
Just sign the safe affadavit and carry the handgun out of the store and put it, unloaded, on the front seat. If you put it into a case it is concieled and has to be locked. Otherwise it is openly carried.

To be transported it must be locked. What you describe here is a crime, IIRC.

Others will probably concur...

But if they do concur, they would be mistaken.

It isn't required that a handgun be locked for transport, unless transported concealed without LTC.

It's sometimes inconvenient, with school zones and all, but unloaded open carry is legal for the moment.

jwkincal
08-24-2011, 6:37 PM
Yeah, just looked it all up and he's right.

It would be asking for trouble in many places, but it is legal, just as OC is.

xxINKxx
08-25-2011, 2:49 PM
Even though there are laws saying what the requirements are, gun shops can still make up their own policy.

I bought a shotgun at big 5 that didn't have a lock, and was like owell I own a safe. The guy said it didn't matter I have to buy a 10$ lock on all guns. So big 5 obviously doesn't care that it's not required.

They also make you wait 11 days. And they don't start the dros til the day after the purchase date, which = 12 days total from start