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View Full Version : I'm sooooo Confused


krazek
01-06-2007, 1:59 PM
So guys i've been a calguns member for.... almost a year. and I've been keeping track of this OLL like no tomorrow because i seriously wanna build up these bad boys and take em to the range. I've been waiting for the list to happen....buuuuut i dunno if thats going to be happening anytime soon, so i decided that i'm just gonna go ahead with the build anyway.

Problem is, i just talked to an LEO in the LAPD who is my friend and the first thing he comes up to me and says "I got bad news about your OLL's" and mentions something about the Atorney General himself releasing a statement about the lower is able to handle a detachable magazine it is considered illegal. meaning big uh oh for everybody, but i was asking if that included mag locks, welds and everything. and according to him the lower has to be unable to take a detachable magazine period.

He also did mention that because that statement is contradactory to the statement that DOJ has previously released about magazines being permanently fixed that its probably going to be fought and won in the legal system because of the contradiction from the same department.

I trust my friend a lot, but i am just really confused because i'm preettyy sure it would be like the hottest news on these forumns. so i'd like to hear it from you guys. Thanks for the help and hopefully it clears up some things.

Fjold
01-06-2007, 2:18 PM
People are seeing the old memo's that the DOJ posted and are reading them as law.

blacklisted
01-06-2007, 2:47 PM
People are seeing the old memo's that the DOJ posted and are reading them as law.

They are also reading the memo incorrectly! Anyone with a basic knowledge of AW laws would know that the "capacity to accept a detachable magazine" alone does not make a semi-automatic centerfire rifle an assault weapon.

This is an example of an agency trying to change a law through regulation. If it bothers you a lot, try one of the alternative grip/stocks with a detachable magazine and no evil features.

bwiese
01-06-2007, 2:57 PM
Problem is, i just talked to an LEO in the LAPD who is my friend and the first thing he comes up to me and says "I got bad news about your OLL's" and mentions something about the Atorney General himself releasing a statement about the lower is able to handle a detachable magazine it is considered illegal.

Nope. He's confusing a memo with actual regulations, which have not changed since 2000.

meaning big uh oh for everybody, but i was asking if that included mag locks, welds and everything. and according to him the lower has to be unable to take a detachable magazine period.

Please go back and read some of the history here, responses to DOJ on calgunlaws.com, etc. It's been discussed to death for the last half year.


He also did mention that because that statement is contradactory to the statement that DOJ has previously released about magazines being permanently fixed that its probably going to be fought and won in the legal system because of the contradiction from the same department.

Ahh, finally he gets it.

Again, the DOJ HANDWAVING IS JUST A MEMO. IT HAS THE SAME LEGAL FORCE AS IF THEY'D SAID THE MOON IS MADE OF GREEN CHEESE. UNTIL IT BECOMES A FORMAL DEFINITION, FORMALLY ADDED TO THE CALIF CODE OF REGULATION, 11CCR 5469, THE DOJ MEMO HAS NO FORCE.

In fact, because of 'underground law' side effects, as well as DOJ not following procedural rules for the adoption of new regulations (and which apply to any agency), continuation of this process without a complete restart will likely be rejected by Office of Administrative Law (part of Sec. of State's office, which controls adoption/publication of new regulations).

CA SHOOTER
01-06-2007, 3:22 PM
Still sucks that lots of LEOs are still saying OLLs are illegal when there not .

hoffmang
01-06-2007, 3:25 PM
Also, If you are worried that the CCR will change and would then change the definition of detachable magazine, then build featureless.

Get a Monsterman Grip or a U-15 Stock and have detachable magazines and no flash hider. Those configurations are not at all dealt with by the proposed Rulemaking.

Remember, Alison would prefer we all run with detachable magazines and no pistol grips! I love her logic.

-Gene

krazek
01-06-2007, 3:45 PM
well i was just asking because it seemed like it was a recent thing according to my leo friend. i know about the previous memos and the stuff thats been going on with that.

Nope. He's confusing a memo with actual regulations, which have not changed since 2000.



Please go back and read some of the history here, responses to DOJ on calgunlaws.com, etc. It's been discussed to death for the last half year.



Ahh, finally he gets it.

Again, the DOJ HANDWAVING IS JUST A MEMO. IT HAS THE SAME LEGAL FORCE AS IF THEY'D SAID THE MOON IS MADE OF GREEN CHEESE. UNTIL IT BECOMES A FORMAL DEFINITION, FORMALLY ADDED TO THE CALIF CODE OF REGULATION, 11CCR 5469, THE DOJ MEMO HAS NO FORCE.

In fact, because of 'underground law' side effects, as well as DOJ not following procedural rules for the adoption of new regulations (and which apply to any agency), continuation of this process without a complete restart will likely be rejected by Office of Administrative Law (part of Sec. of State's office, which controls adoption/publication of new regulations).

sintax
01-06-2007, 3:59 PM
well i was just asking because it seemed like it was a recent thing according to my leo friend. i know about the previous memos and the stuff thats been going on with that.

No your LEO friend is incorrect, there has been NO new laws or regulations.

krazek
01-06-2007, 5:13 PM
Good to know :)

No your LEO friend is incorrect, there has been NO new laws or regulations.

Mark_in_Pasadena
01-06-2007, 5:31 PM
I got a few friends that are LEO's, hell my ex-wife is LAPD, and I have to say this. They are great people, but completely dependant on information that is force fed to them, i.e. crap in = crap out. Just my .02 cents...