PDA

View Full Version : How many guns is too many?


celticstorm
07-13-2011, 7:53 AM
Arrived at work this morning and heard a disturbing story from a co-worker concerning a close friend of his. He just found out this friend and his 92 father were arrested and all their guns confiscated. His friend is a longshorman who had moved back home to take care of his 92 year old father. His father had been collecting guns all his life. Obviously some of those guns were unregistered. They had approximately 35 weapons in a gun safe.

The police raided the home, confiscated all of their weapons and the sons cell phone. Both the son and his 92 year old father were arrested. This co-worker said one of the reasons given was that they owned too many guns and that they were not all registered?

Obviously this is all hearsay.... I don't have all the facts yet, but if you bought a handgun in the days when they didn't require registration do you have to take it in to be registered?.... and is there a limit on how many guns one person can own?

CessnaDriver
07-13-2011, 7:57 AM
There is more to this.
We need details.

Rock6.3
07-13-2011, 8:16 AM
Something happened that caused a reaction by law enforcement. That something was NOT the ownership of 'too many guns'.

Get the rest of the story...

Nick Justice
07-13-2011, 8:17 AM
There is no law requiring you to register your guns ("assault weapons" exlcuded). There is no law regarding the number of guns someone can own. You can own a million if you want (if you can afford them).

Oceanbob
07-13-2011, 8:18 AM
Your entire story is false. (FUD)

Sorry...hearsay is funny sometimes. :D

There is no registration requirements for the situation you describe.

I own guns I bought in the 70s and 80s before any registration law took effect. I am not required to register them.

There is obviously MORE TO THIS TALE.

Rock6.3
07-13-2011, 8:22 AM
Perhaps your longshoreman is a convicted felon who has lost his gun rights, and had access to the gun safe. Perhaps the safe was wide open during a parole visit?

nick
07-13-2011, 8:25 AM
Handguns are registered at the time of purchase/transfer. If you had it since before the registration kicked in, it's perfectly fine. Moreover, if you made a handgun yourself for personal use, you don't have to register it, either.

There's no limit on the number of guns one can own.

There has to be some other reason for the raid. Well, I hope so anyway.

ScottB
07-13-2011, 8:28 AM
To answer the OP's question, I defer to Sen. Phil Gramm (and his thick as molasses Texas drawl):

"Ah got more guns than ah need and less guns than I wohnt"

vanmanstemig
07-13-2011, 8:28 AM
you only have to register newly acquired handguns in California + assault rifles and if you make you own pistol no registration is needed(ar pistol build). and the number of guns you can own is only limited by the amount of money you have as long as guns are legal. but I have 1 pistol two rifles and a shotgun and all acquired legally in the last 3 years but only the pistol is registered.

Mssr. Eleganté
07-13-2011, 8:48 AM
If the unregistered guns were NFA weapons then one is all it takes.

grammaton76
07-13-2011, 8:52 AM
My armory is somewhere north of 90 at present. Not counting un-built parts kits.

celticstorm
07-13-2011, 8:59 AM
As I stated I do not know all of the facts. What I was curious to know is whether there is a limit on the number of guns you can own and the registration issue on already purchased guns.

The fact that this man and his 92 year old father were arrested and all of their guns & cash in the home confiscated is true. As soon as I can get further accurate details I will post.

taperxz
07-13-2011, 9:03 AM
I would think an arrest like this would make the news of some sort. Wher did this happen? The news always loves to hear about "arsenals" being found.

celticstorm
07-13-2011, 9:05 AM
The son works as a longshoreman in Long Beach. I believe they live in Palos Verdes.

robcoe
07-13-2011, 9:10 AM
Arrived at work this morning and heard a disturbing story from a co-worker concerning a close friend of his. He just found out this friend and his 92 father were arrested and all their guns confiscated. His friend is a longshorman who had moved back home to take care of his 92 year old father. His father had been collecting guns all his life. Obviously some of those guns were unregistered. They had approximately 35 weapons in a gun safe.

The police raided the home, confiscated all of their weapons and the sons cell phone. Both the son and his 92 year old father were arrested. This co-worker said one of the reasons given was that they owned too many guns and that they were not all registered?

Obviously this is all hearsay.... I don't have all the facts yet, but if you bought a handgun in the days when they didn't require registration do you have to take it in to be registered?.... and is there a limit on how many guns one person can own?


Something major missing from this story.

the only way I see this happening is if the "unregistered" guns they were talking about were California assault weapons that were not registered.

the "too many" part is not true.

liketoshoot
07-13-2011, 9:14 AM
not all the guns would need to be registered, only the aw the rest depends on when they were purchased.
I say FUD.

celticstorm
07-13-2011, 9:20 AM
Another question. Lets just say that one of the guns was an unregistered AK47. Could they confiscate all of the other legal weapons?

dantodd
07-13-2011, 9:53 AM
Geeze guys. Give a noob a break. You should have your friend give the guys who had their property confiscated the CalGuns Foundation contact info. There many people who have perfectly legal collections numbering in the thousands. There is no limit to the number of firearms you may legally possess if you are not a prohibited person.

Here is the thread with the CalGuns Foundation contact info. http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=245866

Yes, it is likely that an unregistered AW (or suspected unregistered AW) could get all of the contents of the safe confiscated. There are likely ways for the son to get the legal guns back even if the father is convicted of AW possession.

celticstorm
07-13-2011, 10:02 AM
Geeze guys. Give a noob a break. You should have your friend give the guys who had their property confiscated the CalGuns Foundation contact info. There many people who have perfectly legal collections numbering in the thousands. There is no limit to the number of firearms you may legally possess if you are not a prohibited person.

Here is the thread with the CalGuns Foundation contact info. http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=245866

Yes, it is likely that an unregistered AW (or suspected unregistered AW) could get all of the contents of the safe confiscated. There are likely ways for the son to get the legal guns back even if the father is convicted of AW possession.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH. This information was helpful and non condescending. :o

Librarian
07-13-2011, 11:16 AM
when did the whole registration of guns take in to effect?

See the wiki article -- http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index.php/Firearms_registration.

I'm going to clean this up a little and leave it open; let us try to hold speculation until the OP can get more info.

ivanimal
07-13-2011, 11:25 AM
The most I have ever owned at one time is over 400, but then again I was into quantity and not quality. Now it is decidedly less. I am a federally licensed collector.:43:

ETA also please have them call the CGF if they are being charged and are not in the wrong. I heard those guys are really nice people.

RRichie09
07-13-2011, 11:53 AM
I bet your friend conviently left out the reason the police were at their house in the first place. If owning too many guns was a crime then all the PD has to do is go through the gallery section of this forum and they would be busy for months.

stix213
07-13-2011, 1:21 PM
You "may" have too many guns if while counting them someone can trip you up by shouting random numbers, which pisses you off by setting your counting back another 20 minutes :p

HowardW56
07-13-2011, 1:35 PM
1,000,000 + 1 is too many. Anything less than that and you're good!

BayAreaShooter
07-13-2011, 1:40 PM
I believe in some other states there is a limit. While not a set limit they say it is illegal to "HOARD" gun's or ammo.

HowardW56
07-13-2011, 1:59 PM
I believe in some other states there is a limit. While not a set limit they say it is illegal to "HOARD" gun's or ammo.

For the benefit of everyone here, do you have any information as to which states or what amount represents hoarding?

This is the first that I have ever herd of a limit...

stix213
07-13-2011, 2:00 PM
I never understood the idea of setting a limit. There is already a limit to how many you can hold/carry at once, which is set by science.

BayAreaShooter
07-13-2011, 2:43 PM
For the benefit of everyone here, do you have any information as to which states or what amount represents hoarding?

This is the first that I have ever herd of a limit...

While I could not find what I was referring to here are a few articles. While it seems the headlines say they were arrested and/or charged with hoarding guns it does not seem they were. I will look for the YOUTUBE video I was referring too. The person in the video I am looking for could have been completely wrong and as it stands that seems to be the case.

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/02/09/Man-allegedly-hoarding-weapons-arrested/UPI-66721265743666/

http://www.arizonashooting.com/v3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=46768&start=0

Kavey
07-13-2011, 3:10 PM
Arrived at work this morning and heard a disturbing story from a co-worker concerning a close friend of his. He just found out this friend and his 92 father were arrested and all their guns confiscated. His friend is a longshorman who had moved back home to take care of his 92 year old father. His father had been collecting guns all his life. Obviously some of those guns were unregistered. They had approximately 35 weapons in a gun safe.

The police raided the home, confiscated all of their weapons and the sons cell phone. Both the son and his 92 year old father were arrested. This co-worker said one of the reasons given was that they owned too many guns and that they were not all registered?

Obviously this is all hearsay.... I don't have all the facts yet, but if you bought a handgun in the days when they didn't require registration do you have to take it in to be registered?.... and is there a limit on how many guns one person can own?

Without a doubt, at any given time, there is a limit on the number of guns that you can own in California.

I have run into this limit on several occasions and suffered the consequences.

The limit is set and enforced by my wife!


____________________________

I'm not a lawyer, but I have seen every episode of Judge Judy.

Anchors
07-13-2011, 3:36 PM
For the benefit of everyone here, do you have any information as to which states or what amount represents hoarding?

This is the first that I have ever herd of a limit...

There isn't, but MA was proposing a law to limit people to 10 guns because more than that is an "arsenal".

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=430981

celticstorm
07-13-2011, 6:34 PM
Received further information on original thread. Evidently a long time "friend" of the family was up on charges that would have been 3 counts and bye bye to prison for a very long time. He plea bargained out of the 3 strikes by saying he knew of a house that had a large stash of illegal weapons. According to my information they did have a large gun collection that included a couple of unregistered AK 47's. Based on the information from the 3 strikes guy they did a stake out on father and sons house. Raided said house and confiscated all their guns plus cash in the house. Father and son are in the process of trying to clear their name and get back their legal guns.

Moral of the story I guess... don't have felons as friends. Thats all I know for now.

dantodd
07-13-2011, 6:38 PM
Received further information on original thread. Evidently a long time "friend" of the family was up on charges that would have been 3 counts and bye bye to prison for a very long time. He plea bargained out of the 3 strikes by saying he knew of a house that had a large stash of illegal weapons. According to my information they did have a large gun collection that included a couple of unregistered AK 47's. Based on the information from the 3 strikes guy they did a stake out on father and sons house. Raided said house and confiscated all their guns plus cash in the house. Father and son are in the process of trying to clear their name and get back their legal guns.

Moral of the story I guess... don't have felons as friends. Thats all I know for now.

Yes, please make sure they get in touch with CalGuns Foundation. Not only for their own good but for the 2A community. There is certainly the possibility that some good could come out of such a case, and conversely some bad could be generated by handling it poorly.

There is one case, at least, where a man was found not guilty despite possessing a non-registered AW. It was posted here but I can't find it right this minute. The attorney who defended him has posted here and I don't know if your friends could potentially base their defense on his successful case.

celticstorm
07-13-2011, 6:43 PM
Yes, please make sure they get in touch with CalGuns Foundation. Not only for their own good but for the 2A community. There is certainly the possibility that some good could come out of such a case, and conversely some bad could be generated by handling it poorly.

There is one case, at least, where a man was found not guilty despite possessing a non-registered AW. It was posted here but I can't find it right this minute. The attorney who defended him has posted here and I don't know if your friends could potentially base their defense on his successful case.

Thanks.. I will pass the information along. From what I understand they are already owe $20,000 to their current attorney.

SVT-40
07-13-2011, 7:37 PM
When did this allegedly happen? And in what city?

HowardW56
07-13-2011, 8:06 PM
The limit is set and enforced by my wife!

I kept my guns and got rid of the Wife....


:D

Cokebottle
07-13-2011, 8:33 PM
You have "too many guns" when your newest purchase does not fit in the safe.

But the situation is remedied by purchasing a 2nd or a larger safe, at which point you immediately transition from "too many guns" to "not enough guns"


There are health and safety codes regarding the amount of powder that may be stored in a residential area, how it may be stored, as well as how many primers may be stored.
There are no laws governing limits on firearms in general or cartridge ammunition.

InGrAM
07-14-2011, 12:42 AM
I kept my guns and got rid of the Wife....


:D

LOL thats the way to do it.

marcusrn
07-14-2011, 1:12 AM
Very chicken**** to pick on a 92 yr old man who probably forgot he owned the semi auto. Could have had it 20 yrs before bogus law was enacted. What times we live in and what foolishness we put up with these days.

celticstorm
07-14-2011, 8:16 AM
When did this allegedly happen? And in what city?

Don't know the exact date this allegedly all started. They live in Rancho Palos Verdes which is an affluent and beautiful area along the coast next to Long Beach.

Psy Crow
07-14-2011, 8:38 AM
In answer to the OP question: n, where n = (number of guns available) + 1

I kept my guns and got rid of the Wife....


:D

I chose a wife that likes guns. I get sammiches AND toys :yes:

RRichie09
07-14-2011, 9:03 AM
Very chicken**** to pick on a 92 yr old man who probably forgot he owned the semi auto. Could have had it 20 yrs before bogus law was enacted. What times we live in and what foolishness we put up with these days.

Yes it is especially if the accused already has a $20,000 legal fee. The DA should of seen the case and dropped it, at the very worst, keep the unregistered AK's and let them go with the other guns.

Are they really gonna send a 90 year old law abiding citizen to die in jail?

xrMike
07-14-2011, 9:17 AM
How many guns are too many??? What a bizarre question! How many heartbeats are too many? How many breaths of air?

dantodd
07-14-2011, 10:50 AM
Thanks.. I will pass the information along. From what I understand they are already owe $20,000 to their current attorney.

That's a lot to swallow, but it's probably better to owe $40k and not have a record than owe $20k with a felony record.

NytWolf
07-14-2011, 12:54 PM
What a bizarre question! How many heartbeats are too many? How many breaths of air?

I'm sure there is a definite answer when asking about convicted felons.

IGOTDIRT4U
07-14-2011, 1:31 PM
Something's not right. The warrant would have to be specific. If the felon merely said they had a stash of illegal weapons, that would not be cause enough for a warrant. They would need more details such as make/model, location where seen in the house, etc. If that wasn't how the warrant was worded, there might be a defense that they weren't supposed to be in the house anyway. (the police)

And I still wonder how old the AK's were. If they were builds and compliant, then back to above.

dotalchemy
07-14-2011, 1:35 PM
http://www.servantsoftheimperium.com/comic/images/SotI02.jpg

xrMike
07-14-2011, 1:51 PM
I'm sure there is a definite answer when asking about convicted felons.For convicted felons, the answer to the question = 1.

(1 is too many)

SupportGeek
07-14-2011, 4:07 PM
For the benefit of everyone here, do you have any information as to which states or what amount represents hoarding?

This is the first that I have ever herd of a limit...

NC limits handguns, You need to apply to the sheriff and show "good cause" to need a handgun, show good moral character etc (sounds more like a ccw app here) then you might get a handgun certification issued for the purchase of ONE handgun, it is only good for one purchase, and you cant apply for another.

IGOTDIRT4U
07-14-2011, 5:06 PM
NC limits handguns, You need to apply to the sheriff and show "good cause" to need a handgun, show good moral character etc (sounds more like a ccw app here) then you might get a handgun certification issued for the purchase of ONE handgun, it is only good for one purchase, and you cant apply for another.

But not if you have a CHP, and NC is a shall issue state. By the time you wrangle around with the local sheriff, you could just get a CHP and you are done with it.

cfm117
07-14-2011, 5:11 PM
only not enough.

Lostsheep
07-14-2011, 9:35 PM
NC limits handguns, You need to apply to the sheriff and show "good cause" to need a handgun, show good moral character etc (sounds more like a ccw app here) then you might get a handgun certification issued for the purchase of ONE handgun, it is only good for one purchase, and you cant apply for another.

But not if you have a CHP, and NC is a shall issue state. By the time you wrangle around with the local sheriff, you could just get a CHP and you are done with it.


Sorry for the ignorant question here but I assume you guys are talking about NC being North Carolina?

I ask because I have a lot of family there.

Wherryj
07-15-2011, 7:53 AM
The definition of "too many guns" is the purchase that causes your wife to declare that you have "too many guns", file for divorce and thus take half of your guns.

If this situation recurs too often, it will be impossible to ever reach the situation of having "enough guns"...

Munk
07-15-2011, 12:18 PM
You have "too many guns" when your newest purchase does not fit in the safe.

But the situation is remedied by purchasing a 2nd or a larger safe, at which point you immediately transition from "too many guns" to "not enough guns"


There are health and safety codes regarding the amount of powder that may be stored in a residential area, how it may be stored, as well as how many primers may be stored.
There are no laws governing limits on firearms in general or cartridge ammunition.

sounds to me like a case of not enough "safe".

There are practicality issues that are often defined by how you use them, why you want them, and if you can afford them. Those are personal issues, decided by YOU.

There are no legal issues that I'm aware of when it comes to quantity.

So as far as how to define how many is too many? How many do you want? Too many would be one or more beyond that number.

Wherryj
07-15-2011, 1:00 PM
In answer to the OP question: n, where n = (number of guns available) + 1



I chose a wife that likes guns. I get sammiches AND toys :yes:

Yes but "Guns-Wife=Guns/2"

wjc
07-15-2011, 1:22 PM
Yes but "Guns-Wife=Guns/2"

or, in some rare cases...this has been proven empirically.

Guns-Wife = Guns * 2

:D

grammaton76
07-15-2011, 2:38 PM
In other situation...

Girlfriend 1.0 is more expensive to maintain than Wife 1.0.
Upgrade Girlfriend 1.0 to Wife 1.0

Wife 1.0 does not object to reduced maintenance cost being diverted into gun fund, provided that she gets a vote in which new guns to acquire.

...it does cut down on variety of new acquisitions a bit now that we get "his and hers" of a lot of guns now, but I'm not complaining! :)

Wherryj
07-15-2011, 4:12 PM
or, in some rare cases...this has been proven empirically.

Guns-Wife = Guns * 2

:D

I did neglect a few rare cases, such as:

Crazy wife+DV report=Guns * 0

Kavey
07-21-2011, 1:41 AM
I kept my guns and got rid of the Wife....


:D



My wife saw your post. Now I'm not allowed on Calguns anymore.

At the moment, it's 2:42AM. If I hear footsteps coming down the hall, I'm in trouble. :D


____________________________

I'm not a lawyer, but I have seen every episode of Judge Judy.

2Bear
07-21-2011, 2:06 AM
This isn't:
http://www.latinamericanstudies.org/belligerence/ferro.jpg
Nor is this:
http://www.bootsandsabers.com/images/uploads/DSCF5519_thumb.JPG

Bobby Hated
07-21-2011, 5:54 AM
i've purchased or built about 10 guns in the past year since i left my psycho control freak ex.

i got smart and found me a nice demure asian girl who never questions me and never starts fights for no reason. ive never been happier.

epcii
07-21-2011, 10:36 AM
To answer the OP's question, I defer to Sen. Phil Gramm (and his thick as molasses Texas drawl):

"Ah got more guns than ah need and less guns than I wohnt"

Putting this in my sig.

gatdammit
07-21-2011, 11:30 AM
Something's not right. The warrant would have to be specific. If the felon merely said they had a stash of illegal weapons, that would not be cause enough for a warrant. They would need more details such as make/model, location where seen in the house, etc. If that wasn't how the warrant was worded, there might be a defense that they weren't supposed to be in the house anyway. (the police)

And I still wonder how old the AK's were. If they were builds and compliant, then back to above.

This.

I'm no legal expert, but I think there has to more to the warrant. A warrant based on the story of a convicted felon going up on his third strike? That don't smell right...

OlderThanDirt
07-21-2011, 1:25 PM
http://www.bootsandsabers.com/images/uploads/DSCF5519_thumb.JPG

Is this a picture of heaven?

sargenv
07-21-2011, 2:30 PM
telling someone they have too many guns is like telling a woman they have too many pairs of shoes.. ;)

2Bear
07-21-2011, 2:35 PM
Is this a picture of heaven?

Looks like it was...
On June 23rd & 24th (2007) at 10:00 AM Pacific Time, Nye County Public Auction, will be selling, to the highest bidder, firearms from the Estate of the late Jerry Darnell. This Two-Day auction will consist of 841 Firearms & Bayonets from his life long private gun collection.

http://www.bootsandsabers.com/index.php/weblog/permalink/my_goal_in_life/

DocSkinner
07-21-2011, 11:15 PM
Received further information on original thread. Evidently a long time "friend" of the family was up on charges that would have been 3 counts and bye bye to prison for a very long time. He plea bargained out of the 3 strikes by saying he knew of a house that had a large stash of illegal weapons. According to my information they did have a large gun collection that included a couple of unregistered AK 47's. Based on the information from the 3 strikes guy they did a stake out on father and sons house. Raided said house and confiscated all their guns plus cash in the house. Father and son are in the process of trying to clear their name and get back their legal guns.

Moral of the story I guess... don't have felons as friends. Thats all I know for now.

And keep track of the laws. And if you have family that is older and been collecting for ages, help THEM keep up on the laws.

Rascal
07-22-2011, 6:16 PM
http://www.bootsandsabers.com/images/uploads/DSCF5519_thumb.JPG Is this a picture of heaven?

Hey, Where did you get the picture of Ivanimal's house?

Treb5
07-22-2011, 6:27 PM
My armory is somewhere north of 90 at present. Not counting un-built parts kits.

WOW! Beats my 32 all to heck..and I thought I had to many..

HowardW56
07-22-2011, 6:44 PM
My armory is somewhere north of 90 at present. Not counting un-built parts kits.


Thats a good start

2Bear
07-22-2011, 6:46 PM
Hey, Where did you get the picture of Ivanimal's house?

It's actually a frame-grab from the live-feed of Ivanimal's Web-Cam World™ Annual Blowout-Firearms-Celebration-Across-the-Nation™ recently on pay-per-view.