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View Full Version : Is this an illegal AOW that Desantis/La Police Gear is selling.


crackerman
07-06-2011, 11:05 AM
I got the email this morning for this:
http://www.lapolicegear.com/desantis-pocket-shot-holster.html
(I will host pics tonight)

It was my understanding that any pistol that had a holster that could be fired from "inside" the holster was considered an AOW. Now this is going back to a holster I remember seeing from a tv show or FBI tour so I could be wrong, but the question is...

Is this a legal holster or does it make the gun an AOW?

ETA: GUYS I DON"T OWN ONE OR EVEN A PISTOL TO FIT. I just thought this fit in the 2nd amend forum and law forum and would post the question.

G60
07-06-2011, 11:16 AM
What the hell is the point of that?

http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/policestuff_2165_3462660

crackerman
07-06-2011, 11:20 AM
What the hell is the point of that?

http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/policestuff_2165_3462660

From the page itself
"The #110 disguises itself as a wallet but can be brought into action instantly without removing the gun."

Flintlock Tom
07-06-2011, 11:23 AM
Looks funky, but why would it be illegal?
Don't most "Western" style holsters leave the trigger accessible and are open at the bottom?
http://www.westerngunholsters.com/holster_rigs/?xtr=googleadwords&gclid=COG3yu6q7akCFakaQgodlndPYw

robcoe
07-06-2011, 11:26 AM
From the page itself
"The #110 disguises itself as a wallet but can be brought into action instantly without removing the gun."

"disguises itself as a wallet" yea, ok.

And this is just a 24 pack of sprite

http://www.theworldmatters.org/wp-content/plugins/wp-o-matic/cache/b5744_m16disguised.JPG

Stonewalker
07-06-2011, 11:29 AM
"disguises itself as a wallet" yea, ok.

And this is just a 12 pack of sprite

http://www.theworldmatters.org/wp-content/plugins/wp-o-matic/cache/b5744_m16disguised.JPG

LOL. Well the idea with that holster is you can put it in your wallet pocket and it looks like a wallet while it's there.

G60
07-06-2011, 11:29 AM
Not sure that a concealment holster with exposed trigger is such a great idea.

That, and you'll forever be known as the 'guy who carries two wallets'

Hozr
07-06-2011, 11:32 AM
That's a Costanza if I ever saw one. My Chiropractor loves this idea!

WILDMAN442
07-06-2011, 11:32 AM
I think the PC section you are thinking of says something about the gun NOT looking like a gun.

Its obvious that there is a slide of a gun protruding from the top of that "wallet"

I would have to research the PC more though.

Justin

tgriffin
07-06-2011, 11:38 AM
Illegal.

12020. (a) Any person in this state who does any of the following
is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year
or in the state prison:
(1) Manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the
state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives,
lends, or possesses any cane gun or wallet gun, any undetectable
firearm, any firearm which is not immediately recognizable as a
firearm, any camouflaging firearm container

Could fall under any of the 3 bold sections. The primary purpose is to disguise the outline of the firearm when concealed.

thevic
07-06-2011, 11:44 AM
It looks more like a swiss army tool with a cigar/vegtable cutter

bwiese
07-06-2011, 11:48 AM
12020. (a) Any person in this state who does any of the following
is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year
or in the state prison:
(1) Manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the
state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives,
lends, or possesses any cane gun or wallet gun, any undetectable
firearm, any firearm which is not immediately recognizable as a
firearm, any camouflaging firearm container

Could fall under any of the 3 bold sections. The primary purpose is to
disguise the outline of the firearm when concealed.

I'd say grey more than illegal, and yet still avoid this drama in CA.

But is this a wallet gun (i.e, a gun designed to look like a wallet), or is this just a firearm in a weird holster?

To me I still see indicia of firearms status. Disguising the outline of the firearm to avoid 'printing' while (assumed legal) carrying is a separate concept from concealing the firearm's appearance as such when outside the clothing.

This is somewhat akin to difference btwn a carry case for a gun vs. the "HK operational briefcase".

ke6guj
07-06-2011, 12:32 PM
:iagree:

I know that federally it isn't considered an AOW by the feds since the slide is not covered by the holster. But I dunno what CADOJ or one of the 58 DAs would say.

Mesa Tactical
07-06-2011, 12:39 PM
You'll shoot yer foot off.

gunsmithcats
07-06-2011, 12:47 PM
You're correct.
Makes the gun AOW federally, and according to California law i think it counts as a camouflaging container with the capability to fire the firearm while in the case.

spgripside
07-06-2011, 12:54 PM
You'll shoot yer foot off.
Borrowed from tankarian, on another thread (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=452308),
http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg18/scaled.php?server=18&filename=footxray8197447.jpg&res=medium

1911su16b870
07-06-2011, 1:16 PM
IMO that is an accident waiting to happen unless you only run that in one pocket and never, ever put anything else in the same pocket.

The pocket holsters most important feature is to protect the bang switch, and secondly keep it in the same place in the pocket to allow for easy deployment.

G-forceJunkie
07-06-2011, 6:33 PM
Judging by what they said about the NAA Mini revolver wallet holster, I would say its a no-go.:iagree:

I know that federally it isn't considered an AOW by the feds since the slide is not covered by the holster. But I dunno what CADOJ or one of the 58 DAs would say.

Curtis
07-06-2011, 7:27 PM
"disguises itself as a wallet" yea, ok.

And this is just a 24 pack of sprite

http://www.theworldmatters.org/wp-content/plugins/wp-o-matic/cache/b5744_m16disguised.JPG

Does this come in Diet Coke?

Decoligny
07-06-2011, 7:33 PM
PC 12020 (c) (4). As used in this section, a wallet gun means any firearm mounted or enclosed in a case, resembling a wallet, designed to be or capable of being carried in a pocket or a purse, if the firearm may be fired while mounted or enclosed in the case.

So, the PC says that a gun in this holster is indeed a wallet gun and is therefore illegal.

The question then becomes is selling or possessing just the holster illegal? I think it only becomes illegal when a gun is actually in the holster.

BigDogatPlay
07-06-2011, 9:04 PM
The standard I've seen applied is that if the "wallet" completely covers the gun and leaves a hole for access to the trigger, it becomes an AOW "wallet gun". If functional parts of the gun are outside of the "wallet" or can't be fired while contained within the "wallet" it is presumably still recognizable as a firearm and hence not an AOW.

The language about mounted or enclosed leaves a really wide berth open for interpretation in the field. If the item in the OP is actually California legal I'd think it skates right up close to the ragged edge, if not over it. My gut tells me this is bad juju.

FXR
07-07-2011, 12:17 AM
What pocket would be tight enough to print and still allow the gun to be aimed in a useful direction in there? If they want you to remove it I'd think a conventional pocket holster that shields the trigger and doesn't stick to the gun would be much better.

arsilva32
07-07-2011, 1:16 AM
"disguises itself as a wallet" yea, ok.

And this is just a 24 pack of sprite

http://www.theworldmatters.org/wp-content/plugins/wp-o-matic/cache/b5744_m16disguised.JPG




"ROFLMAO"

Kid Stanislaus
07-07-2011, 6:15 AM
Not sure that a concealment holster with exposed trigger is such a great idea. That, and you'll forever be known as the 'guy who carries two wallets'

Is that the same as "Dances With Wolves"?:D

Glock22Fan
07-07-2011, 11:09 AM
Illegal.

snip

Could fall under any of the 3 bold sections. The primary purpose is to disguise the outline of the firearm when concealed.

Isn't the whole point of concealment to disguise the outline of the firearm?

Isn't that what any pocket holster is meant to do? (and keeping dirt out of the mechanism)

My wife's new CCW holster disguises the outline of her SP101 (.327 Fed Mag) as a shoulder bag (purse).

Surely it is the ability to fire when concealed that is the no-no, if there is one?