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View Full Version : SJ Gun Exchange Closing?


LCAZES
12-21-2006, 7:18 AM
Just got an email from the GS 2nd ammendment council stating that these guys are closing their doors. Anyone know the details?

LCAZES
12-21-2006, 9:06 AM
Thanks

gimmejr
12-21-2006, 12:52 PM
I was just there and after today they are no longer selling firearms. That is unless they get there FFL renewed which he didnt sound sure that it would. The store is staying open to sell accessories and ammo.

gimmejr
12-21-2006, 1:30 PM
He also mentioned Kurleys in Cupertino was loosing thier license too but Im not sure if thats accurate.

Santa Cruz Armory
01-06-2007, 2:32 PM
WHY are all these shops closing??? what the F**K??

Why now, what have they done???

xenophobe
01-06-2007, 2:37 PM
Well, SJGE isn't closing. They'll be selling accessories, antiques, and stuff.

They were told by the ATF to reapply for a new FFL in several months.

Alanski56
01-06-2007, 3:27 PM
blfd1,

I think it's obvious that SJGE lost their FFL because they were selling so many OLLs. Mike at SJGE told me the DOJ had to go back 18 years in order to find the discrepancy that gave them the opportunity to refuse SJGE to renew their FFL. It's a sad state of affairs that it comes down to this. Just reinforces the fact that you have to keep your nose very very clean, so to speak.

Have a nice day.

KIDRR
01-06-2007, 4:55 PM
Wow, that sucks.

xenophobe
01-06-2007, 5:09 PM
I think it's obvious that SJGE lost their FFL because they were selling so many OLLs.

Selling OLLs had nothing to do with it. The ATF investigation started before the whole OLL craze.

Alanski56
01-06-2007, 5:13 PM
Selling OLLs had nothing to do with it. The ATF investigation started before the whole OLL craze.


Well, I guess it's just a reflection of my general mistrust of our government that caused me to draw this cynnical conclusion. I wonder why I am so cynnical towards our own government? Hmmmm!

Boomer1961
01-06-2007, 8:12 PM
Well, I guess it's just a reflection of my general mistrust of our government that caused me to draw this cynical conclusion. I wonder why I am so cynical towards our own government? Hmmmm!

Don't count on it.

All gun dealers in CA are under investigation all the time for discrepancies. Just that the most resources goes to the ones that piss them off the most.

Adding OLL to there inventory surely made them a bigger target and made it less likely that they would back down or negotiate a settlement.

Ten years ago it was Clinton's husband who directed the multi-letter-alphabet agency to go after the "kitchen table dealers" in the blue states.

Over two thirds of them did not renew their license.

They did things like jacking up the license fee from something like $25 to $300.

I personally know of the fella across the street that had his license suspended due to "Breaking a local city ordinance" of not having liability insurance that a new city ordinance required. It seems that one of the things that the Clinton Brady Bunch did was to formulate a strategy/policy to harass these dealers out of existence and one of the tools they used was to pass "Harmless feel good common sense business ordinances" like requiring a business license, requiring a store front business, requiring $5 million in liability insurance, etc. etc.

My neighbor had his temporarily suspended for not having the required liability insurance. They came to his house and notified him personally and then said he would have to make arrangements (a deal I guess) to have all his "inventory" transferred to another dealer or be surrendered within 30 days. Fortunately he was one of those folks that bought and transferred at a small fee so had none on the premise.

The stupid idiots though did not get the facts right though as we lived on a sliver of the neighborhood that was not incorporated in the City of Richmond (it is county land). None the less they told him he would be in violation of procedures if he did any transfers while they investigated to determine the facts. This went on for like 6 months then his renewal was due and the new fee came into play. He also said they continued to harass him by stopping by a couple more times requesting to look at records and wanting to see all his guns to check to make certain none were part of his inventory. They called his home owners insurance company asking about his insurance policy and if it covered (possibly even hinting at they would be sued in court) any liability suits which you know led them to telling him they were not going to renew his home owners policy due to a possible violation of the policy. They even had the gal to write in their correspondence about how he should be a good neighbor and consider not renewing his license as it did not fit in the neighborhood and though he might not have run afoul of these new ordinances this time that the community was demanding greater responsibility from gun dealers and it was only a matter of time before he would be required to get the liability insurance and recommended doing so now if he was going to renew.

Of course a $300 renewal fee and $300 a month insurance was not all that appealing so he gave up. I had asked him why he did not get a lawyer and sue but he said it was not worth the hassle of all this harassment.

At the time allot of store front dealers supported this crackdown. I remember Old West Gun Room and Traders both being quoted in the paper and in the news that they supported these new laws to crack down on these "kitchen table dealers" who sold to the drug dealers (now the insert to Arab Terrorist instead) because all they saw was profit$$$$ with a capital $$ and cared less about the 2nd amendment or their fellow firearms enthusiast.

It is obvious it is the divide and conquer, as well as the strength against weakness, both classic military strategies, that the gun grabbers are using.

I don't think I know of any FFL that is not under investigation for irregularities right now. They are not interested in stewarding this industry and helping them conduct their business legitimately but instead are in the business of shutting them down for any reason. They are constantly attacking segments in the industry that are week and labeling a dealer as circumventing laws by using loopholes and/or making it hard to track sells to drug dealers/terrorists/abusive husbands out to kill their wife, just to make money, makes him an attractive target in the media and community.

I remember as a 7 year old going to the local Ace Hardware in town and pushing my face up against the glass show case to look and wishing-, as the owner had a FFL and always had a dozen or so firearms for sale including the typical war surplus 1911's, carbines, garands, as well as some used stuff. Then the Gun Control Act passed and it seemed all those types of dealers were driven away from selling those types of things. Remember the Sears Catalog or those firearms that were sold under the "Montgomery Wards' brand name. Those were the good days before crime and drugs and everybody fighting each other came about as a result of all these laws designed to help us get along with each other.

Now they are going after the last of the dealers and soon there will only be a handful left in California and you will have to drive 3 hours to get there because it will be in rural/mountain/farm communities that have not yet been turned into resorts with $million$ cabins for the rich nobility from the city. They will also have web cams in the parking lot that will go straight to DOJ where it will instantly check your license plate and facial recognition so that they can instantly know if you are arears in a traffic ticket or are disputing a credit card charge because of the enhancement laws that add 3 years of prison time to having bad credit while owning or attempting to purchase a firearm. On your way out the door they will arrest you. And because the software is a government contract software that does not work but they continue to use because of the million dollar kickbacks to Pelosi and Feinstein in Washington, they have incorrectly identified you as having bad breath and
driving someone to pickup a firearm which has enhancements under the RICO III act for conspiracy and trafficking in firearms across city boundaries that have illegal immigrants, and driving by/within 500 miles of a school with defenseless handicapped children, and being 3000 miles within a corrupt politician that you might be tempted to try to assasinate, so you get arrested and thrown in the slammer for 6 months while you hire 5 lawyers to convince them that the software is wrong and they should check your fingerprints but all those old police officers who knew how to do that by hand took the new early retirement at 50 with the 3.5% per year pension.:eek:

Sorry I am rambling but the attack on the gun owning community does this to me. Hate to say this though but George Dubya is not much better since he is screwing up in Iraq because he is tired from not sleeping at night as he is busy/up all night reading my mail and listening to my phone conversations and reading this post, with plans at getting at those who piss him off the most.

Take care everyone and buy a gun Tomorrow to support your local FFL. Make it 10 off list lowers just to piss them off more.:D

xenophobe
01-07-2007, 8:46 AM
All gun dealers in the US are under investigation all the time for discrepancies. Just that the most resources goes to the ones that piss them off the most.

There, I fixed it for you.


Adding OLL to there inventory surely made them a bigger target and made it less likely that they would back down or negotiate a settlement.

People need to stop adding conjecture and assumption to the reality of this situation.

Off list receivers had nothing to do with Traders shutting down. It had nothing to do with SJGE having their license revoked. It had nothing to do with Kerleys getting their lisence revoked. It had nothing to do with LC Action who apparently won their appeal against renewal denial. It had nothing to do with Reeds currently coming under the gun from the ATF either.

As far as I am privy to, none of these businesses' ATF investigations were instigated by a prior DOJ audit or investigation. The off-list situations that Wes@10% and the Milpitas GB were not followed with ATF investigations either.

The ATF does not care about the off-list situation here in California. That is state law to be enforced by the DOJ, the ATF is attacking dealerships all across the country for paperwork violations. It is not just a California thing.

Please stop making assumptions, everyone.

kenc9
01-07-2007, 10:18 AM
There, I fixed it for you.



People need to stop adding conjecture and assumption to the reality of this situation.

Off list receivers had nothing to do with Traders shutting down. It had nothing to do with SJGE having their license revoked. It had nothing to do with Kerleys getting their lisence revoked. It had nothing to do with LC Action who apparently won their appeal against renewal denial. It had nothing to do with Reeds currently coming under the gun from the ATF either.

As far as I am privy to, none of these businesses' ATF investigations were instigated by a prior DOJ audit or investigation. The off-list situations that Wes@10% and the Milpitas GB were not followed with ATF investigations either.

The ATF does not care about the off-list situation here in California. That is state law to be enforced by the DOJ, the ATF is attacking dealerships all across the country for paperwork violations. It is not just a California thing.

Please stop making assumptions, everyone.

There has been a push to lessen the 01 dealers all across the US for more than 15 years now and the decline has been substantial. Does the DOJ ever talk to BATF and put some dealers on notice with them? Not a doubt in my mind, look at everything else they (DOJ) does and say to us and what they told out of state OLL dealers. Any investigation lasting as long as the OLL thing has been going on with no arrests seems the license must have been the target. Every time an 01 has their license pulled they never want to talk about it publicly.

I am sure SJGuns has a fair idea why they are being leaned on/investigated. I am not sure it does any of us a service to not know exactly what the problem is/was and put it all in the light of day.

This is only a question, did the OLL AR15 the guy bought at a dealer up there this same dealer he wanted his money back for? Or was the timing just a coincidence?

My dealer had the DOJ at his place every few months each time with things they needed done or changed. They kept on him until he just finally let his license go.

-ken

xenophobe
01-07-2007, 10:28 AM
I'm speaking on direct knowledge of the shops that have been targeted.

All of the ATF audits that resulted in these stores closing or face hearings fighting license renewal denial or revocation had nothing to do with the OLL situation and predate it by many months.

Does the ATF and DOJ have regular correspondence? Of course they do. Do any of the current ATF investigations have anything to do with the OLL mess? No. Again, it is NOT a state-wide attack against FFLs, it is a NATIONAL attack on FFLs.

There was even a national conference of firearms lawyers held early last year specifically addressing the issue of the ATF investigations that we are currently discussing.

Again, I'm only talking about these particular incidents that I am aware of, and there very well may be FFL's targeted by the ATF that the DOJ has informed them to target, however this is baloney until someone can do anything but speculate on the possibility, as I have not heard of this happening, and does not account for similar circumstances where the ATF is targeting FFLs all across the country where the California DOJ has no authority.

hoffmang
01-07-2007, 2:15 PM
Its a d*mn shame that Feinstein killed H.R. 5092:
http://www.gunlawnews.org/House-Bills/hr5092.html

-Gene