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cpatbay
05-30-2011, 11:38 AM
If I buy a rifle from an out of state source, what's the best way to get the rifle CA legal? Does it have to be modified to be legal before entering CA or can it be modified after it arrives in CA?

ke6guj
05-30-2011, 11:43 AM
it is illegal to import an Assault Weapon into CA so it needs to be californicated BEFORE it comes into the state.

r6raff
05-30-2011, 11:43 AM
There are stickies to answer all these questions. But the short answer is yes, you need to do a few things

1. your lower must be OFF List. See the list of banned lowers for reference

2. (if featured) if you have any evil features ie PistolGrip, collapsible stock, VFG, Flash Hider then you need a bullet button, this effective locks the magazine in place and requires a tool to remove it.

3. (if featured) you need to use a maximum capacity of 10round magazines, not 30 not 11.

4. (if not feature) if you do not have a pistol grip or thumb hole stock or any other "evil" features then you do NOT need a bullet button and can use standard highcap magazines, assuming you had them in the state prior to the ban, which assuming you are now moving to CA, you dont have any legal HighCap mags. Also don't bring them in to state, that is importation and illegal, break them down into parts so it is not a functional highcap mag.

Note*** only 1 "evil feature" is needed on the rifle to require a bullet button. Its all or nothing when it comes to featureless.

as the other posted noted, do these BEFORE entering CA, or you can be in a world of hurt.

cpatbay
05-30-2011, 11:48 AM
Great. Thanks for the advise.

r6raff
05-30-2011, 11:50 AM
I forgot the most important piece of advice...








































Stay out of CA and enjoy your FREE state AR!!!!!!!! Run... Run, while you still can!!!!! :TFH:

morrcarr67
05-30-2011, 11:58 AM
I thought one of the things CA 07 FFL's could do was make AR/AK style rifles CA compliant by installing a BB?

dieselpower
05-30-2011, 12:00 PM
I thought one of the things CA 07 FFL's could do was make AR/AK style rifles CA compliant by installing a BB?

I thought so too...

ke6guj
05-30-2011, 12:08 PM
I thought one of the things CA 07 FFL's could do was make AR/AK style rifles CA compliant by installing a BB?

I thought so too...

No, an 07FFL cannot import AWs to be converted into non-AWs.

However, an FFL with a CADOJ AW permit could, but finding an AW permittee willing to do it for you is hard and will probably cost you $$$, whereas you could have it done out of state for $$.

morrcarr67
05-30-2011, 12:13 PM
No, an 07FFL cannot import AWs to be converted into non-AWs.

However, an FFL with a CADOJ AW permit could, but finding an AW permittee willing to do it for you is hard and will probably cost you $$$, whereas you could have it done out of state for $$.

OH! I got ya. Well that sucks.

r6raff
05-30-2011, 12:19 PM
If I buy a rifle from an out of state source, what's the best way to get the rifle CA legal? Does it have to be modified to be legal before entering CA or can it be modified after it arrives in CA?

So apparently my brain is also on vacation today also, I read your post as "if I brought" I thought you were comming in from out of state... im a total idiot... time to implement that Coffee I.V. I have been considering....

bwiese
05-30-2011, 12:51 PM
I thought one of the things CA 07 FFL's could do was make AR/AK style rifles CA compliant by installing a BB?

Wrong. 07 or not is irrelevant - they do not have a separate special CA DOJ AW permit, which is hard to get and costly.

A CA FFL (regardless of 07 status) without a DOJ AW permit cannot accept AWs in CA. Guns he gets need to be rendered CA legal before crossing the border.

Due to the lack of constructive possession of AWs, however, the guns can be split up into upper & lower (or barreled action separated from all evel features - depends on architecture) by the shipper. [I recommend these two sections are shipped in separate boxes to avoid any prospective drama should the package be misrouted/misdirected, etc.] The CA FFL can then install a BulletButton first, and then reattach the upper or evil features such that the entity transitions straight from legal components into a CA-legal firearm without transitioning - even for a moment - thru CA AW status.


[ATTN NOOBS/YOUNG GUYS: Note that I said above, "lack of constructive possession for AWs." My statement is LIMITED
to AWs only; there is indeed constructive possession in CALIFORNIA law (on top of Fedlaw) for SBRs, SBSes, MGs.... I
frequently hear noobs pipe up that "there's no constructive possession in CA", and that's just wrong and is a mental error
that can get you in a lot of trouble. Words mean something, and reading is fundamental.]

morrcarr67
05-30-2011, 1:26 PM
Wrong. 07 or not is irrelevant - they do not have a separate special CA DOJ AW permit, which is hard to get and costly.

A CA FFL (regardless of 07 status) without a DOJ AW permit cannot accept AWs in CA. Guns he gets need to be rendered CA legal before crossing the border.

Due to the lack of constructive possession of AWs, however, the guns can be split up into upper & lower (or barreled action separated from all evel features - depends on architecture) by the shipper. [I recommend these two sections are shipped in separate boxes to avoid any prospective drama should the package be misrouted/misdirected, etc.] The CA FFL can then install a BulletButton first, and then reattach the upper or evil features such that the entity transitions straight from legal components into a CA-legal firearm without transitioning - even for a moment - thru CA AW status.


[ATTN NOOBS/YOUNG GUYS: Note that I said above, "lack of constructive possession for AWs." My statement is LIMITED
to AWs only; there is indeed constructive possession in CALIFORNIA law (on top of Fedlaw) for SBRs, SBSes, MGs.... I
frequently hear noobs pipe up that "there's no constructive possession in CA", and that's just wrong and is a mental error
that can get you in a lot of trouble. Words mean something, and reading is fundamental.]



OK, let me get this straight. I can order a XYZ AR style complete rifle that is built on a OLL from out of state.

And, have the seller send me the upper and ship the lower to my favorite 07 FFL and he could install the BB and DROS is to me.

Once I have it home I could attach the upper and everything is all good.

bwiese
05-30-2011, 1:37 PM
OK, let me get this straight. I can order a XYZ AR style complete rifle that is built on a OLL from out of state.

And, have the seller send me the upper and ship the lower to my favorite 07 FFL and he could install the BB and DROS is to me.

Once I have it home I could attach the upper and everything is all good.


Sure, that works.

BUT MAKE SURE THE SELLER DOESN'T GET DUMB AND SHIP THE WHOLE UNMODIFIED RIFLE.

Busy shops do forget instructions.
I'd send the instructions in writing.

tonelar
05-30-2011, 1:41 PM
They can't send both halves to the ffl?

I though if they separated the upper from the lower it could arrive at a non AW ffl...

Librarian
05-30-2011, 1:46 PM
They can't send both halves to the ffl?

Shouldn't.

With no upper, it is possible to argue the lower isn't a 'centerfire rifle'; that's hyper-technical, but it's possible to mount a bolt-action upper or a .22 conversion upper, so with NO upper the lower is in an indeterminate state.

But if someone inadvertently assembles a semi-auto centerfire upper to that lower, before the mag lock is installed, there is a Problem.

bwiese
05-30-2011, 1:50 PM
They can't send both halves to the ffl?


Shouldn't.

With no upper, it is possible to argue the lower isn't a 'centerfire rifle'; that's hyper-technical, but it's possible to mount a bolt-action upper or a .22 conversion upper, so with NO upper the lower is in an indeterminate state.

But if someone inadvertently assembles a semi-auto centerfire upper to that lower, before the mag lock is installed, there is a Problem.


Quite a few competent EBR FFLs have arrangements with COMPETENT out-of-state suppliers or intermediaries - such that guns are broken apart in various ways and shipped to the CA FFL, who then installs a BB before reassembling the gun into CA-legal form.

Rukus
05-30-2011, 7:24 PM
So on rifles like the ACR, SCAR etc that have serialized uppers it would be completely legal to ship only the upper to the FFL for DROS. And then its up to the buyer to make sure everythings legal before assembly correct?