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Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 2:35 PM
Has anyone owned one of these? I have the reviews online and most seem to be negative. Anybody had good luck with one these?

Inquirer
05-25-2011, 2:57 PM
Do you mean a carbon fiber AR Lower? Would be handy to link what you're referring to.

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 3:05 PM
Im talking mainly of Bushmaster's carbon rifles.

d4v0s
05-25-2011, 3:07 PM
Are you talking about the Bushmaster Carbon 15?

I have owned two and i will never reccomend them to anyone, you can build alot better rifle for less money. mine was shooting all over the place, i never got it to fire a grouping, i couldnt even hit clay pidgeons at 25 yards repeatedly, there is a serious design flaw with these rifles, I mean it was really lightweight and that part was very cool (hence i bought another to try again, drilled out magwell and bullet buttoned it) but my second one was still getting 8 inch groups at 100 yards, in a rest with a scope...

Scutler
05-25-2011, 3:14 PM
Im talking mainly of Bushmaster's carbon rifles.

My buddy had a Bushmaster Carbon 15 lower with a bull barrel upper on it and it performed just fine. The trigger wasn't as smooth as other standard triggers. The feel of a polymer lower compared to a standard AR-15 is just not right to me. Kind of toyish. That is my subjective opinion :D.

artmachine
05-25-2011, 3:20 PM
I had the bushmaster carbon 15 for a bit...lightweight, but a bit of a nuisance to top load.
shot about 1000 rds, no issues

dieselpower
05-25-2011, 3:25 PM
The problem with the C15 line is flex. That BCG gets moving and it will twist around. My C15 was fine. I could group 1.5 to 2 MOA at 100 yards.

One issue I did hear of was torque on the barrel. If your barrel wasn't tight it wouldn't group, if you tightened the barrel to much, you snapped the upper in half. I changed my upper to an A2, sold the flat top, had a blast with it for about a year and sold it to a buddy.

If you are looking for weight savings, the carbon fiber line is very attractive. If you want durability and cost savings...go aluminum.

The only thing Carbon Fiber has going for it is weight savings... It cost more, its prone to stoppage, its weaker than metal.

Plastic Plumcrazy Lowers are cheap. Thats about it. $150 for a complete lower, while a aluminum lower complete will run you $350+. You get a lot of weight savings, a weak lower and not much spent in $.

6061-T651 Type III anodizing. This is called Billet Lowers. Nearly as strong as 7075-T6, more pliable meaning it will stretch before it snaps. With type III anodizing will hold up to corrosion just as well as 7075-T6. Cost MORE than 7075-T6.

7075-T6 Cast Aluminum Type II or III anodizing. Called Mil-spec Cast Lower. You can get one for $60, or one for $190. the cost is in the name and type of 7075 its made from. There is low grade 7075 out there. the anodizing can get thin and cheap too.

Full Clip
05-25-2011, 3:32 PM
I have a C15 upper on a Stag lower. Works great. Not a tack driver, but it's not supposed to be. Consistent hits out to 200 yards on steel with 55grn ammo and an Aimpoint T1.

dieselpower
05-25-2011, 3:35 PM
Are you talking about the Bushmaster Carbon 15?

I have owned two and i will never reccomend them to anyone, you can build alot better rifle for less money. mine was shooting all over the place, i never got it to fire a grouping, i couldnt even hit clay pidgeons at 25 yards repeatedly, there is a serious design flaw with these rifles, I mean it was really lightweight and that part was very cool (hence i bought another to try again, drilled out magwell and bullet buttoned it) but my second one was still getting 8 inch groups at 100 yards, in a rest with a scope...



I bet $$ for donuts your upper had bad threads and the barrel SEEMED solid, but was a wobble goblin. I have heard this from others too.

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 3:43 PM
Allright it seems like theyre kinda POS. What do you guy think about just getting an su-16? Couldnt I get the telescoping stock change out the lame bipod and put a bullet button on it? The newer ones seem to be getting good reviews.

evidens83
05-25-2011, 3:46 PM
LOL how do you go from that to a SU16? Seems redundant... You're obviously not ready for when SHTF ;) Do your research. Plenty of good AR manufacturers out there from Stag, BCM, Daniel Defense, and RRA just to name a few. Why the fixation on BM?

dieselpower
05-25-2011, 3:51 PM
Allright it seems like theyre kinda POS. What do you guy think about just getting an su-16? Couldnt I get the telescoping stock change out the lame bipod and put a bullet button on it? The newer ones seem to be getting good reviews.

They are not POS, but not Aluminum either. They are hit and miss. You get a warranty on all sales. If you get a POS, send it in for a new one.

I have seen some great C15s and PC15s out there....there is crap too ;)

I see no reason to go SU-16 when you can go Saiga and have a better firearm. Thats just me. SU-16s are great for collectors items, not functional firearms. I would go Hi-point 995 in 40S&W if price was an issue.

What is your goal here man?

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 3:54 PM
Well its light accurate and shoots the 5.56. Ive done by research and most people give the su16 good reviews. If you can tell me of a good AR under 6 pounds I'll definately look into it. My goal is something like an ar, light, accurate(so not a Saiga), dependable that shoots the 5.56.

evidens83
05-25-2011, 4:00 PM
You want light but if you get the SU16 you plan on tacticooling it with a telescoping stock and pistol grip? Sounds like you want an AR. Stick with the AR...

Scutler
05-25-2011, 4:04 PM
What about a standard AR-15 with a lightweight barrel profile? You can build one under 6 lbs or right around there. BCM sells LW uppers.

dieselpower
05-25-2011, 4:04 PM
Well its light accurate and shoots the 5.56. Ive done by research and most people give the su16 good reviews. If you can tell me of a good AR under 6 pounds I'll definately look into it. My goal is something like an ar, light, accurate(so not a Saiga), dependable that shoots the 5.56.

I believe the C15R97F (http://www.bushmaster.com/catalog_carbon15_AZ-C15R97F.asp) to be better than an SU-16.

Thats me.

d4v0s
05-25-2011, 4:13 PM
I bet $$ for donuts your upper had bad threads and the barrel SEEMED solid, but was a wobble goblin. I have heard this from others too.

After trying two and getting a bit of runaround with bushmaster i traded it off for a Sig p220sao... couldnt be happier ha ha ha knowing what i know now, I should have just looked into the threads and or tightness of the barrel, i was nervous though torquing down on a carbon polymer upper it just doesnt give me the warm fuzzies inside.

OP---I also saw a couple threads on people sheering off the front at the magwell so the rifle definately wouldnt be my go to rifle... However you can probably build a very light AR with a carbon lower and a 14.5 inch upper, and longer flash hider to make it 16 inch compliant. or just go for a plum crazy lower, i hear nothing but good things about the plum crazy (trigger needs help tho)

good luck

Sam .223
05-25-2011, 5:47 PM
i have a carbon 15 modded to accept an attachable mag, it works great, just like most other ar platforms.

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 6:22 PM
Whered you find it? Or did you mod it?How much does it weigh?

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 8:41 PM
Maybe I should just get one of these S&W ARs. Any thoughts on that?

themailman
05-25-2011, 9:13 PM
Maybe I should just get one of these S&W ARs. Any thoughts on that?

First, find out what you want, then ask. A S&W AR has nothing lightweight to it over any other similar platform. What do you want?

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 9:33 PM
Well Id like a Bushmaster carbon AR. I called a store today and he told me all bushmaster lowers are prohibited. So I could buy a bm upper and a different upper and hope the upper is not a pos and hope bm gives me my money back after that hassle. Or I could get an su-16 hope its durable enough that it doesnt fall apart when SHTF. Or I could try to build some other one but I'm not really seeing any configuration that comes in less at than 6 pounds. Or I could just buy a S&W while I still can. I got to be ready when SHTF.

Inquirer
05-25-2011, 9:53 PM
Almost EVERY AR variant floats around 6 pounds, unloaded. You're just going to want to skip things like rail systems and fancy stock systems. A normal CAR-type build will weigh in at ABOUT six pounds, from what I've felt/seen/read. And if I were building it for when SHTF, I wouldn't choose a lower because it's six ounces lighter than a more durable, proven one. Build yourself a normal AR-15, 16" Barrel that does what it's supposed to, will shoot straight, and weighs AROUND 6-7 lbs.

If there's some type of obscene baggage weight limit for the apocalypse that you somehow have foreknowledge of, please share what that is. Otherwise, man the f•ck up and carry a seven pound rifle.

--Inq

Ready4whenSHTF
05-25-2011, 10:03 PM
How much you benching their tough guy? Maybe we could meet up sometime and see who can carry what.

Inquirer
05-25-2011, 10:13 PM
Lol man you dont know how many lazers, scopes, and flashlights other crap Im gonna need to keep these damn zombies at bay. Its gonna be like 20 pounds when its all said and done. That one 1 pound extra could be the difference between me making it to safety or getting my brains eaten. Seriously though I might just get a S&W. Maybe I'll read some build threads too.

Maybe read the build threads and also maybe seek therapy.

Or at least realize that in the event of ANY - and I mean any - emergency a scoped, lasered, and illuminated weapons platform will be so far below potable water, shelter, and transportation the fck out of there on your list that you probably won't fire a shot.

If you want a rifle to have at the ready, you don't need scopes and lasers. You need something to defend your house if people come up to it - which they won't - unless they're already in such bad shape that they're not a threat to you. If you want something for bugging out, get a shotgun or a pistol, because I defy Sylvester Stallone on his best day to fire an AR while E&Eing in his Ford Explorer.

I'm sure you, like many Americans, saw the images of people looting after Katrina. Well, guess what - I was there, and most people were too freaked out to give a fck what was going on because their loved ones were being swept away by tidal waves. And if you're somebody who'd shoot someone because they're stealing a TV while a major disaster is happening, please revert to my initial suggestion: seek help.

emy
05-26-2011, 9:00 AM
I have the BM pistol upper in 9mm and never had issue, but then it's 9mm. I guess i got the hit, and not the miss

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/183764_187439874628309_100000868943084_415249_6036 261_n.jpg

CSACANNONEER
05-26-2011, 1:59 PM
Well Id like a Bushmaster carbon AR. I called a store today and he told me all bushmaster lowers are prohibited. So I could buy a bm upper and a different upper and hope the upper is not a pos and hope bm gives me my money back after that hassle. Or I could get an su-16 hope its durable enough that it doesnt fall apart when SHTF. Or I could try to build some other one but I'm not really seeing any configuration that comes in less at than 6 pounds. Or I could just buy a S&W while I still can. I got to be ready when SHTF.

All BMs are not catagory one AWs in CA. It is perfectly legal to buy an OLL BM rifle or lower in Ca today as long as it is not a listed AW. It really sounds like you need to do a lot more research before you give any advise about any type of firearm. BTW, don't ask a gun shop for legal advise, 90% of the time, they are wrong. The other 10% are either mistakes or, the shop owner and employees frequent this forum and actually read and understand the law. So, what shop did you call that spoon fed you such FUD?

Sam .223
05-26-2011, 4:33 PM
Whered you find it? Or did you mod it?How much does it weigh?

i bought it as a toploader, i added a bullet button and cut out the magwell. it weighs just under 6 lbs unloaded, no add ons or rail. i bought it at Turners in San Berdo a long time ago before i knew about this site even.

zfields
05-27-2011, 8:57 AM
How much you benching their tough guy? Maybe we could meet up sometime and see who can carry what.

And this thread just hit troll status

sent from my Damn phone, so deal with the spelling errors.

dieselpower
05-27-2011, 9:22 AM
And this thread just hit troll status

sent from my Damn phone, so deal with the spelling errors.

Almost EVERY AR variant floats around 6 pounds, unloaded. You're just going to want to skip things like rail systems and fancy stock systems. A normal CAR-type build will weigh in at ABOUT six pounds, from what I've felt/seen/read. And if I were building it for when SHTF, I wouldn't choose a lower because it's six ounces lighter than a more durable, proven one. Build yourself a normal AR-15, 16" Barrel that does what it's supposed to, will shoot straight, and weighs AROUND 6-7 lbs.

If there's some type of obscene baggage weight limit for the apocalypse that you somehow have foreknowledge of, please share what that is. Otherwise, man the f•ck up and carry a seven pound rifle.

--Inq

Dude stop with the "man the F up.." comments. We have members in wheelchairs, members who are missing limbs, hands, back injuries.

Some of us do not just carry a rifle from a car to a range bench then back to the car. We carry them for DAYS.

Some of us weigh everything with a budget. Not one based on money, but one based on weight. We buy two of everything and then take a Dremel tool to one of them seeing how much weight we can shave off without weakening it.

Some of us actually plan for the future. We have the weight calculated out BEFORE we spend the money.

His budget is 6 lbs. His reasons are his own. Maybe you need to wise up instead of insulting a person for whom you dont even know.

PEBKAC
05-27-2011, 10:34 AM
Well Id like a Bushmaster carbon AR. I called a store today and he told me all bushmaster lowers are prohibited. So I could buy a bm upper and a different upper and hope the upper is not a pos and hope bm gives me my money back after that hassle.

That's what we call FUD. The carbon lowers are definitely not listed (check page 2 of the AW Flowchart, the only BushMaster lowers listed are the XM15 lowers) so you only need to worry about features. To the best of my knowledge all the Carbon-15 lowers from Professional Ordnance are banned, but that is only an issue if you are buying used guns as PO has been out of business for a while now.