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tomd1584
05-21-2011, 10:41 AM
Remember the guy who asked if his AR was okay when he accidently dropped it from his sofa?

Check out the Daniel Defense Torture test on DD's homepage.

https://danieldefense.com/TortureTest

FourLoko
05-21-2011, 10:56 AM
test shooter could have afforded to skip the lunch break

pretty good video though

NorCal Einstein
05-21-2011, 11:03 AM
Damn that test shooter/big guy is annoying as hell...

xibunkrlilkidsx
05-21-2011, 11:07 AM
WARNING! The following video contains torture tests performed by trained professionals. Attempting to perform these test on your own may lead to serious injury or death to the operator or persons nearby. Intentional damage sustained to your Daniel Defense M4 carbine is not covered under your warranty.

lol...damn seems they thought of everything.

Spaceghost
05-21-2011, 11:31 AM
Seemed more like an aimpoint promo to me.

evidens83
05-21-2011, 11:33 AM
Damn that test shooter/big guy is annoying as hell...

Larry Vickers? ;)

I actually liked the vid. Makes me want to get an Aimpoint :D

cmace22
05-21-2011, 11:43 AM
I know LV is suppose to be a bad *** and is well respected but a wheezing 320lb target is hard to take seriously imo. Maybe a stunt double is in order.

Good video though.

MrPlink
05-21-2011, 11:49 AM
my cpu is actin up and it wouldnt load past the dirt test. I would have liked to see a "sand" test as opposed to a soil test.

Airrixd
05-21-2011, 11:50 AM
Outdoor channel's show Tactical Arms did something similar. Of course using everything LAV's products or endorsed products (DD rails, Aimpoint, Vickers Sling, etc). Not a bad show if you get past the marketing.

elSquid
05-21-2011, 11:50 AM
Not particularly scientific...but fun to watch. Explosions are always cool!

Aimpoints appear to be able to take quite a bit of abuse. :D

-- Michael

cmace22
05-21-2011, 11:53 AM
The torture tests on that show are a joke...

Tape muzzle, close dust cover, insert mag, roll down 5 foot hill and fire 2 rounds.

fullspeed1
05-21-2011, 11:55 AM
Another reason why I run an Aimpoint T1

WTSGDYBBR
05-21-2011, 12:01 PM
The test is lame. Do a retake on all the test then run it with no tape on the barrel . Hell if it was a AK47 it would survive with no tape on the barrel .

Striker
05-21-2011, 12:07 PM
I know LV is suppose to be a bad *** and is well respected but a wheezing 320lb target is hard to take seriously imo. Maybe a stunt double is in order.

Good video though.
Hmm, interesting. Because not only is LAV a former assaulter for Detachment Delta, meaning he's an A level shooter under REAL pressure, but he's also one of the most respected firearms guys in the business. When LAV talks, gun people listen. Not just gun people, but gun companies including HK and obviously Daniel Defense. This guy has forgotten more about guns of all types than most of us will ever know. Not being a fan boy, just rolling out the guy's credentials.

FourLoko
05-21-2011, 12:10 PM
didn't realize that was him, he's certainly legit

but ya, it's an advertisement, tape on the barrel says it all, defeats the purpose

tomd1584
05-21-2011, 12:14 PM
The torture tests on that show are a joke...

Tape muzzle, close dust cover, insert mag, roll down 5 foot hill and fire 2 rounds.

so you didn't like the 25 lbs of explosives, or the 100ft drop out of a heicopter? :p

You're a tough guy to impress, geez....

Chuck67
05-21-2011, 12:18 PM
I would of liked to see the rifle dropped on concrete from the helicopoter and not grass. It would of been nice to actually see the red dot & not have to take his word on it considering he is endorsed by them (bias).

cmace22
05-21-2011, 12:22 PM
Hmm, interesting. Because not only is LAV a former assaulter for Detachment Delta, meaning he's an A level shooter under REAL pressure, but he's also one of the most respected firearms guys in the business. When LAV talks, gun people listen. Not just gun people, but gun companies including HK and obviously Daniel Defense. This guy has forgotten more about guns of all types than most of us will ever know. Not being a fan boy, just rolling out the guy's credentials.


I believe I acknowledged his rep and background. Dont dispute that he would be a formidable foe. But Id bet a short run and a basic obstacle course would even the playing field a bit lol.


so you didn't like the 25 lbs of explosives, or the 100ft drop out of a heicopter? :p

You're a tough guy to impress, geez....

Haha. The explosives and helicopter drop test were impressive. What I didnt like were all the cut shots before firing.

Packy14
05-21-2011, 12:26 PM
pretty sure a Delton could handle that (I run a DD). The aimpoint did well.

Colt-45
05-21-2011, 12:38 PM
I'm sold. I want one now. :D

killshot44
05-21-2011, 12:38 PM
I know LV is suppose to be a bad *** and is well respected but a wheezing 320lb target is hard to take seriously imo.


LV's show title is "Assaulter".......
The only thing he's assaulted in the last fifteen years is a buffet table. He is undefeated.

His shows are more advertisements than tests. But the man gets paid so good for him I guess.

/would like to time travel and stop the guy who introduces LV to the phrase "nice piece of kit"

MrPlink
05-21-2011, 12:47 PM
so you didn't like the 25 lbs of explosives, or the 100ft drop out of a heicopter? :p

You're a tough guy to impress, geez....

I think most modern mil small arms would survive that.

Lets keep in mind, the video is an AVERTISMENT

cmace22
05-21-2011, 12:47 PM
LV's show title is "Assaulter".......
The only thing he's assaulted in the last fifteen years is a buffet table. He is undefeated.

His shows are more advertisements than tests. But the man gets paid so good for him I guess.

/would like to time travel and stop the guy who introduces LV to the phrase "nice piece of kit"

Hahaha...

True on all accounts.

a1fabweld
05-21-2011, 1:01 PM
Damn that test shooter/big guy is annoying as hell...

I agree. I cant stand to watch the tactical shows on tv because of him. The other guys are ok though.

mrvash
05-21-2011, 1:01 PM
That Aimpoint is tough, makes me cherish my Comp M2 even more.

Josh3239
05-21-2011, 1:23 PM
You understand what will happen when there is an obstruction in the barrel, any barrel right? An AK, nor anything can operate with a barrel obstruction. Every gun, everyone, needs to be properly drained. Even that silly HK video, they drained the 416.

The test is lame. Do a retake on all the test then run it with no tape on the barrel . Hell if it was a AK47 it would survive with no tape on the barrel .

aermotor
05-21-2011, 1:44 PM
To me, this video is really more just marketing propaganda. Pretty much the entire time, they don't even reference the abuse the gun is taking, they are talking about how awesome the Aimpoint is. Maybe they forgot which product they were testing.


1) The sand/water tests were sort of pointless since the bolt cover was closed and the muzzle was taped. These are not real world testing conditions.

2) The dirt/gravel run over test imo isn't even abuse. If anything it's strictly cosmetic, not functional.

3) Explosion test just looks more impressive than what's actually happened to the rifle. Add some shrapnel into the mix, flying concrete etc. and we'll see.

4) 6 foot concrete drop test. No big deal.

5) 30 foot dirt drop test. Kinda pointless. Metal vs. Dirt. There shouldn't be any question who wins.

6) Helicopter drop onto grass. This is kinda lame and the DD guys being interviewed are over actors.


If anything, this is a testament to how awesome Aimpoints are.

Ruiner
05-21-2011, 1:49 PM
The test is lame. Do a retake on all the test then run it with no tape on the barrel . Hell if it was a AK47 it would survive with no tape on the barrel .

If it was an AK with no tape on the barrel, it would most likely get a barrel obstruction and explode just like any other gun would if the barrel is plugged.

missiontrails
05-21-2011, 2:17 PM
The torture tests on that show are a joke...

Tape muzzle, close dust cover, insert mag, roll down 5 foot hill and fire 2 rounds.

Agree.... they need to employ the Glock torture test method. Drop the damn thing out of an airplane or something onto asphalt.

missiontrails
05-21-2011, 2:18 PM
I think most modern mil small arms would survive that.

Lets keep in mind, the video is an AVERTISMENT

I was thinking that the ENTIRE time.

KaLiFORNIA
05-21-2011, 2:30 PM
The hate is strong here!

missiontrails
05-21-2011, 2:38 PM
The hate is strong here!

Not really.
How many rifes out there have Magpul Moe stocks on them : Many
How many rifles have milspec upper and lower receivers: Many
How many rifles have hammer forged (or Milspec) barrels: Many
How many rifles have Aimpoint T-1's : Many
How many rifles have rails as strong (or stronger) than DD : Many

Big woopy............... DD just did a test for almost every other rifle on the market also. There was nothing unique to their rifle, except the rail.

UserM4
05-21-2011, 2:54 PM
It's an advertisement made to be grandiose!
Larry Vickers has done more for the firearms industry than all of us combined. Let's show some respect. Not to mention that you wouldn't say anything insulting about him if he was in your face. :p
Even an AK will fail (there's an actual youtube video that backs this) if the safety is off and sand/dirt gets inside the action. Don't believe the hype.

That being said...
I'm damn impressed with the USGI mag! :p

Ruiner
05-21-2011, 3:01 PM
Even an AK will fail (there's an actual youtube video that backs this) if the safety is off and sand/dirt gets inside the action. Don't believe the hype.


Lies! My AK still fires even when it's out of ammo! :p;)

762.DEFENSE
05-21-2011, 3:20 PM
Suddenly I feel the need to buy an Aimpoint.

RonPogi
05-21-2011, 4:04 PM
Bottom line is I'm not going to do that to my rifle torture test :p:D

tomd1584
05-21-2011, 4:05 PM
Suddenly I feel the need to buy an Aimpoint.

No need brah, a Primary Arms will be just fine. Save $500 and buy 2 cases of ammo.:TFH:

JJ1911
05-21-2011, 6:42 PM
Anyone else amazed at how durable the aimpoint is?

a1fabweld
05-21-2011, 7:41 PM
It's an advertisement made to be grandiose!
Larry Vickers has done more for the firearms industry than all of us combined. Let's show some respect. Not to mention that you wouldn't say anything insulting about him if he was in your face. :p
Even an AK will fail (there's an actual youtube video that backs this) if the safety is off and sand/dirt gets inside the action. Don't believe the hype.

That being said...
I'm damn impressed with the USGI mag! :p

If he was in my face I'd be afraid he'd eat me! His dialouge is intended to impress jr high kids. I find it hard to take the guy seriously.

NorCalDustin
05-21-2011, 8:36 PM
You understand what will happen when there is an obstruction in the barrel, any barrel right? An AK, nor anything can operate with a barrel obstruction. Every gun, everyone, needs to be properly drained. Even that silly HK video, they drained the 416.
Exactly.

Anyone who says, "oh yeah remove the tape and stuff the barrel full of crap... My xxxxxxx gun would be ok, hell I do it to mine all the time".... Is full of crap.

Is also an idiot... Has also probably got very limited time around guns... Probably goes to the range once a year... Has probably never seen a bore obstruction and then the damage and injury's said obstruction causes.

acaligunner
05-21-2011, 9:19 PM
I know LV is suppose to be a bad *** and is well respected but a wheezing 320lb target is hard to take seriously imo. Maybe a stunt double is in order.

Good video though.

I don't know, I hang around a lot of old VietNam combat vets (my older brother works with them at the VA hospital), and they all tell me, 'Son it only takes a couple of pounds of force to pull a trigger, or cut someone'.
:43:

He may look overweight, but be careful of his intent.

acaligunner

Chuck67
05-21-2011, 9:59 PM
Just because he isn't covered head to toe in multi cam or doesn't look like he belongs on call of duty folks are talking crap. Yes his dialogue is annoying but the man is a SF veteran so he obliviously knows more then what you have learned on call of duty & the Internet (YouTube & gun forums) Maybe Vickers should have a mall ninja make over then maybe he could get some respect. Just saying....

MrPlink
05-21-2011, 10:00 PM
if we are gonna bag on somebody who does gun reviews I say we gang up on nutnfancy

Norsemen308
05-21-2011, 10:23 PM
it was completely a friggin gimmick. the shotgun test was smoke and mirrors, so was the friggin water test, san test yah lets shovel dirt on the NON-dustcover side... total BS...

they had a GREAT set up to throw the competition under the bus if they put 2 other top contenders in with it... but doing all that with just their rifle doesn't really show the comparison..

jhaselton
05-21-2011, 10:45 PM
I'm not jumping on the hate wagon here. I think it's a good video.

Could it be better? Yea, every video could be better. They showed a bunch of good tests in a very short amount of time.

Could a lot of other manufacturers do this to their rifles? I'm sure they can and I encourage them to make videos to prove it.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: to Daniel Defense!

bombadillo
05-21-2011, 10:46 PM
Shoot, the Aimpoint Micro could be said to be tested just as well in this torture testing. It took as much beating, water, being shot at, run over, and still did well!!!!

SuperSet
05-21-2011, 10:56 PM
Good commercial and I really like their products. Daniel Defense is learning the value of modern production and video marketing.

acaligunner
05-21-2011, 11:49 PM
I thought it was a good video, why? cause it was entertaining.

SF guy, a company that seems to back up what they say, and a gtg rifle.

Even tho their test showed the rifle didn't malfunction, I'm more surprised there where no major failures. I think it was more of a, look it's going to hold up to these types of abuse, than a true torture test.

Either way, Daniel Defense AR's are GTG, and you could throw away the test, and you still have a good quality AR.

I like them, and they seem to offer a lot of different rifles that should be good for most shooting situations. Looks to me like a M3 or M5 model suits my needs, if I can still find one available.

acaligunner

451040
05-22-2011, 5:33 AM
Exactly.

Anyone who says, "oh yeah remove the tape and stuff the barrel full of crap... My xxxxxxx gun would be ok, hell I do it to mine all the time".... Is full of crap.

Is also an idiot... Has also probably got very limited time around guns... Probably goes to the range once a year... Has probably never seen a bore obstruction and then the damage and injury's said obstruction causes.

Just because he isn't covered head to toe in multi cam or doesn't look like he belongs on call of duty folks are talking crap. ... the man is a SF veteran so he obliviously knows more then what you have learned on call of duty & the Internet (YouTube & gun forums) Maybe Vickers should have a mall ninja make over then maybe he could get some respect.

Spot on.

cmace22
05-22-2011, 7:03 AM
Just because he isn't covered head to toe in multi cam or doesn't look like he belongs on call of duty folks are talking crap. Yes his dialogue is annoying but the man is a SF veteran so he obliviously knows more then what you have learned on call of duty & the Internet (YouTube & gun forums) Maybe Vickers should have a mall ninja make over then maybe he could get some respect. Just saying....

I knew sooner or later the chairman of the LV fan club would show.

Here....

Now we can treat him with respect he is tacticool now.

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b164/cmace22/vickers-s-m-heade.jpg

cmace22
05-22-2011, 7:08 AM
I don't know, I hang around a lot of old VietNam combat vets (my older brother works with them at the VA hospital), and they all tell me, 'Son it only takes a couple of pounds of force to pull a trigger, or cut someone'.
:43:

He may look overweight, but be careful of his intent.

acaligunner

How much force does it take him to roll over or turn around?

451040
05-22-2011, 7:42 AM
How much force does it take him to roll over or turn around?

Why are you so concerned with another man's physique?

leoffensive
05-22-2011, 7:57 AM
if we are gonna bag on somebody who does gun reviews I say we gang up on nutnfancy

+999999999999999999999999999999

bombadillo
05-22-2011, 8:18 AM
Shouldn't bag on anybody in the gun community trying to promote, review, or otherwise forward the sport of shooting unless we are doing something we think is bigger, better, or otherwise superior. We should try and stick it out together here y'all.

Striker
05-22-2011, 9:04 AM
Everyone is entitled to his or her opinion. I doubt LAV cares that some of these guys are Sh*t talking him. Me personally, I would prefer to NOT engage him in tactical shoot out. Something, like my common sense, tells me that would be a bad day.

Dhena81
05-22-2011, 9:05 AM
I thought it was a good video LV might be fat but he deserves to be fat now days he's in his 40's and has been through more crap than 99% of men can endure he still has a BAMF badge.

It's funny how no test will be good enough for fan boys of AK's I can post video's of them malfunctioning side by side with a DI AR not malfunctioning. Every gun will malfunction all these torture tests can be taken with a grain of salt as there will always be a variable even in the same conditions the point is that DD and Aimpoint make one hell of a piece of kit :D.

Outta Control
05-22-2011, 9:09 AM
The test is lame. Do a retake on all the test then run it with no tape on the barrel . Hell if it was a AK47 it would survive with no tape on the barrel .

Taping the barrel and having the bolt forward is a Level 3 transport method.

cmace22
05-22-2011, 9:43 AM
Why are you so concerned with another man's physique?


Im not concerned.

Its my pet peeve with obesity not his service or rep.

Ill refrain from any more shots at LV.

I thought it was a good video LV might be fat but he deserves to be fat now days he's in his 40's and has been through more crap than 99% of men can endure he still has a BAMF badge.

This is true.

Airrixd
05-22-2011, 10:22 AM
I just watched this video again.. how come no one is talking about the Magpul stock? It's plastic after all and could still handle all the torture tests that they put it through with no cracks (at least that's what I saw). I'm not a Magpul fan boy but coming from a marketing background, I'm calling the video what it is.. marketing.

ZombieTactics
05-22-2011, 10:36 AM
The giant problem with the gun community at large is that we are (mostly) a bunch of alpha male types jockeying to be lead dog ... or at least not the bottom of the pack.

Young dogs often need to learn the hard way that the old dog who looks fat and and out of shape got to be that way because he has been so damned badass for so long that he has earned that right. I shook Vicker's hand once ... about crushed me to death without even trying. That was that was his "friendly" trade show handshake.

Ultimately the mind and will are more important to a warrior than a toned physique. Given a choice, you're much better off with the former than the latter.

Don't be fooled, young dogs.

eville
05-22-2011, 11:00 AM
makes me want an Aimpoint.

tomd1584
05-22-2011, 11:22 AM
from LAV:

Guys the promo torture test video are actually excerpts from my upcoming TV show on the torture test- the clips you see are pieced together from the filming; believe it or not to get the different angles we needed for filming the tests were usually done more than once ( like shot twice with birdshot, ran over 4 times with the jeep, etc.) - the explosion was only done once however for obvious reasons!

The show will have better continuity however as I also noted bits and pieces that don't fit together on the promo video - we were all very impressed with the DDM4 but even more so with the T1 - particularly since the gun always tilted so the optic hit first from any significant fall

The show is called TacTV and it will be available on Sportsman Channel and the show website for those who don't get that channel or want the bonus material that is available via the website- extended episodes and training tips will be available for a low subscription price - approximately $10 a month or $100 for the year

Heads up both Daniel Defense and Aimpoint are show sponsors - the test shook out exactly as you see it; filming these shows and airing them is not cheap - it frankly would not be possible without sponsors like DD, Aimpoint, BCM, and others - the key is to do it in a fashion that is entertaining and legitimate - I won't lie for anyone so if I say it on the show then you can take it to the bank. Some people don't buy into that and that is OK- I would suggest watching a different show that you feel is more 'believable'

And last but not least a TacTV discussion forum will be right here on M4C - all this should launch around the end of June

Be safe

LAV

Sonic_mike
05-22-2011, 11:41 AM
I didn't know Andrew Zimmerman was a gun guy.






j/k cool video but like most said take it with a grain of salt.

MUKAK
05-22-2011, 1:39 PM
that video is a JOKE, its audited and put together the way they wanted to...

i wanna c some1 on the forum take they AR and drive a car over it a few times... then shoot it with a shotgun round... :rolleyes:

they switched the gun for each take.............................................. . ohh ye they taped the barrel LOL its a "real" test....

Scott Connors
05-22-2011, 2:22 PM
I know LV is suppose to be a bad *** and is well respected but a wheezing 320lb target is hard to take seriously imo. Maybe a stunt double is in order.

Good video though.

That "wheezing 320lb target" retired as a Master Sergeant from SFOD Delta:

From Wiki: "Larry Vickers spent over twenty years in the United States Army in special operations. He participated in Operation Just Cause in Panama, including the rescue of Kurt Muse during Operation Acid Gambit, Operation Gothic Serpent in Somalia, and other still classified operations in Desert Storm and Bosnia.[3]

According to his website, a partial list of his qualifications and awards include:

Operator Training Course, Special Forces Qualification Course, Special Forces Military Freefall Course, Special Operations Target Interdiction Course (SF Sniper School), Airborne School, Infantry Advanced Individual Training, Jumpmaster School, Military Freefall Jumpmaster School, Bronze Star with 'V' device for actions in Panama, Joint Service Commendation medal with 'V' device for actions during Desert Storm, Defense Meritorious Service Medal, Meritorious Service Medal, Combat Infantryman Badge Vickers is one of the few published sources of reliable information on the U.S. Army's Delta Force. He is also known to be one of the driving forces behind Delta Force's customized M1911 pistol program.[4]"

I would wager, if there were any way to determine it, that he has personally fired more rounds than everybody on this thread has combined. Anybody who underestimates him based upon his current body mass index is IMO setting themselves up for epic fail (unless, of course, you're talking about the Mogadishu marathon). I think that he's earned the right to a few Big Macs for lunch. He has certainly earned the respect of every American.

UserM4
05-22-2011, 2:35 PM
I would love to see a sh*t talker exchange rounds on a two way range against Larry Vickers. No? Then stfu.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

a1fabweld
05-22-2011, 4:18 PM
Not only would he win there, he'd also clean your clock in a hot dog eating contest!

Chuck67
05-22-2011, 4:23 PM
Im not a LV fan, I just have much respect for combat vets especially Veterans from the SOCOM. If that makes me a fan boy then so be it

I knew sooner or later the chairman of the LV fan club would show.

Here....

Now we can treat him with respect he is tacticool now.

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b164/cmace22/vickers-s-m-heade.jpg

r6raff
05-22-2011, 4:46 PM
The video was entertaining at the least, showed that aim point can take some beating as well as that USGI Mag, but most of the stuff I would wager most decent quality ARs could survive. When I first saw this thread I though mayve it was a Filthy Fourteen type of test or some other extreme scenario type of test.

To all the LV haters, the man deserves to put on some pounds. This man regardless of his current appearance deserves all the respect we can give. He did all the dirty work so the majority of us didn't even have to know that it had to be done. In his worst condition, he could probably take on the vast majority of us in our best. If you are so threatened by the mans lifetime achievements to at least respect him for it, then say nothing. Resorting to bashing him on his weight is pretty low and very undeserved. For all you know he may have a disorder, and if not, then what do we care. If I had been through what he had for so long, id probably live in a bottle of jack, but he's not. Still out there promoting gun owners and supporting advancements.

tomd1584
05-22-2011, 4:59 PM
For those who are bashing LAV's weight/appearance, lets see what you look like. otherwise, STFU.

Of Course its an advertisement. But whether you liked it or not, personal attacks aren't cool.

$P-Ritch$
05-22-2011, 5:26 PM
I'm going to have bump the T1 a few spots up on my "to buy" list. That was amazing that it kept its zero (except for the helicopter drop) and remained on.

818gtiguy
05-22-2011, 5:27 PM
For those who are bashing LAV's weight/appearance, lets see what you look like. otherwise, STFU.

Of Course its an advertisement. But whether you liked it or not, personal attacks aren't cool.

+1...

For those of you who don't know, Larry Vickers has 20+ years under his belt, with many of them with special ops...He also has been in atleast 3 helo crashs, so he's deserves to chill ,relax, and eat wtf he wants...

cmace22
05-22-2011, 5:31 PM
I'm going to have bump the T1 a few spots up on my "to buy" list. That was amazing that it kept its zero (except for the helicopter drop) and remained on.

+1

I was quite impressed with that. Makes me regret selling mine.

818gtiguy
05-22-2011, 5:35 PM
I would love to see a sh*t talker exchange rounds on a two way range against Larry Vickers. No? Then stfu.


A BIG +1

SuperSet
05-22-2011, 5:41 PM
This place is turning into ARFCOM.

cmace22
05-22-2011, 5:47 PM
I apologize for calling LV fat.

If you would like me to edit my post LMK.

It wasnt personal

It wasnt an attack

Im sure he is a great guy and could beat us all in a gunfight combined.

So again sorry if I offended any of you.

Outta Control
05-22-2011, 5:56 PM
One observations that I can comment on is in a lot of the shows, especially Tactical Arms I've noticed his knuckles are at a stage of continued callus building and if you are familiar with this type of condition you would know he works out his knuckles pretty good aka working on a punching bag w/gloves.

818gtiguy
05-22-2011, 6:22 PM
For those who don't have a Aimpoint Micro, you have been sleeping........:sleeping:

This video pretty much sums it up on "what is the best RDS"...

Oh yea, here's my complete Daniel Defense M4 carbine w/ Aimpoint T-1.....I love the enhanced magwell on the DD lowers..

http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu319/glockpoppin/2011-04-04225505-1.jpg
Nuff said.

Outta Control
05-22-2011, 6:53 PM
http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu319/glockpoppin/2011-04-04225505-1.jpg
Nuff said.

Is that high mount on your T1 with flip up sights?

818gtiguy
05-22-2011, 6:56 PM
Is that high mount on your T1 with flip up sights?

Yea, TROY flip ups with a LaRue tall, lower 1/3 co-witness mount.

cmace22
05-22-2011, 7:06 PM
For those who don't have a Aimpoint Micro, you have been sleeping........:sleeping:

This video pretty much sums it up on "what is the best RDS"...

Oh yea, here's my complete Daniel Defense M4 carbine w/ Aimpoint T-1.....I love the enhanced magwell on the DD lowers..

http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu319/glockpoppin/2011-04-04225505-1.jpg
Nuff said.


How are you liking the LW barrel profile?

818gtiguy
05-22-2011, 7:12 PM
How are you liking the LW barrel profile?

I'm liking it a lot! Cold hammer forged, chrome lined, super accurate, lightweight...What's not to like about that! Personally, I would only utilize a LW profiled barrel if it is cold hammer forged...But that is only my opinion..

cmace22
05-22-2011, 7:16 PM
I'm liking it a lot! Cold hammer forged, chrome lined, lightweight...What's not to like about that! Personally, I would only utilize a LW profiled barrel if it is cold hammer forged.

I regret not getting one. I opted for the 16" BHF from BCM instead (over kill for me). I think you talked me into another build :mad:

Outta Control
05-22-2011, 7:39 PM
Yea, TROY flip ups with a LaRue tall, lower 1/3 co-witness mount.

Oh Okay. Most of the complete flip up/RDS system, including mine run on absolute co-witness. I just want to be consistent on my cheek position.

Gio
05-22-2011, 7:49 PM
Interesting, DD is a good company and their CHF bbl's are good too :)

Secret
05-22-2011, 8:49 PM
Just noticed that Jeep is a call of duty edition lol :P

818gtiguy
05-22-2011, 8:55 PM
Oh Okay. Most of the complete flip up/RDS system, including mine run on absolute co-witness. I just want to be consistent on my cheek position.

I used to run my optics the same way (absolute co-witness), thinking the same as you, wanting to keep the same, consistant cheek weld. That is until I actually tried a lower 1/3 co-witness mount. With the lower 1/3 cowitness, you have more of a "heads up", and you keep more of a peripheral of your surroundings.

45R
05-22-2011, 9:13 PM
WOW after reading some of the comments on this thread, I'm embarrassed that you guys are Calguns Members. :mad:

pyro3k2
05-22-2011, 9:36 PM
3 pages and not one EOtech fanboy? No claims of "try that again with an EOtech, it will work even after that micro fails"


I guess we are not turning into Arf.com

r6raff
05-22-2011, 9:42 PM
3 pages and not one EOtech fanboy? No claims of "try that again with an EOtech, it will work even after that micro fails"


I guess we are not turning into Arf.com

I love my Eotech, but no doubt that aim point is also a rock solid optic. Get one or the either and you are more than gtg.

But I feel ya, not enough fanboyism in this thread...




















BCM is the best every and I worship everything they make... DD is junk and I wont wipe my *** with it... Bam! you ask for it! =P

pyro3k2
05-22-2011, 9:58 PM
I love my Eotech, but no doubt that aim point is also a rock solid optic. Get one or the either and you are more than gtg.

But I feel ya, not enough fanboyism in this thread...




















BCM is the best every and I worship everything they make... DD is junk and I wont wipe my *** with it... Bam! you ask for it! =P

NOW THATS THE KIND OF TROLLING IM TALKING ABOUT :D:D:D

Kerplow
05-22-2011, 10:10 PM
It was neat, but all of those tests favored the gun.

I'd like to see the big drop tests on concrete or asphault.

he should have shot it with 00 buck instead of birdshot.

the explosive test should have incorporated more realistic shrapnel, like if a real bomb designed to kill people/destroy buildings/vehicles went off.

Rebellious
05-23-2011, 12:13 AM
.....so that was an Aimpoint Pomo right? ;)

Elwood_Blues
05-23-2011, 9:29 AM
We were blown away
Ah, no, the rifle was blown away. You guys were standing 100 yards away :D I just thought it was funny of him to use that expression in this case. Of course it was a marketing promo, but I liked the video because it was entertaining. Oh yeah, and I'm rockin' DD M4v3 upper :D

carnelianbay
05-23-2011, 10:32 PM
For all of the ragging on LV, aimpoint, fixed tests, and their marketing tactics, Id love to see all of the ninja builds around here with 2+ lbs of mostly china crap clamped on the front rails make it through even two of these tests. ;)

pyro3k2
05-23-2011, 10:39 PM
For all of the ragging on LV, aimpoint, fixed tests, and their marketing tactics, Id love to see all of the ninja builds around here with 2+ lbs of mostly china crap clamped on the front rails make it through even two of these tests. ;)

2 lbs...try 7-10 lbs. And besides they would make it through all of those tests. All of that China made crap would make a layered shield and protect the rifle from all abuse.

carnelianbay
05-23-2011, 10:47 PM
2 lbs...try 7-10 lbs. And besides they would make it through all of those tests. All of that China made crap would make a layered shield and protect the rifle from all abuse.

LOL.. very true, all of those rubber flashlights, sticky tape pressure switches, and coiled cords would add a level of shock resistance (at least for the first test).:D

pyro3k2
05-23-2011, 10:56 PM
LOL.. very true, all of those rubber flashlights, sticky tape pressure switches, and coiled cords would add a level of shock resistance (at least for the first test).:D

I think it will take the bird shot, not sure how well but it will take it none the less.

Rebellious
05-23-2011, 11:17 PM
I think DD makes a great product please don't get me wrong, but they clearly can't make a video. I'm sorry but the tests were pathetic. Dry dirt? Birdshot? Drop test on grass? I mean come on. Entertaining at most. Falls short on the "real world" scenario IMHO.
+1 for DD, +1 for Aimpoint, -1 for LV and that vid.

PuppY_K1ck3R
05-24-2011, 11:02 AM
that video is a JOKE, its audited and put together the way they wanted to...

i wanna c some1 on the forum take they AR and drive a car over it a few times... then shoot it with a shotgun round... :rolleyes:

they switched the gun for each take.............................................. . ohh ye they taped the barrel LOL its a "real" test....


whats audited? I did not know that the IRS was involved in the making of this video.

Outta Control
05-24-2011, 11:06 AM
LOL! I think he meant "Edited".

HK35
05-24-2011, 12:49 PM
To me, this video is really more just marketing propaganda. Pretty much the entire time, they don't even reference the abuse the gun is taking, they are talking about how awesome the Aimpoint is. Maybe they forgot which product they were testing.

1) The sand/water tests were sort of pointless since the bolt cover was closed and the muzzle was taped. These are not real world testing conditions.
2) The dirt/gravel run over test imo isn't even abuse. If anything it's strictly cosmetic, not functional.
3) Explosion test just looks more impressive than what's actually happened to the rifle. Add some shrapnel into the mix, flying concrete etc. and we'll see.
4) 6 foot concrete drop test. No big deal.
5) 30 foot dirt drop test. Kinda pointless. Metal vs. Dirt. There shouldn't be any question who wins.
6) Helicopter drop onto grass. This is kinda lame and the DD guys being interviewed are over actors.

If anything, this is a testament to how awesome Aimpoints are.

+1 Those were my thoughts while watching the vid. I think most milspec ARs can take the same amount of beating. But I'm glad I got an Aimpoint!!!

Scott Connors
05-24-2011, 2:01 PM
I love my Eotech, but no doubt that aim point is also a rock solid optic. Get one or the either and you are more than gtg.



I love my Eotech as well, but I like the M68 CCO and the T-1 as well. They're all first rate bits of kit, and individual preferences aside they'll all do the job extremely well.

RONIN.
05-24-2011, 2:56 PM
i find two tings funny bout this..

ppl talking crap on one of the most well known, respected carbine/handgun instructors in the business.. are probably call of duty addicts that have no REAL combat under there belt.. ok, so he isn't 8% body fat, and doesn't PT everyday anymore.. then again he doesn't have too. he now instructs those BAD *****ES.. he has earned the right to be over weight. this just shows the age range of ppl here.. no respect for anyone..

as for the guys making fun of the video, well.. to those.. i'm sure if it was a BCM video you would be all about it :rolleyes:.. in all honesty, yes most mil weapons would hold up to those tests..

ronin.

themailman
05-24-2011, 3:04 PM
as for the guys making fun of the video, well.. to those.. i'm sure if it was a BCM video you would be all about it :rolleyes:.. in all honesty, yes most mil weapons would hold up to those tests..

ronin.

Did you get raped by a BCM owner? Seriously, whats your beef? You talk about "showing your age" but then act like a 5 year old. Anyone that has hard on for BCM has one for DD, Colt, LMT, Noveske, and some even like Stag...some even go so far as to like RRA:eek:

Grow up, get over your hatred for a fine company and the owners who choose to buy from them. Ridiculous.

This is for you RONIN:
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f198/glockfire/DSC01547.jpg

RONIN.
05-24-2011, 3:20 PM
i guess when i edited it to be more PC.. i deleted the lols threw out my post.. it was sarcasm..

what i was doing was trying to show that there are fan boys for all the brands.. as you stated.. DD, BCM, SABRE, NOVESKE, COLT.. etc etc.. all have fan boys.. personally i have no favorites.. i own bcm, dd, noveske, high caliber sales uppers.. and all are quality uppers that go bang everytime i pull the trigger..

jeez.. some ppl are so sensitive.. lmao

cmace22
05-24-2011, 3:23 PM
jeez.. some ppl are so sensitive.. lmao

You proved that with your first post.

And

I couldnt agree more.

Justintoxicated
05-24-2011, 3:41 PM
Man that aim point is a turd, lost zero after the wussy helicopter drop. I'll bet my Eotech would be fine.

cmace22
05-24-2011, 3:44 PM
Man that aim point is a turd, lost zero after the wussy helicopter drop. I'll bet my Eotech would be fine.

Haha.

The EO's battery would had been used up by the time it hit the ground.

I kid I kid.

pyro3k2
05-24-2011, 4:01 PM
Man that aim point is a turd, lost zero after the wussy helicopter drop. I'll bet my Eotech would be fine.

Haha.

The EO's battery would had been used up by the time it hit the ground.

I kid I kid.

FINALLY EOTECH FANBOYS GET IN HERE, DEFEND YOUR INSULTED BROTHER!!

SuperSet
05-24-2011, 4:11 PM
Seal Team 6 used an EOTech to kill Bin Laden. Happy? :)

HK35
05-24-2011, 4:18 PM
Seal Team 6 used an EOTech to kill Bin Laden. Happy? :)

What? So they just threw an Eotech at him and that killed him? Now that's rad!

Oh well, I guess an Aimpoint would be too light to inflict any damage to a human.

1811
05-24-2011, 4:45 PM
All DD needs is the MAGPUL guys (Costa) to run one during a class or vid and they will be unobtanium....:chris:

Outta Control
05-24-2011, 4:48 PM
Honestly I'd rather have LAV to teach me versus Costa. This is based on their real world experience.

acaligunner
05-24-2011, 5:19 PM
The old lady dropped one of my rifles today.

I yelled at her, 'hey what the hell are you doing, that's not a daniel defense rifle, dammit'.

':willy_nilly:

acaligunner

cmace22
05-24-2011, 5:46 PM
What? So they just threw an Eotech at him and that killed him? Now that's rad!



Naw, I heard they just showed him how much they spend on batteries each year and he keeld over from laughter.....

Disclaimer: I dont currently own any more Aimpoints or EOtechs.

UserM4
05-24-2011, 6:16 PM
Did you get raped by a BCM owner? Seriously, whats your beef? You talk about "showing your age" but then act like a 5 year old. Anyone that has hard on for BCM has one for DD, Colt, LMT, Noveske, and some even like Stag...some even go so far as to like RRA:eek:

Grow up, get over your hatred for a fine company and the owners who choose to buy from them. Ridiculous.

This is for you RONIN:
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f198/glockfire/DSC01547.jpg

It's cuz BCM owners are like Glock fanbois in the AR world. :p

themailman
05-24-2011, 6:21 PM
It's cuz BCM owners are like Glock fanbois in the AR world. :p

Well then, how about some dual fanboyism:
http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f198/glockfire/DSC01556.jpg

And some Magpul and Aimpoint to boot...

HalfMeltingEyes
05-24-2011, 6:28 PM
That man kind of reminds me of Billy Mays.

pyro3k2
05-24-2011, 6:37 PM
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4051/4215341880_f6778229d1.jpg

cmace22
05-24-2011, 6:40 PM
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4051/4215341880_f6778229d1.jpg

Dont hate.... You know how hard it was to knit that emblem on!

a1fabweld
05-24-2011, 7:26 PM
That man kind of reminds me of Billy Mays.

As in you can only handle so much before you change the channel? Yea.

nitroxdiver
05-24-2011, 10:55 PM
The running over with vehicle and explosive abuse was pretty impressive to me. I'm sure most of the equally well made M4gery's would fair just as well though. I really like DD's products, so I'm biased. They work, have features I want, and I like em.

The aimpoint surprised me in its ability to keep on running after some of those tests.

I have nothing but the utmost respect for LAV, his knowledge, and his military service.
He knows more than I ever will, that's for sure. And so does Costa. I'd love to train with either of them.

Josh3239
05-24-2011, 11:22 PM
I wonder how many people here disrespecting Larry Vickers actually realize that this man was in Delta, received a bronze star, is one of the more respected firearms instructors on the planet, worked on development of the HK416 and knows more about this stuff than all of us combined?

themailman
05-25-2011, 7:42 AM
I wonder how many people here disrespecting Larry Vickers actually realize that this man was in Delta, received a bronze star, is one of the more respected firearms instructors on the planet, worked on development of the HK416 and knows more about this stuff than all of us combined?

Its the internet. The same people dis'ing him on Calguns would be kissing his *** in person. Internet tough guy syndrome.

cmace22
05-25-2011, 9:08 AM
Its the internet. The same people dis'ing him on Calguns would be kissing his *** in person. Internet tough guy syndrome.

True for some, not for others.

a1fabweld
05-25-2011, 9:38 AM
He has served the country & my thanks to him for that. He is knowledgable about guns, that's a given. I'm sure he'd blow me full of holes in a shootout, etc, etc, etc... His tv shows are absolutely cheesy though. I'm not sure if he writes his own scripts or somebody else does, but it sounds as if hes trying to impress a bunch of teenagers.

Flame on.:yawn:

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 6:56 AM
I know LV is suppose to be a bad *** and is well respected but a wheezing 320lb target is hard to take seriously imo. Maybe a stunt double is in order.

Good video though.

You survive 3 helicopter crashes (two of which should have killed him), spend 20yrs in USA SF and receive the Bronze Star (with a V Device) and THEN come back and talk to us about his weight.

The guy has done more for our country and than you most likely will ever do so cut him some slack!



C4

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 6:58 AM
The torture tests on that show are a joke...

Tape muzzle, close dust cover, insert mag, roll down 5 foot hill and fire 2 rounds.

Incorrect. The testing was to simulate what a gun could go through in combat.

Just as an FYI, yes troops in the field use muzzle caps, yes they close dust covers and insert mags. ;)


Please come up with, film and execute your own test and show us how you could do it better.


C4

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 7:01 AM
I would of liked to see the rifle dropped on concrete from the helicopoter and not grass. It would of been nice to actually see the red dot & not have to take his word on it considering he is endorsed by them (bias).

You must not know Mr. Vickers. He doesn't lie, he doesn't cover things up and he does NOT endorse products that he wouldn't trust in combat.


So if he says that the Aimpoint worked, then you can take it to the bank.



C4

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 7:09 AM
Its the internet. The same people dis'ing him on Calguns would be kissing his *** in person. Internet tough guy syndrome.

Right. I would love for some of these keyboard commando's ACTUALLY take a Vickers Tactical class, look him in the face and tell him that they think he is fat.



C4

themailman
05-26-2011, 7:17 AM
He has served the country & my thanks to him for that. He is knowledgable about guns, that's a given. I'm sure he'd blow me full of holes in a shootout, etc, etc, etc... His tv shows are absolutely cheesy though. I'm not sure if he writes his own scripts or somebody else does, but it sounds as if hes trying to impress a bunch of teenagers.

Flame on.:yawn:
Brother, you dont have to like his show. At least you showed him enough respect not to call him fat.
You must not know Mr. Vickers. He doesn't lie, he doesn't cover things up and he does NOT endorse products that he wouldn't trust in combat.


So if he says that the Aimpoint worked, then you can take it to the bank.



C4

Grant, I had no idea you were a member here, thanks for stopping by. I agree, LAV doesnt endorse crap. If something he did endorse went to crap, he'd call it out, much like the HK45.

The CGN mentality is to hate the mainstream for some reason. Glocks arent recieved well by many here, same with BCM, DD, Aimpoint etc. Now that LAV endorses them, he has gone from a well decorated war hero to a fat guy that doesnt know anything about what a gun goes through in combat. Jesus.

morfeeis
05-26-2011, 7:25 AM
and my heart skipped a beat when the butstock of my AR hit the edge of a wall when in my home, nice to see an AR could take this but i'd never do this to mine.........

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 7:27 AM
Brother, you dont have to like his show. At least you showed him enough respect not to call him fat.


Grant, I had no idea you were a member here, thanks for stopping by. I agree, LAV doesnt endorse crap. If something he did endorse went to crap, he'd call it out, much like the HK45.

The CGN mentality is to hate the mainstream for some reason. Glocks arent recieved well by many here, same with BCM, DD, Aimpoint etc. Now that LAV endorses them, he has gone from a well decorated war hero to a fat guy that doesnt know anything about what a gun goes through in combat. Jesus.

I have a large CA customer base and do try and read the forum when I can. The remarks in this thread were so out of line that I had to stand up for the guy.

Mr. Vickers and I are personal friends. I have logged hundreds and hundreds of hours of training with him and because of it, I am the shooter that I am today. People do not realize that this man has forgotten more about the development and deployment of firearms than they will ever know. They also do not realize that he used to kill people for a living and under his fat is an ex-body builder that is REALLY strong. People would be wise to keep their pie hole shut about things and people they don't really know.



C4

cmace22
05-26-2011, 7:43 AM
You survive 3 helicopter crashes (two of which should have killed him), spend 20yrs in USA SF and receive the Bronze Star (with a V Device) and THEN come back and talk to us about his weight.

The guy has done more for our country and than you most likely will ever do so cut him some slack!



C4

I call a spade a spade.

Sorry if LV weight issue is such a sore spot for you and many here! Its pretty laughable actually.

Incorrect. The testing was to simulate what a gun could go through in combat.

Just as an FYI, yes troops in the field use muzzle caps, yes they close dust covers and insert mags. ;)


Please come up with, film and execute your own test and show us how you could do it better.


C4

I wasn't referring to just this video. I was talking about the testing in his show which I do watch regularly.

Just because I think he is fat and out of shape doesnt mean I dont respect what he has done and is doing for OUR country and the shooting community. But put him on a pedestal I will not do because I DO NOT know him as a person. He could be the best soldier with the best service record and still be a horrible human being. You guys want to idolize him so be it but untill I know a person I cant.

In the end ITS MY OPINION and Im entitled to it.

I let the issue go until you decided to quote me.

Outta Control
05-26-2011, 7:48 AM
Right. I would love for some of these keyboard commando's ACTUALLY take a Vickers Tactical class, look him in the face and tell him that they think he is fat.



C4

I agreed LAV is a no BS talking individual. On the last episode of Tactical Arms which is the MP5, LAV wanted to show how efficient the MP5 was by placing 2 shots on a moving target between 3 friendlies, twice. After explaining the demo results he noted that, in honesty, it was more difficult than he expected. That type of straight talking is what I like to hear. It is on 3:45 on the clip.

OEgDrVRJTHQ

PS: I will someday take one of his courses when it is available near my area.

themailman
05-26-2011, 7:53 AM
I call a spade a spade.

Sorry if LV weight issue is such a sore spot for you and many here! Its pretty laughable actually.



I wasn't referring to just this video. I was talking about the testing in his show which I do watch regularly.

Just because I think he is fat and out of shape doesnt mean I dont respect what he has done and is doing for OUR country and the shooting community. But put him on a pedestal I will not do because I DO NOT know him as a person. He could be the best soldier with the best service record and still be a horrible human being. You guys want to idolize him so be it but untill I know a person I cant.

In the end ITS MY OPINION and Im entitled to it.

I let the issue go until you decided to quote me.
Why on earth is it necessary to mention anything about his physique? Was he selling a Total Gym?

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 7:54 AM
I call a spade a spade.

Sorry if LV weight issue is such a sore spot for you and many here! Its pretty laughable actually.

Not a sore spot, but my guess is that if you had all his back issues you would put on a few pounds as well.

Try to walk a day in someones elses shoes before opening your mouth and making yourself look like an AHOLE.



Just because I think he is fat and out of shape doesnt mean I dont respect what he has done and is doing for OUR country and the shooting community. But put him on a pedestal I will not do because I DO NOT know him as a person. He could be the best soldier with the best service record and still be a horrible human being. You guys want to idolize him so be it but untill I know a person I cant.

In the end ITS MY OPINION and Im entitled to it.

I let the issue go until you decided to quote me.

No need to put him on pedestal. Just be aware of what his body has gone through for his country.

One thing the errornet has taught me is that opinions are not always equal and the uniformed seem to make the most noise.


C4

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 7:57 AM
Why on earth is it necessary to mention anything about his physique? Was he selling a Total Gym?

Right. It seems rather GHEY to me to comment on another dudes body (especially on a gun forum).




C4

cmace22
05-26-2011, 8:14 AM
Right. It seems rather GHEY to me to comment on another dudes body (especially on a gun forum).
C4


It seems like harassment to question ones sexual orientation (especially on a gun forum).

Im done with this.

C4iGrant
05-26-2011, 8:39 AM
It seems like harassment to question ones sexual orientation (especially on a gun forum).

Im done with this.


I guess you don't know what GHEY actually means.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ghey


C4

cmace22
05-26-2011, 8:40 AM
I guess you don't know what GHEY actually means.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ghey


C4

I retract my last post then. Seems I wasnt up to date on the urban dictionary.

missiontrails
05-26-2011, 8:41 AM
Right. I would love for some of these keyboard commando's ACTUALLY take a Vickers Tactical class, look him in the face and tell him that they think he is fat.



C4

"Keyboard Commando's".... LMAO :rofl2:

THT
05-26-2011, 8:44 AM
I just wrapped up hosting LAV here in KCMO for a carbine class and his weight doesn't stop him from teaching how to run a carbine better. For a man his size, he can still move and can shoot circles around damn near anyone on the planet.

cmace22
05-26-2011, 9:16 AM
I just wrapped up hosting LAV here in KCMO for a carbine class and his weight doesn't stop him from teaching how to run a carbine better. For a man his size, he can still move and can shoot circles around damn near anyone on the planet.

Thank you.

That will shut me up.

Legasat
05-26-2011, 1:28 PM
Regardless of the Marketing hype, or who is doing it, DD makes excellent quality rifles. To me, that was the whole point.

As for Larry, he has had and always will have my respect and gratitude for his service and knowledge.