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View Full Version : Oral test to buy a handgun?


vincnet11
05-08-2011, 10:39 PM
I have an HSC card already, I thought that was the only question test required to buy a handgun, anyway In the gun store I went to an hour ago they made me take an oral test on gun safety stuff prior to the safety demonstration. The last store I went to only asked me to perform the safety demo.

IPSICK
05-08-2011, 10:40 PM
Which dumbass store was this?

ape1nope
05-08-2011, 10:42 PM
Which dumbass store was this?

seriously. a HSC is plenty.

vincnet11
05-08-2011, 10:43 PM
Which dumbass store was this?Target Masters in Milpitas.

louderthangod
05-08-2011, 10:46 PM
Yeah I did that last week. It was easy enough and if you don't know the answer to a question they'll walk you through it. I doubt they'd deny you your gun after you've already paid for it.

NorCal Einstein
05-08-2011, 10:48 PM
I've seen this one latina girl there absolutely DRILL this guy on the parts of the pistol, types of failures, etc.. I couldn't tell if he was buying a gun that day, or was just shopping around...but I could see he was totally intimidated.

As I was reading the first post, I instantly thought "Target Masters".

Drey
05-08-2011, 11:12 PM
That doesnt sound right.

Mr.Caketown
05-08-2011, 11:14 PM
ive never heard of the Oral Test , ive heard of the demonstration but never the Oral Test

baz152
05-08-2011, 11:34 PM
Wow, it sounds like that Latina girl was giving that dude a pretty vigorous oral exam.

ke6guj
05-08-2011, 11:35 PM
probably their way of doing the handgun safety demo.

12071(b)(8)(D) Commencing January 1, 2003, except as authorized by the department, no firearms dealer may deliver a handgun unless the recipient performs a safe handling demonstration with that handgun. The demonstration shall commence with the handgun unloaded and locked with the firearm safety device with which it is required to be delivered, if applicable. While maintaining muzzle awareness, that is, the firearm is pointed in a safe direction, preferably down at the ground, and trigger discipline, that is, the trigger finger is outside of the trigger guard and along side of the handgun frame, at all times, the handgun recipient shall correctly and safely perform the following:
(i) If the handgun is a semiautomatic pistol:
(I) Remove the magazine.
(II) Lock the slide back. If the model of firearm does not allow the slide to be locked back, pull the slide back, visually and physically check the chamber to ensure that it is clear.
(III) Visually and physically inspect the chamber, to ensure that the handgun is unloaded.
(IV) Remove the firearm safety device, if applicable. If the firearm safety device prevents any of the previous steps, remove the firearm safety device during the appropriate step.
(V) Load one bright orange, red, or other readily identifiable dummy round into the magazine. If no readily identifiable dummy round is available, an empty cartridge casing with an empty primer pocket may be used.
(VI) Insert the magazine into the magazine well of the firearm.
(VII) Manipulate the slide release or pull back and release the slide.
(VIII) Remove the magazine.
(IX) Visually inspect the chamber to reveal that a round can be chambered with the magazine removed.
(X) Lock the slide back to eject the bright orange, red, or other readily identifiable dummy round. If the handgun is of a model that does not allow the slide to be locked back, pull the slide back and physically check the chamber to ensure that the chamber is clear. If no readily identifiable dummy round is available, an empty cartridge casing with an empty primer pocket may be used.
(XI) Apply the safety, if applicable.
(XII) Apply the firearm safety device, if applicable. This requirement shall not apply to an Olympic competition pistol if no firearms safety device, other than a cable lock that the department has determined would damage the barrel of the pistol, has been approved for the pistol, and the pistol is either listed in paragraph (2) of subdivision (h) of Section 12132 or is subject to paragraph (3) of subdivision (h) of Section 12132.
(ii) If the handgun is a double-action revolver:
(I) Open the cylinder.
(II) Visually and physically inspect each chamber, to ensure that the revolver is unloaded.
(III) Remove the firearm safety device. If the firearm safety device prevents any of the previous steps, remove the firearm safety device during the appropriate step.
(IV) While maintaining muzzle awareness and trigger discipline, load one bright orange, red, or other readily identifiable dummy round into a chamber of the cylinder and rotate the cylinder so that the round is in the next-to-fire position. If no readily identifiable dummy round is available, an empty cartridge casing with an empty primer pocket may be used.
(V) Close the cylinder.
(VI) Open the cylinder and eject the round.
(VII) Visually and physically inspect each chamber to ensure that the revolver is unloaded.
(VIII) Apply the firearm safety device, if applicable. This requirement shall not apply to an Olympic competition pistol if no firearms safety device, other than a cable lock that the department has determined would damage the barrel of the pistol, has been approved for the pistol, and the pistol is either listed in paragraph (2) of subdivision (h) of Section 12132 or is subject to paragraph (3) of subdivision (h) of Section 12132.
(iii) If the handgun is a single-action revolver:
(I) Open the loading gate.
(II) Visually and physically inspect each chamber, to ensure that the revolver is unloaded.
(III) Remove the firearm safety device required to be sold with the handgun. If the firearm safety device prevents any of the previous steps, remove the firearm safety device during the appropriate step.
(IV) Load one bright orange, red, or other readily identifiable dummy round into a chamber of the cylinder, close the loading gate and rotate the cylinder so that the round is in the next-to-fire position. If no readily identifiable dummy round is available, an empty cartridge casing with an empty primer pocket may be used.
(V) Open the loading gate and unload the revolver.
(VI) Visually and physically inspect each chamber to ensure that the revolver is unloaded.
(VII) Apply the firearm safety device, if applicable. This requirement shall not apply to an Olympic competition pistol if no firearms safety device, other than a cable lock that the department has determined would damage the barrel of the pistol, has been approved for the pistol, and the pistol is either listed in paragraph (2) of subdivision (h) of Section 12132 or is subject to paragraph (3) of subdivision (h) of Section 12132.
(E) The recipient shall receive instruction regarding how to render that handgun safe in the event of a jam.
(F) The firearms dealer shall sign and date an affidavit stating that the requirements of subparagraph (D) have been met. The firearms dealer shall additionally obtain the signature of the handgun purchaser on the same affidavit. The firearms dealer shall retain the original affidavit as proof of compliance with this requirement.
(G) The recipient shall perform the safe handling demonstration for a department certified instructor.

BayAreaShooter
05-08-2011, 11:49 PM
Target Masters in Milpitas.

HAHAHA I knew you were going to say that. Just another reason I will never step foot in that place again. The people talked to me like I was an idiot, they take your information to buy anything in the store and it was the worst/unsafe range I have ever been to.

Fishslayer
05-09-2011, 12:02 AM
I've seen this one latina girl there absolutely DRILL this guy on the parts of the pistol, types of failures, etc.. I couldn't tell if he was buying a gun that day, or was just shopping around...but I could see he was totally intimidated.

As I was reading the first post, I instantly thought "Target Masters".

Was she hot?:cool:

flyingjalapeno
05-09-2011, 12:05 AM
I've been into Target Masters and I know what latina girl you are talking about. She gives you this look, that just says, "What do you want IDIOT!" I am telling myself, man if this is how they treat people here then ill take my business else where. After I got done with the rental and range, turned in all my stuff to some asian guy. Man he was hella nice!!! Asked how the shooting went, how I liked the gun, asked if I had questions. He even gave me some advise on what other guns i should try out. I was like, wow this dude is awesome. It's hit and miss in there especially when its busy, Since I don't have a day job I am going to trying going in the day to see how it is. I got my HSC card like 2 weeks ago there and no oral. Not sure if that was good or bad...depending on who was giving the oral. LOL :biggrinjester:

llamatrnr
05-09-2011, 12:34 AM
Maybe we can ask Neil to give the hot Latina an "oral test";)

Ranger20
05-09-2011, 12:45 AM
I did a PPT trade in there less than a month ago it was labor intensive..2 hours for what takes 30 min anywhere else Ive done the same thing. They were very nice people I didn't have any issues with them.. The oral test is 2min ok Not a big deal... The paperwork is intense.. I felt bad for what their bosses make em do. I think the 3 second lag time between shots at the range is a bit much... I wouldn't shoot there.

I also thought it intrusive for me to give them my personal info to buy a couple of j frame speed loaders.. with cash.. No people issues since I'm an hour and a half away and I'm not selling guns or buying PPT. it should be the last time I go in there... I will say that if you want to rent a gun to try out they have a lot of them and offer up an opportunity to shoot something before you buy like no other place I've seen.

evil tyler durden
05-09-2011, 12:55 AM
FYI that gun shop is owned and run by the Brady Campaign, & the Retard Arnold Schwarzenegger.

IPSICK
05-09-2011, 1:34 AM
Not surprising. At least tell me you got a great deal. Last time I set foot in there, their prices were sky high. Too many mishaps at their range for me to really ever want to set foot in there, unless I really wanted to shoot late at night.

jbe90
05-09-2011, 1:35 AM
Haha!I knew it's gonna be Target Masters just by the title of the thread alone.

vincnet11
05-09-2011, 1:39 AM
Not surprising. At least tell me you got a great deal. Last time I set foot in there, their prices were sky high. Too many mishaps at their range for me to really ever want to set foot in there, unless I really wanted to shoot late at night.I got the Sig P229 for $786 only $21 more than bud's gun shop not bad considering most Bay Area gun shops start at around $850 with their Sig 226/9.

well206
05-09-2011, 5:57 AM
No oral test when getting HSC. The questions they ask you to answer at Target Masters is during the safe handling demonstration. They ask a couple questions about malfunctions and the four (or six?) basic safety rules. Not a big deal.

Saying that the shop is run by the Brady campaign is off. There are some decent salesman there. I don't think anyone has failed the safety demonstration test there (never heard of anyone at least, or at least not at any higher rate than other places). At least they follow the law regarding safety demonstration in the way they see they should (versus some places that just have people sign the safety demonstration affidavit with no instruction at all).

Target Masters has provided many people an opportunity to try guns, without having to know other gun owners. This has led to many people wanting their own firearms, and exercising their 2A rights.

Ok... this is getting long. Hehe... they are not perfect, obviously, to anyone who had been there. But are decent and honest in providing a service, with good prices too.

Soldier415
05-09-2011, 7:10 AM
Torn on this one. More discussion of safety is never really a bad thing.

Oceanbob
05-09-2011, 9:12 AM
Wow, it sounds like that Latina girl was giving that dude a pretty vigorous oral exam.

Vigorous is best....as long as she doesn't STARE at me while she's conducting the 'exam'.

:43:

NorCal Einstein
05-09-2011, 9:56 AM
I've been into Target Masters and I know what latina girl you are talking about. She gives you this look, that just says, "What do you want IDIOT!" I am telling myself, man if this is how they treat people here then ill take my business else where. After I got done with the rental and range, turned in all my stuff to some asian guy. Man he was hella nice!!! Asked how the shooting went, how I liked the gun, asked if I had questions. He even gave me some advise on what other guns i should try out. I was like, wow this dude is awesome. It's hit and miss in there especially when its busy, Since I don't have a day job I am going to trying going in the day to see how it is. I got my HSC card like 2 weeks ago there and no oral. Not sure if that was good or bad...depending on who was giving the oral. LOL :biggrinjester:

Yup. Her and a few other employees there are just downright rude. I'll give it to them when I know they deal with idiots on an almost daily basis because of the crowd that rolls through TMW, but I don't think that gives you the right to toss hospitality out the window and just treat everyone like ****.

On the flip side, there are some good employees there too just like you said. I have noticed that younger asian guy is nice to everyone there, and there are 1-2 others who actually convey the feeling that they want to work there.

I'm probably done heading to TMW though, even if it was out of desperation. Last trip I was there, I got a lane in the long bays, where it was only myself and 1 other shooter. Within 30 minutes, I had a hard time breathing due to poor ventilation and ended up feeling crappy for the next 3 days or so. When 2 shooters in a 6-7 lane bay can output more than the ventilation system can handle, you know that's bad news.

Kodemonkey
05-09-2011, 10:04 AM
Safe Handling Demonstration. It takes like 3 minutes. And honestly, I've seen people that if they weren't walked through it they would have probably shot themselves. I saw an older gentlemen that should have known better rack the slide 3 times with his finger on the trigger. Each time the salesperson told him;"once again, please take your finger off the trigger when cycling the action."

I think the HSC is a joke, and would rather see it go away before the safe handling test. Only twice have I NOT had to go through the test. Once was when the guy handed me the gun I immediately chamber and mag checked the gun while pointed away from anyone. The other time was from a place where I personally know the manager, knows that I have been to frontsight, and knows I have purchased 4 handguns and a rifle from him in the past 6 months.

mossy
05-09-2011, 11:07 AM
I have an HSC card already, I thought that was the only question test required to buy a handgun, anyway In the gun store I went to an hour ago they made me take an oral test on gun safety stuff prior to the safety demonstration. The last store I went to only asked me to perform the safety demo.

i bet you were in target masters........ when i bought my bersa thunder this fat cow of a woman gave me the most as$ backwards safty test ever and then talked down to me becaus i did not answer the questions to her liking, she also ran me a line of BS about how i have to buy a lock at the same time i buy the gun.... hate the store but love the price on some of the used guns.

Flintlock Tom
05-09-2011, 11:27 AM
I noticed in the description of the safe handling test above, this statement appears a couple times:
"Remove the firearm safety device required to be sold with the handgun."
Since when is a "firearm safety device required to be sold with the handgun"?
I thought you only had to prove that you had purchased one within the last 30 days.

Merc1138
05-09-2011, 11:39 AM
i bet you were in target masters........ when i bought my bersa thunder this fat cow of a woman gave me the most as$ backwards safty test ever and then talked down to me becaus i did not answer the questions to her liking, she also ran me a line of BS about how i have to buy a lock at the same time i buy the gun.... hate the store but love the price on some of the used guns.

Uhhh, the used guns at targetmasters have got to be one of the worst things about that place. They're the range guns they've taken out of service for one reason or another. You know, the range guns they clean maybe once a month and people beat the hell out of. They're loose, rattle in ways they're not supposed to, barrels are worn out, sometimes they've had recoil springs changed but not always. The savings you're getting is nullified by the amount of money you need to spend to get them back in proper order, and I'm not talking about something cosmetic like the finish.

And yes, targetmasters treats their safe handling demonstration like an oral exam. Any other time I've ever bought a handgun or been with anyone else that has at another shop I've never seen a need for a safe handling demonstration because the people I know and myself demonstrate safe handling when we drop the mag, check the chamber, keep it in a safe direction, etc.

NorCal Einstein
05-09-2011, 11:55 AM
Well, they also inform everyone that it's a felony to have loaded magazines/ammo in the same container as your unloaded firearm when transporting. FUD.

Z_SprizL
05-09-2011, 12:12 PM
Since when is a "firearm safety device required to be sold with the handgun"?
I thought you only had to prove that you had purchased one within the last 30 days.

My Walther P99 came with a Master cable lock @ no extra cost to me.

Hopalong
05-09-2011, 12:24 PM
I've never had to pass an oral test, and I've purchased pistols recently.

I've got an idea for a good oral test though.

Gun shop employee: "Would you like to buy a gun?"

Me: "Yes"

Gun shop employee: "Do you have a "HSC?"

Me: "Yes" (shows it)

Gun shop employee: "you pass the oral test, what would you like?"

sequoia_nomad
05-09-2011, 12:51 PM
It just never ends in this state. :mad:

flyingjalapeno
05-09-2011, 12:57 PM
I've never had to pass an oral test, and I've purchased pistols recently.

I've got an idea for a good oral test though.

Gun shop employee: "Would you like to buy a gun?"

Me: "Yes"

Gun shop employee: "Do you have a "HSC?"

Me: "Yes" (shows it)

Gun shop employee: "you pass the oral test, what would you like?"

:rockon:

BayAreaShooter
05-09-2011, 2:36 PM
It just never ends in this state. :mad:

While California laws suck crap gun shops put the icing on the cake.

beretta929mm
05-09-2011, 2:42 PM
Yup, Target Master it is. I have bee orally tested quite a few times there. It is fun to watch others' reactions when you knowl all the answers. Makes one feel like a mall ninja, I mean... a pro. LOL

sigfan91
05-09-2011, 4:57 PM
(III) Visually and physically inspect the chamber, to ensure that the handgun is unloaded.

Do I have to "visually and physically inspect the chamber" if this pistol has a "loaded chamber indicator?"

If so, why bother mandating pistols to have one in the first place?

Skunk2Racer
05-09-2011, 5:00 PM
Because not all of us are smart enough to tell if a round is chambered. That's why we have"Negligent Discharges". Lmao

Just-in
05-09-2011, 5:08 PM
Uhhh, the used guns at targetmasters have got to be one of the worst things about that place. They're the range guns they've taken out of service for one reason or another. You know, the range guns they clean maybe once a month and people beat the hell out of. They're loose, rattle in ways they're not supposed to, barrels are worn out, sometimes they've had recoil springs changed but not always. The savings you're getting is nullified by the amount of money you need to spend to get them back in proper order, and I'm not talking about something cosmetic like the finish..

Meh It's hit or miss Some are consignments I bought a G27 there a while back that was good to go. You do need to be careful though. The oral test is a PITA and having to fill out that tracker for any purchase. Thats why I only purchase items if I'm there shooting anyway, and I love the place but will never do a PPT there. Buying a gun from them takes a long time I can't imagine how long for a ppt lol

That chick just has issue and one the range master with the handlebars can be rude. Other than that the only thing I notice is many of them just seem fed up not intentionally rude but they seem worn out which is understandable.

Do they give a test for long guns to? I know they stop carrying them and I'm interested in one they have left on the shelf...

bline01
05-09-2011, 5:10 PM
haha read the title wrong...must see a dentist before we start the dros, sorry!

cmichini
05-09-2011, 5:14 PM
Torn on this one. More discussion of safety is never really a bad thing.

From a reliable, knowledgable source, no not so bad. From a documented FUDtard as a requesite in excess of what's already excessively mandated by law - BARF.

I'm so glad a I moved away from the HSC, the roster, and all the other baloney. I'm just waiting until I get my NC drivers license, etc. I'm going to go into a shop, buy a pistol, and go home with it. I don't need any more, but just want to feel like I'm an American citizen, living in America again.

RenegadeRebel
05-09-2011, 5:31 PM
So...No one answered the question...Is the Latin girl hot??
:useless:

Merc1138
05-09-2011, 5:34 PM
Meh It's hit or miss Some are consignments I bought a G27 there a while back that was good to go. You do need to be careful though. The oral test is a PITA and having to fill out that tracker for any purchase. Thats why I only purchase items if I'm there shooting anyway, and I love the place but will never do a PPT there. Buying a gun from them takes a long time I can't imagine how long for a ppt lol

That chick just has issue and one the range master with the handlebars can be rude. Other than that the only thing I notice is many of them just seem fed up not intentionally rude but they seem worn out which is understandable.

Do they give a test for long guns to? I know they stop carrying them and I'm interested in one they have left on the shelf...

I've never purchased a long gun from there, so I wouldn't know(and I wouldn't be surprised if they did). However from experience a PPT and HSC took me roughly 90 minutes(and I spent maybe 90 seconds taking the HSC, but doing it so quickly without any errors blew their minds so they had to sit and yap about it with the other employees while "grading" it, so that took up 5 minutes of my time), and pickup of that PPT took me around 30-45 minutes.

Kodemonkey
05-09-2011, 6:27 PM
Do I have to "visually and physically inspect the chamber" if this pistol has a "loaded chamber indicator?"

If so, why bother mandating pistols to have one in the first place?

Anything mechanical can break, so I say yes. The way I see it relying on a loaded chamber indicator is just asking for a negligent discharge.

At some point someone is going to have one that is failed and has an ND. And someone will sue the state and probably lose, but will tie up our courts and cost taxpayers money.

Just-in
05-09-2011, 8:22 PM
[QUOTE=RenegadeRebel;6364533]So...No one answered the question...Is the Latin girl hot??

Meh, I've seen better in the bays during happy hour. Attitude kills the package.

flyingjalapeno
05-09-2011, 10:33 PM
So...No one answered the question...Is the Latin girl hot??
:useless:

She is not, I could have swore I saw some make up covering her teardrop tattoo.

gobi fish
05-10-2011, 6:42 AM
I have an HSC card already, I thought that was the only question test required to buy a handgun, anyway In the gun store I went to an hour ago they made me take an oral test on gun safety stuff prior to the safety demonstration. The last store I went to only asked me to perform the safety demo.

I got an oral test for you baby, now get on your knees and open that purdy mouth of yours!

coyotebait
05-10-2011, 7:21 AM
Additional safety is good. If they want to give me safety pointers from QUALIFIED personnel, then go for it. But, some gun store sales flunky quizzing ME? That's a no go. Whether the test will deny me the gun or not, I believe is irrelevant, the state is throwing enough roadblocks and hurdles in our path, we don't need these gun stores adding to it. Just my opinion.