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derwiking
05-07-2011, 12:27 PM
I have a very disappointing story today.

I have been searching for some time for a decent subcompact for a CCW/Vehicular LCC weapon. I was thinking a Springfield XD Compact .45 ACP but being a 1911 guy I was always leaning towards the 1911. As much as I want to go out and grab a Kimber Ultra Carry, I much rather would have something more simple and functional for half of the cost (XD or similarly priced).

I happen to be on business in North Carolina and came upon a shop which had the perfect compromise, a High-Standard Crusader Compact 3.5" bbl which I was offered an outstanding price on (low $400's). Much to my dismay it is not roster approved. Damn CA. The dealer was even willing to transfer it to my local FFL in CA, what a rubbish situation. :mad:

Does any one have any suggestions for something comparable and decent with out going on the high end and looking at a Kimber or Springfield EMP? Now seeing that there are micro-1911s decently priced, albeit near milspec, I am intrigued and ready to throw the XD idea out the window.

Thanks in advance.

FUBAR
05-07-2011, 12:34 PM
How about a SA EMP. I know its a 9mm but it would be alot more controllable.

707electrician
05-07-2011, 12:44 PM
Does any one have any suggestions for something comparable and decent with out going on the high end and looking at a Kimber or Springfield EMP?

How about a SA EMP. I know its a 9mm but it would be alot more controllable.

:confused:

1lostinspace
05-07-2011, 12:46 PM
Do it right get a Glock 30

derwiking
05-07-2011, 1:03 PM
OK, now I am just plain confused. Over looking the Roster list I see that there are no longer any RIA models listed either. I have seen RIA 1911's for sale before (and recently, also not used which obviously would be an exemption) in CA and I am wondering if the public DOJ list is not complete possibly?

http://certguns.doj.ca.gov/

That is the DOJ roster I am viewing, and see nothing for High-Standard or RIA. Can any one clarify this for me?

redcliff
05-07-2011, 1:25 PM
OK, now I am just plain confused. Over looking the Roster list I see that there are no longer any RIA models listed either. I have seen RIA 1911's for sale before (and recently, also not used which obviously would be an exemption) in CA and I am wondering if the public DOJ list is not complete possibly?

http://certguns.doj.ca.gov/

That is the DOJ roster I am viewing, and see nothing for High-Standard or RIA. Can any one clarify this for me?

It looks like the put all of the RIA under "Armscor Precision" now.

SA227driver
05-07-2011, 1:28 PM
Glock 30/36, Colt Commander

derwiking
05-07-2011, 1:33 PM
Good find Redcliff. Looking into it now if perhaps any of the High-Standards were sub grouped in the same fashion.

MossbergMan
05-07-2011, 1:34 PM
You want a low end gun to risk your life on? Is that what I'm reading here. You are not worth premium equipment? You are not going to find a "good, compact 1911" for a bargain price. There's a thing in the industry referred to as the the "bikini factor", meaning the smaller it is the more it costs (ask any woman about this).
Kimber, Colt, Springfield are making excellent compact and sub-compact firearms in the 1911 model. I understand budgets, but save a little longer and get a "first tier" manufacturer. Save the bargain basement guns for range fodder. There if they fail there it's no big deal.
Of course there's that nasty confiscation factor to consider if you are carrying in a less than legal way. But if you're carrying legally, do yourself a favor and stop squeezing the Washingtons so hard ( I can hear him squealing from here). Buy top quality, not lowest bidder crap. Aren't you worth it?
And no, I don't sell guns. I do train people and the crap some people depend on to save their lives is incredible. The term "Jam-o-matics" comes to mind, RG Rohns"may-pops", and in one case a 1903 Colt pocket pistol (made in 1921) that has never been field stripped for cleaning and malfunctions about every two rounds or so. I will never understand some people.
Good luck in your quest. BTW.. I carry a Glock 27 and in the 1911s a Springfield EMP 9mm.

WILDMAN442
05-07-2011, 2:02 PM
I agree with the above poster. I know it will hurt the wallet but buy once and cry once man.

OR

Buy a sub compact M&P. Thats my personal choice.

Justin

fonzy
05-07-2011, 3:33 PM
RIA has the compact for under $500 and it's CA legal. I know that PRK guns and The Range both in Fresno currently has them in stock.

Sunday
05-07-2011, 6:11 PM
A quality 1911 is toooooo expensive for a CCW gun. A Glock ,XD,M@P you can count on them working and aren't expensive. I love 1911s more that can be imagined, but there are better choices . Not that a real nice Wilson Combat couldn't be used for self defense but plastic is king for a beater and a ccw gun is beater duty...

707electrician
05-07-2011, 6:22 PM
A quality 1911 is toooooo expensive for a CCW gun. A Glock ,XD,M@P you can count on them working and aren't expensive. I love 1911s more that can be imagined, but there are better choices . Not that a real nice Wilson Combat couldn't be used for self defense but plastic is king for a beater and a ccw gun is beater duty...

Nah, a gun is a gun. If its not going to get use you might as well just buy a photograph of it and hang it on the wall

ILVSMOG
05-07-2011, 7:31 PM
I've got a compact RIA 1911 that I use as a CCW pistol and I love it. People knock on RIA because they're inexpensive, but I've found no faults with mine at all. In fact, it shoots nearly as well as my other, FAR more expensive, custom 1911. I've never had any feeding or ejection problems with it. I've made a few minor modifications (grips, safety, trigger, etc.) but I've still got under $700 in it and it's an awesome gun. I'm actually thinking about another RIA in 38 Super as a project gun. I'm considering a Bobtail and some other mods I don't want to try on an "expensive" gun.

derwiking
05-07-2011, 8:14 PM
Thanks for the input guys. I appreciate it.

I think I may be looking into a RIA compact when I return. If not, I may go the XD route after all. Again, I appreciate the input.

Carry on.

carnelianbay
05-07-2011, 9:52 PM
Buying an entry level or low cost 1911 is one thing. Buying a low cost subcompact 1911 is much more risky. If you review sites such as 1911forum.com you’ll find countless threads on sub 4” barrel 1911’s. I have a subcompact and it took some time to get to be reliable to where I’d trust it as an EDC (about 2 yrs). It was very frustrating to spend over $1250 only to have premature slide locks and FTF’s on the last rnd in the mag. In the end it required WC 47OX mags, a polished feed ramp, and an Ed Brown Hardcore Slide Stop, plus a lot of high cost PD ammo to find the stuff it liked. This was after the original mfgr had sent me new mags and two different “modified” slide stops over a one year period.

As stated by a few others, don’t skimp on the $’s for a 1911. I’ll add to that: “especially for a sub compact 1911”.

Just my $0.02

762.DEFENSE
05-07-2011, 10:53 PM
http://sssli.com/images/Glock-30%5B1%5D.jpg
;)

mugiwara
05-08-2011, 4:38 AM
http://metroarms.net/

really well made, lots of models, low $400's.

Q619
05-08-2011, 4:46 AM
I don't know about betting my life on a RIA....they're perfectly fine in the capacity of a range gun for someone just looking to get a bottom of the barrel priced 1911....but for CCW? I'd either carry one of my proven govt 1911's, a Glock 36 or a S&W .357 J frame depending on what I'm wearing. No gambling with a defensive weapon.

707electrician
05-08-2011, 7:21 AM
http://metroarms.net/

really well made, lots of models, low $400's.

Where are you seeing their prices? They have some nice looking guns. Too bad none of them are on roster

Ranger20
05-08-2011, 7:41 AM
You want a low end gun to risk your life on? Is that what I'm reading here. You are not worth premium equipment? You are not going to find a "good, compact 1911" for a bargain price. There's a thing in the industry referred to as the the "bikini factor", meaning the smaller it is the more it costs (ask any woman about this).
Kimber, Colt, Springfield are making excellent compact and sub-compact firearms in the 1911 model. I understand budgets, but save a little longer and get a "first tier" manufacturer. Save the bargain basement guns for range fodder. There if they fail there it's no big deal.
Of course there's that nasty confiscation factor to consider if you are carrying in a less than legal way. But if you're carrying legally, do yourself a favor and stop squeezing the Washingtons so hard ( I can hear him squealing from here). Buy top quality, not lowest bidder crap. Aren't you worth it?
And no, I don't sell guns. I do train people and the crap some people depend on to save their lives is incredible. The term "Jam-o-matics" comes to mind, RG Rohns"may-pops", and in one case a 1903 Colt pocket pistol (made in 1921) that has never been field stripped for cleaning and malfunctions about every two rounds or so. I will never understand some people.
Good luck in your quest. BTW.. I carry a Glock 27 and in the 1911s a Springfield EMP 9mm.

This... is excellent..

And this is my Choice in a small 45acp KIMBER RCP. Traded a like new W.German PPKS and a new Glock23 with Warren Tac. Sites to get it. I'm worth it.. :)

ILVSMOG
05-08-2011, 4:04 PM
I don't know why people get hung up on the price of the RIA. They work. They've been proven over and over again to work. Mine goes bang every time I press the trigger, just like my $1800+ custom 5" gun. I'm not saying I'd take one (RIA or anything, for that matter) out of the box, load and holster it and call it good, but when something has been gone through and proven to work, who really cares how expensive (or inexpensive) it is??? I, for one, am not trying to impress anyone with a rollmark or how much money I can spend on a gun. I just want what works and my RIA Compact works.

I don't know about betting my life on a RIA....they're perfectly fine in the capacity of a range gun for someone just looking to get a bottom of the barrel priced 1911....but for CCW? I'd either carry one of my proven govt 1911's, a Glock 36 or a S&W .357 J frame depending on what I'm wearing. No gambling with a defensive weapon.

Q619
05-08-2011, 4:41 PM
I don't know why people get hung up on the price of the RIA. They work. They've been proven over and over again to work. Mine goes bang every time I press the trigger, just like my $1800+ custom 5" gun. I'm not saying I'd take one (RIA or anything, for that matter) out of the box, load and holster it and call it good, but when something has been gone through and proven to work, who really cares how expensive (or inexpensive) it is??? I, for one, am not trying to impress anyone with a rollmark or how much money I can spend on a gun. I just want what works and my RIA Compact works.

I'm not at all hung up on cost. I have no problem with carrying a Glock. They're of high quality materials and in my experience, function extremely well. It's indisputable that RIA's use lower quality materials and have less attention in their fitting than your $1800 1911, and the parts in a Glock are of better quality. That being said, MY OPINION is such that I would not carry one. There's nothing wrong with RIA in certain capacities IMO. There's just certain things I shoot for quality with when shopping around.

In certain things, quality is less crucial than in others. I can tell you this: I don't buy bargain brand rope when I go rock climbing/rappelling. How dumb would I feel in my last seconds of life if I did so and it gave :p

You have a top shelf quality gun in your safe but would rather carry something of a lesser degree of quality? Hey, if that's your choice I respect that. I however would do the opposite.

jessegpresley
05-08-2011, 5:52 PM
I'm a "1911 Guy" too, but there's no way I'd carry what is basically a RIA Philippine made micro 1911 as a CCW weapon, that's just silly. Sub 4.25" 1911s are famous for being finicky, and as for budget priced 1911s made in the Philippines... they're not exactly the swiss watch of the gun world. You have a ton of tupperware choices that would make more sense. Kahr, M&P, Glock, P2000SK, etc.

ILVSMOG
05-08-2011, 7:39 PM
I respect you guys' opinions, but my personal experience with the compact RIA has led me to trust it. I have not only gone through the weapon and added several reliability upgrades (springs, tuned trigger, extractor, mags) but I have over 1k rounds through it and NO FAILURES since I found out which mags it likes early on (Mec-Gar) I don't carry my high-dollar 1911 because I don't want to tear it up. Example: the wife and I just bought a new house. Today I was stripping and refinishing cabinets. I managed to drip wood stain all over myself, including my pistol. If I had been carrying my custom pistol, I'd have freaked out. Since it was my RIA, I just kept working. To me, my custom gun is a work or art, the RIA is a tool. They both do the same thing, nearly the same way. I view and treat them completely differently.

This is one of those issues, like gas-piston vs. DI in the AR world, that will always be a point of contention, but my personal experience with the RIAs has been a positive one and I have no hesitation about carrying one on a daily basis. If someone has personal experience with them that is poor, I'd love to hear about it.