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View Full Version : 308 machine gun brass ID?


shonc99
11-17-2006, 8:16 AM
I see specials on midwayusa for once fired 308 brass that "may" have been fired from a beltfed machingun. Aside from the sizing issues with the large/ small base die;

1. Can you visually check if the brass was fired in a machine gun or do you need calipers to measure?

and,

2. What with respect to the brass is different if it was fired in a machine gun, what are you looking for or measuring?

Fjold
11-17-2006, 8:36 AM
The easiest thing to see is that the brass is usually marked up by the links on the belt. Look in the middle of the body for scratches running perpendicular to the bore.

ocabj
11-17-2006, 8:42 AM
Machine gun fired brass is less desireable because the chambers are loose in order to have reliable feeding. This results in brass that's expanded quite a bit more than it usually would be in most any commercial firearm.

Use a small base die to resize the brass. Use them just a few times and throw in the scrap brass bucket.

shonc99
11-17-2006, 10:54 AM
Machine gun fired brass is less desireable because the chambers are loose in order to have reliable feeding. This results in brass that's expanded quite a bit more than it usually would be in most any commercial firearm.

Use a small base die to resize the brass. Use them just a few times and throw in the scrap brass bucket.


Thanks but....

My question is how to ID them and if you can visually see it or if you need calipers to measure.

ocabj
11-17-2006, 11:01 AM
Honestly, you really can't. I do not know of any measurements for 5.56 or 7.62 brass that would tell you if the fired case was fired out of a machine gun (or otherwise 'extra' loose chamber).

Reputable places like GI Brass will indicate if the brass was likely machine gun fired. Fjold's recommendation to look for the belt scratches is probably the only way. But even then, I've seen some known machine gun fired .223/5.56 brass (out of SAW) that was processed, and I couldn't tell that it was machine gun fired.

ocabj
11-17-2006, 11:13 AM
Oh, if you're looking for cheaper .308 brass, check out http://www.patsreloading.com since they have a deal on some unfired military 308 brass:

308 REMINGTON MILITARY UNFIRED WAS RUN ON MACHINE THAT DETONATED THE PRIMER THEN DECAPPED, also the type without fired primer hole, same price, 500-$54.99, 1000-$99.99

Not exactly sure what the description means, but it looks like the ammo was rejected because of faulty primers, so they pulled the ammo down. Give Pat's Reloading a call or email. They're good to deal with. Fair on shipping, too.

ivanimal
11-17-2006, 11:46 AM
Oh, if you're looking for cheaper .308 brass, check out http://www.patsreloading.com since they have a deal on some unfired military 308 brass:



Not exactly sure what the description means, but it looks like the ammo was rejected because of faulty primers, so they pulled the ammo down. Give Pat's Reloading a call or email. They're good to deal with. Fair on shipping, too.


No, they pull the bullet, empty the powder, then use a machine to fire the primer then decap. Therefore no case expansion.

shonc99
11-17-2006, 1:57 PM
Thanks for the link and the info

Whitesmoke
11-18-2006, 12:07 AM
This is just my opinion....but any commercially available fired LC (Lake City) 308 brass that is not marked MATCH is probably Machine gun fired. The US military only has 3 commonly used 308 weapons...the M60 machine gun and the sniper rifles (which only usually use 308 LC match ammo). Also the scoped M14 DMR's...which I would guess use the match ammo.

dw1784
11-18-2006, 12:35 AM
I've read on arf.com that u can tell by the extractor marks, that M60's are hard on the rim?

1SGMAT
11-19-2006, 7:55 PM
Whitesmoke and dw1784 are on it with accurate comments.

shonc99
11-20-2006, 7:20 AM
This is just my opinion....but any commercially available fired LC (Lake City) 308 brass that is not marked MATCH is probably Machine gun fired. The US military only has 3 commonly used 308 weapons...the M60 machine gun and the sniper rifles (which only usually use 308 LC match ammo). Also the scoped M14 DMR's...which I would guess use the match ammo.

Being Navy, I know the M-14 (non scoped) is used with non match LC on stripper clips and bandoleers. From a history channel program I learned the M-14 had a very short service life although the Navy still uses it (mostly on ships)

I was hoping to find a way to check the brass before loading it or selling it off.

Can anyone tell me the basic firing sequence of the M-60 which would explain HOW the brass is distorted? (My guess is that it is being extracted as the pressure is still high allowing the base to expand as the case is being extracted.) Am I close?

ltmcarlson
09-12-2009, 10:07 PM
Not true that the mil only uses .308 for M60 or M-14. The Dillon M134D is widely used as is the .308 GE version, the M240 (which replaced the M60) as well as the Mk.48 (.308 version of the M249). I am sure that I am missing a few others but the .308 round is popular. No way to know what .308 was fired from, belt screeches as listed above is the most reliable way to tell if it was fired from a belt fed weapon.

FLIGHT762
09-13-2009, 7:35 AM
I've used a Dillon or Wilson 308 Winchester case gauge to check M.G. fired cases. If the case was fired in a bolt gun, they usually drop right down pretty flush into the gauge. If they were M.G. fired,they drop in and stop about 3/4 of the way in.

http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/9/pid/25547/catid/3/Dillon_Rifle_Case_Gages

Sunwolf
09-13-2009, 7:39 AM
Exactamundo.

ar15barrels
09-13-2009, 1:12 PM
Oh, if you're looking for cheaper .308 brass, check out http://www.patsreloading.com since they have a deal on some unfired military 308 brass

I hate necroposters.
I just saw this thread and the quote from Pats and I was like WOW, I think I'll try some of that brass.
Of course it's no longer listed on their site...

shonc99
09-14-2009, 9:37 AM
I hate necroposters.
I just saw this thread and the quote from Pats and I was like WOW, I think I'll try some of that brass.
Of course it's no longer listed on their site...


Seriously, I forgot I even started this thread. I wish I could delete my own threads sometimes.