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jm838
04-18-2011, 12:07 AM
I know this has been talked about, and it may seem to some to be old news, but I am not up to date with what is happening concerning ATF and the importation of saiga 12 shotguns. I was screwing around on the internet today and ended up on gunbroker, where I noticed that these shotguns were a bit overpriced (considering they could be had for $500 a few months ago). Is this just unfounded panic setting in, or did ATF say something about the saiga specifically? As I recall they never actually declared any intention to ban the Saiga 12, and the only source that people seem to cite is a single website, http://blog.princelaw.com/2011/1/20/atf-to-issue-new-ruling-on-monday-regarding-new-restrictions-on-shotgun-importation. All the information I could find was a few months old. Any updates?

Droc101
04-18-2011, 12:22 AM
We just sold a Saiga 12 in the shop. We haven't heard of any ban as of yet, and the only bills i have seen tossed around as of late are the handgun ammo definiton bill (heard about from NRA newsletter) and long gun registration (which i heard about here and I think it died, confirmation?)

rromeo
04-18-2011, 12:28 AM
ATF mentioned a shotgun import study and everybody is panicking.

Apocalypsenerd
04-18-2011, 12:32 AM
I'm pretty sure that the best thing the Obama administration can do to boost the economy is talk about gun control in one form or another.

jm838
04-18-2011, 1:36 AM
I'm pretty sure that the best thing the Obama administration can do to boost the economy is talk about gun control in one form or another.

True that. It worked great for the ammunition manufacturers.

Rob454
04-18-2011, 6:10 AM
Gun prices are a little like gas prices. They spike up and go back down eventually. They just never go down as far as they did before. So those 500$ saiga prices? You can pretty much wave it bye bye. It will be the same as me saying I remember when I bought my SKS for 59$. Never gonna see that again.
Either way panic buying a saiga is no different than when Obama took office panic buying or the ammo ban panic buying. I remember a buddy offering me 25$ for a box of 50 WWB ammo. I didnt take it but he was that desperate. Now? he has enough ammo to start a small war. People freak out and drive prices up. I would say get used to it inthe coming days. prices will be driven up on a lot of things.

AJAX22
04-18-2011, 7:09 AM
Raa has been unable to obtain approval to import new s12's since the study was released.

They are not expressly denying them but they are sitting on the applications.

JagerTroop
04-18-2011, 7:42 AM
Raa has been unable to obtain approval to import new s12's since the study was released.

They are not expressly denying them but they are sitting on the applications.

True. To the best of my knowledge, no S12s have been imported since January. Supply goes down, price goes up. That's just the way it goes.

unusedusername
04-18-2011, 12:55 PM
Did anyone else see the $2500 converted Saiga 12 at the cow palace gun show last weekend?

I wonder if it sold....

stix213
04-18-2011, 12:57 PM
Did anyone else see the $2500 converted Saiga 12 at the cow palace gun show last weekend?

I wonder if it sold....

Gold plated or something?

glockfu
04-18-2011, 1:32 PM
Nope... just ridiculously over priced

So they are still coming in then? And who is Raa?

Agro
04-18-2011, 1:42 PM
Nope... just ridiculously over priced

So they are still coming in then? And who is Raa?

1. no
2. Russian American Armory (importer)

safewaysecurity
04-18-2011, 1:44 PM
Wait till May 1st

Agro
04-18-2011, 1:45 PM
Wait till May 1st
I heard they will be here in....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V17duGlHEYY

chaseface
04-18-2011, 1:46 PM
True. To the best of my knowledge, no S12s have been imported since January. Supply goes down, price goes up. That's just the way it goes.

There has been a couple shipment since january, but the Form 6's were approved before the study started and just hadnt been imported yet. Thats how my GF ordered an S12 a few weeks ago.

Super Spy
04-18-2011, 2:09 PM
I'm not going to panic buy, the S-12 was on my list, when the prices get reasonable again, I'll pick one up. For the amount they are selling for I can get a much better gun, and a mag locked Saiga just isn't that compelling.

chaseface
04-18-2011, 2:48 PM
I'm not going to panic buy, the S-12 was on my list, when the prices get reasonable again, I'll pick one up. For the amount they are selling for I can get a much better gun, and a mag locked Saiga just isn't that compelling.

$850 is a lot of money definitely, but i've spent more on guns I like less. It just depends what its worth TO YOU. To me I would spend the money because its worth it to me, but i've already got one that I got for $550. A shotgun capable of taking 20 round drum mags (out of state or when we beat the ban) thats super fun and can throw massive ammounts of lead downrange real quick. And you can get pretty quick with the mag changes.

I like what the platform is capable of. You can keep it stock, add a pistol grip, put wood AK furniture on it, throw a quadrail on it with H & K sights, or a scope, muzzle break/door breacher, different chokes, forward pistol grip... the options are endless you can be as traditional or tacticool as you want.

jm838
04-18-2011, 2:56 PM
Raa has been unable to obtain approval to import new s12's since the study was released.

They are not expressly denying them but they are sitting on the applications.

Now THIS is some new information. It's also some pretty disturbing information :(

Zachs300zx
04-18-2011, 3:13 PM
Did anyone else see the $2500 converted Saiga 12 at the cow palace gun show last weekend?

I wonder if it sold....

It didn't sell. The Un-converted one was $1400! I don't think he really wants to sell them. But it was the only one I saw at the show.

nicki
04-18-2011, 3:29 PM
The SAIGA 12 presents a major problem for the ATF.

Other than the detachable magazine, the SAIGA 12 is no different than many other sporting shotguns.

The fact is SAIGA 12s are already being modified with US Parts so if SAIGA had to make the guns with a non detachable magazine, it wouldn't be much to convert them back.

Hell, they just might make them "Single Shot" and let us fix the rest.

All they would have to do is put in a floor plate, leave out the mag release and it would be done.

Another option would be not to put a piston in the gas system and sell it as a "Bolt Action" shotgun.

Of course they could just set up manufacturing here in the US and then the import issue would just go away.

Does anyone have any idea how many SAIGA 12s have been imported into this country?

Yes I got mine and I will be tweeking it so that it will become trully a EBS.
Mine isn't a "Safe Queen", when I shoot it I'd be happy to let you guys try a few rounds.

Nicki

hefedehefe
04-18-2011, 3:38 PM
I LOVE my Saiga 12 :D

Agro
04-18-2011, 10:28 PM
I LOVE my Saiga 12 :D

Me too! I paid $629 for it + the hundreds I spent to convert it the way I wanted (and I'm still not done), but I love shooting it.

http://www.farturator.com/amg/saiga12/saiga12_1.jpg

ivsamhell
04-18-2011, 10:51 PM
the study

http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/012611-study-on-importality-of-certain-shotguns.pdf

Ubermcoupe
04-19-2011, 9:01 AM
...the only source that people seem to cite is a single website, blog[/SIZE].princelaw.com/2011/1/20/atf-to-issue-new-ruling-on-monday-regarding-new-restrictions-on-shotgun-importation (http://[SIZE="7). All the information I could find ...

Blogs are still just opinions and not necessarily a valid resource. Critical thinking tells me this is not a reputable source for information. :D

JagerTroop
04-19-2011, 12:02 PM
From http://www.atf.gov/publications/firearms/012611-study-on-importality-of-certain-shotguns.pdf Analysis B (10)
Note, however, that the working group believes that pistol
grips for the trigger hand are prevalent on shotguns and are therefore generally recognized as
particularly suitable for sporting purposes.

Interesting