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View Full Version : Pump or autoloading shotgun for home defense?


TonyNorCal
10-17-2006, 4:53 PM
Shotgun for home defense...auto or pump?

M. Sage
10-17-2006, 4:58 PM
If I had my druthers, it'd be a PM-5, so pump.

As it is, I don't have a shotgun (yet), so it's "something else."

grammaton76
10-17-2006, 5:04 PM
Pump; I'm pretty sure jam clearance is a lot easier (WHAT jams?) on a pump, than on a semi.

mblat
10-17-2006, 5:23 PM
Pump - added benifits for semi not worse the money/increased complexcity of the device.
It will generally be all done after first shot anyway. You have to run into very determined attacker that won't be stopped by 00 buckshot.....

Richard
10-17-2006, 5:24 PM
why can't we have both?.......Benelli M3:cool:
My M3 performs flawlessley in either mode.

Prc329
10-17-2006, 5:30 PM
The sound of chambering a round in a pump scares the crap out of me so I am sure a criminal would feel the same way.

hkfooey
10-17-2006, 9:38 PM
The sound of chambering a round in a pump scares the crap out of me so I am sure a criminal would feel the same way.

+1 brother ;)

ZapThyCat
10-18-2006, 5:38 AM
The sound of chambering a round in a pump scares the crap out of me so I am sure a criminal would feel the same way.

This is the absolute truth: if you are the kind of person like me who would prefer NOT to have to kill someone, just the sound of that pump should be enough to deter (read: make them flee for their lives) most criminals. It's a fact that most criminals are cowards, so unless it's someone that's strung out on meth or crack, they won't be staying around very long after they hear that shotty being pumped....

Spawn_X
10-18-2006, 6:56 PM
Now I know it may be just because I have a semi-auto, but to those saying pump because of the sound - what kind of situation are we talking about?

If you KNOW you have an intruder at your home, you will have already loaded one into the chamber (I think it would be a mistake not to). If the bad guy is in front of you, I think a shotgun pointing at is guts will scare him just as much as the sound, and by then it should already be loaded anyway

Just trying to understand during what practical situation will the sound scare more than the sight?

Only thing I can come up with is if it was dead quiet, you knew the intruder was nearby, and you pump a round through just to let him know you're armed, but realistically I don't see it all panning like that :confused:


That being said, my vote is for pump due to reliability, although I have a semi-auto myself

kennisonxgs
10-18-2006, 7:47 PM
I don't care about the sound it gives to intruders. It just lets me know it's ready to go.

Gunsmoker
10-18-2006, 9:35 PM
Now I know it may be just because I have a semi-auto, but to those saying pump because of the sound - what kind of situation are we talking about?

If you KNOW you have an intruder at your home, you will have already loaded one into the chamber (I think it would be a mistake not to). If the bad guy is in front of you, I think a shotgun pointing at is guts will scare him just as much as the sound, and by then it should already be loaded anyway

Just trying to understand during what practical situation will the sound scare more than the sight?

Only thing I can come up with is if it was dead quiet, you knew the intruder was nearby, and you pump a round through just to let him know you're armed, but realistically I don't see it all panning like that :confused:


That being said, my vote is for pump due to reliability, although I have a semi-auto myself


They're talking about how it's like in the movies... how the main character has his shotgun and waits till there's danger right in front of him moving about and then pumps the action emphatically.

ZapThyCat
10-19-2006, 5:35 AM
I have a two floor townhome, and I don't keep my shotty with 1 in the chamber, so I will pump while upstairs, while they/he/she is downstairs where all the goods are. Once they hear that, they should be fleeing.

If not, well.... you know how that goes.

AxonGap
10-19-2006, 6:17 AM
You can beat the daylights out of a pump. Reliable, no non-sense.

mow
10-19-2006, 6:46 AM
Pump hands down.

Reliable and that click-click is an unmistakable sound all perps should fear.

762cavalier
10-21-2006, 3:39 PM
I also chose pump but for other reasons. You can have a pistol grip stock and and 6 (or 8 with a mossy) round capacity without running afoul of the stupid assault weapons BS:rolleyes:

M. Sage
10-21-2006, 4:16 PM
This is the absolute truth: if you are the kind of person like me who would prefer NOT to have to kill someone, just the sound of that pump should be enough to deter (read: make them flee for their lives) most criminals. It's a fact that most criminals are cowards, so unless it's someone that's strung out on meth or crack, they won't be staying around very long after they hear that shotty being pumped....

And if they are cranked-out or are just plain dumb... well, now you've got a loaded shotgun in your hands.

randy
11-17-2006, 5:07 AM
If you are going to wait in your room for them to come to you then semi with any stock. If you are going to clear your house then semi with pistol grip.

Move through your house with a pump, stabdard stock and you need two hands to operate it. Now open a door, use the stairs, hold a childs arm, call 911 etc. and you have an unweildly gun using one hand what if you are forced to shoot and you are holding the stair rail for balance you miss and now you have a club or let go of the railing your balance point to pump the gun. A pistol grip and a semi you can tuck the gun farther back under your arm for stability, easier to do all of the above mentioned and much better chance of cycleing the next round if you do shoot.

As for pumps not jamming I've seen countless short stroke them and then "click" some people forget to pump them at all.

Down side to semi is more $$$ more sensitive to ammo (but who would defend themselves with junk ammo?), down side to pistol grip if intruder grabs hold of the gun he can leverage your grip easier.

Try racking a semi and a pump yes the pump is a pump but semis aren't quiet either.

five.five-six
11-17-2006, 5:28 AM
The sound of chambering a round in a pump scares the crap out of me so I am sure a criminal would feel the same way.


big +1 that sound is universaly known, the downside is you may have to clean up excrament.

p.s. if you have kids, then your loaded weppons shuld be locked, I have yet to see a bedside shotgun safe

-1 on mp5 to much overpenitration

Bishop
11-17-2006, 7:14 AM
From a legal standpoint, being forced to defend yourself and/or your family with a old 870 with wood furniture will look a bit better to a jury than an autoloading "street sweeper" (don't get mad; you know they'll say it) or worse; an eeeevil assault mp5 :eek:

Don't forget what state we live in, and how good the ciminal justice system is at getting justice for criminals...

Edit: Oh yeah, pump. Period. End of sentence.

chiefcrash
11-17-2006, 8:46 AM
i have a pump with the first round as a "pepper blast" (just in case that bump in the night is my roommate being stupid). with the pump, it's pretty easy to dump the pepper and load the buckshot if i need to...

BossHog
11-17-2006, 10:00 AM
+1 on pumps for the reliability factor

anotherone
11-17-2006, 11:35 AM
There's a couple good reasons why you should choose a pump over an autoloader for home defense:

1) Because pumps are cheaper and there's no reason to spend $1000+ on an M-4 you will probably never ever get to use. Even in the most dangerous neighborhoods your chances of ever having to shoot someone in self defense with a shotgun is probably around 0.01%. Save the big bucks for your hunting shotgun :)!

2) Because pumps are more reliable and because you won't be using your home defense shotgun often (unless you enjoy shooting buckshot or slugs at ranges) it could accumulate dust and/or other debris (especially if stored in a closet).

3) Because pumps are just more fun than autoloaders.

Now as far as hunting goes I'll choose a pump shotgun any day over an autoloader because in the field reliability is everything. It sucks to go all the way out to a good spot to hunt and then your gas port gets clogged and you end up with a high tech single shot shotgun. This happened to a friend of mine while he was shooting trap and even shooting trap it sucked.

QuickOnTheDraw
11-17-2006, 11:52 AM
I'll be ready with my H&K FP6 pump, my wife will be armed with her preferred shotgun of choice, the FN SLP. She likes the semi-auto action, rather than the pump. Maybe I should enroll her in a tactical shotgun course for Christmas?

luvtolean
11-17-2006, 12:30 PM
From a legal standpoint, being forced to defend yourself and/or your family with a old 870 with wood furniture will look a bit better to a jury than an autoloading "street sweeper" (don't get mad; you know they'll say it) or worse; an eeeevil assault mp5 :eek:

Don't forget what state we live in, and how good the ciminal justice system is at getting justice for criminals...

Edit: Oh yeah, pump. Period. End of sentence.

A friend says the best home defense weapon is a regular pump shotgun with a duck tag and duck hunting book next to it.

Though it's not exactly my choice, quite a bit of wisdom there I think.

Try racking the slide on a pump late at night in your house. My house is kinda small, but I know there is no spot in my house it wouldn't be clearly heard.

An intruder coming through a window anywhere in the house will hear it and know what it means...

Cardinal Sin
11-17-2006, 1:16 PM
The sound of chambering a round in a pump scares the crap out of me so I am sure a criminal would feel the same way.


One of the biggest fallacies EVER!!! Such a load of crap!!! Shucking a round into the chamber or racking a slide does not make people crap or wet themselves. Countless training sessions and real world scenarios/ interviews with bad guys prove this. If anything, by chambering that round, you have just given the perpetrator an approximate location of where you are and that you are possibly armed. That being said, if I grab one of my shotguns and chamber a round I pretty much know that it is “show time” and I could care less about the sound it makes versus my positioning and line of fire.

For me . . . I like the pump action shotgus. They are cheap effective and dont rely on an inertia or gas system to operate. All you have to due is pull all the way back and push all the way forward. If you screw that up, well, its your own damn fault:p

VeryCoolCat
11-17-2006, 1:21 PM
The only use for a semi auto shotgun is for sport/fun.

If your using standard 00 buck in 2 3/4" or 3" the recoil from the shotgun is way too much for a follow up shot on a crook indoors to risk damage to anything else in your home.

The pump is simpler, less odds of a malfunction and the sound of the CLICK-CLACK can make even the toughest crooks jump out of their bodies and high tail it out of the place.

Unfortunately... I have an FN TPS :D

I remember this liberal story a while back that they were talking about the TPS "The gun was designed specifically for killing people and should be banned as it has no practical sporting use" :D

randy
11-18-2006, 8:57 AM
If you advocate the pump shotgun for reliability for HD would you then say the revolver is a better choice than a semi auto?

madjack956
11-18-2006, 4:29 PM
All you have to due is pull all the way back and push all the way forward. If you screw that up, well, its your own damn fault:p

Dead On!

Whichever weapon you choose I strongly recommend that you have trained with it under stress conditions. Shooting under stress is a whole different ballgame. Muscle memory is paramount in a self defense situation and one less factor you have to deal with. If you have not done this, find a good tactical instructor and learn something about yourself you never knew.

secretasianman
12-14-2006, 10:52 PM
One of the biggest fallacies EVER!!!
+1

I agree. You've probably given up your position and now they know you're armed. They'll be that much more cautious if THEY are armed and determined to get you or your belongings (that's some serious goodies you must have!) Odds are they will just leave and pick an easier target but you never know.

I bought a pump because it's cheaper and I've been told more reliable. Plus I couldn't install a stock with a pistol grip if it was semi-auto from what I understand.

JeepRescueService14
12-15-2006, 7:21 PM
Coolcat.. How many times do you plan on shooting that poor burglar? 12 pellets of 00 Buck isn't enough?
I prefer the P2000 with an insight M3X for HD tho.

11Z50
12-17-2006, 3:57 PM
For sure pump for me. It is a safe system that you can bring into play while half asleep. Chamber clear, mag full, OFF SAFE. This is important since once you rack the slide, you don't want to have to fumble with a safety. The clear chamber and your trigger finger are the best safeties.

Personally, I have several 870s in various configurations, and a Mossberg "Cruiser" for HD. The last kid in the house is 15 and a confirmed shotty guy. We practice regularly and he is familiar with all the HD weapons. My SOP is to have at least one HD pump shotty at the ready, chamber clear, mag loaded w/oo buck, off safe. I live out in a rural area so it will be quite awhile before LE can get to us.

rg_1111@yahoo.com
12-17-2006, 4:12 PM
I voted for the pump more reliability.

DrjonesUSA
12-17-2006, 5:29 PM
Pump; I'm pretty sure jam clearance is a lot easier (WHAT jams?) on a pump, than on a semi.


You can short-stroke a pump.

They are reliable, but nothing is 100%.

Regarding the original question, I keep a pump for home defense but want to upgrade to an auto as soon as I can.

The auto I'm looking at has a greater capacity than my current pump, is a very reliable gun, and can fire as fast as you can pull the trigger.

A pump will simply never be as fast as the best autos, and I feel they are more fool-proof in a stressful situation.

Under stress, you well could short-stroke, forget to pump, etc. Not a problem with an auto: just point and click until your needs are met.

I think autos are a better choice for HD, so I voted auto.

cseabass
12-18-2006, 12:13 PM
honestly, i prefer an auto(based on what i have used) i have had 2 pumps(870PM and a hk fabarm fp6) lock up on me, never had an auto jam, just short stroke, and its fairly easy to clear and make ready.

as for the sound of a pump... i would prefer the intruder not know i have a gun.

i have drawn down on an intruder in my house with my m1s90, he was a drunk guy who stumbled into the wrong house. he pissed himself(litterally) after that i helped him get home. he came over the next day and appologized and thanked me for not shooting him. he and i talk on a regular basis now, hell weve even been out shootin together.

point is, while my grandmother was in the front room panicing, my shotgun was chambered and ready to go, the shear supprise from the guy, he saw me round the corner of my hall leveled and he froze. if i racked a pump, that would have given him some thinking time... no thanx.

DANGERCLOSE
12-18-2006, 2:31 PM
i like pump action in comparison to auto. i think both work equally as well. although with less-lethal rounds which wont cycle autos, i have twice been presented with a double load/feed on the rem 870 @ work. after i fired and went to rack the next one, the thrid round followed the second one onto the lifter. i threw it down and grabbed something else. i have also read about another documented incident like mine. i own a moss 590a1 and i know that it wouldnt have happened because of the anti-jam lifter that the mossberg has. as for home-d, m590a1.

AJAX22
12-18-2006, 3:15 PM
I have a few shotguns, mostly older pumps

winchester 97
ithica 37
stevens 520
I enjoy older WWII trench gun replicas made out of real vintage guns.

I've never had a jam or short stroke with my ithica, its the most reliable gun I've ever owned and if you only had one thing for home defense, I'd reccomend an ithica 37.

I have a remmington 11 auto stuffer, which I haven't yet played with, but just from handeling it at the store, I have to say that in the event of a FTF or a jam, it would be more difficult to clear and I wouldn't be able to maintain firing position.

autoloaders tend to be pickeyer about the loads you cram into them. pumps just work, some better than others true, but low quality anything is a poor choice for home defence.

cseabass
12-18-2006, 3:22 PM
I have a few shotguns, mostly older pumps

winchester 97
ithica 37
stevens 520
I enjoy older WWII trench gun replicas made out of real vintage guns.

I've never had a jam or short stroke with my ithica, its the most reliable gun I've ever owned and if you only had one thing for home defense, I'd reccomend an ithica 37.

I have a remmington 11 auto stuffer, which I haven't yet played with, but just from handeling it at the store, I have to say that in the event of a FTF or a jam, it would be more difficult to clear and I wouldn't be able to maintain firing position.

autoloaders tend to be pickeyer about the loads you cram into them. pumps just work, some better than others true, but low quality anything is a poor choice for home defence.


i have a remmington m11 riot gun my grandfather got(military issue model) and i love it, its no benelli but for its age, its a decent weapon. out of my shotguns, its my 3rd fav(behind 2 benellis)

AJAX22
12-22-2006, 9:18 AM
CseaBass - where are you located at? we should meet at a range sometime, I've always wanted to feel what a m11 felt like with a chopped down barrel, (its the reason I bought mine, it just turned out to be too nice) You can play with mine if I can try yours ;)

rkt88edmo
12-22-2006, 10:27 AM
Should probably have an option to vote for "it doesn't matter."

Pumps can have operator errors and autos can have mechanical errors. Train with what you want ot use to reduce the chance of either and have fun :)

sthornwall
12-22-2006, 10:33 AM
I vote pump action. I just love the sound it makes.....CLICK CLACK!!:cool:

Jason_R
12-22-2006, 10:43 AM
Depends...I voted bump because I love my Benelli M1s90, and it's reliable as any pump.

If you had a hunting auto shotgun, I would not use it unless it was my last resort...

Any pump or auto shotty w/ a barrel length of 18-20" and a short stock would be fine.

Socal858
12-22-2006, 10:45 AM
benelli supernova


honestly its what you practice with, as long as its good equipment. if you are accustomed and know what loads to use to not experience jams/FTE, then whats the problem? it is all a means to the end, for scaring the crap out of a burglar or plugging some buck into a murderous psychopath

cseabass
12-23-2006, 12:05 PM
CseaBass - where are you located at? we should meet at a range sometime, I've always wanted to feel what a m11 felt like with a chopped down barrel, (its the reason I bought mine, it just turned out to be too nice) You can play with mine if I can try yours ;)



im in livermore, the gun doesnt kick very hard at all, but then i have been told by others it does. my grandfather had an adjustable choke attatched, i despise it. but, its still a decent functioning weapon, i could/would trust my life to it if i didnt have my benellis.


i just got my benelli m4 too! some range time would be nice.

11Z50
12-23-2006, 2:25 PM
I just got an extra supermag barrel from Remington, a 22" VR. My plan is to use this one for hunting and general use. I took the 26" in to a local shop and had the barrel shortened to 18 1/2", straight tube, no choke. The endstate will be an 870 Supermag, Knox Spec Ops stock, 18 1/2" VR barrel that will blow the hell out just about anything with the 3 1/2" 18 pellet 00B load. I will post pics when I get it complete.

How does this apply to this thread? I don't know, other than can anybody do that with an SA shotty?

vwsergio
01-07-2007, 5:46 PM
I would go with a pump to easy to send a second shot out in error in an auto

NextTimeAround
01-07-2007, 7:41 PM
Pump....pump...pump. You don't want to worry about reliability in a time of need.

Santa Cruz Armory
01-07-2007, 8:11 PM
I hope nobody is found sneaking around inside my house in the middle of the night...:eek:
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e346/BLFD1/pics090.jpg

3GunFunShooter
01-10-2007, 3:41 PM
+1 on the pump for HD. I do have a 1100 tactical also,for 3 gun.
Have seen pump shooters keep up with the auto loaders.

PistolPete75
01-22-2007, 11:36 PM
don't matter as long as you don't miss!

rod
01-23-2007, 5:27 AM
I have a few pump shoty's and a semi auto. I prefer the pump for all the reasons already mentioned.

Aluisious
01-23-2007, 4:18 PM
I have a pump shotty, but would like an auto.

I can see that under stress, I might not rack it correctly and jam it.

Rums
01-26-2007, 12:51 AM
One shot is all you need in the hands of an experienced shooter, and lets face it, pumping doesn't exactly take 5 seconds. Shoot pump shoot is maybe one to one and a half seconds. So I would say pump for reliability and cost. I think it would be worse to have a jam.