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View Full Version : Hawaii considering legislation to outlaw squirt guns to minors


Zak
02-04-2011, 12:46 AM
Article: http://www.760kfmb.com/Global/story.asp?S=13963519

SECTION 1. Chapter 709, Hawaii Revised Statutes, is amended by adding a new section to be appropriately designated and to read as follows: "§709- Sale of toy guns to minors prohibited. (1) It shall be unlawful to sell, attempt to sell, or offer for sale a toy gun to a minor under eighteen years of age…
…(2) Any person who violates this section shall be subject to a fine of not more than $2,000, imprisonment of not more than ninety days, or both."

"Why not just outlaw childhood," asks Amy Alkon.

Well, being a kid is pretty dangerous. Maybe we should just lock the little darlings in a closet until they're adults.

Here's a link to the proposed bill:

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2011/bills/HB432_.HTM

First the nerf gun story and now this?

nick
02-04-2011, 12:48 AM
WTF? Are they so drunk with power? Actually, they are :mad:

Shiboleth
02-04-2011, 12:52 AM
Who's going to turn 18, and then go buy a toy gun when they can buy a real one?

odysseus
02-04-2011, 12:55 AM
Hearts and minds, people. Hearts and minds.

nick
02-04-2011, 1:10 AM
Hearts and minds, people. Hearts and minds.

2 to the heart, one to the mind, or what are you talking about? :confused:

Noxx
02-04-2011, 1:17 AM
I often feel like I'm the only one NOT taking the crazy pills.

odysseus
02-04-2011, 1:18 AM
2 to the heart, one to the mind, or what are you talking about? :confused:

Really? You are confused by what that means?

nick
02-04-2011, 1:21 AM
Really? You are confused by what that means?

Nah, just trying to be funny. Apparently, without much success.

odysseus
02-04-2011, 1:30 AM
Nah, just trying to be funny. Apparently, without much success.

Oh. I see. Gotcha then.

Funtimes
02-04-2011, 1:35 AM
Yet another one of our "stupid" proposed bills.

racky
02-04-2011, 2:19 AM
so if a father buys a toy gun for his kid, is that a straw purchase?

xr650r
02-04-2011, 3:03 AM
Put helmets on the little darlings before you wrap them in bubble wrap and store til they're 18. Save the children! (From the drunk lawmakers)

gatdammit
02-04-2011, 3:15 AM
^ Ha bubble wrap... why not just keep em in the womb till their 18? haha

xr650r
02-04-2011, 3:45 AM
Men spend 9 months trying to get out and the rest of their lives trying to get back in...so...why not! ;-)

cdtx2001
02-04-2011, 5:18 AM
They should just make toys illegal.

RobG
02-04-2011, 6:22 AM
Another awesome law to keep kids safe. Whats the point? It only states sales to a minor. If I lived there I'd wait until the law went into effect then buy every squirt gun on the island and give them out to every kid I saw:D

Cali-Shooter
02-04-2011, 6:25 AM
so if a father buys a toy gun for his kid, is that a straw purchase?

ROFL!
Funny, and sad at the same time.

ccandgc
02-04-2011, 6:32 AM
They did this already....a long time ago. They banned cap gun sales to minors from places like lunchwagons and cheap liquor stores.

tcd511
02-04-2011, 6:40 AM
So my question is this. Had it not been an attempt on the life of a congress woman, would will still be seeing all of these asinine bills being introduced? We have seen shootings on college campuses and other places around the country but people didn't react to those as they are now. Legislators seem to be saying that one of their own got shot so we need to stand together and do something now.

Kali-Jax
02-04-2011, 6:58 AM
Trying to start the anti conditioning early...

ironpegasus
02-04-2011, 7:34 AM
so if a father buys a toy gun for his kid, is that a straw purchase?

:rofl2:
Seriously though. Am I the only one that wonders if some of society's current ills aren't due to the fact that kids didn't get to do all the crazy stuff their parents did as children and as a result have to act out those childhood fantasies as adults with real consequences instead of as kids who will just switch roles the next round of play? I mean my dad could go off and play with firecrackers and M-80s and BB guns in the woods as a kid, I was only able to play with squirt guns and other fake toys - BB guns were relegated to things like cub-scout ranges - I didn't get to play with explosives until I turned 18 and did professional fireworks shows. Now my children can't play with toy guns in public view without having to fear police response? This is the root of what's wrong with the world - it is time to stop legislating the fun and enjoyment out of life.

Don29palms
02-04-2011, 8:00 AM
This is just getting beyond ridiculous! I guess a super soaker will have to change it's product description to a personal water projection device instead of squirt gun.

MudCamper
02-04-2011, 8:35 AM
They could ban toy guns, and most average boys would pick up a stick and pretend it's a gun. They could outlaw sticks, and they'd use their hands. At some point, isn't this a 1A violation as well?

CalBear
02-04-2011, 8:36 AM
First of all, Hawaii is more of a police state than CA, so this is no surprise. It seems pretty obvious they're doing this to remove any positive associations kids have with guns or gun shaped objects. They should also outlaw the reporting of defensive uses of firearms, and require that the media report every criminal use of a gun.

Indoctrination starts early. When the facts aren't on your side, you have to use deceptive and corrupt tactics to win people over. The best way to keep someone in the anti camp is to keep them away from firearms all their life and scare them to death about guns and how they tend to "magically fire without user input."

This is how most Europeans, especially Brits, are at this point. They are utterly terrified by guns because their govs have been pumping BS and propaganda to them since birth. They also have lots of barriers to learn to shoot when young, or even learn gun safety. So guns become more abstract and scarier. A German guy I know said my HG was the first he'd ever seen, he was too scared to hold it (completely unloaded), and he had no interest in going shooting.

escon1
02-04-2011, 8:43 AM
Fascists plain and simple.

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 8:45 AM
Article: http://www.760kfmb.com/Global/story.asp?S=13963519



Here's a link to the proposed bill:

http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2011/bills/HB432_.HTM

First the nerf gun story and now this?

This sounds about as dumb as NY's proposed law to ban using a cell phone/communications device while walking.

http://www.checkeredflag.com/blog/2011/january/27/proposed-ban-on-texting-while-walking.htm

I think that politicians have forgotten about laws needing to actually help to solve a problem, rather than just needing to pass something to get their name in print.

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 8:47 AM
They could ban toy guns, and most average boys would pick up a stick and pretend it's a gun. They could outlaw sticks, and they'd use their hands. At some point, isn't this a 1A violation as well?

Well, they already have banned using their hands-at least in Oakland. That is unless you want to get hit with a charge of making a terrorist threat.

http://jonathanturley.org/2010/04/21/terror-tots-girl-suspended-for-terroristic-threat-in-pointing-finger-at-teacher-and-saying-pew-pew/

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 8:50 AM
so if a father buys a toy gun for his kid, is that a straw purchase?

I think that you are protected by the intrafamiliar transfer as long as your son has a Squirt Gun Safety Certificate.

rromeo
02-04-2011, 8:55 AM
Are pre ban squirt guns still legal? Make way for RSGs, Registered Squirt Guns.

violator22348
02-04-2011, 9:01 AM
Probably a good idea. Long Beach PD shot a man to death 6 weeks ago for holding a black squirt gun.

Jonl
02-04-2011, 9:33 AM
Maybe they should ban the high capacity ones only ha. Idiots.

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 9:34 AM
I often feel like I'm the only one NOT taking the crazy pills.

I feel the same way as well, although I also feel like the pills aren't working for those using them.

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 9:36 AM
Probably a good idea. Long Beach PD shot a man to death 6 weeks ago for holding a black squirt gun.

Paul, is that you? Was MrHelmke already in use?

The law doesn't mention "realistic". Black imitation firearms are already covered by the laws governing imitation firearms (see "7 year old charged for Nerf gun").

The law makes NO sense.

RobG
02-04-2011, 9:37 AM
So my question is this. Had it not been an attempt on the life of a congress woman, would will still be seeing all of these asinine bills being introduced? We have seen shootings on college campuses and other places around the country but people didn't react to those as they are now. Legislators seem to be saying that one of their own got shot so we need to stand together and do something now.

I have said it many times, they want and need that stuff to happen in order to get their agenda through. They don't give a rats azz about the Congresswoman with a bullet hole in her brain or a 9 year old little girl in the ground. Their name on an approved bill/law is all they care about.

RobG
02-04-2011, 9:38 AM
Maybe they should ban the high capacity ones only ha. Idiots.

Anything over 3oz of water is considered "hi capacity.":D

srt4geezer
02-04-2011, 9:44 AM
The cops don't even carry guns in England. So they totally proved only the bad guys will have guns.

This kind of stuff is just amazing.

Cali-Shooter
02-04-2011, 9:56 AM
This sounds about as dumb as NY's proposed law to ban using a cell phone/communications device while walking.

http://www.checkeredflag.com/blog/2011/january/27/proposed-ban-on-texting-while-walking.htm

I think that politicians have forgotten about laws needing to actually help to solve a problem, rather than just needing to pass something to get their name in print.

Wow, WTF! Seriously.

stix213
02-04-2011, 10:02 AM
Lets hope they don't figure out that a regular garden hose is also the ultimate kid squirt gun...

Jack L
02-04-2011, 10:08 AM
so if a father buys a toy gun for his kid, is that a straw purchase?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Dreaded Claymore
02-04-2011, 10:11 AM
I think this is one of those weird dreams I have when I sleep during the day. I'm not posting on Calguns, I'm still in bed. Any minute now I'll wake up in a cold sweat with sunlight streaming through the window.

...Right?

Cali-Shooter
02-04-2011, 10:20 AM
"Why not outlaw childhood?" says a certain Amy from the article. They might as well. They are already 90% there, those nazi-nannies.

rips31
02-04-2011, 10:33 AM
cool...i'll give all my younger cousins toy/squirt guns w/o violating the law, just not sell it to them. :rolleyes:

sd_shooter
02-04-2011, 10:36 AM
The cops don't even carry guns in England. So they totally proved only the bad guys will have guns.

This kind of stuff is just amazing.

Yes, but it's all part of the plan. Soon we will all be subdued:
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_OfpZQm4cpao/TTFi9jWA9TI/AAAAAAAACRU/i6mYxAirPLw/s400/mac-ad-1984.jpg

RomanDad
02-04-2011, 10:41 AM
Had to actually take a look at the calender to confirm its not April 1st.

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 10:48 AM
Lets hope they don't figure out that a regular garden hose is also the ultimate kid squirt gun...

The garden hose will fit into a squirt gun category similar to the firearms category of an M-60 machine gun.

Havoc70
02-04-2011, 10:48 AM
Where I grew up in Shasta County, during hunting season, teachers and students would bring in their rifles for a sort of "show and tell".

People in the town thought my parents were city hippies for not buying me a rifle or shotgun for my 16th birthday. The local sheriff's station insisted that every house had a gun of some sort for defense and public defense, they let us take care of ourselves.

By and large, it's still that way, except in Redding which is getting to be much too much like the Bay Area, IMO.

This nanny state bull has to stop.

rabagley
02-04-2011, 12:53 PM
There has been a steady push in schools to "civilize" children by discouraging and penalizing actions, statements, drawings, and writings that explore violent topics and raising up as the ideal those actions, statements, drawings and writings that explore nurturing and peaceful topics.

This pedagogical approach is based on a model of human development that bears no resemblance to actual human beings. The geniuses behind this model assert that human brains are blank slates and that almost all thought patterns, including typically gendered thought patterns, are learned from the culture around us. Change what the child is exposed to, change the child. Eliminate any mention of violence from the environment, eliminate any interest in violence... right?

Wrong.

Boys and girls have inherent interests, and boys are curious about violence, among many other subjects. To tell boys that they can't express that interest at school forces school to be about uninteresting subjects, which hurts boys in two ways: they can't ask questions that they need answered, and school can't possibly be about anything interesting, so school becomes irrelevant.

There is a social war against boys going on, and this bill is just another effort to say that how boys naturally play and what they naturally choose to play with is WRONG and NEEDS CORRECTING.

I have a 9 month old boy. My wife and I both work. I don't quite see how school is going to do anything useful for him, but I don't see how we're going to homeschool either.

J.D.Allen
02-04-2011, 1:31 PM
Oh good freakin grief!!

:puke:

Dutch3
02-04-2011, 3:52 PM
When I was a kid, we had toy guns and played "cowboys and indians" on a daily basis.

My friend's toy gun even had fake cartridges that would load and eject. Mine made a ricochet sound when being fired. Another friend had a (shudder) bow and arrows. The arrows had blunt tips, but still hurt if they hit you.

Looking back, I now see that those activities were wrong in so many ways and we should all burn in Hell for having that fun back when we were 8.



.

GOEX FFF
02-04-2011, 5:05 PM
You'd think HI is separated from the main land of the United States for miles in all directions like it is it's own country or somthing surrounded by nothing but ......oh wait.

BoxesOfLiberty
02-04-2011, 5:28 PM
^ Ha bubble wrap... why not just keep em in the womb till their 18? haha

That's the worst place for em! Have you seen the murder rate?

Wherryj
02-04-2011, 6:04 PM
There has been a steady push in schools to "civilize" children by discouraging and penalizing actions, statements, drawings, and writings that explore violent topics and raising up as the ideal those actions, statements, drawings and writings that explore nurturing and peaceful topics.

This pedagogical approach is based on a model of human development that bears no resemblance to actual human beings. The geniuses behind this model assert that human brains are blank slates and that almost all thought patterns, including typically gendered thought patterns, are learned from the culture around us. Change what the child is exposed to, change the child. Eliminate any mention of violence from the environment, eliminate any interest in violence... right?

Wrong.

Boys and girls have inherent interests, and boys are curious about violence, among many other subjects. To tell boys that they can't express that interest at school forces school to be about uninteresting subjects, which hurts boys in two ways: they can't ask questions that they need answered, and school can't possibly be about anything interesting, so school becomes irrelevant.

There is a social war against boys going on, and this bill is just another effort to say that how boys naturally play and what they naturally choose to play with is WRONG and NEEDS CORRECTING.

I have a 9 month old boy. My wife and I both work. I don't quite see how school is going to do anything useful for him, but I don't see how we're going to homeschool either.

I don't know about that. I had a hot brunette mom living next door when I was growing up. Since then, I've always had a "thing" for hot brunettes. Proof of theory?

:p

ojisan
02-04-2011, 6:15 PM
Couldn't the squirt guns just be limited to 10 squirts before a reload?
A background check on all minors who may use the squirt gun whould also seem to be a common sense requirement.

TMC
02-04-2011, 6:27 PM
How do these idiots, who want to ban everything because they think kids will go crazy and shoot everyone, explain the fact that most of us who were kids 40 years ago are not raving killers today? Violent crime keeps going down. We all played with toy guns, bows and arrows, BB guns, blow guns, slingshots and firecrackers. Sure we got some bruises and scars and set some stuff on fire but nobody died and we didn't plot to shoot up a school.

Sort of on the same topic, I was telling my 15 year old daughter today (on the way home from action pistol practice) that her grandfather bought his dad a 22 revolver at the local hardware store when he was 14. In the minds of today's politicians that would be unthinkable that a kid would buy a gun and not kill or injure someone.

The Geologist
02-04-2011, 8:44 PM
:rofl2:
Seriously though. Am I the only one that wonders if some of society's current ills aren't due to the fact that kids didn't get to do all the crazy stuff their parents did as children and as a result have to act out those childhood fantasies as adults with real consequences instead of as kids who will just switch roles the next round of play? I mean my dad could go off and play with firecrackers and M-80s and BB guns in the woods as a kid, I was only able to play with squirt guns and other fake toys - BB guns were relegated to things like cub-scout ranges - I didn't get to play with explosives until I turned 18 and did professional fireworks shows. Now my children can't play with toy guns in public view without having to fear police response? This is the root of what's wrong with the world - it is time to stop legislating the fun and enjoyment out of life.

I believe you are correct. Progressive/Liberal = I can do it, but you can't.

JimSar
02-04-2011, 9:16 PM
Forgive them, for they smoke too much pakalolo.

rabagley
02-04-2011, 10:22 PM
:rofl2:
Seriously though. Am I the only one that wonders if some of society's current ills aren't due to the fact that kids didn't get to do all the crazy stuff their parents did as children and as a result have to act out those childhood fantasies as adults with real consequences instead of as kids who will just switch roles the next round of play? I mean my dad could go off and play with firecrackers and M-80s and BB guns in the woods as a kid, I was only able to play with squirt guns and other fake toys - BB guns were relegated to things like cub-scout ranges - I didn't get to play with explosives until I turned 18 and did professional fireworks shows. Now my children can't play with toy guns in public view without having to fear police response? This is the root of what's wrong with the world - it is time to stop legislating the fun and enjoyment out of life.

That is a very interesting theory. My views are pretty close. My daughter is 2.5 years old. My son is 9 months old. I already bought two 22lr rifles and a 22 pistol for them. I wonder if I should be thinking about bb or pellet guns first...

Tarn_Helm
02-05-2011, 10:40 AM
Article: http://www.760kfmb.com/Global/story.asp?S=13963519

Here's a link to the proposed bill:
http://www.capitol.hawaii.gov/session2011/bills/HB432_.HTM
First the nerf gun story and now this?

Just amputate everyone's fingers and toes.

In the name of public safety, that is.

CSACANNONEER
02-05-2011, 10:46 AM
People actually vote these idiots into office and let them waste taxpayer's money to write and vote on this kind of crap. No wonder the US economy is in the tank.

Tarn_Helm
02-05-2011, 10:50 AM
There has been a steady push in schools to "civilize" children by discouraging and penalizing actions, statements, drawings, and writings that explore violent topics and raising up as the ideal those actions, statements, drawings and writings that explore nurturing and peaceful topics.

This pedagogical approach is based on a model of human development that bears no resemblance to actual human beings. The geniuses behind this model assert that human brains are blank slates and that almost all thought patterns, including typically gendered thought patterns, are learned from the culture around us. Change what the child is exposed to, change the child. Eliminate any mention of violence from the environment, eliminate any interest in violence... right?

Wrong.

Boys and girls have inherent interests, and boys are curious about violence, among many other subjects. To tell boys that they can't express that interest at school forces school to be about uninteresting subjects, which hurts boys in two ways: they can't ask questions that they need answered, and school can't possibly be about anything interesting, so school becomes irrelevant.

There is a social war against boys going on, and this bill is just another effort to say that how boys naturally play and what they naturally choose to play with is WRONG and NEEDS CORRECTING.

I have a 9 month old boy. My wife and I both work. I don't quite see how school is going to do anything useful for him, but I don't see how we're going to homeschool either.

Start collecting books, articles, Supreme Court cases and all other materials which you can use to debrief and de-brainwash your kid.

Standard textbooks still contain lies about U.S. History, U.S. Government, and U.S. economics.

If you take the time to read this stuff, sit down with your son and discuss it with him, then the whole process of paying attention to him and SHOWING (not merely telling) him what matters in life will cement his relationship with you and protect him from the brainwashers.

And when he gets to those grades in school where they start trying to force feed him with their bull carp, he will know how to speak up with data and reasoned defense of the truth.

Soon he will have a reputation as either a Holy Terror who is not to be messed with (amongst "Liberal" teachers) or a bright young spark who will go far life (amongst his teachers who love freedom).

ztVaqZajq-I

gunsmith
02-05-2011, 12:02 PM
Nah, just trying to be funny. Apparently, without much success.

what!!?? I LOL'd!!

gunsmith
02-05-2011, 12:05 PM
http://just4families.com/node/82

The gap in education standards between boys and girls is growing and growing at an alarming rate. Some of this has been tracked back to when 'political correctness' took over and parents, schools and sociologists called for the bans on guns, tanks, toy soldiers and the like. One psychologist has been quoted as saying:

To tell a boy that playing with a guns is bad can have consequences. It is often difficult to understand a child's reasoning processes, however, if the child thinks that playing with a gun is bad, and the child likes playing with a gun, then he, the child, must also be bad.

Boys have a naturally aggressive nature. They also have a great imagination when it comes to play. I remember my young days when we played 'cowboys and indians'. Or we played out our own war games. The truth is many generations of males grew up playing with these toys - they certainly did not become overly aggressive adults - in fact the youth of today is far more aggressive than my generation and that is without these toys.

Boys do need to be boys. They need to play in a fashion which is natural - not forced into unnatural play. By being inventive, using their innate tendencies they learn to grow. Education becomes more interesting. With that, one would hope, the gap between boys and girls would fall. Boys may also get some of the aggression out of their systems early.

turbogg
02-05-2011, 12:13 PM
Are pre ban squirt guns still legal? Make way for RSGs, Registered Squirt Guns.

Oh cr@p, I've got a bunch of super soakers. I guess if this law comes to CA, (and it probably will) I'll have to register them, or turn myself in as a law breaker! :rolleyes:

gobler
02-05-2011, 2:14 PM
:mad: OK I think it's time we stop rolling over and kick these anti's in the baby makers now!! We HAVE to fight back or it'll just get worse.