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Gunsmithing
01-28-2011, 6:20 AM
After wining the 2nd Amendment rights what will be next for a anti-guns groups and politics.

I think the next step for Anti-guns groups is for own a firearm you will to be license. Now to get the license you will need to go back to college for a degree.

Anti-guns groups lets put a high tax on tax. If think they will not add tax to bullets or other items on firearm just look at the sale tax on candy you give to your kids.

I know some of this is far fetch for to day but look back 50 year ago and how the laws have changed.

What can we do as a group to stop this from happening in the next 50 years.

I know and most also knows we need taxs and rules for roads, schools, law enforcement and the list goes on. I just want the laws to be fair for gun ownership and use. Not having our rights remove by license or over taxed/fees.


Dave

NapaCountyShooter
01-28-2011, 7:03 AM
Donate to the Calguns Foundation, CRPA, and the NRA. They need money to keep court cases going. Fighting it out in the courts is our best option.

Jack L
01-28-2011, 7:51 AM
Many left wing politicians do not believe the 2A actually says and means what we think it does. Regardless of some victories, these people will keep trying to redefine what it means. Mayor Bloomberg was on MSNBC last night and was saying he was not only against loop holes but did not think guns in the hands of citizens meant more safety at all. Others say the 2A only covers well defined militias, etc. This will not end especially if the ATF and Obama and people like MSNBC talking heads keep mouthing off for ratings. In fact, it's only just begun. It's a matter of taking ammo, then guns, then they do what they want to us politically. The way I see it is that the fight for freedom is just gearing up.

This current ammo ban that has surfaced again yesterday is much more serious than just a CA issue. This is an assault on gun rights that is alarming to me. I hope it gets wrapped up around the 2A to help other states that will also face politicians who are very well protected but leave us and our families out to hang without much protection. I imagine the rural states will be our friends.

Utah has it right with the state gun. Browning help give the USA it's freedom. Nothing more sobering than seeing a old photograph of a grizzled sergeant major, all weathered and dirty with a week long beard humping a road during the Korean war with an BAR in his hands and the 50 yard stare in his eyes..

Gunsmithing
01-28-2011, 8:32 AM
My self I am not even looking the assault guns or even 50 cal. But over taxing make a licesne to own then hard to get. Or on the other hand taking firearm back to 1776 as what ever one was using when the 2nd Amendment was written.

Dave

wildhawker
01-28-2011, 8:38 AM
Dave, the antis are sure to make every effort to restrict our rights wherever possible, especially right now, where we don't have much jurisprudence (and a good deal of what we do have has been districts and circuits being deferential to the legislatures).

However, the financially onerous regulatory schemes you discuss are certainly violative of a fundamental right. It will take 5-10 years, and a number of wins at SCOTUS, but eventually our positioning will change from mainly legislative defense (with some strategic offense, and criminal case byproduct) to legislative offense/maintenance (with some strategic litigation, and criminal case byproduct).

When we have a robust core RKBA that means what it says, issues like permit fees and regulation by taxation will be fairly accessible targets. Once we establish that such schemes are "cannot-do", CA will have to deal with the internalized costs of their very poorly designed (and now fragmented via our litigation) system of regulating arms.

Gunsmithing
01-28-2011, 9:19 AM
We need to promote our sport.
Today you so little on the sport shooting.
Back in the 60's any would see some thing about firearms, shooting even self protection.
Just show how it change in my high school we had a gun club. My older brothers would bring there rifles to school with the bullets to shot in the jim. I do not know of any high school that has a gun club today.

Dave


Dave, the antis are sure to make every effort to restrict our rights wherever possible, especially right now, where we don't have much jurisprudence (and a good deal of what we do have has been districts and circuits being deferential to the legislatures).

However, the financially onerous regulatory schemes you discuss are certainly violative of a fundamental right. It will take 5-10 years, and a number of wins at SCOTUS, but eventually our positioning will change from mainly legislative defense (with some strategic offense, and criminal case byproduct) to legislative offense/maintenance (with some strategic litigation, and criminal case byproduct).

When we have a robust core RKBA that means what it says, issues like permit fees and regulation by taxation will be fairly accessible targets. Once we establish that such schemes are "cannot-do", CA will have to deal with the internalized costs of their very poorly designed (and now fragmented via our litigation) system of regulating arms.

Jack L
01-28-2011, 10:55 AM
"We need to promote our sport.
Today you so little on the sport shooting.
Back in the 60's any would see some thing about firearms, shooting even self protection.
Just show how it change in my high school we had a gun club. My older brothers would bring there rifles to school with the bullets to shot in the jim. I do not know of any high school that has a gun club today.

Dave"

Amazing to think about these days.

Gunsmithing
01-28-2011, 11:55 AM
Jack
I am finding out there are lot of wemen and men that would like to know more about firearms. I just received my gunsmith license last year, I was not tilling any one that I was gunsmith. I was afraid of the reaction, but in time I found out no one to date had bad reaction. Most wanted to know what the best size of gun to buy.

Dave


"We need to promote our sport.

Amazing to think about these days.

Stonewalker
01-28-2011, 12:02 PM
Jack
I am finding out there are lot of wemen and men that would like to know more about firearms. I just received my gunsmith license last year, I was not tilling any one that I was gunsmith. I was afraid of the reaction, but in time I found out no one to date had bad reaction. Most wanted to know what the best size of gun to buy.

Dave

I think gunsmithing is perhaps less "weird" to people because they can understand that it's a craft and a skill. It's probably a great way to start talking about the 2nd amendment to people would otherwise be defensive.

SwissFluCase
01-28-2011, 12:09 PM
We need to promote our sport.
Today you so little on the sport shooting.
Back in the 60's any would see some thing about firearms, shooting even self protection.
Just show how it change in my high school we had a gun club. My older brothers would bring there rifles to school with the bullets to shot in the jim. I do not know of any high school that has a gun club today.

Dave

Shooting is not a sport. It is a deadly serious martial art that can be enjoyable to practice. It is also a means of providing food for one's family, but that was always secondary to the martial aspect. One of the problems that got us into this mess was the concept of shooting as a sport. Where is the sport in defending oneself from a violent attacker?

The sporting concept needs to be tossed into history's dustbin never to be seen again.

Regards,


SwissFluCase

Gunsmithing
01-28-2011, 12:33 PM
I take it you do not like foot ball or base ball

Firarm can be a sport or a hobby, You find shooting even in the Olympics. Most think of gun as self protection from big criminals.

Dave


Shooting is not a sport. It is a deadly serious martial art that can be enjoyable to practice. It is also a means of providing food for one's family, but that was always secondary to the martial aspect. One of the problems that got us into this mess was the concept of shooting as a sport. Where is the sport in defending oneself from a violent attacker?

The sporting concept needs to be tossed into history's dustbin never to be seen again.

Regards,


SwissFluCase

uyoga
01-28-2011, 4:54 PM
There will always be someone or some entity attempting to hold us under their thumb by trying to diminish our Second Amendment rights, The fight will never be over.

thepunisher
01-28-2011, 5:17 PM
The largest army in the world are American hunters and sportmen. That is what they are
afraid of.

warbird
01-28-2011, 5:53 PM
The Second Amendment is not about hunters, sportmen, shooters, the olympics, or even self defense in those paricular words. It is about the right to keep and bear arms in a free and not infringed upon nature. From that concept comes everything else. The anti-gun movement knows it will lose the Second Amendment fight over guns so they will move on to bullets, accessories, and whatever support items it can tax or regulate to make it impossible for you to use those guns and forcing you to fight each battle all the way to the surpeme court. They will over tax and license every use of a weapon that is not self defensive in nature. Outside your home they will do it to the point you cannot afford it as an average man or woman. And they will redefine every aspect of self defense in your home so that the use of a gun in your own home will be severely restricted. In short you are going to be taxed, licensed, and restricted into a corner of your own home for owning a gun. In the end they will concede you can own guns or weapons but the legal use of them will be so rare and expensive legally that you will ask "what is the point of owning them". Just like hot rods and classic cars in california only the rich will be able to afford to have them and use them. You need to protect not only guns but the whole industry that supports those guns.

Anchors
01-28-2011, 6:35 PM
The 2A fight is far from over.
Heller and McDonald just rung the opening bell so to speak.
There is still much work to be done.

SwissFluCase
01-28-2011, 9:42 PM
I take it you do not like foot ball or base ball

Firarm can be a sport or a hobby, You find shooting even in the Olympics. Most think of gun as self protection from big criminals.

Dave

I never said it could not be enjoyed as a hobby, or that competitions could not be held, but it is a martial art. It can still be fun. Karate and Judo can be practiced in a manner that looks like a sport complete with competition, but it is still as martial art as well.

I guess an example of shooting that has no martial aspect would be removing clinker from a cement kiln.

Football and baseball are sport. They are not primarily combat activities.

Regards,


SwissFluCase

Decoligny
01-28-2011, 10:06 PM
I take it you do not like foot ball or base ball

Firarm can be a sport or a hobby, You find shooting even in the Olympics. Most think of gun as self protection from big criminals.

Dave

Football and baseball were developed as sports for fun, i.e. toys. Guns were invented as military weapons, i.e. tools to kill. These tools useage grew from war to personal protection and killing animals for food. The practice required for proficiency naturally developed into competition between shooters. This type of formal tests of skill are often termed "sports". To most people this lowers the importance of shooting to the level of a game.
Shooting is way more than a game.

Fate
01-29-2011, 12:15 AM
Where is the sport in defending oneself from a violent attacker?

I'm sure it would sell on Pay per View.

Gunsmithing
01-29-2011, 10:13 AM
Firarm/shooting as a sport Has been about for hundred of years. The black powder was first as fireworks and fun, only later used by military as weapons. If you go back to the bow it was use for hunting first. Football as we see it today has only been around for 100 years or so bas on the military.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We need to more promote our sport/hobby. What do you think is the best way???
Working on this will help to save the 2nd Amend.


Dave

press1280
01-30-2011, 4:56 AM
After wining the 2nd Amendment rights what will be next for a anti-guns groups and politics.

I think the next step for Anti-guns groups is for own a firearm you will to be license. Now to get the license you will need to go back to college for a degree.

Anti-guns groups lets put a high tax on tax. If think they will not add tax to bullets or other items on firearm just look at the sale tax on candy you give to your kids.

I know some of this is far fetch for to day but look back 50 year ago and how the laws have changed.

What can we do as a group to stop this from happening in the next 50 years.

I know and most also knows we need taxs and rules for roads, schools, law enforcement and the list goes on. I just want the laws to be fair for gun ownership and use. Not having our rights remove by license or over taxed/fees.


Dave

They're trying to push for more discretionary laws (both for CCW and simple possession), as a way to seem "reasonable" to the public. Notice that the Bradys amicus briefs in Heller and McDonald technically were not on the side of DC and Chicago because the public support for handgun bans(once somewhat popular) became extremely unpopular. They like the discretionary system because the public generally is unaware of the corruption of the system, and it basically converts a right back into a privilege. You'll have to prove you "need" a gun in one way or another.
Then they'll claim states rights and more local control. But what they want is Federalism in reverse. Instead of the different states trying different laws and the good ones spread and the bad ones die, they'll push through their Progressive allies just the opposite scenario. Just look at Boxer trying to pass a nationwide "may-issue" bill. The country for the most part already had this only 25 years ago, there was a reason it was rejected state by state.

NotEnufGarage
01-30-2011, 5:16 AM
Probably the best thing we could do is start a campaign of firearms education for the general public. This would need to stress the competition, collecting, outdoors, militaria and family togetherness aspects of the sport, with a lighter emphasis on home defense and warfare aspects.

If you have kids, you should get them involved in your hobby. If they have friends, take them along and teach them safe handling and some shooting skills. Take a friend or neighbor to the range sometime and teach them safe handling and how to shoot, especially if they're ambivelant on the whole thing. Women especially get into this because of the whole power and control issue.

Every person we can show the true aspect of guns and shooting is one less person that the media and the anti's have in their court. It's amazing the number of people out there that have no firsthand knowledge or experience with firearms. The only thing they know is what they hear on the news, which is hardly balanced. For many of these first timers, it doesn't take much more than a single trip to the range to get them interested in the sport. I know of several people I've taken out shooting who went an purchased their first firearm the very next week and now they've all got several.

It's a cultural thing. Those who grow up around guns don't fear them. Those who've never touched them, do. The government, schools, and community in general are not going to fix this. We have to do it.

Of course, a Federal mandate that all Elementary students learn gun safety and all Junior and Senior high school students learn safe gun handling and basic shooting skills would completely change the culture in just a few years. The left would howl about this, but it's really no different than wood shop, metal shop, auto shop or home economics, when you think about it. It's life training on the basic use of certain tools and equipment.