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SniperDan308
08-19-2006, 5:41 PM
Howdy. Does anyone know how to go about buying and registering an AOW (a CA legal one of course) in California?

bwiese
08-19-2006, 5:43 PM
Fuhgeddabout it.

artherd
08-19-2006, 5:47 PM
SBRs and SBSs are outright prohibited in CA.

However, machinegun permits do exist, generally for motion picture industry, or very 'connected' individuals with $millions to play campaign financier with. If you are not one of the above, DOJ generally will not grant one.

I'm not that rich, so I don't have said MG yet. I would like a nice M-134 :)

bwiese
08-19-2006, 6:02 PM
Yeah and I'd give my left gonad for an SBR. A nice 14.5" M4 in 5.56, and a 11" 6.8 w/Noveske brake.

SemiAutoSam
08-19-2006, 6:07 PM
As I recall there is more to an AOW than a SBR or SBS and a 5 dollar transfer is very attractive. Beats the hell out of the 200.00 transfers of some items Ive registered in the past.

A supressor would be 200.00 in tax stamp FRN"S

xenophobe
08-19-2006, 6:16 PM
Good luck with an AOW permit...

A silencer would be easier... get a manufacturing FFL and you can get silencers in California.

artherd
08-19-2006, 6:19 PM
As I recall there is more to an AOW than a SBR or SBS and a 5 dollar transfer is very attractive. Beats the hell out of the 200.00 transfers of some items Ive registered in the past.
The $200 transfer is the absolute least of your worries for this sort of effort in CA. If you don't fart $100 bills, then forget about it.

Mssr. Eleganté
08-19-2006, 6:21 PM
Yes, AOW or "any other weapon" is a separate category from SBR's and SBS's and machineguns under the NFA.

It seems to cover all of those "novelty" type firearms, like pen guns and cane guns. Things that don't look like firearms but are. I think it also includes handguns with a forward grip, but those might be SBR's though. Not sure.

SemiAutoSam
08-19-2006, 6:27 PM
The thread starter has most likely seen the NFA Legal states list and on it it does state that California is a YES across the board as far as legal MG, SUPRESSOR, SBR, SBS, AOW ect.

But little do they know there is the doj to contend with permits are all but impossible to come by.

BigMac
08-19-2006, 8:07 PM
SBRs and SBSs are outright prohibited in CA.

However, machinegun permits do exist, generally for motion picture industry, or very 'connected' individuals with $millions to play campaign financier with. If you are not one of the above, DOJ generally will not grant one.

I'm not that rich, so I don't have said MG yet. I would like a nice M-134 :)

Not true, the guy that taught me to work on revolvers used to have a SBS permit. Waynes in Dublin had one.. not all that long ago.

anotherone
08-19-2006, 9:03 PM
Yeah and I'd give my left gonad for an SBR. A nice 14.5" M4 in 5.56, and a 11" 6.8 w/Noveske brake.

Personally I always fantasize about that 11.5" M4 Bushmaster upper that's on the last page of the Bushmaster catalogue in the law enforcement section. I don't really see what the huge deal about SBRs is in some states anyhow... it's not like they're any easier to hide than a 16 inch barrel which is only 5.5 inches longer!

SemiAutoSam
08-19-2006, 9:09 PM
This last post makes me think of GCA68 im wondering if there was any comment period like there was with the moronic California AW ban all phases of it from roberti to SB23 ?

I have the Amnesty poster hanging in my garage and before GCA68 Having a SBR wasn't an evil thing was it ?

artherd
08-19-2006, 9:40 PM
Not true, the guy that taught me to work on revolvers used to have a SBS permit. Waynes in Dublin had one.. not all that long ago.
Weird, I looked about a year ago and found no permit, but here it is, I stand corrected.:
ARTICLE 6. PERMITS
12095. (a) If it finds that it does not endanger the public safety, the Department of Justice may issue permits initially valid for a period of one year, and renewable annually thereafter, for the manufacture, possession, transportation, or sale of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles upon a showing that good cause exists for the issuance thereof to the applicant for the permit. No permit shall be issued to a person who is under 18 years of age.
(b) Good cause, for the purposes of this section, shall be limited to only the following:
(1) The permit is sought for the manufacture, possession, or use with blank cartridges, of a short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun, solely as props for a motion picture, television, or video production or entertainment event.
(2) The permit is sought for the manufacture of, exposing for sale, keeping for sale, sale of, importation or lending of short-barreled rifles or short-barreled shotguns to the entities listed in paragraph (1) of subdivision (b) of Section 12020 by persons who are licensed as dealers or manufacturers under the provisions of Chapter 53 (commencing with Section 5801) of Title 26 of the United States Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.

Mudvayne540ld
08-19-2006, 11:10 PM
yea... but that is almost impossible to get. Look at thier reasons for granting them. Note that it says it must be renewed every year. :(

Smokeybehr
08-20-2006, 8:09 AM
It's easier to move to one of the free states than it is to get a permit for any Class III goodies. I haven't heard of anyone in CA getting a permit in my entire life, but I know several people in "free states" that have as many Class III toys as their budgets can afford.

JPglee1
08-20-2006, 8:50 AM
It's easier to move to one of the free states than it is to get a permit for any Class III goodies. I haven't heard of anyone in CA getting a permit in my entire life, but I know several people in "free states" that have as many Class III toys as their budgets can afford.


I looked into it, its not that hard, just expensive. DOJ has nothing to do with getting a BATF issued O7/SOT FFL...

The problem is all the zoning/building restrictions. You basically have to find a building in an area zoned for commercial/manufacturing, and then you have to build a fort knox style "security room" that the weapons have to be in all the time....

You're looking at a minimum cash outlay of $20,000 to start, not counting equipment to do the actual production/machining.

The reason you don't see many 07s in CALI is not cuz its illegal/hard to do, but rather there's no customers to sell anything to. You'd have to do all your sales to out of state NFA consumers, and/or LEO sales.

I wanted to get my 07/SOT so I could open a machine gun range in Victorville (Imagine the billboards up the 15FWY..Shoot an MG TODAY for FREE, I thought about giving them first 10rd magazine, free hehe)

Finding a building in the right zoned area, that was secure enough to bother with was nearly impossible. The BATF has real specific rules about the storage area, how its constructed, etc...


JP :D

JPglee1
08-20-2006, 9:01 AM
As I recall there is more to an AOW than a SBR or SBS and a 5 dollar transfer is very attractive. Beats the hell out of the 200.00 transfers of some items Ive registered in the past.

A supressor would be 200.00 in tax stamp FRN"S

AOW/SBR/SBS, all of them require a $200 tax stamp if a private person makes it. SOT/07 is exempt from paying the tax, but its still a $5 transfer tax on the SBR/SBS. Since no new machine guns can be made/transfered, they still have a $200 transfer tax.


J

artherd
08-20-2006, 11:16 AM
I looked into it, its not that hard, just expensive. DOJ has nothing to do with getting a BATF issued O7/SOT FFL...

The problem is all the zoning/building restrictions. You basically have to find a building in an area zoned for commercial/manufacturing, and then you have to build a fort knox style "security room" that the weapons have to be in all the time....

You're looking at a minimum cash outlay of $20,000 to start, not counting equipment to do the actual production/machining.
Ahem, add a zero (IMO).

JPglee1
08-20-2006, 1:23 PM
Ahem, add a zero (IMO).

I just meant permits/leasing on building, etc...

Equipment would be a whole lot more, especially with CNC like a proper shop should have.


J

SemiAutoSam
08-20-2006, 1:27 PM
AOW/SBR/SBS, all of them require a $200 tax stamp if a private person makes it. SOT/07 is exempt from paying the tax, but its still a $5 transfer tax on the SBR/SBS. Since no new machine guns can be made/transfered, they still have a $200 transfer tax.


J

Have a look at a form 4 some time AOW is a $5.00 TAX everything else is $200.00

artherd
08-20-2006, 8:12 PM
I just meant permits/leasing on building, etc...
Equipment would be a whole lot more, especially with CNC like a proper shop should have.
J
True enough, I still think you'll be closer to $50-100k outlay before you even buy a tool, but why quibble. Point is, it takes relatively signifigant $ outlay, AND a bona-fide market, to even think about MG manufacturing in CA.

m24armorer
08-22-2006, 12:04 AM
OK, the original question was about a AOW, that is "Any Other Weapon". In CA you can own one. Yes my Witness Protection 870 is legal in CA, my Ithaca Auto and Burgler 20 gauge pistol is legal and so is my Handy-Gun by H&R.

There are many more, but the kink is having a LEO signoff on the transfer or making of. You could make your own AOW, but your best bet is to get a virgin receiver that has never been assembled or shipped as a complete firearm (ie:rifle or shotgun). And then Inc. yourself and file a form 1.

If your are a corp. you do not have to have the CLEO signoff. Do a form 1 and you as CEO own it along with the company. Then legally you can have some fun as long as you obey (really hate that word) NFA rules.

m24armorer
08-22-2006, 12:07 AM
BTW, first time out for a form 1 non 07 SOT is 200.00 after that, 5.00 stamp.