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jdberger
01-18-2011, 11:21 PM
Dear Karen Arntzen (of the California Brady Campaign) is threatening to list restaurants and businesses (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/17/tucson-shooting-fuels-open-carry-debate-california/)who refuse to post "No Guns" signs on a public "name & shame" list of "socially irresponsible businesses."

She's also making it a point to stalk and confront the UOC folks.

The Brady Campaign push has already led to one confrontation, with more likely as the group sets out to protest the meetings of open-carry advocates in California. The latest incident occurred in Orange County over the weekend, when Brady Campaign activists arrived with protest signs as open-carry advocates carrying weapons met across the street at a Corner Bakery café.

This is interesting in light of the fact that Karen Arntzen, the Bradys and LCAV have all publicly expressed fear of being confronted by the UOC folks.

Ms. Arntzen was exceedingly cautious in confirming the attendees to the California Chapters of the Brady Campaign's Annual Meeting in Oakland. She expressed fear that UOC advocates would try to disrupt the meeting [note that despite her caution, we had 3 Calgunners in attendance - they didn't disrupt anything].

In response to a promised peaceful protest of LCAV's annual fund raising dinner (http://onlygunsandmoney.blogspot.com/2010/07/spoofing-antis.html), LCAV called in a police report suggesting that protesters would be armed - resulting in an overwhelming police response.

It appears that Ms. Arntzen has decided to escalate matters.

I wonder how she'd feel if her meetings started to attract vigorous protests.

pitchbaby
01-18-2011, 11:26 PM
Karen Arntzen = WHINER

freonr22
01-18-2011, 11:27 PM
they will never stop, jdberger

wildhawker
01-18-2011, 11:41 PM
they will never stop, jdberger

And neither, then, shall we.

Purple K
01-19-2011, 12:11 AM
Wouldn't it be nice if we could get our hands on that mailing/contact list and send out a few words of our own.....

FS00008
01-19-2011, 12:16 AM
I suggest we begin to protest everything she does. Loudly.

five.five-six
01-19-2011, 12:26 AM
IF She is so scared of violence, she should probably get a gun IMO

BigFatGuy
01-19-2011, 12:30 AM
I just notified Starbucks of my appreciation for them standing up against the Brady Bunch, and informed them that I will make my appreciation known by patronizing their stores.

BillCA
01-19-2011, 12:36 AM
Karen Arntzen sounds like a typical anti-gun looney but I'm not familiar with her specifically. It would be useful to know what kinds of arguments she and her group are making that UOC is dangerous or threatening.

The looney left gives us some examples of tactics they think are acceptable -- such as infiltrating protesters and making offensive statements. Why not show up on their side of the street with a sign or banner that says something like "We Fear Guns, Ban them all" or "We Fear Guns, So you must be defenseless".

Nah... that wouldn't work.

five.five-six
01-19-2011, 1:06 AM
I'm sure our friend Karen would just love a UOC/police shootout, it would be more useful than a common school shooting

IntoForever
01-19-2011, 1:47 AM
In Rancho Cordova, CA a donut shop gave free donuts to the police. Heavy police presence = less likely chance of being robbed. One would think that a group of armed patrons would deter anyone who's paying attention from robbing a place. If I had a choke n puke, I'd be thrilled to have a group of UOC'ers coming in on a regular basis. Besides the repeated business from them, less likely to have some asshat try to rob the place. Yes, I've seen the videos of criminals robbing places full of police but still, I'd take any advantage. With that said, if there was a place in LA near me they were going, I'd be happy to go there as well in support!

nicki
01-19-2011, 2:10 AM
If she keeps pressuring Restaurants and other businesses to become "Gun Free" what she is effectively doing is working to "undermine a Fundamental Constitutional Right".

Now all we have to do is find a "Protected Class" that has a significant need for self defense and have her violate those individual's rights.

Seems to me what she is doing is similar to what the KKK would do to make sure white businesses kept Blacks in their place.

So guys, let's do some outreach, we gotta have a few people on this board who fall into those classes.

Nicki

Purple K
01-19-2011, 3:03 AM
If memory serves me she's an attorney with an office in southern Cal.

jshoebot
01-19-2011, 3:04 AM
I can't fathom these peoples' logic. It seems to me that they're just bullies. They know UOC'ers are peaceful, yet they keep saying it's dangerous. If it's so dangerous, why do they keep going to protest? Aren't they afraid they'll get shot?

I like the idea in a previous post. I think I'm going to make a sign that says, "I'm afraid of guns, so you shouldn't have any" and stand with the brady bunch :)

RRangel
01-19-2011, 3:12 AM
If she keeps pressuring Restaurants and other businesses to become "Gun Free" what she is effectively doing is working to "undermine a Fundamental Constitutional Right".

Now all we have to do is find a "Protected Class" that has a significant need for self defense and have her violate those individual's rights.

Seems to me what she is doing is similar to what the KKK would do to make sure white businesses kept Blacks in their place.

So guys, let's do some outreach, we gotta have a few people on this board who fall into those classes.

Nicki

She's blowing hot air because who really wants to listen to her? If she actually costs a business substantial income, which I doubt, they certainly do have legal recourse. It's not like what she's attempting to do is low key.

Patrick-2
01-19-2011, 3:59 AM
I suggest we begin to protest everything she does. Loudly.

And give her exactly what she wants.

Brady is irrelevant and cannot get attention like they want. Start showing up and protesting and you make them relevant again.

This is classic agitation politics 101.

Please ignore these idiots, or at least don't be shocked when our protests increase Brady visibility and donations.

Remember, we are winning. Winners don't need to stomp on the losers. We just need to keep winning. Protesting the losing side does us zero good and probably helps them.

Theseus
01-19-2011, 4:14 AM
And perhaps we can also do the opposite and have signs made where by businesses could promote their pro-gun or OC position?

And also provide a list and free advertising for businesses that take a pro-OC stance?

Patrick-2
01-19-2011, 4:33 AM
Quiet recognition, perhaps.

Businesses do not want to stand in the fray of a contentious issue. The more we make the local coffee shop an issue, the more likely they are going to push back against us, for the simple reason that they think more customers will vote their dollars with someone else.

If you put every UOC protester from a neighborhood in line at Starbucks, would it look any different that a normal morning at Starbucks?

I think we gun people need to realize that we are winning in two limited ways: first the courts; and secondly by virtue of the fact the public is largely agnostic on gun control. They are not like us. They are not rabidly anti-gun control. At best they don't care and don't support more of it because it would "maybe be a waste of time."

When guns become a nightly story, it turns against us. There is just too much working against gun rights (like a hostile press corp) to get a fair shake.

We need to keep fighting quietly. Keep the courts busy, support ourselves and our friends.

We can get loud after we have won.

glockwise2000
01-19-2011, 4:36 AM
IF She is so scared of violence, she should probably get a gun IMO

^^^ This:)

Pred@tor
01-19-2011, 5:18 AM
All these signs are just similar to the bigot signs racists used to post for the colored folks. So of course those communists are going to ask for bigotry its what they prefer they support racist gun control measures. Also it sends potential robbers the message that their business is open for robbery.

AJAX22
01-19-2011, 5:59 AM
Don't post her info, just because google turns up all her personal data doesn't mean it won't cause problems to pos it (lessons from iggy for those who remember the problems it caused when I posted his cell phone number and other personal data back in 06 or so)

She's the type of vindictive **** who would try to come after cgn/cgf and get a restraining order...

Play nice guys, we are winning she is largely irrelevant and becoming increasingly more so

383green
01-19-2011, 6:14 AM
Seems to me what she is doing is similar to what the KKK would do to make sure white businesses kept Blacks in their place.


Now, wouldn't it be interesting if a group such as the KKK would begin to visibly and vocally support the Brady Campaign? They say that all publicity is good publicity, after all... :whistling:

CitaDeL
01-19-2011, 7:01 AM
Many wont like this suggestion, as it is a bit of dirty pool- but I think I would stand among them with a sign almost identical to the ones that Brady Campaign Against Gun Violence distribute that says: "No Armed Coloreds" (or with the Pink Pistols angle with signs proclaiming "Disarm the Queers").

While the UOCr's have been accused of being primarily middle aged white guys, from what I've seen the Brady Campaign is largely older white ladies.

If done skillfully, its possible to counter their efforts by revealing the bigoted/racist origins of gun control while demonstrating that lawful gun owners are of all stripes. The downside is however, twofold- you only make it happen once (unless they can be repeatedly duped) and the people holding the signs may have to compromise their beliefs and endure some outrage from onlookers.

Imagine, for a moment how that might appear in the press...

stitchnicklas
01-19-2011, 7:54 AM
send the pink pistol folk to all their sf meetings .....
then have folks protest else where with pink pistols also to confuse them more...

Dr Rockso
01-19-2011, 8:00 AM
Uh-oh, not "the hammer"...

c_O0jNYOGTQ

B Strong
01-19-2011, 8:06 AM
She should be exposed as an Enemy of not just Second Amendment rights, but First Amendment rights as well.

B Strong
01-19-2011, 8:09 AM
And give her exactly what she wants.

Brady is irrelevant and cannot get attention like they want. Start showing up and protesting and you make them relevant again.

This is classic agitation politics 101.

Please ignore these idiots, or at least don't be shocked when our protests increase Brady visibility and donations.

Remember, we are winning. Winners don't need to stomp on the losers. We just need to keep winning. Protesting the losing side does us zero good and probably helps them.

Good advice from a new guy.

Brady isn't much more powerful than Westboro baptist - they make noise and stamp their feet, but are largley ignored by politicians because they can't do what we can - get out the votes.

Coded-Dude
01-19-2011, 8:15 AM
yes its obvious they are hypocrites. they are terrified of guns and the danger they cause, but they make every effort to place themselves in harms way(around UOC'ers) to protect the rest of us. I wonder how many brady people have been injured by these dangerous UOC'ers?

FS00008
01-19-2011, 8:23 AM
What do you guys think about getting her an honorary free NRA membership? ;-)

b_k
01-19-2011, 8:28 AM
http://i.imgur.com/QONVIyz.gif

bodger
01-19-2011, 8:30 AM
Many wont like this suggestion, as it is a bit of dirty pool- but I think I would stand among them with a sign almost identical to the ones that Brady Campaign Against Gun Violence distribute that says: "No Armed Coloreds" (or with the Pink Pistols angle with signs proclaiming "Disarm the Queers").

While the UOCr's have been accused of being primarily middle aged white guys, from what I've seen the Brady Campaign is largely older white ladies.

If done skillfully, its possible to counter their efforts by revealing the bigoted/racist origins of gun control while demonstrating that lawful gun owners are of all stripes. The downside is however, twofold- you only make it happen once (unless they can be repeatedly duped) and the people holding the signs may have to compromise their beliefs and endure some outrage from onlookers.

Imagine, for a moment how that might appear in the press...


Oh man, that is funny. Show up to stand with them in their protest and whip out a NO Armed Coloreds sign.

It would only take one good photo of that to go viral and the Bradys would have some 'splainin' to do.

Coded-Dude
01-19-2011, 8:34 AM
tell the cop yes...you are armed with FREEDOM!

Super Spy
01-19-2011, 8:38 AM
Many wont like this suggestion, as it is a bit of dirty pool- but I think I would stand among them with a sign almost identical to the ones that Brady Campaign Against Gun Violence distribute that says: "No Armed Coloreds" (or with the Pink Pistols angle with signs proclaiming "Disarm the Queers").

While the UOCr's have been accused of being primarily middle aged white guys, from what I've seen the Brady Campaign is largely older white ladies. (Fixed it for you)

If done skillfully, its possible to counter their efforts by revealing the bigoted/racist origins of gun control while demonstrating that lawful gun owners are of all stripes. The downside is however, twofold- you only make it happen once (unless they can be repeatedly duped) and the people holding the signs may have to compromise their beliefs and endure some outrage from onlookers.

Imagine, for a moment how that might appear in the press...

I like the way you think...

n2k
01-19-2011, 8:42 AM
If she keeps pressuring Restaurants and other businesses to become "Gun Free" what she is effectively doing is working to "undermine a Fundamental Constitutional Right".

Now all we have to do is find a "Protected Class" that has a significant need for self defense and have her violate those individual's rights.

Seems to me what she is doing is similar to what the KKK would do to make sure white businesses kept Blacks in their place.

So guys, let's do some outreach, we gotta have a few people on this board who fall into those classes.

Nicki

http://i621.photobucket.com/albums/tt297/n2kphotos/f52ad8c8.jpg

putput
01-19-2011, 8:44 AM
We should let these business know that they can take out a restraining order on her...

wash
01-19-2011, 8:49 AM
Oh man, that is funny. Show up to stand with them in their protest and whip out a NO Armed Coloreds sign.

It would only take one good photo of that to go viral and the Bradys would have some 'splainin' to do.
As tempting as that seems, it would attract all sorts of negative publicity.

It's better to just ignore them and patronize businesses who respect our rights.

Reductio
01-19-2011, 8:56 AM
In other words....

http://warriorwriters.files.wordpress.com/2010/12/troll.jpg

motorhead
01-19-2011, 8:56 AM
the brady bunch is grasping at straws since heller and mc donald.

Wherryj
01-19-2011, 9:04 AM
Which link do I use to report my own business to the Brady's for refusing to post a "no guns" sign?

SeanCasey
01-19-2011, 9:04 AM
We can get loud after we have won.

But that is the catch. We will never "win". The fight for liberty is never ending. The moment we declare that we won and stop fighting, is the moment we will lose the progress we made. The fight for our rights will never end. We would do best to stay soft in our words and win through our actions.

OC-Indian
01-19-2011, 9:09 AM
Can someone confirm if she is the same one in our neck of the woods, who lives in Pleasant Hill, CA?



F4OMBTCmKVA

Wow. She's as ugly on the outside and she is on the inside

Paul S
01-19-2011, 9:09 AM
Quiet recognition, perhaps.

Businesses do not want to stand in the fray of a contentious issue. The more we make the local coffee shop an issue, the more likely they are going to push back against us, for the simple reason that they think more customers will vote their dollars with someone else.

If you put every UOC protester from a neighborhood in line at Starbucks, would it look any different that a normal morning at Starbucks?

I think we gun people need to realize that we are winning in two limited ways: first the courts; and secondly by virtue of the fact the public is largely agnostic on gun control. They are not like us. They are not rabidly anti-gun control. At best they don't care and don't support more of it because it would "maybe be a waste of time."

When guns become a nightly story, it turns against us. There is just too much working against gun rights (like a hostile press corp) to get a fair shake.

We need to keep fighting quietly. Keep the courts busy, support ourselves and our friends.

We can get loud after we have won.

Best analysis of I've read in quite sometime. We thought out sir!

maddoggie13
01-19-2011, 9:11 AM
And perhaps we can also do the opposite and have signs made where by businesses could promote their pro-gun or OC position?

And also provide a list and free advertising for businesses that take a pro-OC stance?

+1...how do we start???

bodger
01-19-2011, 9:12 AM
As tempting as that seems, it would attract all sorts of negative publicity.

It's better to just ignore them and patronize businesses who respect our rights.

No doubt the best policy is to ignore them.

But I cannot get the image of that sign at their protest out of mind. Just hilarious.

jdberger
01-19-2011, 9:20 AM
I think what worries me the most is the rhetoric coming from Ms. Arntzen and her crew.

Those of us familiar with dogs know that a scared animal is dangerous. It's unpredictable. It doesn't think straight. It will sometimes attack, without warning, simply out of fear.

That's what concerns me about Karen Arntzen and her small band of Brady Protestors. She and Paul Helmke and the rest of the Antis are getting followers spun up on the caustic vitriol, casting gun owners and specifically UOCers as different, dangerous and menacing. They're stirring people up, inciting fear. Encouraging loathing.

Simply put, they have the potential to be dangerous.

The UOCers are all carrying arms openly and unloaded. They willingly submit to checks by police both before and during events.

The same can't be said for the Brady protestors. Who's to say that there isn't someone in Ms. Arntzen's cadre who's so frightened that they've decided to bring a loaded concealed firearm to a protest? How are we to know - how is the public to know if there are felons among her crowd with a history of violence? We know that the Brady Campaign has felons as spokesmen. What if they're among the agitated crowd protesting a UOC event?

I would hope, that in the spirit of honesty and being forthright, Karen Arntzen would allow police to confirm that her protestors aren't carrying any illegal weapons when they confront UOCers.

GrizzlyGuy
01-19-2011, 9:39 AM
Which link do I use to report my own business to the Brady's for refusing to post a "no guns" sign?

Her contact info is here (http://www.bradycampaign.org/chapters/ca/) at the bottom of the 'About California Chapters' section. Call or E-mail her and ask to be added to the "Name & Shame - Socially Irresponsible Businesses" list they published in the 'Demand Gun-Free Dining in California' section. Or, you could mail them this form (http://www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/bcam/chapters/california/Gun_Free_Policy_PledgeOrder_Form.pdf) (edited, of course). You'll be in good company:

Domenick's Pizza House (Rancho Palos Verdes)
Nationa's Giant Hamburgers
Panama Red Coffee Co.
Starbucks Coffee Co.

383green
01-19-2011, 9:40 AM
Simply put, they have the potential to be dangerous.


What you're suggesting appears to be that they may just be far enough off their nuts for one of them to protest gun ownership by shooting gun owners with a gun.

What bothers me is that I can't dismiss that idea out of hand. Their rhetoric is so spiteful, hypocritical, disingenuous, self-contradictory, dishonest, inconsistent, illogical, disprovable and poorly-conceived that I can only consider them to be one or more of: insane, incompetent, malicious. None of those is consistent with the actions of well-reasoned law-abiding people, and thus, they may be capable of just about anything. You can't reason with crazy, stupid or evil.

missiondude
01-19-2011, 10:27 AM
Well... I managed to watch almost two minutes of that video. *Suppresses Gag Reflex* Gawd, what a tool.

gunsmith
01-19-2011, 10:39 AM
What do you guys think about getting her an honorary free NRA membership? ;-)

NO, NO, NO, !!!

Michael Moore always uses his NRA membership as a way to make it seem he is pro gun but supports "common sense laws"

jdberger
01-19-2011, 10:39 AM
Her contact info is here (http://www.bradycampaign.org/chapters/ca/) at the bottom of the 'About California Chapters' section. Call or E-mail her and ask to be added to the "Name & Shame - Socially Irresponsible Businesses" list they published in the 'Demand Gun-Free Dining in California' section. Or, you could mail them this form (http://www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/bcam/chapters/california/Gun_Free_Policy_PledgeOrder_Form.pdf) (edited, of course). You'll be in good company:

Or - you could simply ask for lots of free signs.... ;)

I recall a campaign a while back where gunnies asked the Brady Campaign for these packets of educational materials that they had been offered for free. Posters and literature and folders and stickers, all printed in color. That must have cost them a pretty penny.

:D

Wherryj
01-19-2011, 10:50 AM
In Rancho Cordova, CA a donut shop gave free donuts to the police. Heavy police presence = less likely chance of being robbed. One would think that a group of armed patrons would deter anyone who's paying attention from robbing a place. If I had a choke n puke, I'd be thrilled to have a group of UOC'ers coming in on a regular basis. Besides the repeated business from them, less likely to have some asshat try to rob the place. Yes, I've seen the videos of criminals robbing places full of police but still, I'd take any advantage. With that said, if there was a place in LA near me they were going, I'd be happy to go there as well in support!

My sister in law owns a coffee shop in San Jose. She gladly gives free coffee to LEOs, she says both as a thank you for a difficult job and because it's never a bad thing to have officers frequenting one's shop.

Anyone considering robbing the place will never know when a car will drop by for a refill.

Wherryj
01-19-2011, 10:51 AM
Her contact info is here (http://www.bradycampaign.org/chapters/ca/) at the bottom of the 'About California Chapters' section. Call or E-mail her and ask to be added to the "Name & Shame - Socially Irresponsible Businesses" list they published in the 'Demand Gun-Free Dining in California' section. Or, you could mail them this form (http://www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/bcam/chapters/california/Gun_Free_Policy_PledgeOrder_Form.pdf) (edited, of course). You'll be in good company:

Cool, I don't run a food establishment, but I COULD be the first physician to "make the list". I'll send my info ASAP.

GrizzlyGuy
01-19-2011, 10:54 AM
Or - you could simply ask for lots of free signs.... ;)

I recall a campaign a while back where gunnies asked the Brady Campaign for these packets of educational materials that they had been offered for free. Posters and literature and folders and stickers, all printed in color. That must have cost them a pretty penny.

:D

LOL, their little "no gun" symbol would make for a nice target, and the sticky back would save me lots of tape and staple money. :43:

yellowfin
01-19-2011, 11:50 AM
But that is the catch. We will never "win". The fight for liberty is never ending. The moment we declare that we won and stop fighting, is the moment we will lose the progress we made. The fight for our rights will never end. We would do best to stay soft in our words and win through our actions.
Actually it's pretty compelling that we can win permanently. If we can make gun ownership meaningful and relevant to the key population areas, then we can work on dismantling the cultural divide. If we can take out the breeding mechanisms of the anti gun ideology it will wither and become extinct, and once gone we can weld the door shut. It's pretty certain that the 15th and 19th Amendments are permanent and not subject to future contest. We can eventually do that with gun rights if we do the right things and follow through.

blakdawg
01-19-2011, 11:50 AM
If memory serves me she's an attorney with an office in southern Cal.

No - at least not as "Karen Arntzen", there's nobody with that last name licensed to practice in CA.

Coded-Dude
01-19-2011, 11:57 AM
there will always be some nut job that kills a lot of innocent people to help provoke the other side attempt to force us into disarmament.

Glock22Fan
01-19-2011, 12:02 PM
Quiet recognition, perhaps.

Businesses do not want to stand in the fray of a contentious issue. The more we make the local coffee shop an issue, the more likely they are going to push back against us, for the simple reason that they think more customers will vote their dollars with someone else.

If you put every UOC protester from a neighborhood in line at Starbucks, would it look any different that a normal morning at Starbucks?

I think we gun people need to realize that we are winning in two limited ways: first the courts; and secondly by virtue of the fact the public is largely agnostic on gun control. They are not like us. They are not rabidly anti-gun control. At best they don't care and don't support more of it because it would "maybe be a waste of time."

When guns become a nightly story, it turns against us. There is just too much working against gun rights (like a hostile press corp) to get a fair shake.

We need to keep fighting quietly. Keep the courts busy, support ourselves and our friends.

We can get loud after we have won.

Absolutely. This is exactly my sentiments. Let the sheep sleep in ignorance until the playing field is so stacked in our favor that it is too late for them to protest.

thrillhouse700
01-19-2011, 12:02 PM
Wow brady supporters can't even keep a camera steady, they should be banned from guns since they would shake them vigorously in an unsafe manner.

N6ATF
01-19-2011, 12:15 PM
And perhaps we can also do the opposite and have signs made where by businesses could promote their pro-gun or OC position?

And also provide a list and free advertising for businesses that take a pro-OC stance?

"Law-abiding people welcome!"

as opposed to victim disarming businesses...
"Criminals welcome! Our patrons are your victims!"

timdps
01-19-2011, 12:28 PM
Her contact info is here (http://www.bradycampaign.org/chapters/ca/) at the bottom of the 'About California Chapters' section.

Can someone confirm if she is the same one in our neck of the woods, who lives in Pleasant Hill, CA?

925 is an east bay prefix.

Hmmm... Looking at the Chapters page there are only 16 county chapters out of 58 CA counties, less than a third....

I see a at least one gaping hole: Marin

BTW who knew KIA meant Killed In America. A bit of an insult to our servicemen killed in ACTION.

tim

CitaDeL
01-19-2011, 12:42 PM
Or - you could simply ask for lots of free signs.... ;)

I recall a campaign a while back where gunnies asked the Brady Campaign for these packets of educational materials that they had been offered for free. Posters and literature and folders and stickers, all printed in color. That must have cost them a pretty penny.

:D

I think anything that either nullifies their message or absorbs their limited resources is a good thing...

Anyone want to organize a Brady chapter in their community? I am against gun 'violence'... I am also for safe firearms handling. These messages are not mutually exclusive... but somehow I think they would frown on a safety seminar held in their name.

spddrcr
01-19-2011, 12:54 PM
Can someone confirm if she is the same one in our neck of the woods, who lives in Pleasant Hill, CA?


F4OMBTCmKVA

these 2 in the vid often spend time at nation's in pleasent hill waiting for the UOC people. I personally have seen them there twice and on one of those occasions I had just finished shooting a match and had a shirt with a gun image on it as well as two others that were with me and the second they saw us walk in they went to their car and retrieved signs:rolleyes: I wasn't even carrying a gun and she was going to go into protest mode:D

N6ATF
01-19-2011, 1:06 PM
You should go in disguise one time, make eye contact with them to make sure they know you spotted them, then go and get a sign protesting their existence. "I fart in criminal safety proponents' general direction!"

Gray Peterson
01-19-2011, 1:54 PM
Yay, UOC causes collateral damage to concealed carriers too! :rolleyes:

N6ATF
01-19-2011, 3:22 PM
Everything is the UOCers fault. EVERYTHING!!!

Domestic animal overpopulation: THE UOCers fault!
Middle Eastern turmoil: the UOCers fault!
Malaria epidemic in Africa: the UOCers fault!

NOT the treasonous, anti-law-abiding, pro-criminal safety government and civilians who want all civil gun owners dead, in prison, or out of their developing criminals' utopia.

:rolleyes:

wash
01-19-2011, 3:27 PM
Blaming malaria on UOC is taking it a little too far.

dfletcher
01-19-2011, 3:29 PM
Can someone confirm if she is the same one in our neck of the woods, who lives in Pleasant Hill, CA?


F4OMBTCmKVA

It occurs to me these folks always look so tortured and unhappy. I'll bet they make their husbands are miserable as hell too. I know I'd be checking to see if the clothes dryer hose can be taped to the old tailpipe pretty much straight away.

Coded-Dude
01-19-2011, 3:30 PM
mosquitoes everywhere disagree.

N6ATF
01-19-2011, 3:31 PM
Blaming malaria on UOC is taking it a little too far.

But Middle East turmoil and domestic animal overpopulation, you agree with?! Gotcha, Mr. Every Topic Must Somehow Be About UOC!

cmaynes
01-19-2011, 3:40 PM
I would hope people would recognize (actually many here I think do) that UOC is just kind of dumb as far as our gun rights and liberties are concerned- Concealled carry is what makes for a safe society- since the threat to the bad guys is largely unknown- The problem with OC in places where there is frankly relatively few threats is that it gives a platform for freakouts. I remember the OC lunch at El Indio a few years ago and the freakouts some of the patrons had- even in the presence of the SDPD.

I just think it is largely counterproductive to reversing the REALLY bad gun laws that are out there....

but thats just my thoughts....

N6ATF
01-19-2011, 4:10 PM
Concealled carry is what makes for a safe society

Because criminals think everybody are soft targets and easy victims, so they end up getting shot and permanently retired more often?

Criminals know in CA that the .gov has their back and always will, regardless of any court ruling. CCW infringement (more restrictive than Constitutional Carry) is keeping criminals safer because they know people can't afford to exercise their rights as long as those rights are turned into privileges the increasingly unemployed and dirt poor can't afford.

WatchMan
01-19-2011, 4:32 PM
What this woman is suggesting to do to these restaurants seems like lawsuit city. It would be very, very sweet to see her and her lovely organization get taken to the cleaners.

vintagearms
01-19-2011, 5:02 PM
Thats what happens when we allow women out of the kitchen or the bedroom. :innocent:

warbird
01-19-2011, 5:26 PM
I think that when she posts that list we should go out of our way to stop in and at least shake the hand of the manager or the owner and maybe have someone print up a sign that says, "In Appreciation of your support of the Bill of Rights including the Second Amendment" the person could put up if they wanted to. I know I made it clear to Starbuck Franchises I went to I was buying there because of the company policy and I am sure it helps. We need to do more grassroots efforts as individuals to thank businesses and give them business when we can if they support us by supporting the Bill of Rights. They don't have to be flaming in your face supporters but rejecting the Brady campaign quietly helps just as much and posting a sign of appreciation helps even more.

stix213
01-19-2011, 5:32 PM
I'll make it a point to eat at those restaurants and let them know how I got the free advertising :)

warbird
01-19-2011, 5:38 PM
Food for thought on UOC. Ten UOC guys sitting all over the place in and outside of Starbucks drinking coffee or whatever. A robber or a gangbanger pulls up. Is he going to gamble that one or more of those UOCers can't lock and load in 1-2 seconds because he can't cover them all or is he going to go off and find a business without guns to rob? Yes, it would be better if they could load up but they can't right now under the law. CCW looks like you are unarmed and you have the element of surprise hopefully. But surprise carrys some nasty surprises of it's own. You draw and you better be more than willing to kill that criminal because you have just surprised him and since you are not a cop you can't yell police and flash a badge. He starts pulling the trigger in a panic. How many people get shot before you put him down and what if you don't. You triggered a shooting because you froze at the moment of truth and realized you could not kill. Maybe you are one of the victims now. I would rather have an unloaded open display (UOC) than someone with a CCW who panics. But UOC only works if it is in numbers enough in one place to intimidate. think long and hard about bailing out on UOCers. They do have a place and it can be a good one when they show up in numbers.

tiki
01-19-2011, 5:49 PM
here she is



What the hell is that on her head? She looks like a lamp.

hoffmang
01-19-2011, 6:41 PM
And amusingly, this thread is now the top result for a search for her on Google.

There are some interesting counter protest signs available:

"These people believe in the loving memory of the racists who disarmed blacks ->"

"These fools believe in the loving memory of British tyranny."

"in loving memory of the Warsaw Uprising. If only more jews had been armed."

-Gene

Californio
01-19-2011, 7:12 PM
Yup, the Carrie Nation's of the world surely have always know whats best for society:confused:

Cokebottle
01-19-2011, 7:18 PM
Dear Karen Arntzen (of the California Brady Campaign) is threatening to list restaurants and businesses (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/01/17/tucson-shooting-fuels-open-carry-debate-california/)who refuse to post "No Guns" signs on a public "name & shame" list of "socially irresponsible businesses."
Guess where I'm going when I've got a shopping list and trying to decide who to buy from :D