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XDRoX
12-29-2010, 7:48 PM
With the ban on internet orders quickly approaching. I thought it would be a good time to consider reloading for your ammunition needs.

Couple things first:
-Mods, I know this is the wrong forum, feel free to move, but please give it a day or two so the people that don't frequent the ammo forum have a chance to see it.

-There are plenty of great stickies in the ammo/reloading forum (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/forumdisplay.php?f=89). This thread is just to give you a general idea of what you'll need.

-Everything in this post is of course simply my opinion.

Step 1
Buy a book and read it cover to cover.
These are good ones:
The ABC's of Reloading (http://www.amazon.com/ABCs-Reloading-Definitive-Novice-Expert/dp/0896896099/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1293682499&sr=8-1)
Lyman (http://www.amazon.com/Lyman-Reloading-Handbook-49th-Cover/dp/B0028M4K0Y/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1293726459&sr=8-2)

Step 2
Buy a press.
There are three basic options.

A single stage press will load about 50 rounds per hour.
Lee Single Stage (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=317831)
RCBS Rock Chucker (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=513567)

A turret press will load about 250 rounds an hour.
Lee Classic Turret (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=814175)

A progressive press will load about 500 rounds an hour.
Hornady LNL (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=679228)
Dillon 550b (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23594/catid/1/RL_550B)
Dillon XL650 (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23803/catid/1/XL_650)

Step 3
Buy the necessary accessories to load.
Caliper (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=604242)
Tumbler (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23659/catid/8/Dillon__039_s_CV_750_Vibratory_Case_Cleaner)
Dies (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=140349) (one for each caliber that you are loading for)
Scale (beam (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/25215/catid/7/Dillon__039_s___039_Eliminator__039__Scale) or digital (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/25213/catid/7/D_Terminator_Electronic_Scale))

Step 4
Buy components.
Bullets (http://berrysmfg.com/product-i14478-c11-g8-b0-p0-9mm_124gr_RN_DS.aspx)
Primers (http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/3504)
Powder (http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/3512)

That's it. There are a few other odds and ends that you may want, but these are the main necessities.

I good rule of thumb is you'll probably be able to reload ammo (assuming your brass is free) for about half the price of walmart ammo. To get these saving is is important that you buy components in bulk.

I put my favorite brands or the most popular ones in the links. There are plenty of other brands that work fine, but IMO, these are the most common and well liked.

If I forgot something please don't be rude, just correct me and I'll edit the OP.
Thanks for reading.

chesterthehero
12-29-2010, 7:56 PM
this might be better in the reloading (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/forumdisplay.php?f=89) forum...

you also need a solid table/bench..

iareConfusE
12-29-2010, 8:03 PM
this might be better in the reloading (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/forumdisplay.php?f=89) forum...

you also need a solid table/bench..

He knows it's appropriate for the reloading sub forum, but as he stated, he's posting it here because the ammo & reloading sub forum don't receive as much attention as the handguns section does. I think this is a good idea and should be left here and bumped up at least for a week so people are aware that they have this option available to them.

Good initiative!

XDRoX
12-29-2010, 8:09 PM
this might be better in the reloading (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/forumdisplay.php?f=89) forum...

you also need a solid table/bench..

Ya, I hear you. It's just that most of the people in that forum already know these basics, so I'd thought I'd post it here.

A bench is also a necessity that I left off, thanks.

chesterthehero
12-29-2010, 8:10 PM
i skiped straight to the bold stuff... reading>me

XDRoX
12-29-2010, 8:10 PM
He knows it's appropriate for the reloading sub forum, but as he stated, he's posting it here because the ammo & reloading sub forum don't receive as much attention as the handguns section does. I think this is a good idea and should be left here and bumped up at least for a week so people are aware that they have this option available to them.

Good initiative!

Thanks

Rem222
12-29-2010, 8:18 PM
Great links for a new reloader...

Oceanbob
12-29-2010, 8:56 PM
I hope more people get into Reloading....it's fun and saves money.

Be well
Bob

Oh...lol...you forgot the Dillon 1050....1200 rounds per hour.....I know you have to be a WEIRDO to get one, but some on this forum will love the 1050.

:D The one on the left..1050..on the right a 550B with case feeder...

http://i51.tinypic.com/2zhr33r.jpg

XDRoX
12-29-2010, 9:05 PM
Thanks Bob.
How do you like the case feeder on the 550? I have always read that they don't run well on the 550 and so have never considered one. Does your work well? And pistol only right?

bsg
12-29-2010, 9:12 PM
i don't know a thing about reloading. the math tells me it makes sense though. maybe the book first.

thanks.

jessegpresley
12-29-2010, 9:20 PM
That room is larger than my apartment.

I hope more people get into Reloading....it's fun and saves money.

Be well
Bob

Oh...lol...you forgot the Dillon 1050....1200 rounds per hour.....I know you have to be a WEIRDO to get one, but some on this forum will love the 1050.

:D The one on the left..1050..on the right a 550B with case feeder...

http://i51.tinypic.com/2zhr33r.jpg

Oceanbob
12-29-2010, 9:23 PM
Thanks Bob.
How do you like the case feeder on the 550? I have always read that they don't run well on the 550 and so have never considered one. Does your work well? And pistol only right?

The case feeder works just fine. Yes, it's pistol only...I have it running 10MM.

It does save time; whether it's worth the $ or not is another question. I bought the 550 back in 1995 ish and never opened the box. So I splurged on
the case feeder.

Originally I bought the 550 to reload .308 and have the conversion kit and dies that were in the box. But the TOLL ROAD killed the rifle range and I haven't shot a .308 in a long, long time. I have some in stock if I need it.
(factory).

himurax13
12-29-2010, 9:29 PM
Well when it comes to reloading I always ask the person a few questions.

1. How often do you really shoot?
2. Do you have a lot of spare time on your hands?
3. Do you have the room for a lot of equipment?
4. Will your significant other or room mates be cool with you basically trashing an area of the home with reloading equipment?
5. Do you realize that you will not save money by reloading?

These are important questions to ask, especially #5. I have spent a lot more money on reloading than buying guns and gear this year and it will just get worse next year.

j1133s
12-29-2010, 9:30 PM
Ya, I hear you. It's just that most of the people in that forum already know these basics, so I'd thought I'd post it here.

A bench is also a necessity that I left off, thanks.

Wouldn't the people who want to reload naturally read the reloading section?

Anyway, a solid bench/table is very important. Also an isolated area/room where you won't get distracted and double charge. If buying a progressive press, make sure it is a good press or you'll waste a lot of time.

j1133s
12-29-2010, 9:33 PM
Well when it comes to reloading I always ask the person a few questions.

1. How often do you really shoot?
2. Do you have a lot of spare time on your hands?
3. Do you have the room for a lot of equipment?
4. Will your significant other or room mates be cool with you basically trashing an area of the home with reloading equipment?
5. Do you realize that you will not save money by reloading?

These are important questions to ask, especially #5. I have spent a lot more money on reloading than buying guns and gear this year and it will just get worse next year.

I always ask:
1. Do you want your gun to shoot 100x better?
2. Do you want to shoot tinny groups and be the envy of everybody at the range?
3. Are you interested in competing inany centerfire rifle or bullseye pistol in the near future?

The Electrician
12-29-2010, 9:53 PM
Bob, thats one hell of a man cave you got there! I need a klenex to wipe the droul from my chin!!!

JanG
12-29-2010, 11:09 PM
ive been thinking of reloading myself since i picked up my 38 super

i was thinking of getting this, sounds like a simple way to get started
http://www.leeprecision.com/html/catalog/lp1000.html
http://www.leeprecision.com/graphics/shoppingcart/pro1000.jpg

iareConfusE
12-29-2010, 11:13 PM
ive been thinking of reloading myself since i picked up my 38 super

i was thinking of getting this, sounds like a simple way to get started
http://www.leeprecision.com/html/catalog/lp1000.html
http://www.leeprecision.com/graphics/shoppingcart/pro1000.jpg

Most people will tell you to start on a single stage press, and I agree. It's good to at least get the basics down before you buy a progressive. I just bought a Lee Pro 1000 yesterday and it's on its way here. I've tried reloading before but failed. I still understand the concepts and the basics though, so I felt comfortable enough going with a progressive. I'll just be taking it slow, and I've asked for local help to ensure that I don't do anything dangerous or incorrect.

JanG
12-29-2010, 11:18 PM
cool, i've watched other people do it, and once i get one, i do plan on having somebody run me through the process.

scoot64
12-29-2010, 11:20 PM
cool good looking out.

magic32
12-30-2010, 5:20 AM
thanks for the info. i'm getting all the info i need together, to start reloading. i've noticed that my lgs's are now stocked with reloading equipment and reloading supplies. from a business sense that's a smart move, but the mark up.....

zfields
12-30-2010, 6:01 AM
A progressive press will load about 500 rounds an hour.
Hornady LNL (http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=679228)
Dillon 550b (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23594/catid/1/RL_550B)
Dillon XL650 (http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23803/catid/1/XL_650)

Dont make me bring my Lee fanboism into the handguns thread. You know I will do it.....

choprzrul
12-30-2010, 6:23 AM
Man Cave, a new standard has been set:

http://i51.tinypic.com/2zhr33r.jpg

Markus
12-30-2010, 7:15 AM
I found the Lymans reloading manual 49th edition to be much more help than the Abcs of reloading. More pertinent info streamlined and well laid out.

XDRoX
12-30-2010, 7:29 AM
I found the Lymans reloading manual 49th edition to be much more help than the Abcs of reloading. More pertinent info streamlined and well laid out.

Added to OP, thanks.

XDRoX
12-30-2010, 7:32 AM
Dont make me bring my Lee fanboism into the handguns thread. You know I will do it.....

I threw the SS and Turret in there for you:D

Vanilla Gorilla
12-30-2010, 7:42 AM
i don't know a thing about reloading. the math tells me it makes sense though. maybe the book first.

thanks.

the math is right trust me. if you buy a kit for 300 bucks at bass pro (i got the rock chucker supreme) and only reload .45 acp (like i did in the beginning) you stand to save around .25-.30 cents per round, might not sound like much but, if you reload 1000 rounds you just saved 300 bucks, and the whole kit has paid for itself and you now got 1000 rounds of .45. now everything you load after that is pure savings, and the kit doesnt take that long to pay for itself figure 100 rounds a night (that is only about 2 hours of your time per night) it would only take 10 days to get 1000 rounds, i average about 100 rounds an hour and did 2 hours per night so it took me 5 days to have the kit paid for. i started reloading about a year ago originally just for .45 acp i now reload for 9mm, .45 acp and .223, soon i hope to start doing 38 special and 357 mag :D
the best part is i shoot more for less money now! :83::68::36::party:

XDRoX
12-30-2010, 7:44 AM
ive been thinking of reloading myself since i picked up my 38 super

i was thinking of getting this, sounds like a simple way to get started
http://www.leeprecision.com/html/catalog/lp1000.html
http://www.leeprecision.com/graphics/shoppingcart/pro1000.jpg

Like iareCunfusE said, I think it's a good idea to start on a single stage as well. There are many though, that say just to get the progressive first. I have 2 single stages on my bench and they constantly still get used.

anhero
12-30-2010, 8:34 AM
don't forget Forster presses in the single stage area

vNaK
12-30-2010, 9:11 AM
Thanks for the info!

Btw, so how much actual space would be the minimum for setting up a reloading station?

XDRoX
12-30-2010, 9:15 AM
Thanks for the info!

Btw, so how much actual space would be the minimum for setting up a reloading station?

Check out this thread:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=364006&highlight=apartment

zfields
12-30-2010, 9:51 AM
Thanks for the info!

Btw, so how much actual space would be the minimum for setting up a reloading station?

my bench is a 2x4 table, and thats about twice the ammount of room I need.

bsg
12-30-2010, 12:55 PM
the math is right trust me. if you buy a kit for 300 bucks at bass pro (i got the rock chucker supreme) and only reload .45 acp (like i did in the beginning) you stand to save around .25-.30 cents per round, might not sound like much but, if you reload 1000 rounds you just saved 300 bucks, and the whole kit has paid for itself and you now got 1000 rounds of .45. now everything you load after that is pure savings, and the kit doesnt take that long to pay for itself figure 100 rounds a night (that is only about 2 hours of your time per night) it would only take 10 days to get 1000 rounds, i average about 100 rounds an hour and did 2 hours per night so it took me 5 days to have the kit paid for. i started reloading about a year ago originally just for .45 acp i now reload for 9mm, .45 acp and .223, soon i hope to start doing 38 special and 357 mag :D
the best part is i shoot more for less money now! :83::68::36::party:

thanks man. i need a good excuse to escape to the garage; of course she'll follow me out there. maybe i can put her to work!

oh... i'm talking about my rott "Poki." my pit "Fester" would be happy to get rid of her for a few hours a night.

Killawhale415
12-30-2010, 2:13 PM
Great thread, really good info.
And of course its a bonus when we get to see oceanbob's evil lab

Corbin Dallas
12-30-2010, 2:34 PM
Like iareCunfusE said, I think it's a good idea to start on a single stage as well. There are many though, that say just to get the progressive first. I have 2 single stages on my bench and they constantly still get used.

For precision rifle reloading, I agree.

HOWever, for quantity reloading of handgun ammo, I disagree 1 million percent.

Everyone here talks about how a single stage is the best way to go and how much reloading will save you money.

Really? What's your time worth? How about time with your kids, spouse, maybe time you might use to do other items around the house but because you have to run the press for 2 hours to get 100 rounds of ammo ready for the next IDPA/IPSC match.

Yea, in the time it takes you to get 100 rounds out of your single stage, me and my progressive with case and bullet feeders have cranked out 2000 round of ammo. YES, that number is correct - 1000/hour.


Let's look at the numbers for 1 single stage and 1 progressive with the works.

$300 for a single stage from whoever including die set

$850 for a progressive press including case feeder and die set
$550 for the bullet feeder

Now, granted that's a huge difference in price... however, how many hours do you want to spend in your man cave loading ONE case at a time. Not to mention the hand priming of each case and then the setup and re-setup of each die in the die set.

Let's say you load 100 rounds here:

Step 1 - Deprime cases (this is the easy part)
Step 2 - Prime each case with hand held primer (not too bad)
Step 3 - Remove deprime die, Setup powder drop die, flare case and drop powder into each case (ok, don't spill any or knock the tray over. Oh yea, don't forget to weigh your drop and make sure you're not over/under charging the round)
Step 4 - Remove powder drop system, setup seat/crimp die (test OAL and crimp, reset as necessary)
Step 5 - Place bullet on each case and run through single stage

Now you're done with 100 rounds. You've only touched the cases 500 times and it took you 2 hours to do.

What's that time worth to you? $40 or more?

Big deal you say... I like doing this... It's my hobby and I enjoy it...

Yea? Me too. I just don't like the part where I have to waste HOURS of my time for 100 rounds of ammo. This is why I purchased a progressive.

No one is saying you have to go big like Bob or myself on a setup, but do your homework. Calculate the break even point of a progressive INCLUDING your labor to do the work.

If I had a single stage, I wouldn't be here typing this, I'd be in the garage loading rounds for my match on Sunday.

:43:


Lastly, I want to point something out here.

Assuming brass is free, let's calculate out a 1000 rounds of ammo, total cost with labor (I'll be generous)

Brass - Free
Bullets - $75 (9mm example from OP)
Primers - $25 (average cost)
Powder - $20 (Assuming 1lb will load 1000 rounds or more)

That's $120 for 1000 rounds or $12 a box (components ONLY, no shipping, tax, gunshow/parking fee, etc included)

Now down to the labor

IF you could load 100 rounds in 1 hour on a single stage it would take you 10 hours

IF you could load 400 rounds in 1 hour on a progressive it would take you 2.5 hours

Assuming $10/hour labor cost the single stage would cost $100 in labor, the progressive $25 in labor.

Are you now understanding how a progressive will not only save you money but give you a better ROI in the long run?

calishine
12-30-2010, 2:42 PM
thx for taking the time to post this :)

iareConfusE
12-30-2010, 4:52 PM
For precision rifle reloading, I agree.

HOWever, for quantity reloading of handgun ammo, I disagree 1 million percent.

Everyone here talks about how a single stage is the best way to go and how much reloading will save you money.

Really? What's your time worth? How about time with your kids, spouse, maybe time you might use to do other items around the house but because you have to run the press for 2 hours to get 100 rounds of ammo ready for the next IDPA/IPSC match.

Yea, in the time it takes you to get 100 rounds out of your single stage, me and my progressive with case and bullet feeders have cranked out 2000 round of ammo. YES, that number is correct - 1000/hour.


Let's look at the numbers for 1 single stage and 1 progressive with the works.

$300 for a single stage from whoever including die set

$850 for a progressive press including case feeder and die set
$550 for the bullet feeder

Now, granted that's a huge difference in price... however, how many hours do you want to spend in your man cave loading ONE case at a time. Not to mention the hand priming of each case and then the setup and re-setup of each die in the die set.

Let's say you load 100 rounds here:

Step 1 - Deprime cases (this is the easy part)
Step 2 - Prime each case with hand held primer (not too bad)
Step 3 - Remove deprime die, Setup powder drop die, flare case and drop powder into each case (ok, don't spill any or knock the tray over. Oh yea, don't forget to weigh your drop and make sure you're not over/under charging the round)
Step 4 - Remove powder drop system, setup seat/crimp die (test OAL and crimp, reset as necessary)
Step 5 - Place bullet on each case and run through single stage

Now you're done with 100 rounds. You've only touched the cases 500 times and it took you 2 hours to do.

What's that time worth to you? $40 or more?

Big deal you say... I like doing this... It's my hobby and I enjoy it...

Yea? Me too. I just don't like the part where I have to waste HOURS of my time for 100 rounds of ammo. This is why I purchased a progressive.

No one is saying you have to go big like Bob or myself on a setup, but do your homework. Calculate the break even point of a progressive INCLUDING your labor to do the work.

If I had a single stage, I wouldn't be here typing this, I'd be in the garage loading rounds for my match on Sunday.

:43:


Lastly, I want to point something out here.

Assuming brass is free, let's calculate out a 1000 rounds of ammo, total cost with labor (I'll be generous)

Brass - Free
Bullets - $75 (9mm example from OP)
Primers - $25 (average cost)
Powder - $20 (Assuming 1lb will load 1000 rounds or more)

That's $120 for 1000 rounds or $12 a box (components ONLY, no shipping, tax, gunshow/parking fee, etc included)

Now down to the labor

IF you could load 100 rounds in 1 hour on a single stage it would take you 10 hours

IF you could load 400 rounds in 1 hour on a progressive it would take you 2.5 hours

Assuming $10/hour labor cost the single stage would cost $100 in labor, the progressive $25 in labor.

Are you now understanding how a progressive will not only save you money but give you a better ROI in the long run?

I have 8 hours of free time every day after work, and 24 hours of free time on each of my 3 days off :)

Corbin Dallas
12-30-2010, 4:54 PM
I have 8 hours of free time every day after work, and 24 hours of free time on each of my 3 days off :)

And you want to spend ALL this time loading rounds? Ok. Have fun with that.

Beelzy
12-30-2010, 5:08 PM
Man Cave, a new standard has been set:

It's close.....But I don't see a fridge for the beer nor a shelf for the Porn. :D

Smokinthehippies
12-30-2010, 5:14 PM
Gotta say thanks for this thread been interested in reloading as of late and was hoping to find a good intro thread. Hope this doesn't get moved so I can keep the bookmark useful.

Oceanbob
12-30-2010, 5:19 PM
Assuming brass is free, let's calculate out a 1000 rounds of ammo, total cost with labor (I'll be generous)

Brass - Free
Bullets - $75 (9mm example from OP)
Primers - $25 (average cost)
Powder - $20 (Assuming 1lb will load 1000 rounds or more)

That's $120 for 1000 rounds or $12 a box (components ONLY, no shipping, tax, gunshow/parking fee, etc included)



Actually 1000 rounds is 20, fifty round boxes. 20 boxes of 9MM for $120.

120 bucks divided by 20 is $6 per box of 50.

$6

Not bad....my labor is free and this is one of my hobby's as well.

I agree that a fast progressive for pistol ammo is a good idea. Keep the single stage for loading those custom .308s...:43:

Don't forget at the GUNSHOW that $13 beer and corned beef sandwich..;)
And the one you bought for your kids who hated it...hehehe.

Oceanbob
12-30-2010, 5:37 PM
It's close.....But I don't see a fridge for the beer nor a shelf for the Porn. :D

I will post these Fridge photos...no porn...too many kids running around..:D

This Fridge is well stocked with everything I like. Good beer, some White Wine, Cold Water, Fruit, Throw-Back Mountain Dew (for the kids)

http://i56.tinypic.com/2pr5o3r.jpg

Anti-crise with fangs..lol..we reload for ZOMBIES
http://i55.tinypic.com/sfdwsi.jpg

Corbin Dallas
12-30-2010, 7:46 PM
Actually 1000 rounds is 20, fifty round boxes. 20 boxes of 9MM for $120.

120 bucks divided by 20 is $6 per box of 50.

$6

Not bad....my labor is free and this is one of my hobby's as well.

I agree that a fast progressive for pistol ammo is a good idea. Keep the single stage for loading those custom .308s...:43:

Don't forget at the GUNSHOW that $13 beer and corned beef sandwich..;)
And the one you bought for your kids who hated it...hehehe.

Sorry, I was thinking WWB value packs (100/box) and like you said, when you really add up all the costs involved, you are saving money, but on a single stage, not that much when you factor time in.

iareConfusE
12-30-2010, 7:52 PM
And you want to spend ALL this time loading rounds? Ok. Have fun with that.

I have a progressive. I was just trying to make a point. Some people have a lot of free time and don't mind relaxing by doing what they love to do. I for one wouldn't mind sitting down and reloading for a couple hours and just taking it easy. I already work pretty hard and diligently at work, I don't need to turn myself into a machine while doing what I enjoy as well. I'll just sit down, and reload leisurely (Of course while still paying attention to what I'm doing), but I don't need to sweat over it.

donger
12-30-2010, 8:05 PM
And you want to spend ALL this time loading rounds? Ok. Have fun with that.

Some people enjoy the long drive to their destination. ;)

Uriah02
12-30-2010, 8:16 PM
A while ago there were a number of reloading seminars put together that were filled quick. Are people still doing those?

Speedpower
12-30-2010, 8:23 PM
Okay, I'm thinking of upgrading my reloader but can't decide between a Dillon 1050 and a Hornady Lock n Load with Brass feeder, which is better between the 2, I currently have a brand new single stage Hornady reloader which I haven't even use yet, but want to go to the progressive route, please advise!

XDRoX
12-30-2010, 8:34 PM
Okay, I'm thinking of upgrading my reloader but can't decide between a Dillon 1050 and a Hornady Lock n Load with Brass feeder, which is better between the 2, I currently have a brand new single stage Hornady reloader which I haven't even use yet, but want to go to the progressive route, please advise!

Do you mean 650? There is no comparison between a 1050 and a LNL. The 1050 is better.

But if you are comparing a 650 to the LNL, that's going to be a lot opinion. Persoanlly I'd rather have a 650, but I know people that have both and prefer the LNL. It's a tough call.

Speedpower
12-30-2010, 8:44 PM
Do you mean 650? There is no comparison between a 1050 and a LNL. The 1050 is better.

But if you are comparing a 650 to the LNL, that's going to be a lot opinion. Persoanlly I'd rather have a 650, but I know people that have both and prefer the LNL. It's a tough call.

It seems like the LNL with the case feeder is cheaper than the XL650 + case feeder, does both perform the same?

XDRoX
12-30-2010, 8:48 PM
It seems like the LNL with the case feeder is cheaper than the XL650 + case feeder, does both perform the same?

Yes, the LNL is slightly cheaper, and much cheaper for caliber conversions. IMO both machines are comparable. They are both auto indexing and have 5 stations. Both warranties are superb. It's a toss up really. If you can, load on each and see what you prefer.

Oceanbob
12-30-2010, 8:53 PM
I have a progressive. I was just trying to make a point. Some people have a lot of free time and don't mind relaxing by doing what they love to do. I for one wouldn't mind sitting down and reloading for a couple hours and just taking it easy. I already work pretty hard and diligently at work, I don't need to turn myself into a machine while doing what I enjoy as well. I'll just sit down, and reload leisurely (Of course while still paying attention to what I'm doing), but I don't need to sweat over it.

I love puttering around the garage..no hurry...I might get way-laid on some project (I'am trying to fix up a couple of Nylon 66 Rifles now)...But I am never in a hurry to reload. If I was shooting Competition that might change things. I listen to soft music, load some 10MM or .45.

I have a lot of components that I bought years ago. So my time is all it costs me. :D

Blackhawk556
12-30-2010, 9:21 PM
A while ago there were a number of reloading seminars put together that were filled quick. Are people still doing those?

anyone?

iareConfusE
12-30-2010, 9:52 PM
Just did my own quick cost analysis of commercial vs reloaded 9mm and .45ACP.

Here's what I got based on where I shop for commercial ammo, and where I buy my reloaded components. The reloaded numbers assume that you are picking up fired brass from the range, making your cost for brass "free".

Commercial .45ACP ~ $.40/round
Reloaded .45ACP ~ $.15/round

Commercial 9mm ~ $.21/round
Reloaded 9mm ~ $.15/round

So, you save a LOT reloading .45ACP. If you purchase 1000 rounds of commercial .45ACP, it costs you $400, and if you reload 1000 rounds of .45ACP, it costs you only $150. That's $250 savings in just 1000 rounds - insanely significant. Chances are you can even get the cost per reloaded round even cheaper if you buy components on clearance or sale.

You don't seem to save a whole lot reloading 9mm though. Only $60 savings in 1000 rounds, which is still a good sum of money but obviously not as substantial as .45ACP savings.

If you only shoot 9mm, your excuse for reloading would be to get around AB962 and saving just a few bucks. If you shoot .45ACP and don't reload, you're just silly.

zfields
12-30-2010, 9:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uriah02
A while ago there were a number of reloading seminars put together that were filled quick. Are people still doing those?

anyone?

anyone?

Id be more then welcome to help out anyone in the north bay/sonoma county area.

Im set up for 9mm on my turret, and .45 on my progressive. Have a single stage also if someone would prefer to learn on that.

Blackhawk556
12-30-2010, 10:25 PM
@ iareconfuse.....Wow now that's saving for 45cal. With those prices, I wouldn't mind buying a 1911 in 45acp. The only reason I only shoot 9mm right now is because 45 is sooo freaking expensive ...................@zfields..I live too far :(

iareConfusE
12-30-2010, 10:32 PM
@ iareconfuse.....Wow now that's saving for 45cal. With those prices, I wouldn't mind buying a 1911 in 45acp. The only reason I only shoot 9mm right now is because 45 is sooo freaking expensive ...................@zfields..I live too far :(

That's exactly the reason I only shoot 9mm right now. But I just bought a reloading press, so I'll be able to roll .45 and now I have an excuse to buy a 1911 and join the club.

joelogic
12-30-2010, 10:36 PM
What bullets are you using for your $0.15 .45 reloads?

iareConfusE
12-30-2010, 10:57 PM
What bullets are you using for your $0.15 .45 reloads?

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1050115811

$60 for 500 bullets. $.12 per bullet. In my calculation, I forgot to mention that I assumed you pick up your brass from the range, so I counted that as "free"

zfields
12-30-2010, 11:31 PM
I get closer to around 17 cents per round, bringing in consideration of primers.

iareConfusE
12-31-2010, 12:37 AM
I get closer to around 17 cents per round, bringing in consideration of primers.

The cost of primers was factored into my calculations. Perhaps the prices I'm seeing are a bit cheaper because I have a dealer account with MidwayUSA.

loosewreck
12-31-2010, 12:47 AM
That room is larger than my apartment.

:smilielol5:

You said it! Space is my limiting factor too. Reloading is in my grand scheme though, especially these days.

Jimmy310
12-31-2010, 1:37 AM
Im getting into reloading too. I got most of my essentials, i just need dies for .223, 9mm, .40sw, and .303 brit...not to mention bullets, primers, and powder.

If anybody wants to let me come over and see how its done, i'll bring over beer and help out. If anybody comes over and shows me on my kit, i'll buy you beer and pizza or you can take home some rounds.

iareConfusE
12-31-2010, 1:44 AM
Im getting into reloading too. I got most of my essentials, i just need dies for .223, 9mm, .40sw, and .303 brit...not to mention bullets, primers, and powder.

If anybody wants to let me come over and see how its done, i'll bring over beer and help out. If anybody comes over and shows me on my kit, i'll buy you beer and pizza or you can take home some rounds.

I've had a couple people offer to help me set up my press when it all arrives. I'm pretty much just letting whoever wants to come over just come over. Right now I think two or three people will be stopping by my home. You're welcome to join them and learn alongside as well. I'm not exactly new to reloading, as I've tried once before but I still have plenty of questions that I need to ask pertaining to die set up and cartridge characteristics.

BanjoGunner
12-31-2010, 7:09 AM
I reloaded for my .357 back in college, but stopped after I graduated and moved to the Bay Area. I wasn't shooting as much and it wasn't worth the time any more. Now that I'm not working, shooting more, and coupled with the current cost of store-bought ammo, I'm giving it some serious consideration once again. I'm looking at set-ups to do .357/.38sp, 9mm and .223.

Low-Pressure
12-31-2010, 7:30 AM
For those who wants to learn the basics and live near where LA county meets OC county. Field Time Sports and Guns is doing a reloading class on Jan 8. I went to their class early this year, learned the basics and bought my reloading manual there. Now it's just another hobby that helps to keep the other hobby going :).
http://www.fieldtimesportsandguns.com/Coming_Attractions.html

Noobie
12-31-2010, 7:39 AM
Man Cave, a new standard has been set:

Is range attached!!!

Fishslayer
12-31-2010, 8:47 AM
I'll go against the norm & recommend a turret press over a single stage for pistol ammo. I started with a Lee Classic & I can say pretty surely that I would have gone nuts with a single stage.

It takes maybe 15 seconds to turn my turret into a single stage, which I actually do when I need to decap a bunch of brass.

A lot of space isn't really necessary. Mine is in a corner of the garage. The press has since moved to the far right . More efficient use of space.

http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn215/THE_Fishslayer/OSR/100_1045.jpg

Bill Steele
12-31-2010, 8:59 AM
I just returned to reloading after decades off. I am loading handgun right now on my old single stage press (the cheapest way to get started). It is pretty slow going when you want to load 200 rounds.

I shoot about 200 rounds a week. The money I will save in a year will pay for a fully loaded Dillion progressive press that will make churning out 200 rounds quick work. Guess what is next on my shopping list?

I do think starting with a single stage press is fine if you are unsure whether reloading is for you, as you will likely have a use for it when you do eventually spring for that progressive outfit. :)

racky
12-31-2010, 9:13 AM
my modest setup:

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a17/rackycurva/2A%20stuff/38410_412078743714_688673714_4935172_6352654_n.jpg

andalusi
12-31-2010, 10:52 AM
First of all, thanks to the OP for this thread! Very helpful stuff.

I do have a question about scales, though. Is there that much difference between electronic scales? And is there any reason (other than convenience) not to just buy a beam scale to start out with?

mike100
12-31-2010, 11:23 AM
I have 8 hours of free time every day after work, and 24 hours of free time on each of my 3 days off :)

Believe me, the novelty wears off.

I used to have two xl650 progressives (one for each primer size), but sold one off to recover funds and also to make room for some shotshell reloaders I bought. The other day I had to change calibers and the primer feed mechanism and I was really questioning if I should have sold that second press...and I DON'T EVEN SHOOT EVERY WEEK ANYMORE. time is money, for sure.

I'm pretty happy with the capability to do 300-400 rounds an hour. I could spend more to increase my capability, but maybe later on when I get back into shooting again.

XDRoX
12-31-2010, 11:54 AM
First of all, thanks to the OP for this thread! Very helpful stuff.

I do have a question about scales, though. Is there that much difference between electronic scales? And is there any reason (other than convenience) not to just buy a beam scale to start out with?

The beam scales are usually more accurate than the digitals unless you get a very expensive digital. I would not recommend only owning a digital. Most people use beams and they work great. The Dillon one I posted in my OP is one of the cheapest and nicest ones out there. IMO, start out with a good beam scale like the Dillon or an RCBS 505. Either will last a lifetime.

XDRoX
12-31-2010, 11:57 AM
To those of you guys that think it takes too much time to reload or your time is more valuable and you'd rather pay walmart prices, consider this:

It would take me about an hour to drive to walmart and buy ammo.
Or I could walk into my garage and load 500 pistol rounds in an hour and I'm paying half the price for much better ammo.

fullrearview
12-31-2010, 12:01 PM
I was like, "12$ a box...F-that!" I pay 10 something a box at waldos world!

zfields
12-31-2010, 1:04 PM
To those of you guys that think it takes too much time to reload or your time is more valuable and you'd rather pay walmart prices, consider this:

It would take me about an hour to drive to walmart and buy ammo.
Or I could walk into my garage and load 500 pistol rounds in an hour and I'm paying half the price for much better ammo.

thats if they even have ammo. My local wally world has had .45 one time in the last year that I have seen. 9mm a little more common, but still rarely.

iareConfusE
01-01-2011, 1:02 PM
BUMP. People need to know!

JanG
01-01-2011, 1:44 PM
i usually just stop by walmart and get ammo on my way to the range or when i'm there for groceries/shopping.

frankiejoe577
01-01-2011, 1:52 PM
I already reload but its a bummer that I will be forced to reload with the prices of ammo is stores near by. :-(

Pubert
01-01-2011, 2:55 PM
I will post these Fridge photos...no porn...too many kids running around..:D

This Fridge is well stocked with everything I like. Good beer, some White Wine, Cold Water, Fruit, Throw-Back Mountain Dew (for the kids)

Anti-crise with fangs..lol..we reload for ZOMBIES
http://i55.tinypic.com/sfdwsi.jpg

REMINDER: TURN OFF COMPRESSOR BEFORE CALLING IN SICK!

Love it - that's a lesson right there! I'm sure the story behind it is good! I take it you're talking about a shop compressor and not the fridge's compressor?

Nice setup BTW!

zdragon
01-01-2011, 3:18 PM
First of all, thanks to the OP for this thread! Very helpful stuff.

I do have a question about scales, though. Is there that much difference between electronic scales? And is there any reason (other than convenience) not to just buy a beam scale to start out with?

i use my digital scale primarily because it would cut my reloading time in half.
My Lee beam scale would measure exactly the same as my digital when i do my cross checking.

Rugerdaddy
01-02-2011, 9:23 AM
Why do you have a picture of my mother-in-law on your fridge??? :rolleyes:

http://i55.tinypic.com/sfdwsi.jpg

Actually, I'm glad this thread was started in the "wrong" forum, because it's got me seriously thinking about reloading, which I've never done before! (I've thought about it, but never done it.)

Oceanbob
01-02-2011, 9:50 AM
REMINDER: TURN OFF COMPRESSOR BEFORE CALLING IN SICK!

Love it - that's a lesson right there! I'm sure the story behind it is good! I take it you're talking about a shop compressor and not the fridge's compressor?

Nice setup BTW!

The main purpose of my 3.5 car garage is building a homebuilt airplane called the RV-7. It requires about 15,000 rivets installed with a rivet gun, powered by "Steve" our compressor. The joke on the forums (same format as this forum) http://www.vansairforce.com/community/index.php
is the compressor is always running....and people get so involved building their airplane that they skip work. So they call in sick....(turn OFF the compressor before calling in sick)..

Here's the shop before starting....I am waiting for more parts on the Airsheen; about March.
http://i50.tinypic.com/15hjx93.jpg
Horizontal Stabilizer
http://i48.tinypic.com/2remgqq.jpg
More tail parts with blueprints.

http://i50.tinypic.com/2079cux.jpg
Steve, our compressor...
http://i45.tinypic.com/ibkjnm.jpg

cmaher55
01-02-2011, 9:59 AM
Chris, thanks for posting this up. Very good info for those of us who are on the cusp of starting this new hobby. Now only for more time, money, and garage space and I'm set...! Regards

iareConfusE
01-02-2011, 11:47 AM
The main purpose of my 3.5 car garage is building a homebuilt airplane called the RV-7. It requires about 15,000 rivets installed with a rivet gun, powered by "Steve" our compressor. The joke on the forums (same format as this forum) http://www.vansairforce.com/community/index.php
is the compressor is always running....and people get so involved building their airplane that they skip work. So they call in sick....(turn OFF the compressor before calling in sick)..

Here's the shop before starting....I am waiting for more parts on the Airsheen; about March.
http://i50.tinypic.com/15hjx93.jpg
Horizontal Stabilizer
http://i48.tinypic.com/2remgqq.jpg
More tail parts with blueprints.

http://i50.tinypic.com/2079cux.jpg
Steve, our compressor...
http://i45.tinypic.com/ibkjnm.jpg

Homemade airplanes?... That's freaking awesome...

Don the savage
01-02-2011, 1:09 PM
People who do not reload don't like to reload. People who don't like to clean their guns don't clean their guns. You cant change their minds or beliefs.
But statements like "you wont save money reloading" are not always true or false. If you go out and buy a $700 dollar Dillon progressive and shoot 50 rounds a month, no you will not save money. If you have time and a minimum of space you can get set up for less than $500 dollars all inclusive.
My set up is a Lee turret press and I also have a Lee Single stage setup. Total cost for both around $120. I have a Franklin reloading stand to keep both presses set up and off my work bench, (Which you don't need if you already have a bench) $65 from Midway, Dies for any caliber $35, I also have a disk powder measure which runs $20. Digital calipers are $12 at Harbor Freight Tools and a scale can run anywhere from $30 to $100 Plus, reloading manuals run from free ionline to $50. Thats my outlay for equipment, around $300 to start, and I have plenty for left from my $500 for components which at the gun show run $20 for a pound of powder (which goes along way for 9mm or .45) $30 for 1000 primers and $60 to $112 for bullets (Berrys bullets, jacketed per 1000 depending on caliber, from Miwall).
I load 9mm for around $4.50 for 50 and .45 for around $7.00 ( I use IMR 700x powder your powder load/costs will vary)
If you want to save money it can be easily done. If you can beat my costs on factory ammo please let me know so I can catch up on some TV...or something.
Check my math here;
http://www.handloads.com/calc/loadingCosts.asp

So if you want to reload it is pretty easy and you can save a lot of money if you stay simple.

vintagearms
01-02-2011, 1:37 PM
Ya, I hear you. It's just that most of the people in that forum already know these basics, so I'd thought I'd post it here.

A bench is also a necessity that I left off, thanks.

I have toyed with the idea of reloading but haven't made the jump yet. As I have never frequented the reloading forum, I appreciate your post here. :D

Jimmy310
01-06-2011, 1:39 PM
i use my digital scale primarily because it would cut my reloading time in half.
My Lee beam scale would measure exactly the same as my digital when i do my cross checking.

What kind of digital scale are you using. I have a redding beam scale and can already tell that measuring powder is going to be the longest/hardest part of reloading.

XDRoX
01-06-2011, 1:43 PM
What kind of digital scale are you using. I have a redding beam scale and can already tell that measuring powder is going to be the longest/hardest part of reloading.

The best cheap digital scale you can get is made by Dillon, which I linked in my OP.

But I don't see why weighing charges should take any time. When I reload, I weigh the first load. It always measures the same, and then I load 300 rounds. You only use the scale in the beginning to check your powder drop.

XDRoX
01-06-2011, 1:46 PM
Here's a video of me loading some 223:
axVq0ADL-fg

iareConfusE
01-06-2011, 2:23 PM
The best cheap digital scale you can get is made by Dillon, which I linked in my OP.

But I don't see why weighing charges should take any time. When I reload, I weigh the first load. It always measures the same, and then I load 300 rounds. You only use the scale in the beginning to check your powder drop.

You don't check your powder measure for consistency every several rounds?

XDRoX
01-06-2011, 3:19 PM
You don't check your powder measure for consistency every several rounds?

No, I check it at the beginning of each session and then load. I have a separate powder measure for each caliber so they never get adjusted. I haven't adjusted some of them in thousands of rounds. I really don't even need to check at the beginning as it's always exactly on.

I just do out of habit and in case the powder measure fairy came in in the middle of the night and moved it on me:D

Oceanbob
01-06-2011, 3:27 PM
Here's a video of me loading some 223:
axVq0ADL-fg

I see you're pumping out primed brass...cool..

And..it appears that the ROLLER handle is much better than the ball.

Arrg...another order to Dillon.

Bob

XDRoX
01-06-2011, 3:46 PM
I see you're pumping out primed brass...cool..

And..it appears that the ROLLER handle is much better than the ball.

Arrg...another order to Dillon.

Bob

IMO the roller handle is worth its weight in gold. Me and some buddies had a 223 prepping party and so the brass was all ready to go.

Here's what my press looks like now. I pimped it out for Christmas.
http://members.cox.net/chrismosteller/PC253847.JPG

Blackhawk556
01-27-2011, 9:11 PM
For those who wants to learn the basics and live near where LA county meets OC county. Field Time Sports and Guns is doing a reloading class on Jan 8. I went to their class early this year, learned the basics and bought my reloading manual there. Now it's just another hobby that helps to keep the other hobby going :).
http://www.fieldtimesportsandguns.com/Coming_Attractions.html

anyone know of a place up north that teaches the basics like field times does??
if not i'm going to head down there in march

Ezekiel2000
01-27-2011, 9:34 PM
How far north you looking for? I know J&R in Livermore does reloading classes every so often.

Blackhawk556
01-27-2011, 9:54 PM
Livermore is by Pleasanton right? This is actually better, only a two hour drive from Madera. Do I have to call them? Or do they have info on a website?

247Nino
01-27-2011, 10:56 PM
I bought a book... now I wait

Ezekiel2000
01-28-2011, 5:41 AM
Livermore is by Pleasanton right? This is actually better, only a two hour drive from Madera. Do I have to call them? Or do they have info on a website?

I'd call. I'm on their mailing list and I know I've seen mention of reloading classes a few times from them. See if they have any on the horizon maybe.

J&R Sports Supply LLC
2558-B Old First St
Livermore, CA 94550
Phone: (925) 443-9691

Store Hours:
Monday - Friday 10:00AM to 6:00PM
Sat-Sun 10:00AM to 3:00 PM

OC-Indian
01-29-2011, 11:30 AM
ive been thinking of reloading myself since i picked up my 38 super

i was thinking of getting this, sounds like a simple way to get started
http://www.leeprecision.com/html/catalog/lp1000.html
http://www.leeprecision.com/graphics/shoppingcart/pro1000.jpg

I followed the link but do not see any listings for Rem6.8SPC parts. Is this the wrong machine to reload the 6.8? Can someone reccomend a different setup?

XDRoX
01-29-2011, 11:49 AM
I followed the link but do not see any listings for Rem6.8SPC parts. Is this the wrong machine to reload the 6.8? Can someone reccomend a different setup?

I PM'd you back. I don't know if that Lee can load 6.8SPC, but I know the Dillon 550b can. That's the one in my video above.

meaty-btz
01-29-2011, 12:33 PM
I was looking at your dillon and thinking.. damn that would be bonhead simple cludge an automation for. Maybe $100 in parts + a PLC and you could fully automate that process.

DannyZRC
01-29-2011, 12:50 PM
especially with case and bullet feeders, hah.

but it's a bad idea, you should be there to pay attention and make sure things are running right.

XDRoX
01-29-2011, 4:20 PM
I was looking at your dillon and thinking.. damn that would be bonhead simple cludge an automation for. Maybe $100 in parts + a PLC and you could fully automate that process.

Youtube it. It has been done and it is sick.

Kid Stanislaus
01-29-2011, 5:39 PM
I hope more people get into Reloading....it's fun and saves money.
Be well
Bob

Oh...lol...you forgot the Dillon 1050....1200 rounds per hour.....I know you have to be a WEIRDO to get one, but some on this forum will love the 1050.

:D The one on the left..1050..on the right a 550B with case feeder...

http://i51.tinypic.com/2zhr33r.jpg

When I start robbing banks for a living I'll get me a reloading room just like that one!!