PDA

View Full Version : what should i ask a dealer when purchasing a Garand?


Hornet_RN
12-04-2010, 9:26 AM
i almost dropped around 1k for a Garand at a gun show without doing any research, good thing i stopped myself...whew! anyways, i need help, because i don't really know what questions to ask the dealer when buying a Garand (or any curio and relic firearm).

here is a list of questions i had...

1. can you describe the condition of this rifle? does it still shoot and cycle ammunition well? how worn is the barrel?
2. are these original parts or a mixture of different parts?
3. what year was this rifle manufactured?

PLEASE ADD TO MY LIST OF QUESTIONS FOR M-1 GARAND DEALERS...THANKS! :D

Milsurp Collector
12-04-2010, 9:34 AM
The best place to buy a Garand hands down is the Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP) http://www.thecmp.org/m1garand.htm

I would not tell a first-time buyer to buy anywhere else.

TregoMark
12-04-2010, 10:24 AM
First off, the CMP is the best place to buy a Garand. I would recommend a Service Grade for the first time buyer.

That being said, if you buy from a dealer there are a few things that come to mind. Take a good look at the receiver. It should be stamped on the heel either with Springfield, Winchester, International Harvester (IHC) or H&R (Harrington & Richardson). If it says something else like CAI or something else, than it is a newer made receiver and not worth the potential problems. An original receiver, though, could still be problematic if it has been re-welded or welded. This is the act of taking two parts of different receivers (front and back) that have been previously cut and demilled and welding them together to form a new receiver. I see these pop up from time to time. There are numbers stamped on the "legs" of forward portion of the receiver that will correspond to the serial number of the rifle. These are not matching numbers, but there are resources available to match these numbers together to verify an original un-cut receiver.

Next biggy would be the barrel. Is it clean and shiny with sharp groves? Check the muzzle wear (MW) and the throat erosion (TE) if possible. This will indicate the potential accuracy of the rifle.

Stock can be new of original. All other parts can be examined also to determine whether they are original GI or new made commercial. If you are looking for a rifle to shoot, if doesn’t matter if the parts are "original" to the rifle or "correct". Most Garands were rebuilt by the military at least once.

That's just a few things that come to mind. Good luck and ask lots of questions... :)

mls343
12-04-2010, 10:37 AM
CMP all the way. Don't even waste time with anything else. I saw some rack grade Garands at a shop, still with the CMP tags on them, selling for $1k.

Heck a Service Grade CMP Garand - 2 grades better - only goes for $595 (Springfield).

Also, the requirements for joining the CMP are not hard at all.

Good luck!

Dr.Mauser
12-04-2010, 11:27 AM
Go CMP, I've never seen a crap rifle from them.

Divernhunter
12-04-2010, 11:39 AM
Buy a CMP service grade or if you want a Correct Grade. I have both and am quite happy. I have bought about 9 from them and all were better than discribed on their site. If you need help contact me.

MongooseV8
12-04-2010, 12:14 PM
Im in your shoes OP. I want to get my first Garand like yesterday ;)

I have made the easy choice of buying from CMP, after I meet their requirements of course. I plan on shooting an Appleseed event in the next couple months and getting a membership then buying a Service grade H&R manufacture M1.

The Springfields and the Winchesters are more for the same grade rifle due to demand. Im going to be shooting thousands of rounds through mine so I dont care who made it!

If you buy from CMP, read their website including the FAQ page and rest assured that you will get a better rifle for the money than anywhere else.

kurac
12-04-2010, 2:09 PM
you have to jump through some hoops to buy from the CMP but its 100% worth.

If you by from a dealer, or at a gun show you better be an expert otherwise the chances are you will come out behind on the deal. My first Garand appeared to be a winner, 7mil serial number until I took it home and learned otherwise. At least it had a nice Fajen stock.

Mssr. Eleganté
12-04-2010, 3:27 PM
...7mil serial number...

Ouch! :D

mosinnagantm9130
12-04-2010, 4:11 PM
If you want an M1, buy from the CMP.

You won't get any B.S. from them, and it's a given that you will get a good M1.

microwaveguy
12-04-2010, 5:47 PM
WARNING .......there is no turning back once you have the first one


As stated, the CMP is the only way to go.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=252709
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=263693
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=252180
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=266272
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=245008

LazyAndy
12-04-2010, 5:51 PM
+1 on going the CMP route. Genuine USGI garands so there's no way you can be scammed by random dealers. Plus they are like 600 bucks.

JohanD
12-04-2010, 11:01 PM
CMP hands down.

safewaysecurity
12-04-2010, 11:12 PM
There are no Service Grade Springfield M1s available atm.. =( they are all on backorder.

metalliman545
12-04-2010, 11:42 PM
join the army. and all requirements are waived :)

Mssr. Eleganté
12-04-2010, 11:46 PM
join the army. and all requirements are waived :)

Almost all of the requirements. You still need to be a U.S. citizen.

Markus
12-05-2010, 12:31 AM
what are the cmp requirements again?

Milsurp Collector
12-05-2010, 7:03 AM
what are the cmp requirements again?

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=3777620&postcount=26
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showpost.php?p=5143853&postcount=17

Hornet_RN
12-05-2010, 8:18 AM
this is the original poster...

okay guys, slowly but surely making myself eligible to buy something from the CMP...

1. got my US Passport
2. i just joined the CRPA, so waiting for a membership card now.
3. i have my hunter's education safety card (i also have copies of scores at my local action pistol/3-gun matches)
4. i have no felonies nor am i ineligible to own a firearm. (i already own several firearms)
5. NOW TIME TO DO THE ORDER FORM AND PURCHASER AND CERTIFICATION AGREEMENT!!!

hybridatsun350
12-05-2010, 9:06 AM
CMP



:D

SideWinder11
12-05-2010, 12:03 PM
this is the original poster...

okay guys, slowly but surely making myself eligible to buy something from the CMP...

1. got my US Passport
2. i just joined the CRPA, so waiting for a membership card now.3. i have my hunter's education safety card (i also have copies of scores at my local action pistol/3-gun matches)
4. i have no felonies nor am i ineligible to own a firearm. (i already own several firearms)
5. NOW TIME TO DO THE ORDER FORM AND PURCHASER AND CERTIFICATION AGREEMENT!!!

CRPA will take about 3 weeks to get your card. You can join GCA and it's my understanding that they will electronically update CMP weekly. Or you can just join both :)

RaceDay
12-05-2010, 1:35 PM
this is the original poster...

okay guys, slowly but surely making myself eligible to buy something from the CMP...

1. got my US Passport
2. i just joined the CRPA, so waiting for a membership card now.
3. i have my hunter's education safety card (i also have copies of scores at my local action pistol/3-gun matches)
4. i have no felonies nor am i ineligible to own a firearm. (i already own several firearms)
5. NOW TIME TO DO THE ORDER FORM AND PURCHASER AND CERTIFICATION AGREEMENT!!!

First off let me congratulate you for making the smart choice and going with CMP. You will be getting a great rifle for cheaper than you can in the secondary market.

Yes, it sounds like you are just about ready to go. CRPA membership card (for photocopy proof) sounds like the only hold up. Fill out your paperwork, pay the $10 for a notary at a place like UPS Store, and send in the paperwork with copies of your eligibility paperwork.

Get the service grade. It will have a barrel in very good shape so you probably will never have to replace the barrel... unless you shoot a ton of 30-06 and if you can afford all that ammo then you can afford a new bbl :D

Josh3239
12-05-2010, 1:51 PM
CMP's rating system is worse case scenario. The one I purchased from CMP was a field grade and could easily be considered a service grade. It was the best $500 I ever spent. I don't have a muzzle or throat erosion gauge, but the rifling looks good. The wood handguard are a slightly different color than the stock but there are no cracks. No rust, no pits. Trigger and bolt group are in great shape. It is an SA rifle, but I think it has a few IHC parts on it.

Bottom line, the ratings are worse case scenario and most of the rifles sold in one category could pass off as ones in the above category. I know people suggest service grades, but my field grade looked just as good as many of the service grades I have seen.


There are no Service Grade Springfield M1s available atm.. =( they are all on backorder.

Orlando
12-05-2010, 2:27 PM
I would never take the chance on a mail order Field Grade. I have personally inspected/ gauged many hundreds of them and a very large percentage of them were in need of a rebarrel.
Yes there are a few diamonds in the rough in FG but its not worth the chance.
Mail order a SG and you will not be dissapointed
JMO

003
12-05-2010, 2:29 PM
I certainly do agree with the recommendation that you get your first M-1 from CMP. You cannot go wrong, and you will get what you pay for without having to worry. While I do not suggest you buy a custom made match rifle. You may want to check out the below site which will give you loads of information about what to look for in buying a good M-1. Eric is one of the finest M-1 builders in the US today, he builds the Camp Perry winners, and knows what he is talking about when it comes to the M-1 rifle.

http://www.nationalmatcharmory.com/

InFamous20
12-05-2010, 2:38 PM
You only need to familiarize yourself with the following letters.

CMP! :cool:

maxx424
12-05-2010, 2:48 PM
Hmmmm - I guess I'm going to be the only one here. Got a CMP Garand and yes, it was not really expensive but did not shoot well. If you have a $1000 to spend take a look at the Garand Guy. We have three from him and they are all fantastic. Yes - more money - quite a bit more, but what a nice rifle.

Milsurp Collector
12-05-2010, 5:24 PM
Hmmmm - I guess I'm going to be the only one here. Got a CMP Garand and yes, it was not really expensive but did not shoot well. If you have a $1000 to spend take a look at the Garand Guy. We have three from him and they are all fantastic. Yes - more money - quite a bit more, but what a nice rifle.

What grade did you get from the CMP?

It is possible to get a lemon from anyone, even the Garand Guy http://www.surplusrifleforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=84306&start=0

TregoMark
12-05-2010, 6:22 PM
Hmmmm - I guess I'm going to be the only one here. Got a CMP Garand and yes, it was not really expensive but did not shoot well. If you have a $1000 to spend take a look at the Garand Guy. We have three from him and they are all fantastic. Yes - more money - quite a bit more, but what a nice rifle.

Didn't function? Not accurate? If you bought a Service Grade then you would have received a nice Garand that functions and is accurate to military standards. If you were expecting something else, then maybe you should look elsewhere. If you received a Garand from the CMP that doesn't function, then contact customer service and they will make it right.

Hornet_RN
12-17-2010, 1:54 PM
this is the original poster again...

so i finally collected all the documents needed and sent in my order form yesterday.

i spoke to the CMP yesterday too, they said it would take up to a possible 60 days for my Garand to arrive.

i settled on the M1 Garand Special grade. yeah, it's basically a new rifle, so there is not collector's value at all, but i wanted it to be a shooter! so the stock and barrel is new! i'll update when it comes in here the next month or two.

hornet_rn

trautert
12-17-2010, 2:00 PM
Or less. CMP often under-rates their rifle conditions and over estimates the time it takes to process them. And as someone mentioned, best customer service in the industry.

Hornet_RN
12-30-2010, 2:35 PM
this is the o.p. of this long forgotten post...

but i received an email from the CMP that my order has been verified and received!!!

it should be a little more longer till they actually ship out my M-1 Garand...this is going to be an awesome birthday present (for myself of course)!








"We have received and verified your recent order. Your order will now advance to our sales area and from there to our shipping area. Please note, that unless otherwise listed, our order to ship time is at least 30-60 days. You will receive other emails as the order progresses.

Your customer # is @&*%$#@. Please use this customer # in any communications with us concerning the order as that is where all of your information is stored.

Thank you for your order and support of our program."

G-Man WC
12-30-2010, 9:09 PM
Congrats Hornet RN. Hope to see it on the MP range at USI next year. -g

Nihonto Chicken
12-30-2010, 9:18 PM
this is the o.p. of this long forgotten post...

but i received an email from the CMP that my order has been verified and received!!!

it should be a little more longer till they actually ship out my M-1 Garand...this is going to be an awesome birthday present (for myself of course)!

So what did you order? Of course, you will need to post photos once received. With few downward exceptions, a CMP Garand ranges from (usually not published) "Poor" (I got basically what was described on the web page, no more, no less), to "Good" (I got a helluva lot better than the description) to "Excellent" (I got a near Correct to Collector rifle for a Service Grade price, these are the ones that tend to be publicized).

cruddymutt
12-30-2010, 9:19 PM
this is the o.p. of this long forgotten post...

but i received an email from the CMP that my order has been verified and received!!!

it should be a little more longer till they actually ship out my M-1 Garand...this is going to be an awesome birthday present (for myself of course)!








"We have received and verified your recent order. Your order will now advance to our sales area and from there to our shipping area. Please note, that unless otherwise listed, our order to ship time is at least 30-60 days. You will receive other emails as the order progresses.

Your customer # is @&*%$#@. Please use this customer # in any communications with us concerning the order as that is where all of your information is stored.

Thank you for your order and support of our program."
I got my email today as well. Sounds like we might get ours around the same time. I ordered a Springfield Service grade.

CaliforniaLiberal
12-31-2010, 9:14 AM
Special Grade!! Yes!! You will not regret it, it's sooo beautiful. (Don't tell anyone but I slept with my Special Grade for quite a few days when I first got it.) I am not a trained marksman, just like to shoot targets for fun, but this Garand is like some self aware being that refuses to miss anything it's pointed at.

And don't worry about the Collector's Value thing. In a few years CMP will be out of Garands and there will be a market for your Special Grade should you be insane enough to ever sell it. I think the Special Grade would be a good deal even for $500 more.

Wait a while until the joy and newness start to fade a little and think about getting a couple of service grade Garands for the character and history of them. CMP is conservative about their grading, the rifles are always better than they describe.

Congratulations! Enjoy!!

Exile Machine
12-31-2010, 9:46 AM
Count me among the CMP crowd. Don't forget to order a truckload of surplus ammo as well. The Garand likes a certain flavor of ammo and the new-manufacture stuff is quite expensive.

-Mark