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View Full Version : What would you use if its all you had?


Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 5:55 PM
Ok so I know your all going to hate me, but I'm DYING to know what C&R rifle would you use in a SHTF scenario and why? For me, I would say the G-43, it could be used for CQB or for long range targets with a scope, it uses a high impact round, and would knock down any target it touches. I forgot to hit multiple choice voting, so I would say I'd also like to carry an M1 Carbine as back up, using a .30 Carbine round stopping power close to a .357, I couldnt pass that up.....Please post why! I'm dying to know the reason behind the rifle. :D

Captain Cogle
11-24-2010, 6:06 PM
SVT-40. Ammo is cheap. Easy to find. Semi-Auto, long range, good for all around. Only draw back would be replacement parts but that would be an issue for any of these guns.

Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 6:12 PM
This is true, I should probably invest as much into parts as ammo :D....im joking but 2012 is right around the corner ;)

Beetle Bailey
11-24-2010, 6:13 PM
Errr. . . if it's all I had, I'd use a muzzleloader! :shrug:

I maked US Rifle, Cal 30 M1 since it has great sights, 8-round clip, quick reloads, powerful cartridge, and good reliability.

BTW, I actually found myself in a pickle at the SoCal Tactical Turkey Shoot a few weeks back and had to use my M28 Finnish Mosin Nagant for a carbine stage. Other guys were running RAW's, M1A, featureless OLL, BB OLL, Mini's, etc. I actually outshot a lot of them, but reloads killed me (didn't even have stripper clips) and I finished the stage (24 shots Virginia Count) with a time of 191 seconds.

So I actually did have to use a Mosin or be eaten by zombies and I met the challenge ;) BTW, I would rate the Mosin as good to go for slow moving zombies only.

CSACANNONEER
11-24-2010, 6:34 PM
I either do or have most of the guns on the list. I'd probably take a K31 as long as ammo wasn't an issue.

Rogerbutthead
11-24-2010, 6:35 PM
Ah, I don't know anyone who collects and owns G/K43s who would rely on them in an emergency. They break very easily - as produced - they are vastly overpowered for long term use. Read the Aberdeen Postwar evaluation on the G43 at page 163-165 of Backbone of the Wehrmacht Volume 2 to see how it malfunctioned during these tests.

If you had a shooter's kit (Apfeltor site: http://www.apfeltor.com/html_pages/damage/receiverstress/hobnailspage1.html) installed you'd have a better chance, but most G43 owners would choose an M1 Garand first. (How do I know? - this question has come up before on G43 forums)

I hear G43s work great in computer games, but in real life, with your life on the line, no way should you rely on one. I got over 30 of them, fun to collect, but I would rely on the other weapons I have before I ever used a G43 in a SHTF situation.

Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 6:40 PM
My grandpa has a G-43 bought it in the late 50's, hes never had a problem with his, and its all original parts, I loved the way it fired and the sighting on it, as well as the detachable mags. But without parts, I can what you mean, but for me I would use either the G43 or the K98. Love the Garand, but I'd stick to my 8mm before anything else :D

tgriffin
11-24-2010, 6:45 PM
Im going to say M1 Garand.

Beetle Bailey
11-24-2010, 6:53 PM
If you love 8mm, you should try an FN49 in 8mm :D That would be my second choice after the Garand.

mosinnagantm9130
11-24-2010, 6:55 PM
None of the above?

My first choice for C&R milsurp rifles in a SHTF situation would be an SKS. Plenty reliable, accurate enough, and 7.62x39 wouldn't be hard to find.

On that list though, I'd take an M1 carbine, mostly because it's light and handy, with easy to acquire sights. I'd imagine ammo would be a real pain though.

Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 7:05 PM
i love it, lets keeps this puppy rollin!

8bitnintendo
11-24-2010, 7:06 PM
My first choice for C&R milsurp rifles in a SHTF situation would be an SKS.
:rofl: The first question I had once I saw the list was, "Where's the SKS?"

Captain Cogle
11-24-2010, 7:12 PM
HEH yeah the M1 Garand would be a good pick if it weren't for the charger issue. Might be hard finding more of those and they are fairly easy lose. SKS is also a great pick. I dont know that I can really decide between SVT-40, SKS and a M1-Garand.

But then again, I will be in full operation when your ammo runs out.

I can always make match cord for my matchlocks and I can always find flints for my flintlocks. Replacement parts can be made at home.

rojocorsa
11-24-2010, 7:17 PM
My No.4Mk1* (ironically, I still need to buy that extractor spring for it)---and once I ran out of .303, I'd switch over to my 91/30.

I voted for the Enfield. And I voted according to what I own. But sure, who wouldn't take a damn M-1?

7.62x54R
11-24-2010, 7:25 PM
Of the guns on the list I own a M44 or M39. Because I have the most ammo for them and I know I wouldn't have a problem with them breaking. Preferably having the ammo and the gun it would be an M1 Carbine small light weight. Detachable magazines, maneuverable also high capacity magazines are available.

jms
11-24-2010, 7:25 PM
Surprised it's not on the list, Swedish Mauser M38 or the short M96. Smooth action, accurate and reliable. I reload and got a lot of 'em. You don't really need lots of ammo if all you need is one shot per target.

Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 7:43 PM
Im sorry I forgot the SKS, I was thinking more WWII era and such, my bad friends :( I'm enjoying the input though :D. Im justing thinking K98 and my beloved 8mm for body armor penetration and knock down power from range.

Howie44
11-24-2010, 8:05 PM
I'd have to go with a scout scoped M39. got lots of ammo, I can kill ANYTHING I can see with it, and I keep spare extractors and firing pins for every weapon type I have, so parts aren't really an issue

easy
11-24-2010, 8:17 PM
If it's all I have, it wouldn't really matter now, would it?

steve91104
11-24-2010, 8:20 PM
Where's the SKS?

derteufel
11-24-2010, 8:22 PM
What about any model Mauser? At one time, all I had was a Turk Mauser and would have been just fine using it in a SHTF scenario. I sense that you have a love affair with the K98, but there were other Mauser models in WWII.

Rob454
11-24-2010, 8:27 PM
Garand first if that was not available SVT 40

Haggar85
11-24-2010, 8:28 PM
id use my type 99 as long as i had a couple hundred rounds of 7.7mm. it has a lot of nifty gadgets to aid in zombie clean up.

Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 8:36 PM
Enlighten me about your Type 99 :)

Sheepdog1968
11-24-2010, 8:50 PM
Its not about the weapon. Its about the skill and mindset of the user. You are the wesapon. I really don't have much experience with curio and relics. I'd probably choose one of the bolt actions. Likely a Springfield in 30-06. Why the bolt actions? Of those listed, I'm most comfortable with the bolt actions. I'd be even more comfortable with a lever action.

Haggar85
11-24-2010, 9:13 PM
Enlighten me about your Type 99 :)

it has a machete that attaches to it. it has a good round, slightly more user friendly sights than some other rifles out there, at least my experience.

Dr.Mauser
11-24-2010, 9:23 PM
We talkin the Arisaka model or the LMG Type 99?

Haggar85
11-24-2010, 9:28 PM
i wish i had the LMG, i meant the type 99 bolt action rifle

SoCal Bob
11-24-2010, 9:38 PM
Garand, because its a semi auto with the M38 or 91/30 tied for second.

Interloper
11-24-2010, 10:56 PM
Dude. No SKS?
You would take a G43 over an SKS? Might as well get a "Zombie Bait" tattoo on your forehead.

guns4life
11-24-2010, 11:00 PM
Mosin...cause it's the only C&R I own.

I have a feeling that will be the reason for a few people.

8bitnintendo
11-24-2010, 11:07 PM
If I can't go with SKS I'm going with Nagant M1895 revolver! Gotta love that reload time, not to mention the ammo commonality.

rivraton
11-24-2010, 11:20 PM
A Ballista... I guess you would have to use whatever you've got, if it's all you have.:D
I don't own any of the weapons listed in the poll.

Rogerbutthead
11-24-2010, 11:55 PM
Nagant M1895 revolver? 7.62x38R? Ammo commonality - you funny.

Exile Machine
11-25-2010, 2:28 AM
Of course I'd use the greatest battle implement ever devised.

Moress
11-25-2010, 3:08 AM
Haha, I too saw the title to this thread and instantly thought SKS! More specifically, my Yugo SKS (Yeah I know, it's not a C&R YET!), I just love that thing so much! Along with my RIA 1911, those are all guns I need for any SHTF scenario. :)

From that list tho, I had to pick the M1 Garand. I've never shot one before, but I like the feel of it, love the sights, and the cartridge is very easy to find on the fly. My only issue with Garands as a SHTF weapon is they need En Bloc clips to function, and in the heat of a battle when they go flying out of the gun on empty, you might be to busy running for your life to pick them up, so you could potentially run out of clips and have a useless rifle. Unlike say a Mosin Nagant (My second choice :) ) or an SKS which can still be hand loaded one by one.

metalliman545
11-25-2010, 3:52 AM
If I can't go with SKS I'm going with Nagant M1895 revolver! Gotta love that reload time, not to mention the ammo commonality.

yea what?
its a revolver with a loading gate if you dont use milsurp ammo (from what i heard) you have to use the ejecting road, for each and every single chamber

not to mention the SKS uses 7.62x39
the Nagant uses 7.62x38r

the nagant bullet is recessed INSIDE the brass case.you do not see it at all

http://www.sturmgewehr.com/bhinton/AK/7.62LakeCityB.jpg

this is 7.62x38r
http://surplusrifle.com/shooting/m1895comrade/graphics/l/8.jpg
and the two on the left are the correct rounds the two on the right are reloaded at home by a press

http://surplusrifle.com/shooting/m1895comrade/graphics/l/9.jpg

mls343
11-25-2010, 7:20 AM
M1 Garand for me. 30-06 can be used for everything SHTF - from hunting to self defence. A reliable semi-auto with plenty of available ammo (provided you have the plug), that is accurate as well.

For me, if we were only limited to one long gun, that long gun would be the M1A. The M1 Garand comes is a close 2nd.

Note: The SKS is a very good choice for me as well. I have ruled out bolt actions (although I do love them...) as I think the benefits of a semi-auto for "SHTF" is a better overall choice (getting on targets quicker, follow up shots, etc.).

CSACANNONEER
11-25-2010, 7:29 AM
If I can't go with SKS I'm going with Nagant M1895 revolver! Gotta love that reload time, not to mention the ammo commonality.

How can anyone not recognize your sarcasim?

emc002
11-25-2010, 7:32 AM
Garand for easy access of ammo in the continental US.
The only gun that can reach out and touch somebody better on your list is the K-31 IMHO, but getting ammo in the US during a SHTF? In fact, getting ammo for most of the foreign guns listed in a SHTF, I wish you good luck!

cruddymutt
11-25-2010, 8:12 AM
If I could only grab one gun out of my collection and it HAD to be a C&R then it would be my SKS. It is a tough decision though as one of my snipers would be nice for long range or observation. O well I have a wife and 2 kids so they can carry other rifles;)

MongooseV8
11-25-2010, 8:26 AM
I went with the Garand as well, but only because there was no SKS option :p

M39 is another good choice. There is a crap ton of x54r ammo here in the states now

LazyAndy
11-25-2010, 9:57 AM
Definitely the garand.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 10:00 AM
Again, Im sorry I forgot the SKS! :( Loving this! So I keep hearing about this "plug" for the Garand, what plug are we talking about? The replacement adjustable gas plug for modern ammo? When I had my Garand I wanted to get one but didnt know which one to get I ended up selling it before I moved down here almost 2 years ago.

Rogerbutthead
11-25-2010, 10:07 AM
Never bought one of those 30-06 to 308 chamber inserts.

Seem to have bad press.

http://forums.gunbroker.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=303393

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 10:12 AM
I kinda surprised no one has voted for the Hakim, or FN49.

sevensix2x51
11-25-2010, 10:17 AM
gotta go with my garand. mines chambered for 7.62x51, so new production surplus is pretty rampant, and ive got like 6.2bil enbloc clips for it.

but if it's all i had, i would make do with a pointed stick or a boomerang, if need be.

8bitnintendo
11-25-2010, 10:23 AM
How can anyone not recognize your sarcasm?
Yeah I guess I played that one a little too straight. If SHTF I'd probably be better off throwing my Nagant revolver at someone rather than trying to shoot it.

trautert
11-25-2010, 10:23 AM
The question answers itself. If it's "all I've got", then that's what I'll use.
:rolleyes:

Spiggy
11-25-2010, 10:25 AM
I'll banzai charge if I have to

My home defense shotgun is a chi-com 1897 copy. I'd imagine if it came down to it, I'll use the original one too. Bayonet and all

Cowboy T
11-25-2010, 10:32 AM
In SHTF, my preference would be a bolt-action because of the ruggedness, simplicity, and ultra-reliability. 1st choice would be a Mosin-Nagant because of the dirt-cheap ammo. Ammo prices being equal, I'd go for the 1903 Springfield due to the .30-06's amazing versatility. If that's not available, then the M1 Garand due (again) to the .30-06 round, even though it's semi-auto.

Milsurps
11-25-2010, 10:39 AM
Again, Im sorry I forgot the SKS! :(

You should be ! :mad:

SKS ! :D
.
.
.
.
.
.

;)

Vlad 11
11-25-2010, 10:56 AM
I'm another write-in for the SKS.

Im sorry I forgot the SKS, I was thinking more WWII era and such

Well the SKS was designed during WW2 and supposedly 'A small number of SKS rifles were tested on the front line in early 1945 against the Germans in World War II.' (wiki) which is very plausible. So you wouldn't have been wrong on that one. And having the benefit of being one of the the last major firearm designs of the conflict, I think it took the some of the best elements, corrected the problems of, and updated most of the guns on your list.

rp55
11-25-2010, 10:57 AM
I do have several of the rifles on the poll and after giving it due consideration I would select the M-1 Garand. Primarily because I have two of them in perfect shape, ready to roll and a couple thousand rounds of M2 ball and boxes of clips ready to go. A close second would be the Mosin Nagant varieties. I have a half dozen or so floating around and crates of Russian and Polish surplus 7.62x54R. All the Mosins are not cosmoline free and not all have received the sticky bolt fix is what gave the edge to the Garands. Any of the other rifles would be fine choices as well IMO, except for the M-1 Carbine. While it is a thing of beauty and fun to shoot, I do not consider it to be enough gun for serious social intercourse.

Interloper
11-25-2010, 10:59 AM
I really think the SKS has a lot going for it in a SHTF scenario. Good fire power, decent knock down. There's enough of them around to scavenge parts. 10 rounds and fast to reload but no detachable mag to lose or damage. The bayonet could come in very handy if you run out of quarters or where stealth is desired.
Unfortunately, ammo could become scarce in prolonged SHTF. It's not an uncommon round but LEO's and soldiers aren't going to be carrying it. You won't find it in the average household. In that regard, I can't think of anything more practical than 12 gauge. I think Spiggy's trench guns might be the all around best choice.

Eddie1965
11-25-2010, 10:59 AM
The Garand, semi auto, knock down power and if you run out ammo you still have the bayonet and it's heavy enough to use as a club.

NaughtyMonkey
11-25-2010, 11:39 AM
Its not on the list but how about my Belt feed 1919A4?

I'd choose the M1 Carbine, light weight and compact, can carry more ammo.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 12:58 PM
Ok since we're on the SKS topic, I've wanted a new one for a while now, and I want it to look something like the pic below, my question is how the hell do i get the grenade sight, bayonet, and flash hider off! I had one and hated because of those stupid features, and ideas?


http://lh4.ggpht.com/_8KZqFHa8D1s/SYR7tgd5DyI/AAAAAAAABNc/Po9lSPeOlxI/DSCF0030.JPG

Ergo the Qualmed
11-25-2010, 1:06 PM
Well, guess i'm gonna submit another write-in for the SKS hahahaa

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 1:13 PM
Ok if everyone is voting SKS why not the AK47? Its C&R now is it not? 1947 was well over 50 years ago...

Ergo the Qualmed
11-25-2010, 1:25 PM
Ok if everyone is voting SKS why not the AK47? Its C&R now is it not? 1947 was well over 50 years ago...

I prefer the last-shot bolt-holdopen of the SKS, as well as a magazine I cannot lose, and the ability to load it manually, one at a time, if need be. And it is what I am most familiar with, tbh.

Palimino Stripe
11-25-2010, 1:27 PM
M1 Garands, G43's, SKS's.... Sheesh. Semi-auto rifles are overrated IMO. I'm one of the few guys who voted Lee-Enfield. Why? I like the smooth bolt, the sight picture & acqusition, the round, the magazine capasity... Yeah accuracy isn't on par with say a K31, but it's decent. The only other 'flaws' that I can think of would be it's need for a bolt take-down tool, and the general lack of ammo. But I think the benefits outweigh the drawbacks...

And don't get me wrong- I'm an avid enthusiast of Mosins, Mausers, K31's, and I'm admitted Steyr M95 fanatic. But Lee Enfields are just where it's at; They've been tested in the muddy trenches of WWI, and the deserts & the tropics of WWII.

-Palimino

Lucky Scott
11-25-2010, 1:27 PM
I am another one that will vote for a SKS. Shoots great clean or dirty, easy to tear down, mine shoot great and accurate enough to hit bodies at long range, (if not accurate for a shooting match)
Recoil is not bad so you can hand it to anybody.
Ammo is cheap enough to stockpile and light enough to carry a bunch. Plus, you can load a bunch on stripper clips and be ready to go.
For a back up weapon, a mosin with a scope for long range sniper type stuff.

AK47 not C & R because the old ones were full auto. Hard to find and hard to own legally. Most of the semi auto are not old enough.
(Of course, I could be wrong and if I am corrected by someone smarter than me I will apoligize in advance)

Cali-Shooter
11-25-2010, 1:31 PM
Dude... I can't believe you forgot the SKS. George W. Bush added ones that are 50+ years old to C&R eligibility status after all.

I'm a M1 carbine lover also.

Ergo the Qualmed
11-25-2010, 1:31 PM
M1 Garands, G43's, SKS's.... Sheesh. Semi-auto rifles are overrated IMO. I'm one of the few guys who voted Lee-Enfield. Why? I like the smooth bolt, the sight picture & acqusition, the round, the magazine capasity... Yeah accuracy isn't on par with say a K31, but it's decent. The only other 'flaws' that I can think of would be it's need for a bolt take-down tool, and the general lack of ammo. But I think the benefits outweigh the drawbacks...

And don't get me wrong- I'm an avid enthusiast of Mosins, Mausers, K31's, and I'm admitted Steyr M95 fanatic. But Lee Enfields are just where it's at; They've been tested in the muddy trenches of WWI, and the deserts & the tropics of WWII.

-Palimino


Hey, if I turn the gas-system off on my Yugo SKS, I have a 10-rd straight-pull bolt gun...kinda...hehe:D
If it was good enough to survive in Vietnam, I guess that speaks well for it. Though I would like an Enfield, don't get me wrong.

NaughtyMonkey
11-25-2010, 1:36 PM
Hey, if I turn the gas-system off on my Yugo SKS, I have a 10-rd straight-pull bolt gun...kinda...hehe:D
If it was good enough to survive in Vietnam, I guess that speaks well for it. Though I would like an Enfield, don't get me wrong.

I could do the same with my M1 Garands, turn them into straight bolts.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 1:36 PM
What would be the best ammo for this scenario, for any weapon and why? FMJ, Hollow, Ballistic, Frangible?

NaughtyMonkey
11-25-2010, 1:37 PM
Hollow points, More damage, at least thats my opinion.

Ergo the Qualmed
11-25-2010, 1:38 PM
Hollow points, More damage, at least thats my opinion.

I'd probably choose FMJ, just because I understand that many milsurp rifles are somewhat more reliable when eating it.

Cali-Shooter
11-25-2010, 1:39 PM
What would be the best ammo for this scenario, for any weapon and why? FMJ, Hollow, Ballistic, Frangible?

I think your question depends highly on which weapon system is in question here.

For example, I believe that M1 carbine's have the best stopping power with SP or HP ammo. FMJ's are simply too weak and don't have much hit power.

By contrast, I would be totally fine using FMJ or even AP ammo in an M1 Garand, because the Garand is a hard hitter, even with FMJ ammo. The 30-06 cartridge is no joke :eek:

Ergo the Qualmed
11-25-2010, 1:40 PM
I think your question depends highly on which weapon system is in question here.

For example, I believe that M1 carbine's have the best stopping power with SP or HP ammo. FMJ's are simply too weak and don't have much hit power.

By contrast, I would be totally fine using FMJ or even AP ammo in an M1 Garand, because the Garand is a hard hitter, even with FMJ ammo. The 30-06 cartridge is no joke :eek:

Yeah, I hadn't considered that. +1 on the Carbine needing some sort of specialized ammo to be truly effective.

send it_hit
11-25-2010, 1:41 PM
garand.... for versatility and availability of ammo.

Lucky Scott
11-25-2010, 1:43 PM
FMJ
Some guns are more reliable loading them.

Lucky Scott
11-25-2010, 1:44 PM
Just re-read the entire thread and it appears lots of us love our SKS rifles.
Glad to see I am not the only one.

NaughtyMonkey
11-25-2010, 1:47 PM
Just re-read the entire thread and it appears lots of us love our SKS rifles.
Glad to see I am not the only one.

I don't have an SKS yet. They Key word there was yet. hahaha.

hk91666
11-25-2010, 1:52 PM
Fn49 except I just sold mine. Second a Vz.24 mauser family. Both 8mm reach out there and touch someone.....

Noonanda
11-25-2010, 1:58 PM
I chose the 1903A3 over everything else because as a bolt action 30-06 I dont have to worry about hot loads bending an oprod (M-1 Garand), .30-06 can be found in any sporting goods store and most gun owning households, where as most of the other calibers listed are foreign calibers and are imported so in a true SHTF TEOTWAWKI I want something I could find in a wallyworld, or someones house.
7.62x54 while it is my favorite cartridge is istill mported here, when the imports stop due to TEOTWAWKI. and even though i reload for all of the calibers used by the rifles listed, Im not gonna have a reloading press strapped to my pack.
I think a bolt action while having a reduced rate of fire is a better choice due to less parts moving/prone to breakage.
While the G/K-43 is a cool gun there is no way I would rely on it due to almost no parts availability.
SVT-40 same thing, awesome gun but no replacement parts for it.

but there are alot of sporterized 1903's out there lol

my second choice would be any Mosin nagant only due to power comparability and ease of use. plus I also have a good stash of ammo for it, but when that ammo runs out during TEOTWAWKI I atleast have a spear as well using a 91/30 with bayonet.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 2:01 PM
I want to get me a Tactical SKS, not Tacti-cool so right now I'm looking at around $509 for an 1953 Tula, Tapco Dark Earth Intrafuse stock, Intrafuse Vertical Foregrip, NcStar 4X30 and the Tapco SKS Gas Tube.

Noonanda
11-25-2010, 2:02 PM
Ok since we're on the SKS topic, I've wanted a new one for a while now, and I want it to look something like the pic below, my question is how the hell do i get the grenade sight, bayonet, and flash hider off! I had one and hated because of those stupid features, and ideas?


http://lh4.ggpht.com/_8KZqFHa8D1s/SYR7tgd5DyI/AAAAAAAABNc/Po9lSPeOlxI/DSCF0030.JPG

you might as well buy an AK47 if you want something like what is in the picture.

that is a crapcoed I mean tapcoed SKS. How can the person shoot it without optics, it doesnt even have a front sight.

for a TEOTWAWKI scenario optics would be great but optics also break, so you would want iron sights as well

Ergo the Qualmed
11-25-2010, 2:08 PM
"crapcoed" = totally awesome, I hope you don't mind if I use that sometimes :D

But seriously...that picture makes me sad...

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 2:14 PM
I dont want the iron sight to go away!!!! I just want a newer stock and foregrip, thats as far as I'll go, the 10/30 mags arent for me, but that was the closest picture I could find to use as an example.

Lucky Scott
11-25-2010, 2:22 PM
Personally, I find that the original stock and stuff is better. It is built like a tank, compared to some plastic junk. In a SHTF situation, I would think durability and reliability would be what you want.
Just my opinion.
No offense meant to the mall ninjas.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 2:26 PM
IDK why but Im a foregrip fan, for me its easier to aim and fire steady with a foregrip rather then holding the full weight of rifle. But thats just me. And I sir, am no mall ninja. The farthest I would ever go would be a single foregrip, thats it, no quad rail, lights, laser, garage door open or compass on my guns. Im shocked no ones said the M14 yet, its virtually a beefed up Garand.

Mac Attack
11-25-2010, 2:28 PM
Sign me up as another M1 Garand selector. Heavy as heck, but the .30-06 round is no joke in CQCB (probably too strong) and excels at long range. You can find .30-06 rounds just about anywhere and if you add an adjustable gas plug to your rifle you can shoot all commercial rounds. The drawbacks are weight of rifle, capacity before needing to reload and the weight of the ammo.

If long range shooting was not required I would have chosen the M1 Carbine because it is a light rifle, has the capability to be reloaded from a high capacity magazine and if in a SHTF could be made to be a select fire rifle. Drawbacks are not effective at anything beyond 100 yards, not as accurate as a full combat rifle but is effective as rifle.

My third choice would be the 1903A3 for it's durable design, light weight and accuracy. Shoots a .30-06 round and can shoot surplus or commercial. More accurate than I am and one heck of a workhorse.

NaughtyMonkey
11-25-2010, 2:29 PM
IDK why but Im a foregrip fan, for me its easier to aim and fire steady with a foregrip rather then holding the full weight of rifle. But thats just me. And I sir, am no mall ninja. The farthest I would ever go would be a single foregrip, thats it, no quad rail, lights, laser, garage door open or compass on my guns. Im shocked no ones said the M14 yet, its virtually a beefed up Garand.

Because finding an M14 is near impossible, but I was thinking an M1A, that .308 round.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 2:39 PM
Is one model of the 1903 better than anothers?

Mac Attack
11-25-2010, 2:54 PM
Is one model of the 1903 better than anothers?

There are multiple version of the 1903 - 1903, 1903 Mk I, 1903 Mk 2, 1903A3 and 1903A4.

The A3's had a easier to use rear peep sight while the 03's and Mk1 and Mk2's had a leaf sight. The A4 was a sniper rifle that was made from the A3's.

To answer your question. I prefer the A3 as a shooter but would love to own a shootable 1903.

sevensix2x51
11-25-2010, 3:09 PM
i like my 1903a3, with the aperture sight and longer sight radius. it is also exempt from that whole "low number" situation, which makes the early 1903's unsafe to shoot, iirc...

Noonanda
11-25-2010, 3:38 PM
Because finding an M14 is near impossible, but I was thinking an M1A, that .308 round.

not that hard, I have an M-14S which is made by polytech, closer to original M-14 specs than the M-1A.

Im looking at this SHTF TEOTWAWKI scenario as if it happens/could happen 20 minutes from now. so if you dont already have an adjustable gas system on your garand it wouldnt do you much good ( I have one on mine and still chose a different gun lol). I love my Garand, and have in my garage probably 1000 rounds of Surplus ammo for it to include AP, but if/when that ammo runs out I dont want to have to adjust the gas system every time I find more ammo. plus you need enbloc clips to feed the ammo unless you single load it so if you lose/run out of clips you are pretty much hosed. if you treat your clips like magazines not as much of a problem, but if you are in a running gunfight you probably wont have time to pick up all your clips.

M-14S/M-1A is actually a good choice, but I only have like 150-200 rounds on hand. thinking the long haul, plus bolt gun again has less moving parts, M-14S/M-1A wasnt listed in choices and is not C&R:p

For SHTF TEOTWAWKI you want to keep it simple. The guy witht the ultra-fandangled uber tacticool weapons, while they may look cool, are most likely the first to go. if you are trying to CQB in SHTF then you are getting ready to eat a proverbial crap sandwich. Im gonna be trying to get to the hills where I can see people coming from a long ways away, and use the full range of that .30-06 round if neccessary. I will be trying to survive till what ever made the SHTF blows over and normalcy returns.

Dr.Mauser
11-25-2010, 3:39 PM
I hear alot ot yes semi-auto, and no semi-auto and yes bolt action and no blot actions,why yess' and why nos'? Run to the hills is what Im saying, thousands of citizens with guns living and thriving in a highly wooded and large area would be a nightmare for a foreign military, theyd have to deal with the US forces in the area, the terrain and us...

Noonanda
11-25-2010, 4:58 PM
When I think of SHTF TEOWAWKI I dont think invasion, I think something more alot the lines of nuclear war, what is left is similar to the game Fallout or maybe even the movie "The Postman".

My plans for such would be to try to find an area with fresh water and food, and would hole up till normalcy or some semblace of it returned.
Dont think 2 weeks, think minimum 2 years.

Now my weapons choice would be a bolt gun (M-1903A3) for a few reasons. Simple, reliable, less moving parts prone to breakage. Remember you bend your oprod you cant just order or buy a new one online.

I have used a M-4 in Combat, and while combat is one thing, survival is another. I dont have higher echelon repair facilities if something breaks. All I possibly have is what I can scrounge/barter/trade for. and in this Weapons, ammo medical supplies and food will be in high demand.

A bolt action while slower firing is less prone to failure than an Semi-auto. Also remember you have to feed your weapon. so you need to find ammo for it.

.30-06 is americas cartridge. I can use it weither it is surplus ammo or which-ever-chester ammo without worrying if it will damage my rifle due to higher pressures. yes as has been stated you can buy an adjustable gas plug. out of those that chose the Garand, how many actually own one and if so have a adjustable gas plug installed? probably a good amount so good on em. but if you dont you better have a good plan to locate ammo. Im not sharing mine:p

A K-98 or mosin would also be a good choice, hell Ive got alot of ammo for both of them as well, but it is a less comon caliber in my eyes. it isnt like you can go into an abandoned walmart and find boxes and boxes of 8mm or 7.62x54 (you might if there is a big 5 or you live near J&G sales LOL)

Noonanda
11-25-2010, 5:02 PM
And just so I dont seem biased, on the list I own everything on there except the Hakim, G-43, FN-49 and K-31. I would arm my family with Mosins as that is the next type of rifle I possess the most ammo for, and probably bring the Cricket .22 rifle as well for the youngest daughter who is 6

Mojaveman
11-25-2010, 5:57 PM
M-1 Garand

.30-06 ammunition is more available that any of the others and the semi-automatic action provides for quick successive shots.

M1903A3 is a little more accurate though and I like them better. :D

I've had fine examples of both.

NaughtyMonkey
11-25-2010, 7:55 PM
When you said SHTF I was thinking a zombie apocalypse. I think a bolt gun would be too slow for sworms of zombies, but then again the M1 Garand only has 8 rounds before you have to reload.

Interloper
11-25-2010, 10:10 PM
People seem to be forgetting .22LR. Probably the single most practical cartridge in a survival situation. Mark my words, in the event of the collapse of civilization, it won't be bottle caps nor Krugerrands. 22 Long rifle cartridges will be the de-facto currency of the Wasteland.

I want to get me a Tactical SKS, not Tacti-cool so right now I'm looking at around $509 for an 1953 Tula, Tapco Dark Earth Intrafuse stock, Intrafuse Vertical Foregrip, NcStar 4X30 and the Tapco SKS Gas Tube.

Dang why would you drop 500 clams on a cherry Soviet SKS just to mod it? Find a Chinese one or a Yugo for under $250 or better yet, one that's already been modded. I have a 53 Tula myself and I couldn't bear to modify it...of course, if the SHTF I would probably take a more practical view of my C&R weapons...

SideWinder11
11-26-2010, 12:15 AM
Garand because that's killing zombies the American way!

Dr.Mauser
11-26-2010, 3:18 PM
In a SHTF scenario brought on by nuclear warfare, everyone with their Tacti-cool guns would be SOL, their fancy laser, holo and red dot sights wouldnt work. So they would be the first to go, it would be the guys using iron sights and regular scopes that would prevail.

IrishPirate
11-26-2010, 3:21 PM
Garand......the reason should be obvious

Dr.Mauser
11-26-2010, 3:23 PM
Because it "is the greatest battle implement ever devised." ? I dont know if the infamous 'ping' would be that great for a SHTF scenario though.

mosinnagantm9130
11-26-2010, 5:03 PM
I would hope those choosing the M1 have either a good supply of M2 ball or the adjustable gas plug;)

Noonanda
11-26-2010, 5:06 PM
I would hope those choosing the M1 have either a good supply of M2 ball or the adjustable gas plug;)

Ive got both but I still didnt choose it LOL;)

Dr.Mauser
11-26-2010, 9:19 PM
Still no votes for the Hakim! Shocking...its uses the 8mm, semi-auto and a hefty battle rifle. Lets keep this bad boy going!

bigstick61
11-26-2010, 9:48 PM
Ok so I know your all going to hate me, but I'm DYING to know what C&R rifle would you use in a SHTF scenario and why? For me, I would say the G-43, it could be used for CQB or for long range targets with a scope, it uses a high impact round, and would knock down any target it touches. I forgot to hit multiple choice voting, so I would say I'd also like to carry an M1 Carbine as back up, using a .30 Carbine round stopping power close to a .357, I couldnt pass that up.....Please post why! I'm dying to know the reason behind the rifle. :D

My current SHTF rifle is a C&R. I use a Lee-Enfield No. 5 Mk I with a center sling swivel and a Ching sling. My current kit is oriented around it and I have plenty of chargers for it as well as plenty of .303 ammo. I use an FM Hi-Power (older military variant with lanyard ring) as my sidearm.

I use it because it is what I have until I finish my FAL build. It weighs less and is handier than my SKS (which needs to be headspaced) and my other C&R rifles. I have the most ammunition and chargers for it. And I can use a speed shooting sling with it. I also really like the Lee-Enfield action as it is smooth and fast. I can put aimed shots on target at about the same rate as with a semi-auto. I also really like the ghost ring sight. If I had a few more clips, more ammo, and ammo were easier to find at a lower price I would be tempted to use the Steyr M95, though (lighter and just as fast and handy). Once my FAL build is done it will be my primary SHTF rifle and the Lee-Enfield will be secondary. Until I can save enough for a 1911 the Hi-Power will continue to be my SHTF sidearm.

My rifle:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v336/bigstick61/DSCN5293.jpg

And my sidearm:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v336/bigstick61/DSCN5296.jpg

Dr.Mauser
11-26-2010, 9:50 PM
an FM Hi-Power? Why not a M1911, TT-33, or a P-38. I've had bad experiences with the P-08 Luger...very inaccurate.

bigstick61
11-26-2010, 10:14 PM
an FM Hi-Power? Why not a M1911, TT-33, or a P-38. I've had bad experiences with the P-08 Luger...very inaccurate.

Because it's what I could get and afford (was 19 when I bought it from my grandfather for $200 with ammo and multiple mags) and it is what I have. Getting another pistol won't happen for at least another year, probably longer. It does the job just fine even if my preference is for .45 ACP.

Dr.Mauser
11-26-2010, 10:18 PM
Fair enough, I'd be using my Grandfathers Luger, he's giving it to me for my 21st birthday...omg thats a year and 9 days from now!

johnthomas
11-26-2010, 10:42 PM
I would go with the SKS and 2, CZ52 side arms. I have plenty of 7.62x39 for the SKS and x25 for the CZ's. My thought is that any confrontation would be in town or a place with lots of building, hiding places for bad guys. I want a weapon that has pretty good range, but can throw down cover if I need it. I don't own most of the weapons on the list, the Mosin is great for range, not rapid cover. The CZ's have a decent range. The ammo for both the sks and CZ's are light enough to carry a couple hundred rounds of each.

Dr.Mauser
11-26-2010, 11:43 PM
Thats why I've been saying 8mm lol, I want something thats going to go through a wall or door and knock down whoever is behind it. Ok So I've been looking for a repo ZF41 scope for a K98, anyone have any ideas? I want to buy an RC and drill that, not my grandfathers K98

metalliman545
11-27-2010, 1:25 AM
In a SHTF scenario brought on by nuclear warfare, everyone with their Tacti-cool guns would be SOL, their fancy laser, holo and red dot sights wouldnt work. So they would be the first to go, it would be the guys using iron sights and regular scopes that would prevail.

sure, and you have proof of this where? oh ok, CODMW2. great reference but sorry, i have read nothing that a nuclear blast would make all lights and lazers not work. i prefer irons personally but still.

Rogerbutthead
11-27-2010, 1:30 AM
a zf41 scope is like 1.5 power with a tiny view - I have read interviews of German soldiers who laughed when asked about it as a sniper rifle and they said it was given to the soldier with the worse eyesight.

Dr.Mauser
11-27-2010, 9:28 AM
sure, and you have proof of this where? oh ok, CODMW2. great reference but sorry, i have read nothing that a nuclear blast would make all lights and lazers not work. i prefer irons personally but still.

No, actually my Grandfather is a Nuclear Physicist who works at the Hanford Nuclear Site in Richland, Wa. During a nuclear or atomic blast theres a sizable EMP charge, all electronics go out, that would mean anything with batteries would go out as well (ie lights, lasers and red dot and holographic sighting systems). And I dont even know what CODMW2 is. My point is all those bells and whistles that the mall ninjas add to their guns wont be worth a damn after a while, they look cool I'll give them that, but all the parts they use and have will break, fall apart, get jammed, clogged, and ruined. So I'll stick with something with only a few parts and oodles of spares. Like my grandfathers K98 and an M1 Carbine that has maybe 6 to 8 critical pieces it needs to function.
http://www.nicolausassociates.com/images/Carbine-CampHood-Page8.jpg



Heres some 'proof':

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_pulse

http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/emp.htm

hk91666
11-27-2010, 9:57 AM
I hear alot ot yes semi-auto, and no semi-auto and yes bolt action and no blot actions,why yess' and why nos'? Run to the hills is what Im saying, thousands of citizens with guns living and thriving in a highly wooded and large area would be a nightmare for a foreign military, theyd have to deal with the US forces in the area, the terrain and us...

"Wolverines" Red Dawn

scobun
11-27-2010, 10:53 AM
The question answers itself. If it's "all I've got", then that's what I'll use.
:rolleyes:

Makes sense to me.

magsnubby
11-27-2010, 11:15 AM
It really depends on the scenario. Since i'm a crippled up old fart i figure my best bet would be to just hunker down and dig in somewhere. In that case it would most likely be the Garand. I was totally amazed how well i could shot it. It's far more accurate than i am. I would also be comfortable with a either my Mosin 44, Enfield or M48.

If i had to be fairly mobile and move at a moments notice then the SKS would be my choice. Second choice would be an M1 carbine, but only because i already own one. I've packed my Garand on hunting trips and it doesn't take long before you're wishing for something lighter. Especially if you're wearing a backpack, carrying extra ammo and water.

Dr.Mauser
11-27-2010, 10:46 PM
I hear you there, I lugged my Garand for 15 miles on a camping trip we took in the middle of NO WHERE in near puyallup washington about 2 years ago. I hated that heavy thing for a while lol

Spiggy
11-27-2010, 10:50 PM
I'd skip out on the ZF41 man, you would probably have a better time taping a hollowed sharpie to your rear sight.

On the note of EMP strike. Tritium is not battery operated ;)

Reductio
11-27-2010, 10:50 PM
People seem to be forgetting .22LR. Probably the single most practical cartridge in a survival situation. Mark my words, in the event of the collapse of civilization, it won't be bottle caps nor Krugerrands. 22 Long rifle cartridges will be the de-facto currency of the Wasteland.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner. Perfect for small / medium game hunting, and I sure as heck can carry a lot more of that than 30-06 in enblocs. :eek:

POLICESTATE
11-27-2010, 10:53 PM
I would go garand except for the reliance on the en bloc clips. So I went with the Springfield 1903

Someguy925
11-28-2010, 9:59 AM
I don't know if I would lug my Hakim around in a SHTF situation. Its a pretty heavy rifle and also quite long as well. Maybe my FN49 but not the Hakim.

If I were aiming for mobility, I'd lug my Yugo M24/47, M1 Carbine, or Winchester 1895. Maybe more Winny 1895 since 12ga are probably a bit more common.

harmoniums
11-28-2010, 10:51 AM
No, actually my Grandfather is a Nuclear Physicist who works at the Hanford Nuclear Site in Richland, Wa. During a nuclear or atomic blast theres a sizable EMP charge, all electronics go out, that would mean anything with batteries would go out as well (ie lights, lasers and red dot and holographic sighting systems). And I dont even know what CODMW2 is. My point is all those bells and whistles that the mall ninjas add to their guns wont be worth a damn after a while, they look cool I'll give them that, but all the parts they use and have will break, fall apart, get jammed, clogged, and ruined. So I'll stick with something with only a few parts and oodles of spares. Like my grandfathers K98 and an M1 Carbine that has maybe 6 to 8 critical pieces it needs to function.


Unshielded electronics may die as the EMP pulse would induce a current in any exposed conductors.
But if your electronics were in a safe made of some kind of conductive metal, they'd be safe, it would act as a faraday cage.
One more reason to keep them locked up folks

Dr.Mauser
11-28-2010, 11:21 AM
True story, funny how I was told I didnt know what I was talking about...Im starting to think this guy really doesnt like me (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=365392&page=3) .

sure, and you have proof of this where? oh ok, CODMW2. great reference but sorry, i have read nothing that a nuclear blast would make all lights and lazers not work. i prefer irons personally but still.

JohanD
11-28-2010, 8:00 PM
M1 garand!

knucklehead0202
11-29-2010, 8:18 PM
no carcano? just kidding. i have one but it sure to hell wouldn't be anywhere close to my first choice. i chose mosin because i've got a ton of ammo for it that i paid almost nothing for, they're accurate enough, have a powerful round that is readily available, and no reliability issues. sure we'd all prefer a semi-auto but all of them from that era are a little finicky, the garand being the best, but still probably not with the ammo available were you to run out of handloads. mosins shoot anything and don't do any funny stuff. hard to argue with that. +1 on the swede mauser, i've got lots of ammo for mine, but you'd be hosed once you ran out.

Dr.Mauser
11-29-2010, 9:39 PM
The more and more I think about it the more and more I'm leaning Garand, as stated earlier 30-06 is Americas ammo, it will always be around, the only down side, also stated through out is the gas plug...

hybridatsun350
11-29-2010, 9:45 PM
The numbers don't lie, and there are any number of reasons why the M1 Garand is the best rifle for the job!

Dr.Mauser
11-29-2010, 10:03 PM
Anyone know whats going on here?

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2009/09/m1-garands-and-carbines-return-from-south-korea/

Interloper
11-30-2010, 6:43 AM
Anyone know whats going on here?

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2009/09/m1-garands-and-carbines-return-from-south-korea/

Ugh. There's several threads on this fiasco. Basically, the State Department has blocked re-importation of these. Then we have a Congressman who's introduced a bill to let them in. Tough to say how it will all turn out.
I'll tell you this, though. If these Korean M1's do eventually make it to market, the hype that has built up will ensure they sell for about what the CMP ones have gone for or maybe much more.

Dr.Mauser
11-30-2010, 10:06 PM
Youd think theyd flood the market and lower prices

Spiggy
11-30-2010, 10:21 PM
Because it "is the greatest battle implement ever devised." ? I dont know if the infamous 'ping' would be that great for a SHTF scenario though.

tie two together with a shoelace and swing it at stuff. :D works well enough on fake Germans.

Dr.Mauser
12-01-2010, 12:52 AM
And I hear that trick and others like it worked well towards the closing days of the war. Looks to me like I need to invest in a Garand, a gas plug(s) and a crap load of surplus 30-06 ammo....and oodles of 8mm, I only have about 220 rds as of right now....What would you guys say? Garand or a 1903 model? I say Garand, but you are much wiser than I.

mosinnagantm9130
12-01-2010, 12:18 PM
And I hear that trick and others like it worked well towards the closing days of the war. Looks to me like I need to invest in a Garand, a gas plug(s) and a crap load of surplus 30-06 ammo....and oodles of 8mm, I only have about 220 rds as of right now....What would you guys say? Garand or a 1903 model? I say Garand, but you are much wiser than I.

If I was going for a shooter, that's a tough choice. Both the 03 and the M1 can be great shooters.

I think I'd buy an 03A3 myself, I just don't seem to see near as many of them as I do Garands. Plus I prefer the 03A3 sights over the 03, but YMMV.

Dr.Mauser
12-01-2010, 1:25 PM
I would want a Semi-Auto is my only vice. Although the more I look the more appealing the 1903a3 is...

skscj
12-01-2010, 5:51 PM
Garand

DasBoost
12-01-2010, 6:04 PM
K31 because it's what I will have this Saturday. Plan on reloading and already stockpiling spare parts.

Dr.Mauser
12-02-2010, 6:16 PM
What about ammo, from what I've heard its expensive and a tad hard to find.

Volksgrenadier
12-03-2010, 7:23 AM
"If it's all you had" as in, Zombies have risen from the dead while I was at the range shooting my favorite milsurp?

Or,

"It's all you had" as in, Finland, winter of 1939 and that's a whole lot of Ivans heading our way?

In both cases, I think I will have to default to Simo Häyhä's way of thinking, reaching for my TNW semi-auto Suomi 31, but as that is not on the list I will default to my Finnish M91.

Cowboy T
12-03-2010, 12:32 PM
Actually, Simo took the majority of them out with his M91. He offed about 250 or so with the Suomi, but 505 with the Mosin.

For SHTF, I'd have three guns.

1.) A milsurp 30-cal bolt action with iron sights (M91, M1903, whatever) and chambered in some common cartridge; .308 Win, .30-06, and 7.62x54R are good choices
2.) some kind of .22LR long gun for rabbit and squirrel hunting (or anything else that size)
3.) a Ruger Security-Six or S&W K-frame in .357 Magnum, because they're simple (being wheelguns), they're reasonably lightweight, and .38/357 ammo is everywhere

I know a lot of folks like the M1 Garand, and it's a great gun, but yes, what if a part breaks? That's more prone to happen on a semi-auto, and in SHTF, you're toast if you can't find parts. Hence, the bolt-action preference.

Dr.Mauser
12-04-2010, 11:25 AM
keep this going friends, ok, lets talk mil-surp in a "Red Dawn" situation, that a tiny bit more likely than Zombies IMHO

Interloper
12-04-2010, 8:37 PM
keep this going friends, ok, lets talk mil-surp in a "Red Dawn" situation, that a tiny bit more likely than Zombies IMHO

Wolverines!
Love Red Dawn. Unlike when the film was made, it wouldn't be the Soviets/Cubans/Nicaraguans nowadays. Either the Chi-Com's, or much more likely, NATO and or our own military. Now the Chinese I'm not so sure on. Have they transitioned over to 5.45x39mm like the Russians? If they're still on 7.62x39 then those of us who picked the SKS are in good shape.
In the case of NATO/US, then all bets are off. The guys on this site who have contributed so much information on AR builds would be enemy number one. Otherwise, pick your favorite shooter and vote from the rooftops because the S has HTF indeed!

JohanD
12-04-2010, 9:11 PM
I guess we should buy one of each caliber.. just to be safe!! :)

Dr.Mauser
12-05-2010, 1:20 AM
Or stay with 30-06 lol

Why would NATO and the US go to war?

Interloper
12-05-2010, 1:43 AM
Or stay with 30-06 lol

Why would NATO and the US go to war?

No, I meant more like an occupying force. Martial law and all that tinfoil-hattery...:TFH:

Noonanda
12-05-2010, 3:09 AM
Chinese now use a 5.8 round (cant remember the whole designation). So SKS and AK owners are all SOL. it is an evil little round from what I have read.

On a different note the "new" version of red dawn with the chinese playing the role of invaders is supposed to come out this summer IIRC

headshrinker
12-05-2010, 4:59 AM
My first choice is the M-1 Garand. In fact, it's sitting a few feet away right now with a clip of eight next to it.

I also have an M-1 Carbine for close-in work, or for my GF to back me up.

An interesting option would be my M39 Fin-Mosin. Very,very accurate and ultra-reliable. A couple of spam cans of 54R and I'm good to go. I keep it at my cache location, along with some other options and a bunch of ammo.

The .22LR is an option that makes a whole lot of sense however.

scoot64
12-05-2010, 6:13 AM
gotta go with M1 Carbine, light weight it's what I have the most ammo & magazines for.

Noonanda
12-05-2010, 6:39 AM
that is one question I got for all that picked a rifle on here, expecially some of the exotic ammo types such as 7.7x58 or such. Do you actually have this ammo on hand or did you pick it as a favorite rifle to plink with. For example I have probably 1000+ rounds of .30-06 on hand so I picked a .30-06 weapon. if the SHTF tommorrow, I would be ready to go. hell I have ammo for all of the rifles listed other than 7.5 swiss because I dont own one of them, but the only one I have ammo in the quantity that I would feel comfortable with surviving SHTF/TEOTWAWKI is .30-06, with either 7.62x54r, 8mm or .22LR as a backup for the family

Charlie50
12-05-2010, 6:52 AM
Slam dunk, no question, no BS, no debate... GARAND or, of course, what ever you happen to actually have on hand, pitchfork, spoon, copy of Sports Illustrated

Henry Shooter
12-05-2010, 6:58 AM
Garand and 03A3. You can be on the run and always find 30-06 ammo.

Noonanda
12-05-2010, 7:22 AM
Garand and 03A3. You can be on the run and always find 30-06 ammo.

Thats why I chose 1903A3, can use winchester white box or any other ammo and any bullet weights with no concern of bending an op-rod without a gas plug replacement. I love my Garand and it does have a adjustable gas plug, but unless I had trailer full of .30-06 surplus ( which most of my ammo is surplus but why limit myselfinstead of ammo I also will find) I'll use a 03A3. If I need to rapid fire and engage multiple targets at close ranges, well I got bigger problems to worry about.:eek:

Dr.Mauser
12-05-2010, 11:43 AM
Not C&R but I think for the .22 I would go with the GSG-5 or the Ruger 10/22 (with this, makes it look C&R)
http://www.desmidt-armory.com/images/SquadLeader.jpg

But I think after my next Carbine, I'm going to be getting a Garand, then 03A3 and stock up on 30-06 ammo.

magsnubby
12-05-2010, 12:01 PM
.... an occupying force. Martial law and all that tinfoil-hattery...:TFH:

Garand or SKS because i have ton of ammo for each one.

Rogerbutthead
12-05-2010, 2:44 PM
I think you would go with what you are the best shot with, cuz you will using the targets weapon and ammo for much of what comes next.

If you are just going to snipe from long range, you are only going to use 1 or 2 rounds at a time, so our little stashes of 200 to a couple of thousand rounds should do fine for those purposes.

Dr.Mauser
12-05-2010, 7:46 PM
I'd have to go iron sights, I have no scope for my Mauser :(

Volksgrenadier
12-05-2010, 8:07 PM
*reaches for Suomi 31 but hand is slapped by the OP's list* Curses!

Then 7.62x54r it is. Finn or Soviet. Brutal, honest, lethal, and may be substituted for spear, club, flamethrower, or nuclear device in pinch.

pingpong
12-05-2010, 10:07 PM
Definitely the SVT. You can find that 7.92x54R stuff practically anywhere on the planet. Who care's if it won't hit anything past 300 yards. If something is 300 yards away odds are I won't be shooting it in fear attracting attention to myself.

Noonanda
12-06-2010, 5:13 AM
Definitely the SVT. You can find that 7.92x54R stuff practically anywhere on the planet. Who care's if it won't hit anything past 300 yards. If something is 300 yards away odds are I won't be shooting it in fear attracting attention to myself.

if you can find 7.92x54R anywhere this planet then you are the man.:D And if you cant hit something with 7.62x54R at 300 yds then you have issues as that cartridge is ballisticly comparable to .30-06

Volksgrenadier
12-06-2010, 9:49 AM
7.92x54r...the love child of a Mosin and Mauser? Now that would be awesome! :D

Dr.Mauser
12-06-2010, 10:32 AM
that would be a kick @ss round, if it were real haha

easy
12-06-2010, 4:36 PM
... You can be on the run and always find 30-06 ammo.

I wouldn't count on this or any other caliber being available. Think back a few short months ago and tell me where the ammo was?!

It it's SHTF or TEOTWAWKI it will only be a 'run-what-ya-brung' event!

Dr.Mauser
12-06-2010, 4:41 PM
True that, stock up gents and keep your fingers crossed! The only problem I would foresee with having oodles of ammo would be carrying it and storing it, it would start to corrode after a while if not stored correctly. Same thing with your rifle, what happens when cleaners runs out?

DasBoost
12-06-2010, 5:13 PM
What about ammo, from what I've heard its expensive and a tad hard to find.

Was that towards me? I've got GP-11 on the way and saving for brass and the essentials. :D Otherwise I have my pistol, a lot of 45, and hopes that I'll just be left alone. :)

Dr.Mauser
12-06-2010, 5:20 PM
I'd be headed to the hills, theres no way I'd be staying in the city, especially Modesto...I hope in the back woods I'd be left alone

Interloper
12-06-2010, 6:14 PM
Anyone have any recipes for sub-sonic .30-'06? Just something I was thinking about while watching "The Walking Dead".

Dr.Mauser
12-06-2010, 11:49 PM
Ha I wish! Anyone want to start a new discussion? About this topic? Lets keep this baby going, Im lovin it and having alot of gun here

Geodetic
12-07-2010, 10:35 AM
M1 Garand but M1 Carbine is close 2nd just for the fact that you have semiauto with high capacity magazines. Actually I'd be tempted to take an M1 Garand over modern rifles if I'm limited to open sights just for the fact that its powerful enough to go through cinder blocks, cars and body armor that I may encounter. I suppose I'd have to take an M14/M1A but I don't own one of those. Having plenty of 30-06, I'd take my Garand over my SKS any day.

glennsche
12-07-2010, 11:03 AM
Anyone have any recipes for sub-sonic .30-'06? Just something I was thinking about while watching "The Walking Dead".

i really, really liked the first few eps but it kinda went to pieces with the "vatos" episode, and i didnt care for the last one at all.

but on to more serious things, like what to really have w you when the zombie apocalypse finally befalls us. What do we know about this eventuality?

well, fighting seems to be up close, like under 100 yrds. Engaging zombie targets at ranges where you'd need a scope or a full powered cartridge are virtually non-existant, since the noise attracts them. So you're fighting up close and personal: when you need to break through somewhere, when suddenly you're surrounded, when you have to get from point A to B. You're not going to be sniping much, since the report of the rifle could draw too much attention maybe even cause a swarm. so you dont want to shoot unless you have to, when they're RIGHT THERE ON TOP OF YOU.

for the purposes of this incredibly nerdy C&R focused thread, lets say you can only have C&Rs: i'd say...

gimme an SKS.

in the event of a zombie apocalypse, i'd want my k31 for the 400-500 yrd targets, and the sks for everything else.

ok ending incredibly dorky zombie rant. :)

Noonanda
12-07-2010, 11:35 AM
Anyone have any recipes for sub-sonic .30-'06? Just something I was thinking about while watching "The Walking Dead".

it aint subsonic, but look into "the load" using either reddot or unique ( I have used both). For red dot it is 13Gr behind a normal bullet which is a great reduced load for new shooters to some of the larger calibers out there. My daughters have shot this out of an M-39, and I have used it in .30-06, 7.62x54, .303 brit, 8mm, and 7.7 Arisaka. never had a problem, fun little plinking load

here is a great link for it
http://members.shaw.ca/cronhelm/TheLoad.html

Bavaria1990
12-07-2010, 11:40 AM
In a SHTF moment, I would avoid everybody at all cost, hope my family would meet me at the house, and we would backtrack to the woods and hills.

My ak, have all the extra parts for a breakdown (after 40 years of being neglected, and shot often)

Ammo would be an issue though-after I have gone through my stash

223 or 30.06 is more plentiful

I guess I would hopefully find an m16 or something, after all, there are 3 Armories in a 60mile radius of my house. one is 10 minutes from me.

Hmmm.

Geodetic
12-07-2010, 11:54 AM
Anyone have any recipes for sub-sonic .30-'06? Just something I was thinking about while watching "The Walking Dead".

.38 Special with 158 gr. bullets :laugh:

7.62 Soviet
12-07-2010, 12:20 PM
Mosin Nagant for sure in a SHTF situation its easy to take apart and damn near indestructible.

doc1buc
12-07-2010, 12:31 PM
1903......shoots the 30-06, no other necessary parts (clips, mags, etc) for it to shoot, and doesn't require the cleaning of a semi-auto.

sigfan91
12-07-2010, 3:19 PM
SHTF and only C&R to protect us from zombies and hippies? Or zombie hippies? I'll take a Garand in my hands and a 1911 on my hip. You can't go wrong with this combo.

Dr.Mauser
12-07-2010, 6:50 PM
SHTF and only C&R to protect us from zombies and hippies? Or zombie hippies? I'll take a Garand in my hands and a 1911 on my hip. You can't go wrong with this combo.

^^^YES^^^ And maybe a Carbine on your back :D

Jarhead
12-07-2010, 6:56 PM
M-1 Garand beats the G-43 Hands Down once again, followed by little brother M-1 Carbine

Dr.Mauser
12-07-2010, 7:03 PM
Soooo close to getting my hands on a new Carbine :D

beemaze
12-07-2010, 7:16 PM
SKS X 9

Which is about how many SKS' I own. One for me, my wife, and two almost grown up kids with some left over for parts.

Plenty of 7.62x39 ammo at home and at about every gun store, Wal-mart, Big 5, etc. I can think of....

Now bring them Zombies on!

Dr.Mauser
12-07-2010, 7:25 PM
So if SHTF do you think everyone would remove their BBs and grab their 30rd M1 cabine mag kits :D

Volksgrenadier
12-08-2010, 11:30 AM
So if SHTF do you think everyone would remove their BBs and grab their 30rd M1 cabine mag kits :D

Yes.

Dr.Mauser
12-08-2010, 2:39 PM
get this, so I posted on the CMP forums that I wanted to trade my Gradfathers K98 for a Carbine, and this is what i get back:

I don't think we need to worry about our boy anymore. Though pretty new to the CMP forum, he is a regular forum commando at Calguns.net, closing in on his thousandth chatty post, zombie killer, TEOTWAWKI enthusiast and an apparent "expert" on most everything at the tender age of 20. He is not hard to find there and I almost admire his "enthusiasm".

I for one was imagining all along that his grandfather was some poor mud-slogging dogface (or clerk typist) in Europe who brought back the K98 along with a good story about how he captured it only to have his indifferent grandson ready to swap it for the first shiny thing that caught his eye. Well, his grandfather was probably slugging through the mud alright, but it appears he was facing the other direction as a member of the Waffen SS....but don't worry, grandson says he was one of the "good Germans" who hated Hitler and gave his prisoners a drink before sending them back on their way. I believe the "bring-back" in question was brought back some time in the late 50s....a little removed from the battlefields.

Anyway, from what I can tell, the before-mentioned K98 appears to be just one of many guns that the prodigal son has received from dad & granddad, which helps explain his ease at selling a couple of Mausers he was given to buy a couple of CMP M1 Carbines which he pawned for a $400 engagement ring (if I got his story straight between the two forums). For some, when an item costs you nothing, that is its value.

He loves guns (as do we all) and wants to have many more (as do we all) and is looking to swap and buy for more while being unemployed and living with his in-laws (there but for the grace of god goes all). The "rethinking priorities" I mentioned in an earlier post comes back to mind, but being a free country, Dr.Mauser is free to live his life as he see fit.

My suggestion is to treat this K98 "family heirloom" with the same reverence he does and make yourself the best deal you can with your trade....he probably won't know the difference.

So Dr.M, happy birthday last Monday....less than a year before "ompa" gives you that Luger (really great trading stock btw). And do tell, was the PPSH-41 your daddy gave you one of the modern semi-auto repros?

Enjoy your carbine when you get it. Sorry to be a buzz-kill.

Scratch705
12-08-2010, 2:48 PM
sounds like a immature idiot. there will always be a few in a forum.

Dr.Mauser
12-08-2010, 3:35 PM
and all i was doing was asking if anyone would be interested in trading their carbine for a Bring Back K98. But I think it may be spoken for, I just need to get the pics I have uploaded.....Anyway, lets talk reloading, Im assuming it would be choice for any reason especially for this, and save oodles of money.

Interloper
12-08-2010, 4:58 PM
Wait. You are going to trade that k98? WTF are you thinking?

SideWinder11
12-08-2010, 5:08 PM
Let me see if I got all this correct.

*you worked at Hot Topic with your GF
*you got fired because they found out you were dating/getting married
*you sold two M1 Carbines for $400 so you could show her how much you loved her and buy her a ring
*you have no job
*live with your in laws
*want to trade your grandfathers bring back from the war K98 for a rack grade M1 Carbine
*you're 20 years old with no money for ammo

To summarize your 20 live with your in laws, no job, no money, getting married/or just married and you're worried about trading your grandfathers gun to replace a gun you hastily sold.

Why are you on here shouldn't you be looking for a job like 24/7? Shouldn't you have your priorities in a different place?

WOW :lurk5:

Dr.Mauser
12-08-2010, 8:43 PM
I am bro, I've have 7 interviews just in the last month, and the firing went as follows: They ask us if we were together, and told us we had until 9pm that night to let them know so they could work around us and there would be no trouble they just needed to know for HR reasons (schedule us on different shifts and such) so we came clean. The following monday we were fired. I have many more items from my grandfather (a M35 stahlhelm, iron cross, his tunic, a Waffen SS M43 field cap plus oodles of nazi coins), the Carbine Im trading for is far from a racker (not that im justifying it). I spoke with my parents and they are wiring me my college funds and I start class for a phlebotomy program the end of the month and its only 2 weeks long, they place you for externship hours, and then place you in a job upon completion, and from what I've been told starting I will be making anything from $16.25-$20 an hour, my wife is taking the class as well so money and work soon wont be a problem. haha and as far as ammo goes, I still have roughly 250 rd of 8mm and 350 of .30 carbine. I am also wondering how I go about getting the gun, and sending it, do I have to send it to a dealer on his end, and he send his gun to one on mine? Or how does this work? Or does someone in Modesto have an FFL that can help so it doesnt cost me as much as buying a whole gun on its own.
__________________

SideWinder11
12-08-2010, 9:01 PM
I am bro, I've have 7 interviews just in the last month, and the firing went as follows: They ask us if we were together, and told us we had until 9pm that night to let them know so they could work around us and there would be no trouble they just needed to know for HR reasons (schedule us on different shifts and such) so we came clean. The following monday we were fired. I have many more items from my grandfather (a M35 stahlhelm, iron cross, his tunic, a Waffen SS M43 field cap plus oodles of nazi coins), the Carbine Im trading for is far from a racker (not that im justifying it). I spoke with my parents and they are wiring me my college funds and I start class for a phlebotomy program the end of the month and its only 2 weeks long, they place you for externship hours, and then place you in a job upon completion, and from what I've been told starting I will be making anything from $16.25-$20 an hour, my wife is taking the class as well so money and work soon wont be a problem. haha and as far as ammo goes, I still have roughly 250 rd of 8mm and 350 of .30 carbine. I am also wondering how I go about getting the gun, and sending it, do I have to send it to a dealer on his end, and he send his gun to one on mine? Or how does this work? Or does someone in Modesto have an FFL that can help so it doesnt cost me as much as buying a whole gun on its own.
__________________

...

Dr.Mauser
12-08-2010, 9:03 PM
I GET IT!!!! I shouldnt be trading it but I am, I have many more items of his, and when he gave it to me he said "sell, keep it, play baseball with it, or use it for firewood, I dont care, I carried it for 4 long damn years, its yours now"...Lets get back on topic now, I hearing more and more and more about the Garand, that wouldnt be my first choice personally just because of its weight and size, but on the other hand that 30-06 has some damn fine knock down power! But then again so does the 7.62x54r, Swiss 7mm, .303 British, and the 8mm Mauser.

SideWinder11
12-08-2010, 9:33 PM
? I dont understand...I GET IT!!!! I shouldnt be trading it but I am, I have many more items of his, and when he gave it to me he said "sell, keep it, play baseball with it, or use it for firewood, I dont care, I carried it for 4 long damn years, its yours now"...Lets get back on topic now, I hearing more and more and more about the Garand, that wouldnt be my first choice personally just because of its weight and size, but on the other hand that 30-06 has some damn fine knock down power! But then again so does the 7.62x54r, Swiss 7mm, .303 British, and the 8mm Mauser.

you don't understand or you get it? If you get it then you wouldn't be trading it. You'd get a job save a couple hundred for a few months and buy one.

He may have said that to you but it's like when a girl says to you "you don't have to buy me flowers" but she really means you "better" buy me some flowers.....

but you get it or you don't were not sure. Either way it's your gun do with it whatever you'd like I'm done. I was only trying to be a friend and stop you from doing something that I think you'd regret later in your life. thats all

Here's what others have said. I've said my peace.

http://forums.thecmp.org/showthread.php?t=30054

Dr.Mauser
12-08-2010, 9:45 PM
I know guys :( im not meaning to get angry..im sorry :( I just really want to get a new Carbine, my wife wants to get me one but I dont want her to spend all of her christmas budget on me...she has a 4 yr old brother that wants one of those ride in Power Wheels cars and if she gets me the Carbine she cant get the Power Wheels, so I wanted to take care of it myself, and I've been discouraged as all hell with work, 7 interviews and no word yet, and thats just within the last 30 days, all together I've had 12 and nothing...So Im going to school to get something that could potentially get me a job...and that is Phlebotomy.

SideWinder11
12-08-2010, 9:52 PM
I know guys :( im not meaning to get angry..im sorry :( I just really want to get a new Carbine, my wife wants to get me one but I dont want her to spend all of her christmas budget on me...she has a 4 yr old brother that wants one of those ride in Power Wheels cars and if she gets me the Carbine she cant get the Power Wheels, so I wanted to take care of it myself, and I've been discouraged as all hell with work, 7 interviews and no word yet, and thats just within the last 30 days, all together I've had 12 and nothing...So Im going to school to get something that could potentially get me a job...and that is Phlebotomy.

:lurk5:

beemaze
12-09-2010, 7:10 AM
This is getting totally off topic:

Bottom line: Don't trade/sell you grandfather's K98. Keep it. It's part of your heritage.

Save up for an M1 Carbine. Be patient. There are a ton out there already on the market. You'll eventually find one, regardless of whether or not CMP will have more to sell.

On topic: Sure would be nice to see your poll with SKS on there just to see how it would fare against the Garand....

Dr.Mauser
12-09-2010, 8:23 PM
I tried to edit the poll after everyone started mentioning it, but alas, I could not :( What are the big advantages of the SKS over the Garand, I know it had a large rd capacity, but the Garand has much better knock down power, and from personal experience its much more accurate.

SideWinder11
12-09-2010, 8:28 PM
lol you're a funny guy. Why do you keep going into your last post (the last one in the thread) delete and repost it just to bump your thread.

You did the same thing when you told us it was your birthday. If I recall not one person wished you a happy birthday.

Interloper
12-09-2010, 8:52 PM
Hey now. Let's not get nasty.
Happy birthday, Dr. Mauser.
This is just a light hearted thread. The same old SHTF/Zombie discussion with a C&R twist. Don't be hatin!

SideWinder11
12-09-2010, 9:10 PM
I head ya just seems like he is needy of attention.

mls343
12-10-2010, 3:48 AM
Please hang on to your Grandfather's Mauser. There is really no replacement for it.

Period.

Dr.Mauser
12-10-2010, 12:02 PM
I head ya just seems like he is needy of attention.
I didnt mean to repost the thing about my birthday actually. I dont get why you have to me rude about it...

mosinnagantm9130
12-10-2010, 12:39 PM
Please hang on to your Grandfather's Mauser. There is really no replacement for it.

Period.

+1. It really can't be replaced.

There are plenty of carbines, patience grasshopper.:D

skscj
12-12-2010, 8:47 AM
My only issue with Garands as a SHTF weapon is they need En Bloc clips to function, and in the heat of a battle when they go flying out of the gun on empty, you might be to busy running for your life to pick them up, so you could potentially run out of clips and have a useless rifle.

He got a point there. The FN49 with 10 rounds would make a good choice also..

sindominator
12-12-2010, 5:26 PM
The S(did)HTF in the 1940's and the Garand scored heavily. So from the list above I would go with my Garand.

But if the SKS was on the list? Then hands down the SKS with a thumbhole or pistol grip stock. and extended magazine.

Geodetic
12-13-2010, 12:00 PM
He got a point there. The FN49 with 10 rounds would make a good choice also..

I never understood this argument, any semi auto with a detachable mag is a single shot without that magazine. The enbloc clip design was John Garand's solution to the silly requirement by the US government that a rifle should not have a detachable magazine that would get lost by our troops. I believe that given this requirement the enbloc clip system was the best solution. It's hard to argue that a detachable mag with more capacity wouldn't have been better, but given a fixed magazine the enbloc clip loads a rifle quicker than stripper clips in my opinion. I can load my M1 faster than I can my SKS with a stripper clip, and thats why I'd prefer my M1.