PDA

View Full Version : cheap and dirty little $500.00 Kiss


sker13
11-02-2010, 1:13 AM
*Update* With Pic
This thread is meant to show how cheap you can build a AR beater/plinker CA legal carbine. If you have any ideas how it can be done for less speak up. 500.00 Kiss refers to price of all components nec. to build a AR, inc. sights and mag, without Gov fees, taxes, or Mag lock.

Plum Crazy completer lower w/butt stock......$100.00
JSE 16'' Carbine Complete upper...................$335.00
C products 10 round mag from JSE................$11.00
JSE shipping to CA......................................$16.20
UTG front and rear sights (amazon)................$40.54 free shipping

Total for a rifle ready to fire..........................$502.74

Dros, tax, ect.............................................$6 0.00
Prince 50 BB...............................................$ 18.00

You could stop right here..............................$580.74


Things I bought that don't really apply but are in the pic
Magpul forgrip........................................... ..$18.00
Magpul VFG............................................... .$35.00

total $633.74

Obviously, I could have kept it under 600.00 total inc tax, shipping and Dros. But, without the Magpul items.

I will post some pics tomorrow.
Total Weight without sights...........................6lbs

Now before you aficionados get all worked up...Plum Crazy is lifetime warranty and we all know how easy it is to upgrade parts at a later date...I know..I know... You get what you pay for but, for that price it's a beater that by all accounts works...And,

I paid more for my Glock.....

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii23/sker13/arphoto-1.jpg
http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii23/sker13/plumblower.jpg

mikaarce
11-02-2010, 4:28 AM
Now, How about some pics and actual review of your KISS.

SanPedroShooter
11-02-2010, 5:33 AM
Dude, no pics?

Milsurps
11-02-2010, 5:39 AM
Plum Crazy completer lower w/butt stock......$100.00
..

Inquiring minds need to know. Where did you get the Plum Crazy completer lower w/butt stock for $100 ?

Echidin
11-02-2010, 6:34 AM
Prove it! :)

racky
11-02-2010, 6:39 AM
pics or it didn't happen

BostonFan
11-02-2010, 7:59 AM
Nice. Needs pics though!

I'm roughly $100 more than you with the exact same build except a spikes tactical lower

Upper arrives today. Lower is out of jail tomorrow.

sker13
11-02-2010, 8:04 AM
Sorry guys pics will have to wait a while....Everything is paid for but haven't even started jail yet....

Flintlock Tom
11-02-2010, 8:21 AM
Well done.
The cost was the only thing holding me back from building my first AR.
And don't worry too much about criticism of the Plum Crazy lower. There was an article around here somewhere about a guy building lowers out of unconventional materials: molded nylon, wood, etc. It's amazing how little stress the lower must sustain.
When you say "complete" lower, was that really complete with LPK, pistol grip and stock?! That's amazing!
Please share your sources with us.

evidens83
11-02-2010, 8:23 AM
Lower is paid but hasnt started DROS? We want pics!! Not bad for a budget plinker..

$P-Ritch$
11-02-2010, 8:34 AM
Well done.
The cost was the only thing holding me back from building my first AR.
And don't worry too much about criticism of the Plum Crazy lower. There was an article around here somewhere about a guy building lowers out of unconventional materials: molded nylon, wood, etc. It's amazing how little stress the lower must sustain.
When you say "complete" lower, was that really complete with LPK, pistol grip and stock?! That's amazing!
Please share your sources with us.

There was a few different group buys that just ended with plumcrazy complete lowers for $99. I believe there was one in SoCal and the other was in the Fresno area. Normal price is $129, still pretty affordable.

762.DEFENSE
11-02-2010, 8:43 AM
What's the point if there's no pics?

cgseanp1
11-02-2010, 8:50 AM
What's the point if there's no pics?

Point of what?

s30
11-02-2010, 9:26 AM
i rather spend another hundred and fifty on a kiss build and have something nicer, im just not crazy about the plum lowers.

sker13
11-02-2010, 9:31 AM
Inquiring minds need to know. Where did you get the Plum Crazy completer lower w/butt stock for $100 ?

Got it as part of a group buy....If you want to start one you can ask Slim in the Fresno Group buy thread...I don't want to disclose the dealer (actually I don't even know) because there is a pricing map that supposedly prevents dealers from undercutting each other.

sker13
11-02-2010, 9:34 AM
Lower is paid but hasnt started DROS? We want pics!! Not bad for a budget plinker..

Has to travel from dealer to our FFL....I just paid yesterday...Shipping time from east coast? DROS will hopefully start Fri. or Sat.

sker13
11-02-2010, 9:48 AM
i rather spend another hundred and fifty on a kiss build and have something nicer, im just not crazy about the plum lowers.

Why not get a HK for around 2K to 3K they are really nice....They are polymer.

On a serious note if and when I decide to build a "combat weapon" it will be at least 1800.00 with optic. This is made to be a beater for fun and plinking. To build something nicer to me would be like 800.00 min. and most of it would still be in the upper. I really love the finer things too. But this rifle will make something just as dead at 200 yards as a Noveske.

mif_slim
11-02-2010, 10:17 AM
^ you need to read the hunting thread i made. it's about a dead bear vs a dead'er deer. Lol

sker13
11-02-2010, 10:49 AM
^ LMBO! Yes. It is deader then the bear which is only dead. Lol

LOL...LMFAO!

Cali4nia_AR
11-02-2010, 11:08 AM
What do u think your new toy will weigh? Sounds like a really nice build for the $. Enjoy

sker13
11-02-2010, 11:37 AM
best guess is 6lbs. But I wouldn't be surprised if it's in the high fives. Might have to add a little weight to the *** end to balance it better if it feels front heavy.

sker13
11-28-2010, 12:01 AM
update on post #1

Reductio
11-28-2010, 12:02 AM
cheap and dirty little $500.00 Kiss

Dude, I was totally thinking something else. :whistling:

Carry on: will be interested in pics still.

IsaacGlass
11-28-2010, 2:48 AM
26 days and still no pictures or range report? I guess it never happen.

mikaarce
11-28-2010, 6:59 AM
Here is one from an earlier post.
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=358996&highlight=plumcrazy

Darklyte27
11-28-2010, 7:02 AM
does it shoot?

WILDMAN442
11-28-2010, 7:58 AM
Donde estas the pictures man?

Justin

NapaCountyShooter
11-28-2010, 8:19 AM
How is it a $500 kiss if it cost $633?

23 Blast
11-28-2010, 10:12 AM
How is it a $500 kiss if it cost $633?

The government got their hands on it!

Seriously, pics and a range report would be nice. I'm starting to get BRD (black rifle disease) again. Haven't actually broken down and bought one yet, but I've been religiously perusing the ads and reviews. Smith and Wesson's AR looks pretty nice to me.

bombadillo
11-28-2010, 10:18 AM
You have a link to the upper you got. Cheapest I found was over $40 more for a DPMS M4 style upper.

afro
11-28-2010, 10:29 AM
JSE Surplus complete upper link:

http://www.jsesurplus.com/custom16hbarmidlength1x9flattopuppercompletestanda rd-2.aspx

Out of stock but keep an eye on it they restock fairly regularly.

I have a build (http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=367144) with one of these too but I can't get to the range until next weekend. Will do some sighting in and update my thread with reports of functionality.

chesterthehero
11-28-2010, 11:28 AM
there was a guy at the crossroads show selling prettymuch this exact setup for $600..

zman
11-28-2010, 11:53 AM
How is it a $500 kiss if it cost $633?

I was about to post that too, plus UTG......come on?

NapaCountyShooter
11-28-2010, 1:13 PM
The government got their hands on it!

Haha. Good one, but if they got their hands on it, it would be more like $50,000.

Don29palms
11-28-2010, 1:18 PM
I'm just curious to hear how it is after 1000rds or more. I hope it works well for you.

sker13
11-28-2010, 1:36 PM
Gimme a frigin break....Back out the Magpul, Dros, tax, and Bullet Button. It's 503.00 inc shipping, for a complete rifle ready to shoot. I weather someone wants featureless or BB isn't inc. I was showing how cheap you can build a rifle for plinking. You think UTG is junk then don't buy. I wasn't suggesting you should put them on your superior rifle. For the record I plan on running a PA optic with riser. Is that ok with you? Should I inc that, the 1000 rounds of ammo, and the 3 PMAG 10/20's in the price too?

Does the 600.00 rifle inc Magpul, Dros, Tax, Mag, Mag Lock, or sights? I don't think so. So let's see that is a 17% savings (plus the cost of sights and mag). Maybe you should just pay someone 97.00 to slap a upper and a lower together.

I can't believe some can't figure this stuff out on their own.

sker13
11-28-2010, 1:40 PM
I'm just curious to hear how it is after 1000rds or more. I hope it works well for you.

Me too. We will see how this little experiment works out. I have 500 rounds of quality brass reloads and 500 rounds of the American Eagle stuff that was on sale at Cabella's to run through it.

longarmshortlegs
11-28-2010, 2:31 PM
Look's good. I think that the two most overwhelming/discouraging factors of building/purchasing a black rifle are the cost, and the endless array of accessories and configurations. It's nice to actually see a budget, a list of everything necessary that was purchased, and a final product and cost including fees (DROS, tax est., etc.) and a photo of the final completed product.

Thanks a lot. I hope it works for you.

NationsMostWanted
11-28-2010, 3:07 PM
I paid hmm right at 600-610 for everything. Plumcrazy lower delton upper for 385 and a carry handle and 2 mags. No tax for anything either.

Fjold
11-28-2010, 3:14 PM
As far as the cost of a black rifle goes, spread it out over 6 months or so and it's a lot easier to do.

I bought a Tactical Machining DPMS style "blem" lower last month, found a NIB MagPUl PRS stock on EBay for $192 delivered, got a DPMS 308 LPK off of Midway and used one of their coupons for like $55. I'll keep an eye out for an upper and wait until I find one on sale some place. Or I'll but a barrel and pick up all the Upper parts one at a time.

sker13
11-28-2010, 3:16 PM
I paid hmm right at 600-610 for everything. Plumcrazy lower delton upper for 385 and a carry handle and 2 mags. No tax for anything either.

Break it down for me if you don't mind so everyone can see how you did it. Actually part of PRK 60.00 DROS was tax if I'm not mistaken.

NationsMostWanted
11-28-2010, 3:19 PM
Break it down for me if you don't mind so everyone can see how you did it.

350- delton upper
160 PCL with fees
23- 2 mags
27.47- carry handle sight
16 - shipping to CA
20-BB from PRK

586...i think thats it

sker13
11-28-2010, 4:33 PM
$596.47 Nice budget build. I hope to see you at the range. Slim needs to help us set up a carbine course.

tomd1584
11-28-2010, 4:33 PM
Unless that front sight is meant for a railed gas block, dont plan on getting it zeroed.

NationsMostWanted
11-28-2010, 4:41 PM
$596.47 Nice budget build. I hope to see you at the range. Slim needs to help us set up a carbine course.

yea im not quite finished yet technically cus i got to contact Plumcrazy on getting me a RMA to get my lower sent back for return on Monday. So im kinda PO about that. hopefully they get everything back to me ASAP

I did test it out still last friday with Slim at the range. Shot great and didnt see any issues with it.

slomofo
11-28-2010, 4:53 PM
Not bad for the price you paid, but I personally wouldn't have gone with a plumcrazy lower with the amount of money you spent.

sker13
11-28-2010, 5:03 PM
Unless that front sight is meant for a railed gas block, dont plan on getting it zeroed.

Why yes, the POS UTG front sight is meant for a gas block...Thanks for your concern....I already zeroed it at 30 yards with a laser bore sight.

sker13
11-28-2010, 5:13 PM
Not bad for the price you paid, but I personally wouldn't have gone with a plumcrazy lower with the amount of money you spent.

For the amount of money I spent?

I guess there are a lot of options I don't know about for 100.00 that inc. Lower, Lower parts kit, buffer assembly, and Butt Stock.

IrishPirate
11-28-2010, 5:16 PM
hmmmm. might go this route but have a solar tactical grip and forget the BB and magpul. cheap is good....so long as it shoots when i want it to...

any chance we'll get a range report soon? i'm interested in hearing how well this thing shoots!!!!

mif_slim
11-28-2010, 9:03 PM
I'll do a range report tomorrow. I went the other night with NMW but I had a entire bag of crappy mags so it jammed every time! Grr.. Today I went again with good mags and I had no issues but I'll go, again, tomorrow, lol, for a report.

captbilly
11-28-2010, 10:53 PM
As a design engineer myself I am constantly faced with the decision as to finding an inexpensive (hopefully elegant) solution to a problem, or just throwing money at a design. Clearly one can get better quality by spending lots of money but a $500 AR is going to be far more affordable to a much larger group of buyers than a $5,000 tricked out AR. There are all sorts of places that one might want to spend money on an AR, you can buy $280 triggers, $500 barrels, $5,000 4th Gen night vision scopes, etc. etc. but the incremental improvement becomes smaller and smaller for the money spent. I am a big time target shooter but even I understand that for most users the ability to consistently shoot 0.5MOA vs. 1 or 1.5 MOA is completely irrelevant since the shooter can't or doesn't need to shoot that well. Night vision is absolutely a nice thing to have, after all nearly 1/2 of the time it is dark, but the cost can be many times the price of a good rifle. Same thing is true of the $2,000 -$4,000 Nightforce, US optics, Leica, Zeiss, Schmidt Bender, Swarovski, and other ultra premium scopes, they're great but at 4-8 times the cost of the rifle the OP built it becomes questionable whether they make sense for most users.

I tried to take a similar approach with both my AR style rifles. I didn't necessarily get quite as cheap as you did but I tried to find the least expensive solution that met my needs.

Falstaff
11-28-2010, 11:30 PM
Here's mine:

Aero precision lower 59.99 (when you buy 10 from TDS guns)
JSe Surplus 16" upper 335.00 +16.00 shipping
Magpul CTR stock,buffer,tube, spring in FDE 127.00
Magpul moe grip and forend ~35
LPK 65.00
UTG sites ~35 (I think I have the wrong type on the front, its for a rail not a gas block)
http://i52.tinypic.com/dfvmnt.jpg
http://i55.tinypic.com/2afkck8.jpg
WDNssllCRxg

performed flawlessly at the range today, 120 rounds no failures of any kind. Used Tula .223 metal case, federal .223 value pack and some 5,56 62 grain green tips

d sauce
11-29-2010, 12:31 AM
This is a terrible thread... now that I know you can build an AR-15 for around $500 means my family will not be receiving christmas gifts next months. On a serious note, this thread did its job in spreading awareness of how affordable one of these rifles can be, and for that I thank you.

LoudSilence
11-29-2010, 12:50 AM
Is that the 50 yard range in Linden? I think I saw you there yesterday.

Infidel
11-29-2010, 8:23 AM
*Update* With Pic
This thread is meant to show how cheap you can build a AR beater/plinker CA legal carbine. If you have any ideas how it can be done for less speak up. 500.00 Kiss refers to price of all components nec. to build a AR, inc. sights and mag, without Gov fees, taxes, or Mag lock.

Plum Crazy completer lower w/butt stock......$100.00
JSE 16'' Carbine Complete upper...................$335.00
C products 10 round mag from JSE................$11.00
JSE shipping to CA......................................$16.20
UTG front and rear sights (amazon)................$40.54 free shipping

Total for a rifle ready to fire..........................$502.74

Dros, tax, ect.............................................$6 0.00
Prince 50 BB...............................................$ 18.00

You could stop right here..............................$580.74


Things I bought that don't really apply but are in the pic
Magpul forgrip........................................... ..$18.00
Magpul VFG............................................... .$35.00

total $633.74

Obviously, I could have kept it under 600.00 total inc tax, shipping and Dros. But, without the Magpul items.

I will post some pics tomorrow.
Total Weight without sights...........................6lbs

Now before you aficionados get all worked up...Plum Crazy is lifetime warranty and we all know how easy it is to upgrade parts at a later date...I know..I know... You get what you pay for but, for that price it's a beater that by all accounts works...And,

I paid more for my Glock.....

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii23/sker13/arphoto-1.jpg
http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii23/sker13/plumblower.jpg

Congrats on the new rifle bro. it looks awesome!...Please let us know how it shoots! I'm very interested in doing something very similar to your build for a budget plinker/beater rifle

Bizcuits
11-29-2010, 11:29 AM
And to think I spent nearly 1200 on my stag :(

slomofo
11-29-2010, 12:04 PM
Here's my budget builds. There were a few used parts used to construct these (carry handles, front sight posts, one set of handguards, and other small items), but for the most part they were brand new.


http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e237/slomofo562/ARBuildpics/e8535321.jpg

msand951
11-29-2010, 1:11 PM
Nice builds , Im in the process in finishing my build but im going to have to wait until after Christmas. I want a Ar so bad i went the inexpensive way also. Buying it in steps or parts. So far I got .
dpms complete upper: 320 shipped purchased used from calguns.
http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=2100
Aero lower : 75 plus dros and tax , got 2 for the next one :)
palmetto LPK: 55
mag buttom: 35
10 round mag 10
total spent so far is $495. Im looking for a deal on a stock kit. I like the a2 stock.

The next one i plan on getting in parts also. I have a lower already but i want a good upper. So a good barrel and good Bolt . Im thinking of this
Upper: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/Upper-Receiver-assembly-M4-Flat-Top-p/flat%20top%20-upper%20-m4%202.htm
BCG: http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-Bolt-Carrier-Group-MPI-Auto-M16-p/bcm%20bolt%20carrier%20group%20auto%20mp.htm
Barrel:http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-16-M4-Barrel-Stripped-p/bcm-brl-s-m4%2016%20std.htm
Thats about 470 on what i think, most important stuff I hope.

Killawhale415
11-29-2010, 1:26 PM
Your front sight is on backwards

msand951
11-29-2010, 2:17 PM
This is probably a dumb noob question but some people say that most lowers are the same or close. That, it just comes down to the design or make you like. Is that sort of true and are upper receivers the same also . With the exception of billet stuff of course. Cause i was checking this upper to build off of.
http://www.largrizzly.com/web/guest/grizzly-uppers they have blemished for $48.

slomofo
11-29-2010, 2:59 PM
This is probably a dumb noob question but some people say that most lowers are the same or close. That, it just comes down to the design or make you like. Is that sort of true and are upper receivers the same also . With the exception of billet stuff of course. Cause i was checking this upper to build off of.
http://www.largrizzly.com/web/guest/grizzly-uppers they have blemished for $48.

Most lowers are made by four big companies and restamped with different names on them. LAR Manufacturing, the company you just linked to, is one of those big four companies that makes the majority of lowers/uppers.

jeffsenpai
11-29-2010, 5:17 PM
looks great I will have to save this info.;)

sker13
11-29-2010, 6:15 PM
Your front sight is on backwards

So it is...OOOOOPS:o

Falstaff
11-29-2010, 8:01 PM
Is that the 50 yard range in Linden? I think I saw you there yesterday.

Yep, that was me.

Fate
11-30-2010, 7:22 AM
So what's up with your selector switch? It should be vertical or horizontal, not at a 45 degree angle, unless that's some secret squirrel setting I've never heard of ;)

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii23/sker13/plumblower.jpg

dfletcher
11-30-2010, 8:50 AM
Me too. We will see how this little experiment works out. I have 500 rounds of quality brass reloads and 500 rounds of the American Eagle stuff that was on sale at Cabella's to run through it.

Given the way the net works, I wouldn't be surprised if someone who has never gone beyond the "considering it" stage sees the thread & realizes that for a basic set up a) it doesn't cost alot of money and b) no engineering degree/special tools are required. Aside from the Air Force, before I stumbled on to an AR thread I'd spent about 40 years shooting & working on guns before learning I could build an AR (that I'd like) myself - I think I've done maybe a dozen thus far and kept half of them.

Whether it's a little above or below $500.00 or switching out standard for more desireable parts, making the endeavor user and wallet friendly is good.

sker13
11-30-2010, 9:24 AM
So what's up with your selector switch? It should be vertical or horizontal, not at a 45 degree angle, unless that's some secret squirrel setting I've never heard of ;)

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii23/sker13/plumblower.jpg

That is the super special secret mall ninja setting...LOL....It is covering up my serial number...Easier than doing some photoshop.

Falstaff
11-30-2010, 9:36 PM
That is the super special secret mall ninja setting...LOL....It is covering up my serial number...Easier than doing some photoshop.

What mag catch is that you have there? (The fluted one) Never seen one like that before

Has anyone broken solidly below the 500.00 mark yet on an AR build??

Hump0311
11-30-2010, 9:44 PM
What mag catch is that you have there? (The fluted one) Never seen one like that before

Has anyone broken solidly below the 500.00 mark yet on an AR build??

I dunno but it would be a fun little challenge.

Who can complete the first AR build for under $500 that shoots at "whatever" MOA.

goodlookin1
12-01-2010, 10:29 AM
Lower from TDS: $78.41 including taxes and DROS (bought 4 pack for the discount)
LPK from Palmetto State Armory: On sale for $48.50 shipped
JSE Surplus Upper: $335 (dont know shipping yet)
Butt Stock Kit from Calguns: $38 shipped

Total = $499.91

Ok, if you want to get stinky about shipping on the upper, prolly add about another $16 as others have said.

thebrassnuckles
12-01-2010, 10:48 AM
My complete ar cost me... lets see.. going off memory here, but..


YHM lower---------$115 (2pack on gunbroker)
LPK -------------- $75
Buffer tube------- $40
Troy front sight----$120
LaRue stealth upper, buttstock, pistol grip, FUG, sling and rear sight,
(and everything else) plus a storm case -----$25
total cost $375
pic for your enjoyment;)
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c199/brassnuckles/bang%20bang%20fruit/IMG_4140.jpg

mikaarce
12-01-2010, 12:00 PM
where did you buy such cheap stuff?

sker13
12-01-2010, 12:02 PM
Nice!!! I don't know where you found the sucker to sell you that upper for 25.00.

afro
12-01-2010, 12:40 PM
Nice. Win it at a Larue event or something?

247Nino
12-01-2010, 12:46 PM
will you need more BUIS for your UTG BUIS?

slomofo
12-01-2010, 1:10 PM
will you need more BUIS for your UTG BUIS?

wat:confused:

thebrassnuckles
12-01-2010, 1:17 PM
I wont the monthly contest on ar15.com.. the 25 bucks is the cost of the membership..

a few months later I won a spare BCG too.. lol

tba02
12-02-2010, 6:38 PM
So here's another KISS build that I just pinned together this afternoon, range trip planned for Sat.

My budget build AR-15 5.56
Jse Surplus complete A4 upper w/ M4 feed ramps + shipping = 350.74
Magpul MOE Carbine Hand Guard upgrade = 18.00
PlumCrazy Complete Lower = 150.00
CA and transfer fees = 50.00
Bullet Button - Included w/ lower = 0.00
Red Dot = 28.95
10rd Pmag = 20.00

Total = 617.69 (all shipping, fees etc. included)
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/attachment.php?attachmentid=77344&d=1291343804