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View Full Version : No such thing as a "true" 1x magnification on scopes...


OutlawDon
10-28-2010, 7:36 PM
I did not write this...I am sharing info...

Source: Molon 04-14-2010, 05:59 PM
http://www.m4carbine.net/showpost.php?p=627913&postcount=13



As you’ve discovered, the “true 1X magnification” claim parroted by so many on the Internet is incorrect. No worries though, as for all practical purposes, it matters not. The “1X” magnification of the TR24 works great for both-eyes-open shooting. Even if the 1X magnification truly were a “true 1X magnification” in the truest sense of the word, you still wouldn’t be able to co-witness your iron sights through the TR24 as you would not be able to flip-up your rear BUIS with the TR24 properly placed for its eye relief. Also, I have yet to see a single 1-4X variable scope on the market that is a “true 1X magnification.”

The Ruler of Truth
Pictured below is a view of an Aimpoint M4S with a metal ruler running through its field of view and beyond. Notice that the lines formed by the top and bottom edges of the ruler continue uninterrupted when passing through the Aimpoint’s field of view. Notice that the numbers and graduation marks are the exact same size, both inside the Aimpoint’s field of view and out. This is “true” 1X magnification; that is to say, no magnification at all.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/58pd7y9c7g.jpg

The next view has the ruler running through the field of view of an EOTech HoloSight. Again, the lines of the ruler continue uninterrupted and the ruler remains the exact same size inside the EOTech’s fied of view and out.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/vq6utzjd7i.jpg

Now, let’s apply the Ruler of Truth to what many here have called a “true 1X” optic, the Trijicon Accupoint TR24-R. The magnification ring is set to 1X in the view below.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/jh4aayxniz.jpg

As you can clearly see, the lines formed by the edges of the ruler are shifted when running through the field of view of the TR24-R and the ruler is clearly larger inside the field of view of the TR24-R; that is to say, the ruler is MAGNIFIED.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/r8hyxavoyl.jpg

The Ruler of Truth applied to a NightForce 1- 4 x 24 NXS with the magnification ring set to 1X reveals the same findings.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/1377knqo8b.jpg

http://www.box.net/shared/static/cdpf2qdn1k.jpg

OutlawDon
10-28-2010, 7:37 PM
The Ruler of Truth applied to a Short Dot LE with the magnification ring set to 1.1X shows little difference from the NightForce NXS on 1X.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/m7ck5sbbz9.jpg

http://www.box.net/shared/static/en9lqsv308.jpg

In truth, since the “true 1X” scopes are not truly without magnification in the truest sense of the word like an Aimpoint or EOTech, the only thing the truly matters is, can these optics be easily used with human binocular vision; that is, both eyes opened and focused on the target at the same time? The answer is a resounding yes, just as it is with the Short Dot LE at 1.1X magnification.


Focus On The Front Sight
Here's a view of the front sight when looking through an Aimpoint M4S.
http://www.box.net/shared/static/2xkb5uv154.jpg

This view is looking through a NightForce NXS 1-4 x 24 at 1X magnification.

http://www.box.net/shared/static/07belpyc4t.jpg

armygunsmith
10-28-2010, 7:49 PM
Good find, thanks for posting.

captbilly
10-28-2010, 9:25 PM
The pictures presented would seem to show a pretty serious error in the power setting on these scopes. I would roughly call most of those about 2 power according to what we see in the pictures.

Nodda Duma
10-29-2010, 6:03 AM
Sounds like some marketing boys weren't paying attention to their engineers..

prc77
10-29-2010, 6:37 AM
does the EOTech claim to be 1x

Merc1138
10-29-2010, 6:48 AM
I've never seen eotech claim to be "1x magnification", I've read it as being "non-magnified". The issue comes from variable power scopes claiming to go down to 1x when they don't, not non-magnified red dots being any different.

As far as the 1x magnification not being correct, I had always kinda doubted it anyway seeing as how no matter you turn the dial, you aren't taking the curvature out of the lenses and without some insane engineering, you aren't going to optically remove it(nothing that could fit into a rifle scope anyway).

nikonuser
10-29-2010, 7:39 AM
Good info and good reading.

badfish71
10-29-2010, 9:34 AM
I always thought 0x ie. Aimpoint etc. Was zero magnification. So, 1x would have. Some magnification.

berg
10-29-2010, 9:37 AM
does the EOTech claim to be 1x

http://www.eotech-inc.com/page.php?id=8

rero360
10-29-2010, 9:42 AM
Take a look at the USO SN-4S, I've only been able to handle one briefly but it did seem like true 1x at the bottom of the magnification range. But then again I didn't do a ruler test, just looked around with it using the old MK1 MOD1 eye balls, I couldn't detect any difference between the two images having both eyes open.

UserM4
10-29-2010, 9:56 AM
For what it's worth, they're closer to 1x at further distances.

MoeSizslak
10-29-2010, 10:11 AM
Thanks Outlaw - this is something I was just wondering about.

goodlookin1
10-29-2010, 11:48 AM
For what it's worth, they're closer to 1x at further distances.

QFT


Up close tests like the "Ruler of Truth" test will definitely show the magnification being much more prominent that it really is. That being said, it is a good test for seeing if there really is any magnification.

I'm curious as to how the internals of a Spectre Dr scope 1x/4x works, because I have heard and seen that it is a true 1x when on this setting, unlike the 1-4x scopes that claim to be a "true" 1x. Not sure how they did this with the glass being like a scope.

JaeOne3345
10-29-2010, 4:03 PM
For what it's worth, they're closer to 1x at further distances.

Exactly. On my 1-4x this error is much less noticeable at the distances I actually shoot at.