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View Full Version : Scalia takes Kagan to gun range, sources say


RKV
10-25-2010, 6:13 AM
"According to two witnesses, Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia took fellow Justice Elena Kagan out for a lesson in skeet shooting at his shooting club in Virginia last week."

http://dailycaller.com/2010/10/25/scalia-takes-kagan-to-gun-range-sources-say/

This, of course, is no guarantee of anything. That said, I support the approach.

VegasND
10-25-2010, 6:22 AM
Let me know when he takes her pistol shooting or to an NFA shoot.


Liberals seem to be able to compartmentalize their need to outlaw guns -- somehow shotguns are okay. Even Biden and his Berettas are okay, probably because they're too expensive for most citizens.

NightOwl
10-25-2010, 6:26 AM
Interesting, thanks!

That being said, I'm hoping to see her hanging out with Clarance Thomas next. Pleeeeeeeeease pleasepleasepleaseplease.

Hey, I can hope, can't I?

RKV
10-25-2010, 6:53 AM
And yeah, a pick of Kagan shooting an MP5 would be golden.

Regulus
10-25-2010, 7:00 AM
Interesting, thanks!

That being said, I'm hoping to see her hanging out with Clarance Thomas next. Pleeeeeeeeease pleasepleasepleaseplease.

Hey, I can hope, can't I?

Or Quail hunting with Dick Cheney?

Disclaimer: Please do not misconstrue my statement. I do not wish any harm to befall Dick Cheney.

Ford8N
10-25-2010, 7:09 AM
Phfft.......Knob Creek FTW!!!!!!

Nodda Duma
10-25-2010, 7:13 AM
Let's hope he took the opportunity to explain the dead-document interpretation of the 2nd Amendment.

choprzrul
10-25-2010, 7:13 AM
Any gun in the hands of any non-shooter or anti-gun person is an educational experience that often illuminates that little light bulb in their heads. A truly wise justice will recognize the importance of giving the weaker members of society a method by which they can effectively defend themselves.

Maybe we should start a SCOTUS ammo fund so that they can go to that range and blast away. The more rounds sent down range, the bigger the smile...

.

CharlieK
10-25-2010, 7:18 AM
Any gun in the hands of any non-shooter or anti-gun person is an educational experience that often illuminates that little light bulb in their heads.

Often perhaps, but not always. Remember, Feinstein once had a CCW. Didn't stop her tyrannous ways.

rromeo
10-25-2010, 7:21 AM
I'm sure that others are better informed than I, and already knew this. For me, it's good to see that Scalia is actually "Pro Gun".

a1c
10-25-2010, 7:41 AM
Some people often assume that the originalists/conservatives on the bench don't mix with the liberals, and vice-versa. It couldn't be more false - those are brilliant people who have personal friendships. Ginsberg and Scalia are close friends who share a passion for the opera, wine and fine food. And just back a few months ago, Scalia was describing Kagan as a friend.

glockman19
10-25-2010, 7:58 AM
Great news...I look forward to incramental change in the was Kagan thinks...even if just a little.

faterikcartman
10-25-2010, 8:30 AM
Russian Commissars often enjoyed American goods and a Dacha in the country while prescribing communism and austerity for the proletariat.

In other words, she could come to love guns and shooting as a hobby and it would do nothing to help the position of ordinary American gun owners.

As an aside, remember that Thomas tends to follow the Constitution whilst Scalia tends to follow precedent -- whatever he may favour.

sholling
10-25-2010, 9:16 AM
Any gun in the hands of any non-shooter or anti-gun person is an educational experience that often illuminates that little light bulb in their heads. A truly wise justice will recognize the importance of giving the weaker members of society a method by which they can effectively defend themselves.
A true Progressive firmly believes that the average human is too stupid to to be trusted to decide for him/herself what to have for lunch - much less own a firearm. The true Progressive believes that decision making and firearms are best reserved for elites such as themselves.

a1c
10-25-2010, 9:22 AM
Russian Commissars often enjoyed American goods and a Dacha in the country while prescribing communism and austerity for the proletariat.

In other words, she could come to love guns and shooting as a hobby and it would do nothing to help the position of ordinary American gun owners.

As an aside, remember that Thomas tends to follow the Constitution whilst Scalia tends to follow precedent -- whatever he may favour.

Actually, it's a bit of a caricature to portray Thomas as someone who doesn't believe in stare decisis, as opposed to Scalia. He's a bit more complex than that.

Wherryj
10-25-2010, 9:40 AM
Let's hope he took the opportunity to explain the dead-document interpretation of the 2nd Amendment.

I'm unaware of the "dead-document interpretation" of which you speak. If you mean that he is against the "Living document" interpretation used by those who wish to view the Constitution as saying things that it does not say, perhaps this may enlighten.

http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/guest_commentary/scalia-constitutional-speech.htm

"What is a moderate interpretation of the text? Halfway between what it really means and what you’d like it to mean? "

Scalia believes that laws and contracts MUST be interpreted in the context in which they were written. I agree. If a law has become outdated, thus no longer having a meaning in the current society, it is improper to merely "reinterpret" that law. The law needs to be struck and a new law needs to be written.

If you believe that the Constitution can be "reinterpreted" for "modern times", you believe in the power of the Supreme Court to WRITE law. There is a process in the Constitution to deal with such issues. It is called an Amendment. Allowing judges to rewrite the Constitution is abhorrent and removes the checks and balances upon our government.

DougJ
10-25-2010, 9:49 AM
^Excellent post!

Fyathyrio
10-25-2010, 10:00 AM
Being something of a cipher when nominated, there were only two items that I recall from her written history to attempt to interpret her opinions on the 2A, and both were negative. She penned those while working for the Clintonistas, so should we really be surprised that she wrote something that would please her boss?

I wasn't able to watch the confirmation hearings while out here, but as I recall from summaries her only 2A statement was that she'd support precedent. Wouldn't it be truly funny to see the anti's reaction if she joins the Heller five?

bandook
10-25-2010, 10:21 AM
Interesting, thanks!

That being said, I'm hoping to see her hanging out with Clarance Thomas next. Pleeeeeeeeease pleasepleasepleaseplease.

Hey, I can hope, can't I?

I don't think she's his 'type' so there's almost no chance of lewd comments from him. (Sorry, Clarence Thomas has been in the news lately for all the wrong reasons).

But I like the handgun ammo fund Idea for SCOTUS. It'll show some of the justices that owning a handgun doesn't make you a murderer

yellowfin
10-25-2010, 1:51 PM
Allowing judges to rewrite the Constitution is abhorrent and removes the checks and balances upon our government.And is exactly what they did for the entirety of the 1930's and 40's.

jl123
10-25-2010, 3:17 PM
And is exactly what they did for the entirety of the 1930's and 40's.

Roosevelt strong-armed the court......threatened to add justices to get what he wanted done anyway.

Maestro Pistolero
10-25-2010, 3:33 PM
Wouldn't it just be the most wonderful surprise if Kagan were to come down on the right side of things?

jccam
10-25-2010, 3:48 PM
Let me know when he takes her pistol shooting or to an NFA shoot.


Liberals seem to be able to compartmentalize their need to outlaw guns -- somehow shotguns are okay. .

Yes, I have noticed this to be true on many occasions, but pro-2A people should use this to advantage. The biggest hurdle in converting an anti-gun person is to get them to the range, help them participate in the discipline and challenge of hitting targets, and realize that the gun itself is not some inherently evil thing. This is a huge step, and a relatively innocuous session of trap shooting seems to accomplish this far better than leaving copies of Soldier of Fortune on their coffee table.

Seems like Scalia is doing exactly what I have done many times with newbies or borderline antis. It works! Realize that you may never convert someone completely, but if you move them from being an anti to being neutral or at least fair-minded, that is very worthwhile.

---
As a side note, I mentioned the good work of Calguns to some guys at my local trap & skeet range. Response was "Oh yeah, I've heard of Calguns. They're mostly into Glocks and ARs, right?" Ouch!

We gotta hang together fellas! And this includes the NRA behaving with basic courtesy to SAF. Egos and in-fighting will do us in.

Dr Rockso
10-25-2010, 3:50 PM
Wouldn't it just be the most wonderful surprise if Kagan were to come down on the right side of things?

I'm hoping she goes full gun nut, myself. In a year she could be posting pics of her 15 pound tacticooled AR on arfcom and opining on her favorite parts of Unintended Consequences.

Hey, it could happen :p

IrishPirate
10-25-2010, 4:01 PM
I'm unaware of the "dead-document interpretation" of which you speak. If you mean that he is against the "Living document" interpretation used by those who wish to view the Constitution as saying things that it does not say, perhaps this may enlighten.

http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/guest_commentary/scalia-constitutional-speech.htm

"What is a moderate interpretation of the text? Halfway between what it really means and what you’d like it to mean? "

Scalia believes that laws and contracts MUST be interpreted in the context in which they were written. I agree. If a law has become outdated, thus no longer having a meaning in the current society, it is improper to merely "reinterpret" that law. The law needs to be struck and a new law needs to be written.

If you believe that the Constitution can be "reinterpreted" for "modern times", you believe in the power of the Supreme Court to WRITE law. There is a process in the Constitution to deal with such issues. It is called an Amendment. Allowing judges to rewrite the Constitution is abhorrent and removes the checks and balances upon our government.

couldn't have said this any better......bravo!!

dantodd
10-25-2010, 4:06 PM
Shooting skeet with Scalia or an LCAV conference call with Stevens. I know which I'd prefer Kagan spend her time doing.

Neil McCauley
10-26-2010, 11:22 AM
I could imagine him constantly yelling "TRIGGER DISCILIPINE!!" at her. Anyone slow mo vids of her shooting full auto?

Window_Seat
10-26-2010, 11:27 AM
In the words of another member here (don't know who said it), if the SCJ is a black lesbian atheist raised in MA, lives in TX, but she/he (I had a teacher named Shehe once) can count without missing the #2, she/he is alright in my book. If this turns Kagen around (not saying she is any of the above :p), I just might invite her to Reed's and pay her way for a lesson with Rick. :D

Erik.

nicki
10-26-2010, 11:57 AM
Overall I have found that people who are anti gun can be flipped over to our side because if they are sincere people, once they find out that their believes are based on ignorance and lies, they are open to change.

Kagan grew up in NYC and she has been in urban anti gun areas her whole life. If she is intellectually honest and if in her mind she really supports the constitution, she just may come around and pleasantly surprise us.

I am not a Kagan fan, but perhaps she may flip our way. She will never be a conservative, but perhaps she will evolve and move toward Libertarianism.

Havoc70
10-26-2010, 12:08 PM
I still think part of the oath of becoming a Supreme Court Justice should be "I hereby renounce all influences of any political party that I may belong to and solemnly swear to adjudicate solely based upon the Constitution of the United States". Granted, it may be only lip service, but at least it would be something.

3B830
10-26-2010, 3:45 PM
http://dailycaller.com/2010/10/25/scalia-takes-kagan-to-gun-range-sources-say/

Skeet can be fun. Hope she had a good time. I wonder where he had to go for trades? :)


Hat tip to http://armsandthelaw.com/

Skidmark
10-26-2010, 3:48 PM
:dupe:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=356181

Skidmark
10-26-2010, 5:47 PM
Everyone should have a hobby. If she takes a liking to skeet shooting, or rifles, that's perfectly fine. I think in her judicial opinions, she's bound to disappoint liberals and surprise conservatives... such was the incorrect labeling she was adorned with.

safewaysecurity
10-26-2010, 5:50 PM
Or Quail hunting with Dick Cheney?

Disclaimer: Please do not misconstrue my statement. I do not wish any harm to befall Dick Cheney.

HAHAHAHAHA

HondaMasterTech
10-26-2010, 7:09 PM
Bad dupe police. No donut.

marcusrn
10-26-2010, 9:09 PM
Well played Chief Justice Scalia! The best thing any of us can do is to be safe and responsible and take an unbeliever fun shooting. I worked with a nurse who told we that we should go shooting because I told him I did this a lot. He went on like this for 2 years and we never actually went.I kept telling him " whenever you want". I think his wife was keeping him from going because she thought guns where something that drew people to violence. She was mugged in Carlsbad Ca. and got her purse stolen and teeth knocked out. He's finally gone shooting with me numerous X and is choosing handgun and black rifle at this time. There are a lot of smart people who have been affluent enough to never have been in crime area or in crime's way. Good for them. People adapt to circumstance. I just marveled at how fast this guy went from "would'nt have a gun in house" to" must have .22 target, .38 and black rifle w optics". I played it on the down low the whole 2 yrs. I am a nurse and NRA instructor and always tell neophyte or non shooter workmates that I will teach them to shoot for free. Oftentimes people just need to make a connection and some help getting started.

PyroFox79
10-26-2010, 9:53 PM
Baby steps.

dantodd
10-26-2010, 9:58 PM
Well played Chief Justice Scalia!

Did he get a promotion?

Nodda Duma
10-27-2010, 12:04 AM
Wherryj, Scalia himself has called the Constitution a dead document (60 Minutes interview I believe, same time frame as Heller decision was handed down), going on to explain the exact point you make in your post, that the Constitution and Amendments should be interpreted as they were originally intended. That is the essence of a Constitutionalist.

Not sure if you were debating or expanding my comment. :)

xXBigJoeXx
10-28-2010, 5:46 PM
I think that this is a good first step towards her being Pro 2A. Would like to see the next trip to the range for some pistol action, then before you know it she will be sporting an EBR!! Hehehehehehe :43::chris:

dunndeal
10-28-2010, 9:07 PM
I don't think she's his 'type' so there's almost no chance of lewd comments from him. (Sorry, Clarence Thomas has been in the news lately for all the wrong reasons).

"Sorry",,, that's an appropriate word. There's ZERO proof her allegations were fact.

Jonl
10-29-2010, 7:38 AM
Good for her to try something new. I have some libs in my family, through marriage, that cringe when I mention "gun". But I'm working on her and will get her to the range someday.

Skidmark
10-29-2010, 8:00 AM
I don't think she's his 'type' so there's almost no chance of lewd comments from him. (Sorry, Clarence Thomas has been in the news lately for all the wrong reasons).
By "type" you're suggesting he's an adulterer?

And yes, odd that his wife (arch-conservative Virginia Thomas) decided to revive the ugly episode of his confirmation hearings. What could her strategy possibly be? How does it benefit her husband or her political causes to breathe new life into old allegations?

biglou
10-29-2010, 2:28 PM
Like one person said - baby steps.
http://www.gunreports.com/news/news/Scalia-Kagan-Supreme-Court_2476-1.html?ET=gunreports:p843:169777a:&st=pmail