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Gray Peterson
10-15-2010, 12:28 AM
UPDATE (2015 April 07): From IMPORTANT CCW APPLICATION INSTRUCTIONS .pdf linked at: http://www.tularecounty.ca.gov/sheriff/index.cfm/resources/forms-documents/

Good Cause Statements

California Penal code section 12050 states in part that the CCW applicant must provide good cause which is defined as a Convincing evidence of a clear and present danger to life, or of great bodily harm to the applicant, his/her spouse, or dependent child, which cannot be adequately dealt with by existing law enforcement resources, and which danger cannot be reasonably avoided by alternative measures, and which danger would be significantly mitigated by the applicant's carrying of a concealed firearm.

85mr
02-08-2011, 8:34 PM
New used, taking this from another forum, I'm interested in getting my CCW, my neighborhood's gotten a little bit sketchy, robberieshad 4 seperate and caught/tackled a guy trying to break in two weeks ago. I know just the "inside the home" stuff isn't cause in-itself, but my street seems to be a byway for people from other neighborhoods. My girlfriends car stolen off the street, felt like I was going to get carjacked a couple times... Can I use the break-in attempts/robberies as evidence that I don't live in a safe neighborhood? I really don't want to wait to get mugged or carjacked to submit for it...
I backpack up in the Sierras... and don't like the idea of running into the people growing "cash crops"... and I frequently travel from Reedley to Visalia to visit Family... usually returning by myself late at night driving on the back roads... I know that this site hasn't posted any "approved good cause statements" for Tulare yet... So I wondering if any users could help me fine tune? Are these reasons somthing that would be considered or am I out in left field? I've been told that multiple applications/re-jections can hurt your chances, didn't want to just whip something together and throw it in the mail...


mike

ironman5669
02-08-2011, 8:48 PM
Welcome Mike, I also Live in tulare county and would like to invite you to join the visalia sportsmans association, we offer free ccw classes to all members, ( required in tulare county)we also have our own range, clubhouse and FFL all for only 45.00 a year ( I think) many of our members are ccw holders and would be happy to share information with new people. you can find us in the phone book or at visaliasportsmans.com

John Spier

85mr
02-08-2011, 9:54 PM
Thanks John, E-mail's been sent to the address listed for membership...

wildhawker
02-08-2011, 10:04 PM
Tulare is a friendly county; you should feel free to apply using a self-defense variant. We urge applicants to keep their good cause focused, as most cause-based denials are based on "storybook" narratives.

New used, taking this from another forum, I'm interested in getting my CCW, my neighborhood's gotten a little bit sketchy, robberieshad 4 seperate and caught/tackled a guy trying to break in two weeks ago. I know just the "inside the home" stuff isn't cause in-itself, but my street seems to be a byway for people from other neighborhoods. My girlfriends car stolen off the street, felt like I was going to get carjacked a couple times... Can I use the break-in attempts/robberies as evidence that I don't live in a safe neighborhood? I really don't want to wait to get mugged or carjacked to submit for it...
I backpack up in the Sierras... and don't like the idea of running into the people growing "cash crops"... and I frequently travel from Reedley to Visalia to visit Family... usually returning by myself late at night driving on the back roads... I know that this site hasn't posted any "approved good cause statements" for Tulare yet... So I wondering if any users could help me fine tune? Are these reasons somthing that would be considered or am I out in left field? I've been told that multiple applications/re-jections can hurt your chances, didn't want to just whip something together and throw it in the mail...


mike

crankn22
07-16-2011, 8:14 AM
Hi, I am new to this forum, I am a member of VSA and am interestest in applying for my CCW,as is my wife. We own our own business and I travel quite a bit. My question is in regards to section 7 question 6 on the Tulare county CCW application. I have a DUI that is more than 5 years old and was wondering if that would cause me to be declined. Also where you have to list your traffic infringements, i pulled a 10 year driving record from the DMV but can not figure out what it acctually says. can someone help please??

wildhawker
07-16-2011, 10:08 AM
Crank, can a DUI cause denial? Under the current law, yes. Will it? Probably not, in Tulare. If you've already pulled your 10 year dmv history, make a copy and attached it to the application. Mark the section "see attached copy of record". Also, be sure to note the DUI under convictions.

pkbirdog
11-03-2011, 8:20 PM
I have a couple of buddys that live in Tulare county that want to get their LTC's and I was wondering how the process works there. Here in Kern county we apply first and then after you are approved you take the 8 hour course and do the background check, that way your not out the money if you get denied. Is it the same in Tulare co? Also, dose the sheriff their accept being in the mountains and country alot, doing shooting sports and that sort of thing as a good cause. Any other commits or suggestions would help. Thanks.

greasemonkey
11-03-2011, 9:42 PM
Tulare is a friendly county; you should feel free to apply using a self-defense variant. We urge applicants to keep their good cause focused, as most cause-based denials are based on "storybook" narratives.

I have a couple of buddys that live in Tulare county that want to get their LTC's and I was wondering how the process works there. Here in Kern county we apply first and then after you are approved you take the 8 hour course and do the background check, that way your not out the money if you get denied. Is it the same in Tulare co? Also, dose the sheriff their accept being in the mountains and country alot, doing shooting sports and that sort of thing as a good cause. Any other commits or suggestions would help. Thanks.
Post #5 seems pretty straightforward. I don't recall hearing any Tulare applicants being charged full price before their Good Cause was approved. For your buddies in Tulare County, have them check out the License to Carry class at the Visalia Sportsmens Association. Daniel does the class and he's good people.

bogustime
02-15-2013, 11:32 PM
Just purchased my first handgun and am now interested in getting my CCW. Can someone explain the entire process and requirements in order to obtain my CCW for Tulare County? Thanks!

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bogustime
02-19-2013, 9:58 PM
Anyone have any type of info for me?

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TulareCounty
02-23-2013, 9:59 AM
The latest info, which I learned in January 2013 when I submitted my application.

1. You can pick up an application packet at the Sheriff's office near the main courthouse in Visalia or you can get most of the forms online at the TCSO website. They do not include the paper to list your three personal references online, but you can just bring your references' names, addresses and phone numbers with you on a paper and write it out when you turn in your forms. That's what I did.

2. You will have to list the make/model/serial number of any FA you intend to carry. It's fine if you have an off-roster handgun.

3. When you drop off the application, the nice lady who works there will do your livescan fingerprinting before you leave, and after she takes a look at your paperwork. You pay $114 to submit application and get the livescan. More $$ when you pick up permit.

4. You need a current utility bill or property tax bill with YOUR name (not spouse) and your residence address to prove you live there.

5. You can submit your application and take the CCW class while it is pending or after it is approved (presumably so you don't waste your money on a CCW class when the sheriff will be denying you). Or you can turn in your certificate with your application.

6. When I was there, she called a few people up and said "you need a little more here than what you have written." It sounded to me like people were giving a good cause statement "for self defense" without more, and she was suggesting they elaborate. But I don't know for sure, because she was discreet about the actual contents of others' applications.

7. It took about 45 minutes total to drop off the application because she reviews it and brings it back for clarification, etc. Which I thought was nice, rather than just rejecting you later.

8. She said it is taking about 2-4 months to get the permits out because there are so many people submitting applications.

When I was there, it was a steady stream of people. Easy process, though.

bogustime
02-23-2013, 12:35 PM
The latest info, which I learned in January 2013 when I submitted my application.

1. You can pick up an application packet at the Sheriff's office near the main courthouse in Visalia or you can get most of the forms online at the TCSO website. They do not include the paper to list your three personal references online, but you can just bring your references' names, addresses and phone numbers with you on a paper and write it out when you turn in your forms. That's what I did.

2. You will have to list the make/model/serial number of any FA you intend to carry. It's fine if you have an off-roster handgun.

3. When you drop off the application, the nice lady who works there will do your livescan fingerprinting before you leave, and after she takes a look at your paperwork. You pay $114 to submit application and get the livescan. More $$ when you pick up permit.

4. You need a current utility bill or property tax bill with YOUR name (not spouse) and your residence address to prove you live there.

5. You can submit your application and take the CCW class while it is pending or after it is approved (presumably so you don't waste your money on a CCW class when the sheriff will be denying you). Or you can turn in your certificate with your application.

6. When I was there, she called a few people up and said "you need a little more here than what you have written." It sounded to me like people were giving a good cause statement "for self defense" without more, and she was suggesting they elaborate. But I don't know for sure, because she was discreet about the actual contents of others' applications.

7. It took about 45 minutes total to drop off the application because she reviews it and brings it back for clarification, etc. Which I thought was nice, rather than just rejecting you later.

8. She said it is taking about 2-4 months to get the permits out because there are so many people submitting applications.

When I was there, it was a steady stream of people. Easy process, though.

Perfect! Thanks for the details!

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v.kevin
02-08-2015, 9:04 AM
You can download the PDF file found on Calguns, fill it out and print. Instructions on the application state it needs to be filled out in person but the nice lady said I could turn in the application that I printed from home all filled out.

Checklist: http://www.tularecounty.ca.gov/sheriff/index.cfm/resources/forms-documents/important-ccw-application-instructions/

Application in PDF: http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/California-DOJ-Standard-Carry-License-Application.pdf

You will also need 3 references (Name, Address, Phone Number). Known for over two years and not a relative.

You bring in your app with I.D. and proof of residency along with $112 and you will get Live Scanned on the spot.

Then you wait for them to contact our references and run your background check.

Paladin
02-08-2015, 1:22 PM
You can download the PDF file found on Calguns, fill it out and print. Instructions on the application state it needs to be filled out in person but the nice lady said I could turn in the application that I printed from home all filled out.

Checklist: http://www.tularecounty.ca.gov/sheriff/index.cfm/resources/forms-documents/important-ccw-application-instructions/

Application in PDF: http://www.calgunsfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/California-DOJ-Standard-Carry-License-Application.pdf

You will also need 3 references (Name, Address, Phone Number). Known for over two years and not a relative.

You bring in your app with I.D. and proof of residency along with $112 and you will get Live Scanned on the spot.

Then you wait for them to contact our references and run your background check.
Did you get a CCW from Tulare SO? If so, do they require more than "self-defense" as a Good Cause statement?

v.kevin
02-08-2015, 1:29 PM
Did you get a CCW from Tulare SO? If so, do they require more than "self-defense" as a Good Cause statement?

I turned in my application with references and proof of I.D. etc 5 days ago but haven't heard back yet. I did apply through Tulare Co. SO and they looked it over. I wrote "Primarily for protection of myself and family" and I noted that I often carry lots of expensive technology and I had my truck broken into a few years ago.

I didn't get any responses to my original question of GC so I just went with that. I will definitely update this thread when I go back to (hopefully) pick up my license.

DRoberts12345
02-08-2015, 9:26 PM
The process is pretty easy in Tulare Co. they are giving CCW's to pretty much anyone that has a clean record. When you fill out the 13 page app it will ask your cause or reason. Just say for protection of myself and others. I understand if you say I was attacked or something like that it will slow the process and they will investigate.
This is what I wrote in another thread.
"My son and several of our friends have gotten CCWs lately it Tulare. It's an easy process now. I got mine 20+ years ago when you needed a good reason."

Hope this helps

DRoberts12345
02-08-2015, 9:32 PM
A group of people got theirs in a few weeks and others got them a few weeks later all at the same time. The way we looked at it was a pile of apps sat on someones desk until they got around to processing .

Paladin
02-09-2015, 5:47 PM
I didn't get any responses to my original question of GC so I just went with that. I will definitely update this thread when I go back to (hopefully) pick up my license.
Wish you the best!

The process is pretty easy in Tulare Co. they are giving CCW's to pretty much anyone that has a clean record. When you fill out the 13 page app it will ask your cause or reason. Just say for protection of myself and others. I understand if you say I was attacked or something like that it will slow the process and they will investigate.
This is what I wrote in another thread.
"My son and several of our friends have gotten CCWs lately it Tulare. It's an easy process now. I got mine 20+ years ago when you needed a good reason."

Hope this helpsIt does. Thx!

v.kevin
03-15-2015, 12:57 PM
It's been about 6 weeks since I submitted my app and did my Livescan. Should I call on Monday to check on the status? Too early to be concerned?

bemani4u
03-23-2015, 9:32 PM
v.Kevin, have you heard anything yet? It's been about 6 weeks for me as well, and I've yet to hear anything either. What's interesting is that a friend of mine told me his application process took about 5 weeks, but he did his several months ago.

Daytona Coupe
03-31-2015, 9:26 PM
FWIW: I applied in mid Dec. and got the call to come pick it up on Mar 2nd. So I guess that's about 10 weeks for a recent example.

bemani4u
04-01-2015, 11:18 AM
Thanks for that info! Looks like I just need to be patient and wait a few more weeks.

v.kevin
04-05-2015, 5:05 PM
Yes, thanks for the input.

I was speaking to a gentleman at the range who works for the county and knows the folks down at the sheriff's office very well. He said they had 7 or 8 thousand applications to go through. :eek:

Paladin
04-07-2015, 4:42 PM
The process is pretty easy in Tulare Co. they are giving CCW's to pretty much anyone that has a clean record. When you fill out the 13 page app it will ask your cause or reason. Just say for protection of myself and others. I understand if you say I was attacked or something like that it will slow the process and they will investigate.
Something does not make sense....

On their CCW Info webpage (http://www.tularecounty.ca.gov/sheriff/index.cfm/resources/forms-documents/), their linked IMPORTANT CCW APPLICATION INFORMATION .pdf says,

Good Cause Statements

California Penal code section 12050 states in part that the CCW applicant must provide good cause which is defined as a Convincing evidence of a clear and present danger to life, or of great bodily harm to the applicant, his/her spouse, or dependent child, which cannot be adequately dealt with by existing law enforcement resources, and which danger cannot be reasonably avoided by alternative measures, and which danger would be significantly mitigated by the applicant's carrying of a concealed firearm.

That sure sounds restrictive issuance to me. (I'm adding that quote & link to this thread's OP since it's their official position.)

I was speaking to a gentleman at the range who works for the county and knows the folks down at the sheriff's office very well. He said they had 7 or 8 thousand applications to go through. :eek:

If their GC requirement is still as stated on their website, that's one heck of a lot of applications that will be denied....

If they've loosened their GC requirement, Tulare SO is on its way to becoming one of the leading issuers of CCWs in the state! :party:

bemani4u
04-07-2015, 5:11 PM
To the best of my knowledge, that message has always been on their site, but our current Sheriff was already on board with the Peruta ruling (prior to the recent development). I've heard the same thing from several applicants that got approved and even from my CCW instructor.

I'm honestly kind of curious though with Peruta being reheard and all if he's still going to issue as much as before.

v.kevin
04-15-2015, 7:04 AM
I wish I knew about the Good Cause. I kinda heard about "Self Protection" but couldn't confirm it would fly. I got my info from the Sheriff's website and saw that statement ^^^.

Hopefully I didn't make things difficult by following instructions. lol

v.kevin
04-17-2015, 8:14 AM
Wooohooo! Just got the call from Liz at the sheriff's office. My permit is approved and ready to be picked up.

I turned in my application, CCW class cert. of completion and everything on Feb 3rd. So 10 weeks, 3 days for the entire process.

Thanks, Obama!!!

comifornia:(
04-18-2015, 7:44 AM
The process is pretty easy in Tulare Co. they are giving CCW's to pretty much anyone that has a clean record. When you fill out the 13 page app it will ask your cause or reason. Just say for protection of myself and others. I understand if you say I was attacked or something like that it will slow the process and they will investigate.
This is what I wrote in another thread.
"My son and several of our friends have gotten CCWs lately it Tulare. It's an easy process now. I got mine 20+ years ago when you needed a good reason."

Hope this helps

Can I apply for a CCW in Tulare Co. if I live in santa clara Co.???

teg33
04-18-2015, 9:00 AM
Can I apply for a CCW in Tulare Co. if I live in santa clara Co.???

No you can't. You must apply to your county Sheriff or local PD

comifornia:(
04-18-2015, 4:46 PM
No you can't. You must apply to your county Sheriff or local PD

If you have a CCW can it be used in all of California? Or just the county you got it from?

v.kevin
04-18-2015, 9:19 PM
If you have a CCW can it be used in all of California? Or just the county you got it from?

All of California.

teg33
04-18-2015, 11:25 PM
If you have a CCW can it be used in all of California? Or just the county you got it from?

Its valid throughout the state

v.kevin
04-27-2015, 9:02 AM
I was at a rib cook-off in Exeter this weekend and a guy at the Sportsmen's Club said that Tulare Co. just did away with the school restriction. He said that his buddy went to pick up his renewal and was informed of the change in policy.
Anyone else heard about this?

I checked the Sheriff's website and didn't see anything.

bemani4u
04-27-2015, 11:24 AM
I haven't heard anything, but I'm still waiting for my call. When I get called in (hopefully soon) I'm going to definitely ask about that.

v.kevin
04-27-2015, 11:32 AM
I haven't heard anything, but I'm still waiting for my call. When I get called in (hopefully soon) I'm going to definitely ask about that.

You may not even have to ask. On the bottom of the permit, it will either be listed or it will be blank. If it's blank, it's no longer a policy.
I was going to call but I know they are super busy trying to process all the apps.

bemani4u
04-27-2015, 1:51 PM
Good to know, thanks for that info! I'll definitely keep you posted when I pick up my permit!

v.kevin
04-28-2015, 4:01 PM
Hurry up, Bemani4u. I need answers. :)

bemani4u
04-28-2015, 11:12 PM
I know, right? Believe me when I say that I've had my phone glued to my pocket and been anxiously waiting for that phone call, lol!

v.kevin
05-04-2015, 1:33 PM
Any day now, bemani.

bemani4u
05-04-2015, 4:28 PM
Hopefully soon. I'm kind of surprised I haven't heard anything yet. Though a buddy of mine turned in all his paperwork the exact same day (within the hour actually) I turned in mine and hasn't heard anything yet either. So I'm guessing they're just REALLY back logged on applications.

Barnstormer
05-05-2015, 5:09 PM
I'm inquiring for a friend from Tulare County who is showing some interest in obtaining her CCW. For those individuals applying and receiving approval recently, would you consider Sheriff Boudreauxa to be a "shall-issue" or a "may-issue" sheriff?

v.kevin
05-06-2015, 10:41 AM
He's very CCW-friendly. Shall-issue.

He spoke at a meeting of the Sportsmen's Association and said that if you have a clean record and aren't on drugs (illegal or anti-depressants) he would prefer you carried. I got my LTC in 10 weeks and that is only because they are processing so many apps now. Would have been closer to 6 weeks if it were 6 months ago.

bemani4u
05-06-2015, 10:55 AM
I just got approved! I received the phone call a few minutes ago! I'm going to go pick it up in a bit!!!

v.kevin
05-06-2015, 11:01 AM
Hip Hip!

HOORAY!!!!

So it is now taking about 11 weeks in Tulare County.

bemani4u
05-06-2015, 11:19 AM
Haha yeah. 11 weeks and 5 days for me. I'm headed over there right now to pick up so I'll definitely let you know about the campus restriction.

bemani4u
05-06-2015, 12:28 PM
I just picked it up a short while ago and I can personally confirm that there are no longer any school restrictions on the permit. The section with restrictions was blanked out with white out and the lady told me that it's because it's up to the schools to decide now.

v.kevin
05-06-2015, 3:22 PM
So if you don't see a sign, you're gtg.

Paladin
05-10-2015, 8:29 AM
I just got approved! I received the phone call a few minutes ago! I'm going to go pick it up in a bit!!!
Congrats!

:party:

Be sure to encourage friends, family, shooting buddies, and coworkers who live in Tulare or other issuing counties to apply.

Also be sure to CCW whenever you visit the Bay Area. :43:

BenW
06-04-2015, 4:09 PM
I've recently moved to Tulare County from Santa Barbara County (good luck getting an LTC there!) and plan on applying post haste.

Quick question though: Is there a minimum residency time before applying? I've actually had rental property here for 30 years, but just changed my residence address a couple of weeks ago.

Edit: Tangent question: Sounds like Visalia Sportsmans Association is the best place to take the class? Are they the best shooting range in the Visalia area as well? I shoot mostly pistol, but break out the rifles once in a while as well. I prefer a place where I can move and shoot.

oger214
06-19-2015, 4:52 PM
Rankin field in Tulare has a second pistol range that they allow holster drawing and moving while shooting if you have done your ccw class there. Im sure if you talk with them and explain that your a ccw holder they would let your practice on that range.

A friend of mine moved from San Diego to the area and the sheriffs office told him there was no waiting time to applied as long as he has a valid prof of residency.

rankinfield.org is the ranges web address

v.kevin
06-25-2015, 11:34 AM
I've recently moved to Tulare County from Santa Barbara County (good luck getting an LTC there!) and plan on applying post haste.

Quick question though: Is there a minimum residency time before applying? I've actually had rental property here for 30 years, but just changed my residence address a couple of weeks ago.

Edit: Tangent question: Sounds like Visalia Sportsmans Association is the best place to take the class? Are they the best shooting range in the Visalia area as well? I shoot mostly pistol, but break out the rifles once in a while as well. I prefer a place where I can move and shoot.

Visalia Sportsmen's Association is defo the best for taking the class. $60 annual membership and the class is included along with range access and other bennies like use of the clubhouse. The pistol range is pretty sparse though. Only two lanes and no rapid fire, drawing from holster or moving and shooting. We are going to break ground on expanding the pistol range to about 8 lanes but I don't think the rapid-fire, moving, drawing rules will change.

You can become an RSO and get a key for off days. Then you can pretty much whatever you want.

BenW
07-09-2015, 1:41 PM
Thanks guys! I'll look at paying a visit to both ranges to check them out.

v.kevin
08-06-2015, 9:08 AM
Just a heads-up to those of you who have a CCW in Tulare Co. already...

The School Campus restriction was lifted back in May I think. You can go to the office and get a new permit without the restriction printed on it. I did it yesterday and there was no charge. Their laminator was not working.

ltranger
10-20-2015, 5:27 PM
Is it still lifted after our lovely Mr. Brown just signed that new bill

Paladin
10-20-2015, 6:07 PM
He's very CCW-friendly. Shall-issue.

He spoke at a meeting of the Sportsmen's Association and said that if you have a clean record and aren't on drugs (illegal or anti-depressants) he would prefer you carried.

While that sounds good, I just went to their website and this is still their IMPORTANT CCW APPLICATION INSTRUCTIONS....

UPDATE (2015 April 07): From IMPORTANT CCW APPLICATION INSTRUCTIONS .pdf linked at: http://www.tularecounty.ca.gov/sheriff/index.cfm/resources/forms-documents/

Good Cause Statements

California Penal code section 12050 states in part that the CCW applicant must provide good cause which is defined as a Convincing evidence of a clear and present danger to life, or of great bodily harm to the applicant, his/her spouse, or dependent child, which cannot be adequately dealt with by existing law enforcement resources, and which danger cannot be reasonably avoided by alternative measures, and which danger would be significantly mitigated by the applicant's carrying of a concealed firearm.

It would be great if one or more of you who live in Tulare got in touch w/the SO (or your point of contact during your CCW app process), and mention to them if they really want Good Guys to get CCWs, they should remove that old GC standard document and put something up saying that "'self-defense' is sufficient Good Cause for applying for a CCW" or similar. (IIRC, Sacto, Monterey, San Joaquin, Merced, and a few others have SD = GC statements posted on their websites.) Otherwise, law-abiding folks who go to their website, but not to CGN, will be dissuaded from even applying.

I won't even add a "thumbs-up" symbol to this thread since their website still states they have a highly restrictive interpretation of GC.

Paladin
10-20-2015, 6:14 PM
I just got approved! I received the phone call a few minutes ago! I'm going to go pick it up in a bit!!!
Seems like I forgot to ask: without giving so much detail so as to ID you, can you tell us what your GC statement was like? Did you use mere "self-defense"/"personal protection" or something more? If more, what was that like?

ltranger
10-20-2015, 6:39 PM
I have talked to the sherrif (at a NRA dinner) he told me and my wife (under age at the time) to go apply no cause needed. I applied 3 months before my 21st and go approved and my license a month before my 21st. I am a service tech and part owner of my family's business so my good cause was a little more in depth than (self defense)

bemani4u
10-21-2015, 9:49 PM
Seems like I forgot to ask: without giving so much detail so as to ID you, can you tell us what your GC statement was like? Did you use mere "self-defense"/"personal protection" or something more? If more, what was that like?


Verbatim, all I wrote was "Personal protection for myself and my family." That's more or less what my CCW instructor told us to put down on our applications.


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stewie84
12-07-2015, 3:37 PM
Seems like I forgot to ask: without giving so much detail so as to ID you, can you tell us what your GC statement was like? Did you use mere "self-defense"/"personal protection" or something more? If more, what was that like?

Sorry to revive an older thread. I simply put "self-defense" for my GC statement and this was early 2014 time frame. Wait time from submission to actually picking up my permit was roughly 3 weeks.