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View Full Version : How I got my Colt Combat Commander in 9mm, and how you too can obtain unobtanium


Cyc Wid It
10-12-2010, 10:21 PM
Warning: A bit of a long read, but it goes over everything from start to finish

I had to have one. So I checked the Marketplace and waited... and waited. Finally, I gave up actively looking and put it on the back burner. Then, I saw the thread on Valkyrie Arms (07 FFL in Milpitas) and their willingness to do single shot exemptions for off-roster pistols. The gears started turning, and I started looking again, expanding my search to Gunbroker and other gun forums.

Finally I found one on Gunbroker that was going for less than $1200. I contacted the seller, hoping that he would be willing to ship to CA. He was, although he was unsure about the single shot exemption to the roster. I was able to put him in touch directly with Tim @ Valkyrie Arms who talked to the seller over the phone explaining the legalities of the process and reassuring the seller. He was able to ship the gun in standard configuration since Valkyrie Arms is an 07 FFL (they can modify after, so the gun did not have to be converted prior).

I bought the gun, and it was shipped to Valkyrie Arms for the transfer. They made a substitute barrel of the required length and mag lock for single shot status. With this in place, I did the usual paperwork and my 10 days began.

Fast forward 10 days and I went to complete my pickup. After taking possession of the gun, I proceeded to return the gun to its original status. Look! It's really true:

http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz269/cycwidit/Colt9mmSlide.jpg

I can't wait to get some good range time in with this gun, and hopefully customize it tastefully somewhere down the line. They're done with the parts for the HK45 and I've seen them in person (I believe there's at least 1 already in 10 day jail). He's getting close on Gen 4 Glocks and should have other models soon too.

You can get pretty much any modern pistol converted in this manner (if it's going to be a time consuming 1 off be prepared to take on some additional cost) for a nominal fee. Seen those marketplace ads for used HK45's going for $1500+? How would you like a new one for over $300 less than that?

Big thanks to Tim for the prompt communication the whole way, and his willingness to work with my Gunbroker seller. You really owe it to yourself to stop by the shop if you're in the bay area. Even though they're still getting items in, they already have all sorts of things you won't see in many other established shops. Besides the off-list handguns (which you can actually buy), there's a Scar 17, enhanced ACR, Sig 516, FN A3G, various AK's, etc. If you're interested in having a custom AK or AR rifle/pistol built, they can make that happen for you too. You can stop by after work AND on Sundays.

Sam
10-13-2010, 12:01 AM
That's awesome! I lust after a Wilson Combat LW Compact and this has got me thinking again. Good for you that found a willing seller. My two main Wilson guys refused to ship anything not on the roster. I guess I can bypass them altogether.

STAGE 2
10-13-2010, 1:06 AM
So how does this work for people who cant do a transfer in norcal?

Cyc Wid It
10-13-2010, 6:48 AM
I would imagine that you could pay a deposit to have it shipped to your local FFL. After you return the conversion parts the deposit would be refunded. You'd just have to find a local FFL who was willing to transfer it.

Greg-Dawg
10-13-2010, 7:38 AM
So...VA can get any non-roster guns?

smle-man
10-13-2010, 7:57 AM
Once it is converted to a repeater haven't you broken the law and made the FFL an accessory to circumventing the law? Not an attorney, just a confused shooter.

Mute
10-13-2010, 8:02 AM
Once it is converted to a repeater haven't you broken the law and made the FFL an accessory to circumventing the law? Not an attorney, just a confused shooter.

No. Once you've taken possession (legally), the law does not prevent you from returning the gun to it's original configuration.

Colt-45
10-13-2010, 8:29 AM
So how does this work for people who cant do a transfer in norcal?

Contact them, they can ship to an fll near you. I've heard them talking about this before. They know more about this they I do.

Currently in the process of acquiring an off-roster Glock from them:D


They're done with the parts for the HK45 and I've seen them in person (I believe there's at least 1 already in 10 day jail). He's getting close on Gen 4 Glocks and should have other models soon too.

You can get pretty much any modern pistol converted in this manner (if it's going to be a time consuming 1 off be prepared to take on some additional cost) for a nominal fee. Seen those marketplace ads for used HK45's going for $1500+? How would you like a new one for over $300 less than that?

Big thanks to Tim for the prompt communication the whole way, and his willingness to work with my Gunbroker seller. You really owe it to yourself to stop by the shop if you're in the bay area. You can stop by after work AND on Sundays.

On top of all the off-rosterness, these guys have the best hours. Finally a shop that realizes most people have jobs. More people have the time to stop by after work or on the weekend rather than 10am on a weekday. If you pay attention to other shops hours these guys basically are barely opening when everyone else is closing which is a good thing.

I live all the way in Fresno and even then I'm planning on taking all my business to Valkyrie. All my *new* gun purchases will be coming from them. It's worth it. I finally found a shop that got it right. The 3 hour trip is worth it to me.

Other shops make faces when you walk in for a PPT. To my amazement these guys BUBBLE wrapped my PPTd rifle! :eek:.
A shop like this "my friends" deserves my patronage.

And no I'm not kissing ***.

Californio
10-13-2010, 8:52 AM
No California Law that prevents a pistol from being legally modified by the owner.

I can convert a S&W Model 28 6" to any legal barrel length or have it converted from .357 magnum to .44 special. I can do the work myself or send it in or out of State to have it done.

As long as the CA FFL receives it in a legal configuration, the buyer has no restrictions on what he can do, within the law, after he takes possession.

The biggest problem is getting the out of State seller to convert it to a legal configuration for import.

California Guns Laws are just insane and written by fools.

To the OP, congratulations, nice piece of history.

Cyc Wid It
10-13-2010, 9:17 AM
No California Law that prevents a pistol from being legally modified by the owner.

I can convert a S&W Model 28 6" to any legal barrel length or have it converted from .357 magnum to .44 special. I can do the work myself or send it in or out of State to have it done.

As long as the CA FFL receives it in a legal configuration, the buyer has no restrictions on what he can do, within the law, after he takes possession.

The biggest problem is getting the out of State seller to convert it to a legal configuration for import.

California Guns Laws are just insane and written by fools.

To the OP, congratulations, nice piece of history.

Actully, Valkyrie Arms can receive guns in normal form and modify them after as they are an 07 FFL. Thanks for the compliment regarding the Colt, it appears to be completely original and non-bubba'ed.

fennecfrank
10-13-2010, 10:17 AM
Thanks, OP! This thread gives me hope for an HK MK23

doc540
10-13-2010, 11:20 AM
This just warms a Texan's heart.

Gryff
10-13-2010, 11:33 AM
Or just have a Dad who lives in a Free State and can ship your FFL all the off-list guns you want.

theneko
10-13-2010, 11:35 AM
fennecfrank- you probably know this but I beliueve that "returning the pistol to its original configuration" was only pertaining to making it a single shot. As the Mk23 still has a threaded barrell *I think* you need to deal with that too. I "neutered" my Mik23 to be CA legal so if you need any info on that just PM me. Cheers!

fennecfrank
10-13-2010, 11:55 AM
theneko: yeah, I'm aware of that. Thank you! I'll probably get a brand new barrel and cut off the threaded part out and put it on the gun.

The hardest parts for this, are 1. driving 6 hours to VA one way and 2. finding an out-of-state FFL who's willing to ship an off-list gun to CA.

Ultimate
10-13-2010, 11:56 AM
how much of a premium was added to the purchase of your firearm for the service?

I am also lusting after a commander sized 9mm but with an aluminum frame like a Dan Wesson Guardian or Kimber Pro Carry II.

Cyc Wid It
10-13-2010, 12:24 PM
Should be $50 for all non 1 off types.

nn3453
10-13-2010, 12:36 PM
Or just have a Dad who lives in a Free State and can ship your FFL all the off-list guns you want.

I know how I could father children in other states. Not sure how to make Dads appear :)

Cyc Wid It
10-13-2010, 12:49 PM
theneko: yeah, I'm aware of that. Thank you! I'll probably get a brand new barrel and cut off the threaded part out and put it on the gun.

The hardest parts for this, are 1. driving 6 hours to VA one way and 2. finding an out-of-state FFL who's willing to ship an off-list gun to CA.

You could probably get it shipped to a FFL in SoCal with a refundable deposit for the parts. While this does add a bit to the overall cost, it's probably more cost and time effective than driving or flying twice.

Colt
10-13-2010, 1:41 PM
Congrats. I love the Combat Commander in 9mm. I hope you enjoy it a lot. Also - way to go on learning how to deal with the system. I was fortunate, in that I found mine relatively local and was able to do FTF PPT - but it took over two years to find one.

Mute
10-13-2010, 1:47 PM
BTW, what method did Valkyrie use to block off the magwell?

Cyc Wid It
10-13-2010, 2:32 PM
BTW, what method did Valkyrie use to block off the magwell?

My Colt was mag-locked.

rorschach
10-13-2010, 6:03 PM
Awesome. Now I gotta find an out of state seller willing to send a Colt Rail Gun here.

Cyc Wid It
10-13-2010, 6:12 PM
Awesome. Now I gotta find an out of state seller willing to send a Colt Rail Gun here.

Valkyrie Arms can probably order that for you (not sure if there's a wait time on these) if you want a new one.

Colt-45
10-13-2010, 6:18 PM
BTW, what method did Valkyrie use to block off the magwell?

I believe on some the feedramp is extended so it blocks the magazine and you cannot chamber a round.

ColdDeadHands1
10-13-2010, 6:32 PM
DO NOT shoot that gun! For the love of God, it's not SAFE!




At least that's what the highly trained and superior minds in the legislature and DOJ say. :43:

Bill Steele
10-13-2010, 6:50 PM
Great gun, great stuff.

Good for you!

sirgiles
10-13-2010, 7:28 PM
its good to know that the substitute barrel for the hk45 is done. finally, the price of these pistol will be more realistic (at least in norcal :)).

erikdjs
10-13-2010, 7:45 PM
oO I want a Dan Wesson Guardian........ or a RIA 9mm:O

trashman
10-13-2010, 8:13 PM
This thread makes me happy :). --neill

BANG BANG
10-13-2010, 9:20 PM
I've been there and got a lower from them. They are nothing short of AWESOME
All my future purchases are going to be with them !!!

teIam
10-27-2010, 11:17 AM
So, out of curiosity, how do you perform the safe handling demonstration on a single shot firearm?

I may or may not have purchased a DW Heritage, and it may or may not be shipping out tonight/tomorrow, so I may or may not need to figure this out with a quickness.

Valkyriearms
10-27-2010, 12:05 PM
Rack the slide, drop in a dummy round. Close slide, show there's a dummy roun loaded. Remove dummy round, close slide and safe gun. Do not remove the magazine at any time before you legally take possession or it will not be single shot anymore.

Thanks
Tim

Cyc Wid It
10-27-2010, 12:13 PM
Rack the slide, drop in a dummy round. Close slide, show there's a dummy roun loaded. Remove dummy round, close slide and safe gun. Do not remove the magazine at any time before you legally take possession or it will not be single shot anymore.

Thanks
Tim

Yeap. Nothing you shouldn't be able to do already. Thanks again to Tim @ Valkyrie Arms for letting me be the first!

MoeSizslak
10-27-2010, 12:20 PM
Nice! Thanks for sharing that. It's awesome to see solutions to the problems of living in the PRK.

The Original Godfather
10-27-2010, 2:20 PM
Cool! VA is near by. I will be buying from them or using them for an FFL/PPT for my next purchase :)

teIam
10-27-2010, 3:00 PM
Rack the slide, drop in a dummy round. Close slide, show there's a dummy roun loaded. Remove dummy round, close slide and safe gun. Do not remove the magazine at any time before you legally take possession or it will not be single shot anymore.

Thanks
Tim

Thanks Tim, saved me a phone call.

erikdjs
10-27-2010, 3:24 PM
I don't want to start a flame war - and there are definitely a bunch of off-roster guns that I'd love to get my hands on.

But do you guys think this violates the spirit of the law? Or is there precedence of using this exemption in court and winning?

Tank 57
10-27-2010, 3:38 PM
This thread is awesome.Milpitas is a short ride.Just added visiting Valkyrie Arms to my Saturday list of things to do.Several things I am interested in.

Valkyriearms
10-27-2010, 3:48 PM
I don't want to start a flame war - and there are definitely a bunch of off-roster guns that I'd love to get my hands on.

But do you guys think this violates the spirit of the law? Or is there precedence of using this exemption in court and winning?

Is there any law that says this is illegal?

How do you acquire AR and AK pistols?

erikdjs
10-27-2010, 3:53 PM
Is there any law that says this is illegal?

How do you acquire AR and AK pistols?

No idea - I'm not saying it's illegal. I'd hope that you would know if there was a law saying it is illegal considering you're the manufacturing FFL.

I'm not making accusations, just concerned. I do appreciate what you guys are doing though to help Californians.

trashman
10-27-2010, 5:24 PM
But do you guys think this violates the spirit of the law?

Given that the 'spirit' of the law is to limit the number and kinds of guns you as a civilian can own, I'd have to say "yes" this violates* the spirit of the law.

--Neill

*gives a big fat middle finger to...

precisionshooter308
10-28-2010, 12:43 PM
I love my 60's vintage LWC 9mm. I got it about 3.5 years ago for $400 PTP from a guy at the Firing Line. I got 3 factory mags and some aftermarket grips in the buy. I bought 3 Wilson Mags , put on some nice grips and put in a beaver tail grip safety( don't like the original one, but kept the original just in case). Shoots like a champ and lite to carry.