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ocspeedracer
09-27-2010, 9:22 AM
The title says it all, up-sides, down-sides?

DirtRacer151
09-27-2010, 9:25 AM
There's a ton of guys here that hate them. I have not ever really heard why though. Seem pretty standard no frills to me.

Spanky8601
09-27-2010, 9:29 AM
The 2H set up I have has worked great. I would buy another Stag in the future

johnrunner89
09-27-2010, 9:32 AM
This is has been discussed countless times. A quick use of the search tool will show you tons of reviews and also tons of people's not so good opinions. This is a link to a similiar thread from just a few days ago.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=341623

gun toting monkeyboy
09-27-2010, 9:35 AM
They are just fine. Mid-tier manufacturer with a decent reputation. I have been going with BCM lately, as they offer a higher quality product for a comparable price. But I would be just fine with a Stag, if the price was right. And the upper had the features I was looking for. All of the Stags I has shot handled like any other decent upper.

-Mb

Lead-Thrower
09-27-2010, 9:35 AM
I have a Stag 6H complete upper and I love it. Not only have I not had any reliability issues with it, but it is also a tack-driver! Figured I'd get one positive review in here before all the nay-sayers arrive...

ocspeedracer
09-27-2010, 9:39 AM
This is has been discussed countless times. A quick use of the search tool will show you tons of reviews and also tons of people's not so good opinions. This is a link to a similiar thread from just a few days ago.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=341623

I actually did read this thread... a few days ago... and still felt the need to post this. I don't care about BCM, as I'm asking about Stag, I don't care about competitors, as I asked about Stag(unless making a specific comparison, for example Mim parts vs ETC), I didn't use the search button because I asked just about Stag, so if you post a link to a thread just about Stag that would be appreciated.
Your post about Stag and BCM...not so much.

SexualChocolate
09-27-2010, 9:56 AM
I love my 2H. Properly staked BCG, no problems to report, fit and finish are good as well.

Not sure why there is so much hate, reminds me of the anti-Xbox 360 people.

Dump1567
09-27-2010, 10:04 AM
Owned a few. Never any problems. Stag should take care of you if you do have any.

fullspeed1
09-27-2010, 10:23 AM
My stag has been great. Stag arms fully re manufactured a new lower for me after I broke off one side of my trigger guard forging switching from a winter trigger guard to a standard guard, No questions asked. I have put several thousand rounds through my 2h upper of both factory and handloaded ammo without a single ftf or fte. My AR will never be thrown in the mud or ever see a sand box, Living in the coastal mountain/city region it serves it purpose just fine. In all reality I will probably never put more than 400rds through it in a session.

dieselpower
09-27-2010, 10:31 AM
I build on Stag. There are no issues you need to be aware of if thats what you are asking. Stag are standard Mil-spec parts made by CMT. The same as nearly all Mil-spec manufacturers who get their parts from CMT. Its all about in & end process inspections.

Mil-spec is Mil-spec. Many people think that means it's one way or the highway..its not. Small arms Mil-specs are looping spiderweb of backwards sidetalking BS. Once you hit the standard..its all good after that.

Colts TDP is another story. Colt and FN are the only manufacturers who manufacture AR15s as per Colt TDP...period...end of story...there is no valid argument against this at all. They then deliver these AR15s to the Military and are then designated small arms. M16, M4, SPR, XM...blah blah blah.

That being said, a $7500 Magpul China Doll is NOT Mil-spec...not even close. Its not even close to TDP...but its a fine AR15. Same goes for a $5000 LaRue Stealth.

Any differences between BCM, Stag, Spikes, Bushmaster, blah blah blah is minor at best.

Everyone has a "list". I place Stag upper mid on the list and is my manufacturer of choice. When I win the powerball, LaRue is my choice and all you are just peons who can't afford top tier gear...lol

To the OP Stag is good gear. No worries.

slowjonn
09-27-2010, 10:44 AM
I have a Stag 4H upper. Fit and finsh is great. Operations have yielded no issues. It feeds everything, goes bang and extracts like it should. Accuracy is better than I am.

In short, I like Stag and would not hesitate to buy another..

ren
09-27-2010, 10:44 AM
I have a stag 2h and can't complain. I needed replacement lower parts because of my error and they sent them free. I would buy another stag.

Spaceghost
09-27-2010, 10:53 AM
I have a Stag upper and I am on the fence about the purchase. It will not run steel case ammo with out A LOT of CLP. I did a class with LMS defense and was running wolf ammo because I had it on hand and it was a short range class. The upper required so much CLP just to reliably cycle that I was eating vapor clouds of CLP on more than one occasion.

The upper has no problems with brass cased ammo and just a little CLP does the trick. The accuracy seems right where I would expect it to be.

ocspeedracer
09-27-2010, 10:59 AM
Right on, thanks for the input. I'm thinking of getting the 3h upper, a red dot site and most likely just pistol grip, bb, and a collapsoble stock. I figure it'll be my first AR so i don't need anything too fancy and see how much I actually get to shoot it.

dieselpower
09-27-2010, 11:07 AM
I have a Stag upper and I am on the fence about the purchase. It will not run steel case ammo with out A LOT of CLP. I did a class with LMS defense and was running wolf ammo because I had it on hand and it was a short range class. The upper required so much CLP just to reliably cycle that I was eating vapor clouds of CLP on more than one occasion.

The upper has no problems with brass cased ammo and just a little CLP does the trick. The accuracy seems right where I would expect it to be.

:threadjacked:
What about Stag is the reason for this in your mind?

Spaceghost
09-27-2010, 11:50 AM
I am not too sure. I purchased the upper from a great vendor here, maybe in 2007, and just after I made my purchase there was a bunch of hoopla on the internet about how stag uppers won't run wolf at all. There was a thread about it, but I couldn't find it.

I have heard a few different reason tossed around by members and shooters I know. Most suspect it has something to with the chrome lining and that I should take some steel wool to the chamber and smooth it down some.

I only shoot brass cased ammo and the only reason I had some wolf .223 was a friend asked me to order a case for him then never got back to me about paying for it. So I kept it as blasting ammo, which has been blasted so I really don't care about crappy steel cased ammo in my Stag. I just wanted to give the OP heads up in case he cared.



:threadjacked:
What about Stag is the reason for this in your mind?

Extreme Z28
09-27-2010, 3:04 PM
Edit

tomd1584
09-27-2010, 3:05 PM
This comes up like 5x a week....try searching "STAG"...

Colt-45
09-27-2010, 3:28 PM
I don't care about BCM, as I'm asking about Stag, I don't care about competitors, as I asked about Stag(unless making a specific comparison, for example Mim parts vs ETC)
+1

I had a Stag. It was great. It chewed up steel case .223 ammo like nothing, both wolf and bear. I also shot a lot of 5.56x45 stuff. NO issues, not 1 jam.

Stag, best DI bang for your buck in my opinion.:D

Only sold my Stag rifle to buy an LWRC M6A3 piston rifle. Definitely miss how the Stag was much lighter.



There's a ton of guys here that hate them.

A LOT of guys hate them and never mention why. :rolleyes:

If you have a Stag upper, cheap *** lower parts kit, pro mag magazines and a bottom end lower you can't blame the failures on the Stag upper.

tomd1584
09-27-2010, 3:41 PM
its not that people 'hate' them, but rather that for a little more coin, you get a better product, which is much closer to the TDP.

STAG's are able to offer at a lower cost because they do batch testing instead of indivudual, use a slightly lower grade steel for their barrels, etc.

If the difference is +/- $50 between Stag and BCM/LMT/Daniel Defense, why not just spend the extra and rest assured you are getting top quality?

gmcal
09-27-2010, 3:54 PM
I have a Stag upper and I am on the fence about the purchase. It will not run steel case ammo with out A LOT of CLP. I did a class with LMS defense and was running wolf ammo because I had it on hand and it was a short range class. The upper required so much CLP just to reliably cycle that I was eating vapor clouds of CLP on more than one occasion.

The upper has no problems with brass cased ammo and just a little CLP does the trick. The accuracy seems right where I would expect it to be.

Maybe a batch of underpowered ammo. What kind of buffer were you running?sometimes a heavy (H) buffer will not run well with weaker ammo. Switching to a car buffer and spring will likely help.

JRent54
09-27-2010, 3:58 PM
Stag is great!

chesterthehero
09-27-2010, 4:06 PM
ive never had an issue with my stag complete upper.. its a nail driver and the finish is nice as well... ive fully striped a few times "just cuz".. its as solid today as it was the day i got it..
true ive never "beat the living hell out of it" or let it go for more than a thousand rounds without cleaning it (not by choice or need.. i simply cant afford to shoot thousands of rounds in a short amount of time.. i get the urge to shoot but cant afford it so i clean my guns even if i have not shot them)..

i got mine based on a thumbs up from a friend of mine who has been in the middle east for several years (private security).. he trusts his life to both stag and rockriver on daily basis.. this is all i needed to know and i have not been let down..

gmcal
09-27-2010, 4:10 PM
The title says it all, up-sides, down-sides?

The application which you'll use the rifle for should determine what you get. What do you want to do with it? If you want to shoot the match grade 75-77 gr ammo I'd recommend something with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist, which I don't think stag makes. If you just want to plink with the cheapest 55 gr ammo you can the 1:9 twist is good.

If you're serious about training to fight with and take carbine courses then read some aar's over on lightfighter. The stags have not done very well in those courses.

NorCalSJ
09-27-2010, 4:13 PM
JRent54 why is stag great--explain.

I agree with tomd1584 "If the difference is +/- $50 between Stag and BCM/LMT/Daniel Defense, why not just spend the extra and rest assured you are getting top quality?"

Spaceghost
09-27-2010, 4:15 PM
Carbine buffer and spring were used.

Maybe a batch of underpowered ammo. What kind of buffer were you running?sometimes a heavy (H) buffer will not run well with weaker ammo. Switching to a car buffer and spring will likely help.

U5512
09-27-2010, 4:32 PM
There's a ton of guys here that hate them. I have not ever really heard why though. Seem pretty standard no frills to me.

I love my 2H. Properly staked BCG, no problems to report, fit and finish are good as well.

Not sure why there is so much hate, reminds me of the anti-Xbox 360 people.

+1


Stag, best DI bang for your buck in my opinion.:D






A LOT of guys hate them and never mention why. :rolleyes:

If you have a Stag upper, cheap *** lower parts kit, pro mag magazines and a bottom end lower you can't blame the failures on the Stag upper.

Alright guys, show me the threats supporting your arguments that there are Stag haters here. Show them to me!!!:D: Now, there were threads/posts that the OPs were asking what to buy between a Stag and BCM uppers, that’s where people suggested for a little bit more money (<$100 bucks) get a BCM upper instead.:)

In this case, the OP doesn’t care about BCM uppers and he ONLY wanted to hear opinions about Stag uppers, and obviously he got plenty of good reviews about Stag. Since he wasn’t asking about what to buy (Stag or BCM), I DON’T SEE ANYONE RECOMMENDS HIM TO BUY A BCM UPPER IN THIS THREAD!!! DO YOU???

I hope you guys understand the difference between asking for a comparison (Stag or BCM) or purely opinions on one manufacturer!!! There’s NO HATE here….get it???

JRent54
09-27-2010, 4:42 PM
Its like anything else, most of us have rifles that we shoot every weekend(I do, about 300 rds a month), and my stag does just fine, I clean and lube it after every trip...no problems, so again it does fine, if you you are gonna be runnin and gunnin every weekend shooting 1,000rds a weekend,taking tactical carbine classes, maybe you should go on a more expensive route, speaking for myself, my stag does what I need, I do plan on buying a topshelf ar, because I want to take carbine classes...and all that cool stuff...but for now my stag is great,like I said.

ExtremeX
09-27-2010, 4:50 PM
I bought a Stag 2T complete rifle. I did spend some extra cash doing some upgrades but mostly to the lower, but overall, from the upper standpoint, they did a good job. Its accurate and its light, and that’s all I wanted in that setup.

I’m in the process of building my 2nd AR, but im going with a BMC middy upper in Stainless this time around. For the price, I dont think you can go wrong with Stag upper, since the BCM is going to cost more for sure.

Jarhead
09-27-2010, 4:51 PM
Stag A+

SPR18
09-27-2010, 4:59 PM
The application which you'll use the rifle for should determine what you get. What do you want to do with it? If you want to shoot the match grade 75-77 gr ammo I'd recommend something with a 1:8 or 1:7 twist, which I don't think stag makes. If you just want to plink with the cheapest 55 gr ammo you can the 1:9 twist is good.

If you're serious about training to fight with and take carbine courses then read some aar's over on lightfighter. The stags have not done very well in those courses.

they do make 1:7 barrel, m4 ramp....etc. they just started...:D but the price is close to lmt and bcm:)

StephenhDMRS
09-27-2010, 5:10 PM
Get a stag and never look back. I think even for running and gunning it would be a great choice. You don't want to spend a lot more on something that you are going to shoot the heck out of. I have the 2ht and shoot the cheapest stuff I can find(steel case) and not one fte or ftf. It's pretty accurate to. When it was reviewed by one magazine they got 1moa out of it. Plus if you get the 2ht you're getting a $250 rail. BCM doesn't come with that. There's nothing wrong with stag. See all these testimonials? I would trust my life on mine.

slowjonn
09-27-2010, 6:34 PM
This comes up like 5x a week....try searching "STAG"...

So what? Lots of things come up frequently on this forum. Sometimes it's easier to just ask the question again versus using the dubious search function.

Responses like yours come up just as often. Don't post if you have nothing to add.

Caiden07
09-27-2010, 6:52 PM
For my opinion Stag are good budget build.

tomd1584
09-27-2010, 7:00 PM
So what? Lots of things come up frequently on this forum. Sometimes it's easier to just ask the question again versus using the dubious search function.

Responses like yours come up just as often. Don't post if you have nothing to add.


Actually, I did add something. My response wouldnt come up if people tried searching...its really not that hard.:rolleyes:

The reason i like this site, and others like it (m4carbine.net) as opposed to TOS is because we try not to get the same repetitious questions over and over again. Over on M4carbine.net, these threads get locked by the Mods, and their response? "this has been hashed to death, use the search button".

Here it is incase you missed it, Post #21:

its not that people 'hate' them, but rather that for a little more coin, you get a better product, which is much closer to the TDP.

STAG's are able to offer at a lower cost because they do batch testing instead of indivudual, use a slightly lower grade steel for their barrels, etc.

If the difference is +/- $50 between Stag and BCM/LMT/Daniel Defense, why not just spend the extra and rest assured you are getting top quality?

gmcal
09-27-2010, 7:25 PM
they do make 1:7 barrel, m4 ramp....etc. they just started...:D but the price is close to lmt and bcm:)

True but only in 11.5" and 14.5" versions. Changing handguards/rails and muzzle devices would be more difficult with a pinned and welded flash hider.

Red Dog
09-27-2010, 7:32 PM
A++++++ on my Model 4H

sdearnest1981
09-28-2010, 7:13 PM
I bought a Model 3 and decked it out with Magpul and I love it.

IsaacGlass
09-28-2010, 9:37 PM
OP, be aware of the BCM preacher. They wont leave you alone until you convert and become a BCM follower :willy_nilly: :smilielol5:
I have a BCM middy upper, great for carbine class, but doesnt like Wolf and Bear ammo like my Stag 2T. Next on my list,
LaRue OBR.

ExtremeX
09-28-2010, 9:42 PM
Gotta catch em all

ArkinDomino
09-28-2010, 9:57 PM
Don't buy Stag.

Ron-Solo
09-28-2010, 11:16 PM
I have three Stag rifles in various configurations and my son has one. Thousands of rounds without any problems. I have several friends that have Stag with the same results. They make a good quality rifle at a reasonable price. One of my friends had another brand that cost him a lot more money. We had to pull parts out of one of my Stags to get his to cycle properly. He put too many 'Kool-Aid' parts on his and lost the reliability factor.

My rifles will cycle Wolf and Bear ammo with no hiccups.

The Stag rifles are built the way Saint Eugene of Stoner intended them to be.

When I start building rifles for my Grandkids, they will be Stags. One will be a lefty. :cool:

UserM4
09-28-2010, 11:39 PM
Stags are good to go. I've yet to see someone prove that Stags can't run with BCM/DD/LMT/etc.

Average Joe American
09-28-2010, 11:42 PM
I dont have just the upper but I do have a Stag Model 8 gas piston rifle. It runs flawless, cool and clean in the chamber which is all I really want it to do. I went with Stag because of their "lifetime warranty". I am not going to Iraq anytime soon as an operator who has to supply his own guns so individual HPT & MPI wasnt too much of an issue for me. I am realistic with my needs and I know I am not a hardcore shooter so I dont see my gun breaking anytime soon.

plankowner
09-29-2010, 7:08 AM
I have nothing nut good things to say about my stag after about 2000 rds not one ftf so far.

Spaceghost
09-29-2010, 10:47 AM
I tracked down the old thread on this, if anyone is interested. I did get my upper from tenpercent.

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=76365