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View Full Version : mid range upper build for my ar-15


dancinzen
09-05-2010, 12:46 PM
so i decided to build a mid range upper for a new ar lower that is sitting around in my safe. i am debating on two different options and would like to hear some input on this one.

i am debating between the

1. 20" government profile 1x7 chrome lined from BCM.

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-M16-Government-20-Upper-Receiver-Group-p/bcm-urg-gov-20.htm

2. 16" ss410 1x8 from bcm

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-SS410-16-Mid-Length-Upper-Receiver-Group-p/bcm-urg-mid16%20ss410.htm

my pros and cons for each...

20" government upper
pros:
longer barrel offers more velocity for longer shots (500 yds and further)
chrome lined offer longer barrel life
faster 1x7 twist will shoot heaver grained bullets better
twist rate matches my other uppers that are in 1x7 so i can match my ammo between guns more easily with better accuracy

cons:
longer barrel means more weight and way longer so it is more clunky
chrome lined is less accurate than stainless steel

16" ss410 upper
pros:
shorter barrel for less weight and better movement
stainless steel for better accuracy

cons:
ss barrels wear out faster than chrome lined barrels
less length for velocity and accuracy for long shots
wont shoot heavier grained ammo that are required to really reach out to 500 plus yds
different barrel twist so will need a new formula for bullets i make


these are just what is going through my head and i am not sure how to make this decision. i will be mounting a 4.5 by 14 nikon mildot scope that i already have on for optic. and i load my own ammo so i will be making all my own match ammo for this rifle for best accuracy.

please give me some thoughts on this.

Rogu3
09-05-2010, 12:49 PM
The MV variation seems to be minimal, only about 100 fps, so that's 1 less con for the 16"

dancinzen
09-05-2010, 2:21 PM
Does anyone have a 20" goverment profile upper? How accurate is it?

dancinzen
09-06-2010, 10:40 PM
i thought i would have gotten some more advise... did i post this in the wrong section?

Mrskylinetou
09-06-2010, 10:52 PM
If yr looking for a mid range upper, like 600 yards.... U should go 22 24 loath walther blank, more than a million companies use this blank. Acurrite I think is the name of the company that puts together an admazing upper for 800 ready to shoot. U can chamber it in what ever u want but if u wanna get 3/4 moa u need to hand load and use match bullets. I'll look up the company in a min. Black rain is a better reciever.

My opinion it's cheaper to built it to get the real accuracy but I know plunty of people that will buy a upper from a good company and get a half moa with a good hand load. Now hand loading is another beast keep in mind.

Rogu3
09-06-2010, 10:58 PM
Drunk post, my friend? http://www.rationalskepticism.org/images/smilies/icon_drunk.gif

freonr22
09-06-2010, 11:01 PM
,aybe phone post. my letter v doesnt work right now on my phone, and sometime its a differeny letter thats disfunctional

Rogu3
09-06-2010, 11:02 PM
Very strange....The lothars are polygon rifled yes?

Mrskylinetou
09-06-2010, 11:06 PM
http://www.accuracysystemsinc.com/ar15_conversion.php

I would get the asi match 3 upper. Over a grand. 204 ruger is the most accurate round but one should stick to what they know and is that's 556 stick with it. I'm going 6.5 grendal actly improv or 30 wenchester actly. That's off the shelf in yr gun 1/2 moa done deal. I would never get a muzzel break on a 24 inch barrel, no need for it in my opinion. The parts kit is spot in, I don't like the side lock feature but it works. Fluted heavy, I go heaviest. 1-7.5 or 7 so u can shoot 80 or better grain bullet.

There are other companies that I can recamend, just gotta do some looking. I know for a fact that I found a half moa upper with a loath barrel for a g just forgot who made it. If this is what yr looking for let me and I share what I found. If u wanna send 5, 6 or 700 u can easly get a 3/4 moa with hand loads.

If that's too much what u really need is a barrel and upper receaver to get that mid to long accuracy. A good dpms bolt help but sometimes that's not a big deal. It's just picking what's gonna match and function properly...

Hope that helps u more

freonr22
09-06-2010, 11:09 PM
Drunk post, my friend? http://www.rationalskepticism.org/images/smilies/icon_drunk.gif


prior post retracted

Mrskylinetou
09-06-2010, 11:10 PM
No idea on the barrel. I just know their blanks are the best but they will sell their blanks to anyone and then they'll put their names on that blank. That link used loath barrels and gives u a great deal. The break they put on them sucks though. I hate 360 breaks, they kick up dirt and my range cards and in 556 a breat with that heavy of a gun is kinda pointless.

Scratch705
09-06-2010, 11:11 PM
i thought i would have gotten some more advise... did i post this in the wrong section?

no you just posted during a holiday weekend when most are actually outside with family/friends.

gmcal
09-07-2010, 5:21 AM
Are other brands an option? Budget?

You could get a 20" stainless barrel upper from bcm when they're released but they're pricey and might have options you don't need or want. They do sell their barrels separately though and you could buy the parts for a custom build. Or WOA has their SDMR upper with 1/7 20" stainless barrel. But both of those cost a significant amount more than what you listed.

gmcal
09-07-2010, 6:50 AM
Forgot to add, IIRC the 1/8 twist can stabalize the 75-77 gr match ammo. Maybe someone else can confirm this or correct me but if not email BCM, they can tell you.

Mrskylinetou
09-07-2010, 7:23 AM
Yes 1/8 will stabalize hight 70 match bullets. It helps to molley coat them for MUCH better performance. I like 1/7 as a much better choice just bec u can shoot the heavier better match bullets that will buck the wind much better. U can pick a round that u like and have a barrel turned to the perfect twist. U can get the chamber turned also but there is good money in that. Unless u plan on shooting 72-79 or even 82 grain bullets I would go 1-7 bec u got much more choices of match bullets. The brass has as much to do with it also and yr prep on the brass. Acly improv is a great option but there is not much for parts out there for that. When u look for a barrel just ask them what blanks they use then compair prices from others who use the same blank. There areany manu that are VERY pround of their name but use a loath blank and charge hundreds more than the same blank with someone elses name. Same accuracy maybe a bit different chamber but most will never know the difference

Mrskylinetou
09-07-2010, 7:39 AM
U really wanna stat away from crome lined barrels. What gives u accuracy is close tolerences while machining, it is impossible to line a barrel and keep these close tollerences. If yr looking to make the barrel last buy stanless. Most match barrels are stainless. There is a ton of info on thos with a simple google search.

dancinzen
09-07-2010, 1:00 PM
I have read chrome lined last way longer than stainless barells. This is because the stainless is such close tolerance that the bullets wear away at the bore as opposed to the protective chrome lining but offers less accuracy. Is this wrong? What kind of accuracy can I expect with a 20" chrome lined barrel? 2" or 3" groups at 100 yds? Or better?

Mrskylinetou
09-07-2010, 1:15 PM
Well yea u can get 2" groups at 100 easy with a chrom barrel and hand loads but that's a lot of money to just get 2 or 3" groups. Any match barrel yr gonna shoot out in 5 to 10k rounds to what a chrom barrel shoots off the self. That's part of shooting a high acurate barrel. Replacing a barrel is the least of the worries. If u wanna shoot volume, plink, impress friends then chrom lined is the way to go. If u want ten shot touching at 400 yards then there is some things that u sacrifice in the proccess.

First things first. What exactly are u looking to do? What type of shooting do u want to do? And how much do u wanna budget?

Have u though of what caliber?

wash
09-07-2010, 1:24 PM
At the moment I would have to advise you to avoid BCM.

As much as I like their gunfighter charging handle, they wouldn't sell 10 round .458 SOCOM magazines or even parts kits to me.

I find it very hard to support a company that won't sell me items that I know are perfectly legal.

I was planning on buying several magazines, stripped uppers and charging handles from them, not any more.

gmcal
09-07-2010, 2:26 PM
If 2-3" groups is all you're looking for and are concerned about barrel life the 20" upper you're looking at will serve you well.

dancinzen
09-07-2010, 4:14 PM
I want to be able to shoot a 12 to 15 inch gong from 500 to 700 yds. I make my own hand loads. I was just curious if the 20" goverment profile upper was capable of shootin that distance and hitting those targets.

NiteQwill
09-07-2010, 4:24 PM
I want to be able to shoot a 12 to 15 inch gong from 500 to 700 yds. I make my own hand loads. I was just curious if the 20" goverment profile upper was capable of shootin that distance and hitting those targets.

Of course it is.