PDA

View Full Version : LMT or POF 308


JoeGSX
09-04-2010, 7:29 PM
Trying to decide between the POF and the LMT in 308 need your guys advise.

tomd1584
09-04-2010, 10:53 PM
I'm a huge fan of LMT, and their .308 MWS is an awesome weapon. the lower reciever is almost identical to KAC's SR-25, and its also been awarded a contract for the British Army as the L129A1.

The POF handguards felt really bulky in my hands. On top of that, they're ugly as sin, IMO.


On the other hand, the LMT sure is sexy:
http://i737.photobucket.com/albums/xx14/TD236/204a.jpg

X-NewYawker
09-04-2010, 11:06 PM
POF: POS

LMT MWS RULES!



Seriously.

sleepercar
09-04-2010, 11:10 PM
LMT for the win.
I got a chance to drool over one a little while ago at Riflegear. Some guy had FFL'd it there. I wish I had a child to give for that rifle. That thing is gorgeous.

Ruiner
09-04-2010, 11:11 PM
I'd go for the LMT. Infact it will be my next rifle.

Sick Boy
09-04-2010, 11:16 PM
I'm for the LMT too.

My buddy has a POF in 6.8 and it's just meh. Big and bully and just kinda ugly.

I think an LMT .308 MRP would be awesome!

Dhena81
09-05-2010, 12:51 AM
There is no real debate here LMT is the way to go without a doubt in the future you'll be able to change out different barrel lengths and calibers. I know that on the 5.56 LMT MRP's you can change from DI to Piston and from 5.56 to 6.8. The piston conversion might not happen for the .308 but the different calibers and barrel lengths will happen soon.

problemchild
09-05-2010, 7:19 AM
I have owned both and here is what I know.

Pof

Much easier to clean (5 minutes VS 1 hour for the LMT)
Pof kicks harder with the piston coming back at you but not a deal killer
NO FTE-FTF's
Pof comes with a Geissle trigger and match barrel


Lmt

Much dirtier gun, PITA to clean the bolt/bcg/barrel extension
slimmer hand-guard
interchangeable barrel (dont know if I will ever use this feature)
less recoil
2 FTE's running handloads
2 stage NON-Geissle trigger

Quiet
09-05-2010, 7:54 AM
Go with the LMT MWS308.

Brits adopted the LMT MWS308 because it outperformed the H&K HK417 and the POF P308 is essentially a clone of the HK417.

Jpach
09-05-2010, 3:04 PM
LMT all the way. I just picked up my lower on friday and slapped my upper on it as soon as I go thome. It is the most solid gun I have ever felt. Maybe Im biased since I have a huge LMT boner and the rifle is my own, but its honestly one of the coolest guns ever.

I got it all decked out now so Ill take pictures and put them on my thread about it.

Im going to shoot it tomorrow morning too.

Josh3239
09-05-2010, 3:05 PM
Another vote for LMT. POF doesn't deserve to be in the same sentence as LMT.

supermario
09-08-2010, 10:16 PM
Im curious to why people dont like the POF 308 as much? Does anybody who doesnt like them, ever own one and have problems? To me the POF appears to be pretty good option, its accurate (from what i read), its not that heavy or unbalanced like the LWRC REPR, Its reliable, easy to clean, keeps clean, and the biggest plus to me is that it can shoot Wolf Ammo. To me, being able to shoot cheap ammo is a major plus, i cant afford to spend $15+ a box of 20. I know the LMT is a great 308 rifle but Im curious if its picky to ammo? I want either one but Im going with whatever rifle is can shoot any type of ammo. I know its a $2k plus rifle but at that much $$ it should shoot anything. Anyways, any of you guys actually have bad experience or is just becus you dont like the 5.56/6.8 version or becus the rails are too big and bulky and ugly? Just curious, thanks.

Jpach
09-08-2010, 11:04 PM
Im curious to why people dont like the POF 308 as much? Does anybody who doesnt like them, ever own one and have problems? To me the POF appears to be pretty good option, its accurate (from what i read), its not that heavy or unbalanced like the LWRC REPR, Its reliable, easy to clean, keeps clean, and the biggest plus to me is that it can shoot Wolf Ammo. To me, being able to shoot cheap ammo is a major plus, i cant afford to spend $15+ a box of 20. I know the LMT is a great 308 rifle but Im curious if its picky to ammo? I want either one but Im going with whatever rifle is can shoot any type of ammo. I know its a $2k plus rifle but at that much $$ it should shoot anything. Anyways, any of you guys actually have bad experience or is just becus you dont like the 5.56/6.8 version or becus the rails are too big and bulky and ugly? Just curious, thanks.

PM sent.

And btw...

Start reloading! Its worth it. Big time.

Rekrab
09-09-2010, 12:01 AM
My dad decided to build a POF .308 AR with after I put together my DPMS 16" .308. Unfortunately he's had a lot of extraction issues with cheaper ammunition, with some ammo the extractor actually tears through the rims.

I will say that the POF piston, 20" upper with muzzle brake kicks just as much my DPMS DI 16". Can't say I'm a huge fan. The fancy NP3 finish is nice and all, but I couldn't justify spending so much on one.

pacrimguru
09-09-2010, 8:08 AM
how is this even debatable? get the LMT.

FeuerFrei
09-09-2010, 2:26 PM
Im curious to why people dont like the POF 308 as much? Does anybody who doesnt like them, ever own one and have problems? To me the POF appears to be pretty good option, its accurate (from what i read), its not that heavy or unbalanced like the LWRC REPR, Its reliable, easy to clean, keeps clean, and the biggest plus to me is that it can shoot Wolf Ammo. To me, being able to shoot cheap ammo is a major plus, i cant afford to spend $15+ a box of 20. I know the LMT is a great 308 rifle but Im curious if its picky to ammo? I want either one but Im going with whatever rifle is can shoot any type of ammo. I know its a $2k plus rifle but at that much $$ it should shoot anything. Anyways, any of you guys actually have bad experience or is just becus you dont like the 5.56/6.8 version or becus the rails are too big and bulky and ugly? Just curious, thanks.

I'll offer up my experience with POF 556 uppers I own. (sorry no 308)
Very accurate with cheap ammo, aka; Wolf,PMC etc..
I run both 16" railed uppers and M4 basic upper.
They have all proved to be very reliable and accurate.
I cannot see why others hate POF so much. I don't know many people that actually posses these uppers or rifles. I don't have any full auto NFA stuff so that may be where they are coming from.
Personally I think it is kinda of a Chevy vs Ford argument.
Oh well.

artmachine
09-09-2010, 2:38 PM
I own multiple POF rifles (although not .308) and redundant uppers. accurate, dependable. I haven't had an issue yet with any and have run thousands of rds thru some.

Easy to clean, too.

Rommel
09-09-2010, 4:34 PM
I haven't shot or even seen the LMT in person so I can't really comment on that but I do own a POF 308 with a 20" upper. I have put ~ 1200 rounds through my POF and have had exactly one stuck case it was South African Surplus from the 1980's. Other than that not one stoppage or hiccup in use.

With my hand loads my POF is a solid 3/4 MOA rifle. I think a lot of people on CalGuns don't like the POF for reasons they have read on the internet and not actual use. Either way to each their own. Personally I think its a great rifle and I enjoy shooting it the most out of any of my AR style rifles.

I will admit I think POF the company itself did have some teething problems which hasn't helped their case. But I think their service has gotten a lot better as they have staff regularly contributing on forums, etc, etc. You will see a lot more POF supporters on Sniper's Hide than here.

quick draw mcgraw
09-09-2010, 6:18 PM
I wonder how many of you "experts" that are bashing POF have ever owned one, let alone shot or even touched one.

I am a big fan of LMT and plan on buying their 5.56 MRP piston upper in the near future, but my choice for a .308 battle rifle was the POF P308 14.5" carbine and it is majorly bada**!! It is 1/2 MOA capable (not that I am, although double and triple taps on clay pigeons at 300 yrds was child's play), it runs like a champ, and will eat any ammo you feed it.

It is heavy, but it is after all a .308 so go buy a good 2 point sling and man-up!

I will concede that POF's customer service is terrible if non-existent altogether, but the squeaky wheel does eventually get the grease.

All in all I think they are both awesome guns. I am a piston fan and a fan of Rock Creek barrels so I went with the POF. That being said, I will probably own an LMT .308 sooner or later too.

Good luck with your choice. I am sure you will be happy with either.

Here's my POF P308

http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad308/tnewburn/IMG_4649.jpg

http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/ad308/tnewburn/IMG_4657.jpg

silverfj40
09-09-2010, 7:38 PM
I also own multiple POF rifles including several POF 308 rifles.

Love them.

No issues.

+1 for POF

Jpach
09-09-2010, 11:53 PM
I hear nothing but great things about POF 308s (from the actual owners).

Both are awesome rifles and capable of awesome accuracy.

Pretty much you need to decide if you need a piston, or if you want to change barrels quickly and relatively cheaply vs buying a completely new upper. Also monolithic vs non-olithic (:p).

ddindetroit
10-14-2010, 5:22 PM
Trying to decide between the POF and the LMT in 308 need your guys advise.

I've handled almost all the 308 AR's: the high end ones:

POF, LWRC, Larue OBR, and the LMT MWS. For the money and flexibility, the LMT MWS 308 is the best. I bought several because they are that good!

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=340716&highlight=ddindetroit

ddindetroit:D

bomb_on_bus
10-14-2010, 8:47 PM
Your good with going either way as both guns have a great reputation behind them for accuracy. I went with POF as thats what was best on the market at the time and am still happy with the gun as it keeps up with most bolt actions at the range. Unless someone has a Palma, GAP, Tango 51, or a Surgeon on the line that is.

Both guns can shoot sub MOA all day long.

heres the link to POFs web page with some older data about range performance with various barrel lengths and bullet weights.

http://www.pof-usa.net/pdf_files/P-308ballistictestresults.pdf

also the main page video is worth checking out too. http://www.pof-usa.com

jasonnorcal
10-14-2010, 9:37 PM
how is this even debatable? get the LMT.

hahaha....this:iagree: DI FTW!

OutlawDon
10-14-2010, 9:46 PM
I got much love for this!...Larue OBR. Clean, sleek design.

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Magpul%20Precision%20Rifle%202010/MDprCO6-15-10fmcdh13.jpg

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Magpul%20Precision%20Rifle%202010/MDspCO6-16-10fmcdh55.jpg

thmpr
10-14-2010, 9:54 PM
For me, KAC all the way!

OutlawDon
10-14-2010, 10:14 PM
For me, KAC all the way!

;););)

http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk99/USMC03_photos/Magpul%20Precision%20Rifle%202010/MDprCO6-15-10fmcdh7.jpg

thmpr
10-14-2010, 10:24 PM
Let me know when you want to try one....

N3TD3ViL
10-29-2010, 2:47 PM
I wonder how many of you "experts" that are bashing POF have ever owned one, let alone shot or even touched one.

It is heavy, but it is after all a .308 so go buy a good 2 point sling and man-up!

All in all I think they are both awesome guns. I am a piston fan and a fan of Rock Creek barrels so I went with the POF. That being said, I will probably own an LMT .308 sooner or later too.


Very nice rifle, and I would also like to know how many of the keyboard commandos in this thread have owned or for that matter, fired a POF rifle. My guess is slim to none, other than those who presently own one.

I've had my POF P-308 20" since May and it hasn't failed me once. It will accept any brand of ammo I feed into it and never misses a lick. Simply put, I'd put my POF up against any other semi-auto .308 on the market.

Oh, and by the way Quick Draw McGraw, nice rifle you have there!

http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/2863/photo4edt.jpg
http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/5981/39825135276358779114924.jpg

Predator
10-30-2010, 1:01 PM
I run POF as well, ::Zero FTF/FTE, no complaints,

If your choice of rifle is based purely on how it "looks" then get what you like the look of.
If it's based on how it SHOOTS, then try both and figure out which you prefer.

Double_tap
10-30-2010, 1:04 PM
POF sells to the pakistani army, i wouldnt give them a dime of my money. I'm sure they make a good product, i am not bashing that.

THT
10-30-2010, 1:08 PM
The POF is more accurate then the LMT when the LMT sports the chrome-lined barrel; jury is still out on the stainless barrel. This makes sense considering the POF uses a Rock Creek barrel. However, I think the LMT is the better overall package considering the plethora of features like the monolithic rail and the quick change barrel.

C_1
10-30-2010, 1:27 PM
LMT>POF

freonr22
10-30-2010, 1:39 PM
Btw all LMT barrels are Cryo'd

quick draw mcgraw
10-30-2010, 3:38 PM
POF sells to the pakistani army, i wouldnt give them a dime of my money. I'm sure they make a good product, i am not bashing that.

??????

Are you sure about your claim??? Can you back this up with any factual data?

I do know their is a POF in Pakistan, but it is NOT Patriot Ordnance Factory, it is the Pakistani Ordnance Factory. As in they make their country's ammo.

Double_tap
10-30-2010, 3:59 PM
??????

Are you sure about your claim??? Can you back this up with any factual data?

I do know their is a POF in Pakistan, but it is NOT Patriot Ordnance Factory, it is the Pakistani Ordnance Factory. As in they make their country's ammo.

i stand corrected. thank you for clarifying.

Josh3239
10-30-2010, 4:29 PM
I wonder if they'd even service POFs owned by Californians. Either way, that is just another reason why I'd choose LMT.

POF's website's FAQ:

Do you sell Lower receivers to California residents or FFL Dealers?
No. We don't even sell to California FFL dealers.

X-NewYawker
10-30-2010, 5:02 PM
Easily interchangeable barrels.
Super accurate.
Nice people in CS
Adopted by UK Army
Sell to the poor saps in CA

LMT

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p54/Fasanoland/Rifles/SWATLM308MWS.jpg

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p54/Fasanoland/Rifles/LMTCOPShooting.jpg

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p54/Fasanoland/Rifles/lmt308roman.jpg

bomb_on_bus
10-30-2010, 5:48 PM
meh who really is ever going to be in a situation where they are going to need to swap out barrels? Especially on a semi auto. Sure you can go to different lengths and ammo types but your still stuck lugging the barrels around. To me they just tried to find a market niche that was better suited for a bolt action which is where the windrunner comes in. Both guns are up to par as far as accuracy goes but to me its whats inside the gun that makes it or breaks it for me.

I shot the LMT a few times and didnt see the need to get rid of my set up nor the need to go out and get one. Its like compairing chevys to fords IMO.

As far as POF not selling lowers to CA I think that is a little outdated as I bought some POF lowers from Wes over at tenpercent a couple years ago.

THT
10-30-2010, 7:56 PM
Being able to swap from .308 to .260 or .243 would be really, really nice if you're shooting long distance where the bullets with better external ballistics shine but you don't want to setup a new rifle.

N3TD3ViL
10-30-2010, 8:03 PM
meh who really is ever going to be in a situation where they are going to need to swap out barrels? Especially on a semi auto. Sure you can go to different lengths and ammo types but your still stuck lugging the barrels around. To me they just tried to find a market niche that was better suited for a bolt action which is where the windrunner comes in. Both guns are up to par as far as accuracy goes but to me its whats inside the gun that makes it or breaks it for me.

Very well said, and I agree.

X-NewYawker
10-30-2010, 11:00 PM
Being able to swap from .308 to .260 or .243 would be really, really nice if you're shooting long distance where the bullets with better external ballistics shine but you don't want to setup a new rifle.

What HE said. We are not here to only discuss combat situations. I might not have the jack to buy a 6.8 AND a 5.56. with an MRP you have both, and with LESS lugging that a second 6.8 gun, with the SAME controls, ergonomics of your main rifle. or have a titsed out M-forgery style combat gun, and a 20 inch 204 varmint gun for the weekend without having to buy a second gun.

because it doesn't interest one guy doesn't mean it's a bad idea. Some of us only have one AR.

Jpach
10-30-2010, 11:43 PM
What HE said. We are not here to only discuss combat situations. I might not have the jack to buy a 6.8 AND a 5.56. with an MRP you have both, and with LESS lugging that a second 6.8 gun, with the SAME controls, ergonomics of your main rifle. or have a titsed out M-forgery style combat gun, and a 20 inch 204 varmint gun for the weekend without having to buy a second gun.

because it doesn't interest one guy doesn't mean it's a bad idea. Some of us only have one AR.

Well said. Why buy an entirely new .260 or .243 upper or rifle when you can just buy the barrel?

I know damn well that Im getting a .260 barrel when they come out. That way I can have a .308 short barrel for blowing things up close and a .260 to mess around at a farther distance.

9-12
10-31-2010, 9:17 PM
One word...Armalite. I built both of these for less than 2 grand each (less optics and bipod), and both will do anything either of those others will except one thing, and I really don't care about switching barrels in a hurry. The top one is a 20" with an IOR 3x18x42 and the second is a 16" (SASS barrel) with an Aimpoint. Both are easy sub moa guns with FGMM. With the IOR on the 16" it's good to 800yds. ;)

http://www.performanceboats.com/html/youBoat/data/500/medium/0227.JPG

problemchild
10-31-2010, 9:28 PM
I have owned both and here is what I can tell you.

POF= much easier to clean
LMT = much harder to clean

Both are machined to amazing specs. Both have quality parts. Both are nice rifles. The pof seemed to kick harder. The LMT has a softer recoil. POF never jammed, ever! LMT has had 4 ftj's during break-in but not again in 400 rds. Both shoot good. LMT can change out the barrel in 30 seconds. LMT has a smaller handguard. POF had a nicer trigger.

pyro3k2
10-31-2010, 10:07 PM
Well I am one of those anti-POF people who have actually shot and used a .308 POF. But to add a twist my reasons for not liking the firearm had nothing to do with performance, I just really don't like that free float hand guard. And if im paying that much for the rifle there shouldn't be one thing on it that I don't find sexy or that I have to swap out.

pyro3k2
10-31-2010, 10:11 PM
One word...Armalite. I built both of these for less than 2 grand each (less optics and bipod), and both will do anything either of those others will except one thing, and I really don't care about switching barrels in a hurry. The top one is a 20" with an IOR 3x18x42 and the second is a 16" (SASS barrel) with an Aimpoint. Both are easy sub moa guns with FGMM. With the IOR on the 16" it's good to 800yds. ;)

http://www.performanceboats.com/html/youBoat/data/500/medium/0227.JPG

Do they say AR-10 on the reciever? could they be Reg. AW?

9-12
10-31-2010, 10:28 PM
Do they say AR-10 on the reciever? could they be Reg. AW?NO, they're built on Aero lowers. The rest is all Armalite except for the furniture, and the RR 2 stage triggers. They both have bullet buttons and are CA legal.