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View Full Version : Whats the real deal on Preban Mags for Rifles?


x2delight
05-02-2006, 4:19 PM
i understand that whoever had magazines before the ban is allowed to have it in the state of california. what i wanted to know was is it possible for me to legally take possession of a magazine from a friend who happens to have a few? i dont quite get the understanding on it. can someone clarify all this for me

thanks

ohsmily
05-02-2006, 4:20 PM
No, it isn't legal to do so.

rssslvr
05-02-2006, 4:21 PM
Sorry the answer is no

blkA4alb
05-02-2006, 4:23 PM
High cap magazines cannot be sold, given, loaned, traded, manufactured. Nothing. Its simple, unless YOU possessed them before 2000, they are illegal.

Racefiend
05-02-2006, 4:25 PM
High cap magazines cannot be sold, given, loaded, traded, manufactured. Nothing. Its simple, unless YOU possessed them before 2000, they are illegal.


AAAHHH! what good are they then!:eek:

:p

mow
05-02-2006, 4:30 PM
So if you possessed them before 2000 and you gave them to a friend he can give them back to you without a problem ?

lol :D slippery slope?

x2delight
05-02-2006, 4:36 PM
the date of manufacturing on the magazine has to say before 2000 right? how in the hell will they know my friend gave me the magazine? as long as it says pre 2000 it should be bueno no?

SC_00_05
05-02-2006, 4:39 PM
the date of manufacturing on the magazine has to say before 2000 right? how in the hell will they know my friend gave me the magazine? as long as it says pre 2000 it should be bueno no?
Virtually no magazines have any sort of date of manufacture on them.

x2delight
05-02-2006, 4:39 PM
its kinda useles anyways... i guess i rather not get one from him... too much complicated crap...

ocabj
05-02-2006, 4:40 PM
I don't know what kind of standard capacity mags that you have that hold more than 10 rounds, but none of my standard capacity magazines have dates of manufacture on them.

blkA4alb
05-02-2006, 4:42 PM
AAAHHH! what good are they then!:eek:

:p
Whoa whoops, thats a pretty big typing error on my part. Edited to say loaned, of course they can be loaded! Geez...:rolleyes:

grammaton76
05-02-2006, 4:50 PM
Virtually no magazines have any sort of date of manufacture on them.

I beg to differ. A huge number of magazines currently on the market are stamped LEO/Military restricted and have a manufacture date, as they were manufactured during the 1994 assault weapons ban.

And aside from explicitly stated dates, there are plenty of ways to date mags. Two of my favorite USGI magazines date from the 60s and 70s, respectively. If you do a search, you'll find that there's a magazine identification thread out there that gets regularly posted. Floorplate stamps and manufacturer do a lot for date placement, as the suppliers of USGI mags shifted around a lot from the 60s through today.

SC_00_05
05-02-2006, 5:05 PM
I beg to differ. A huge number of magazines currently on the market are stamped LEO/Military restricted and have a manufacture date, as they were manufactured during the 1994 assault weapons ban.

And aside from explicitly stated dates, there are plenty of ways to date mags. Two of my favorite USGI magazines date from the 60s and 70s, respectively. If you do a search, you'll find that there's a magazine identification thread out there that gets regularly posted. Floorplate stamps and manufacturer do a lot for date placement, as the suppliers of USGI mags shifted around a lot from the 60s through today.
I stand corrected.

I should have said that of the 50 or so standard cap mags I have, there are no explicit manufacturing dates on them.

Stanze
05-02-2006, 5:17 PM
These kinds of threads remind me of the the people who want the government's legal blessing to smoke pot in the privacy of their homes.

:rolleyes:

If you ever get busted for unlawful possesion of banned mags or pot, you were either born after 1.1.2000 or are stupid and deserved it.:p

rocketboy
05-02-2006, 5:31 PM
Have proof that you were 18 before the ban took place.

ohsmily
05-02-2006, 5:33 PM
Have proof that you were 18 before the ban took place.

Why? You didn't have to be 18 to own magazines.

As long as you were born prior to 1-1-2000, you could have legally acquired full cap magazines when someone gave them to you, even as an infant, on the day you were born...

harley66
05-02-2006, 5:43 PM
Virtually no magazines have any sort of date of manufacture on them.


how much $$$$ do you have to bet on the above statment -

Matt C
05-02-2006, 5:56 PM
Virtually no magazines have any sort of date of manufacture on them.


Even if they do, you can replace old magazine parts (the body or floorplate for example) on legal magazines and they could say LEO or Military.

ohsmily
05-02-2006, 7:04 PM
Even if they do, you can replace old magazine parts (the body or floorplate for example) on legal magazines and they could say LEO or Military.

correct...

EBWhite
05-02-2006, 7:08 PM
x2-

He cannot give you a complete magazine however he can give you all the parts in pieces. Now, It is against the law for you to reassemble the magazine.

hung380
05-02-2006, 7:12 PM
i have some 30 rounders that i bought before the ban but it doesnt have any date stamped on them. Is that legal?:eek:

ohsmily
05-02-2006, 7:15 PM
i have some 30 rounders that i bought before the ban but it doesnt have any date stamped on them. Is that legal?:eek:

Yes, they are legal...Why wouldn't they be? Was that a serious question?

Matt C
05-02-2006, 8:08 PM
He cannot give you a complete magazine however he can give you all the parts in pieces. Now, It is against the law for you to reassemble the magazine.

Good ol' EB, layin it out Barney style :)

hung380
05-02-2006, 8:21 PM
Yes, they are legal...Why wouldn't they be? Was that a serious question?
i heard different rumors, some say they are legal only if they have dates stamped on them. but thanks

Jicko
05-02-2006, 8:58 PM
Virtually no magazines have any sort of date of manufacture on them.

That is not true.... many new production 30 rounds AR magazines out there have manuf date on the magazine body.... (many of those nice teflon coated ones...)

But then, this wasn't really much of a practice until probably late 90s..... or maybe even after 2000s..... so if you didn't acquire any new magazines (which you shouldn't have.... unless you are replacing old parts....)... then... what you have most probably don't have date-stamps...

To make it simple... if you OWN some "more than 10 rounds" magazines before Jan 1, 2000.... continue to own, use, fix them(just don't give or sell or loan to anyone, if you don't want them anymore, destroy them)..... date stamped or not... they are legal... but if you didn't have some back then.... you are out of luck... you just can't have them now.... PERIOD... don't order parts to build them yourself, don't sneak them into the state, don't try to buy/get/steal/trade/receive them from anyone.....

Mr.RoDiN
05-02-2006, 11:02 PM
so could a minor have legally purchased high cap mags prior 2000?

blkA4alb
05-02-2006, 11:11 PM
so could a minor have legally purchased high cap mags prior 2000?
Why not? There is no law restricting magazine sales to minors. It is just a part.

hung380
05-03-2006, 1:51 PM
so if i get pulled over with my non dated high cap. pre-ban mag, then the police wouldnt do anything? Or would they? If so how can they prove that its a post/ pre ban mags?:confused:

shopkeep
05-03-2006, 1:57 PM
Pre-ban magazines can have virtually any appearance. Many with pre-ban mags have repaired them or upgraded them since 1999. Some of the most popular upgrades include Magpul Self Leveling Followers, Magpul Ranger Plates, and Teflon magazine bodies.

zombieflanders
05-03-2006, 2:16 PM
What about High cap mags that my deceased father owned? He bought them back in the mid 90's. I certalnly used them when he was alive. Are they legal for me to own? And yes, some newer mags have dates. My ten round Bushy's do.

ohsmily
05-03-2006, 3:12 PM
What about High cap mags that my deceased father owned? He bought them back in the mid 90's. I certalnly used them when he was alive. Are they legal for me to own? And yes, some newer mags have dates. My ten round Bushy's do.

If YOU possessed them at the time of the ban (1-1-2000) then you can legally continue to possess them...


this isn't difficult.

rocketboy
05-03-2006, 3:52 PM
Why? You didn't have to be 18 to own magazines.

As long as you were born prior to 1-1-2000, you could have legally acquired full cap magazines when someone gave them to you, even as an infant, on the day you were born...


I have no doubt that you are right! I think its going to be real interesting when or if we are able to use detachable mags in the rifles about how many newbies are going to be sporting standard capacity mags. Also that could be a good thing, if the gov sees that the law is unenforceable then maybe it will get thrown out.

grammaton76
05-03-2006, 3:54 PM
so if i get pulled over with my non dated high cap. pre-ban mag, then the police wouldnt do anything? Or would they? If so how can they prove that its a post/ pre ban mags?:confused:

If you lived in California prior to 2000, they really can't.

ohsmily
05-03-2006, 3:56 PM
I have no doubt that you are right! I think its going to be real interesting when or if we are able to use detachable mags in the rifles about how many newbies are going to be sporting standard capacity mags. Also that could be a good thing, if the gov sees that the law is unenforceable then maybe it will get thrown out.

The law isn't unenforceable. In fact, it is an extremely strict and effective law against anyone born on or after 1-1-2000. This may sound silly now, but about 12 years from now, there will be MANY people who want full caps but will have no legal way of having owned them and thus most people will choose not to own them.

floorance
05-03-2006, 3:59 PM
Man..so many "what if's?" and "How about.." and "My dad.." give it a break. If you don't have them by now, don't push the law to try and get some illegally. You guys asking these hypothetical queston's aren't fooling anyone but yourself. Is it really worth the risk? Just be grateful that you even have an AR now, 10 round mags are fine. (Im a little biased after all.. i have a few preban mags, and yes, they are dated Way before 1-1-2000 :D and I was 24 years old in 00 )

grammaton76
05-03-2006, 4:07 PM
The law isn't unenforceable. In fact, it is an extremely strict and effective law against anyone born on or after 1-1-2000. This may sound silly now, but about 12 years from now, there will be MANY people who want full caps but will have no legal way of having owned them and thus most people will choose not to own them.

Don't forget how many folks we have move into California - it's also very strict and effective vs anyone who moved into the state in the past 6 years, which is a good chunk of them in the major cities.

ohsmily
05-03-2006, 4:18 PM
Don't forget how many folks we have move into California - it's also very strict and effective vs anyone who moved into the state in the past 6 years, which is a good chunk of them in the major cities.

True, but you don't know how long someone has lived in the state just by glancing at their current CA identification. Conversely, for the people cut off by age, a simply glance at their birthdate will tell you whether they can legally own them or not.

grammaton76
05-03-2006, 4:22 PM
True, but you don't know how long someone has lived in the state just by glancing at their current CA identification. Conversely, for the people cut off by age, a simply glance at their birthdate will tell you whether they can legally own them or not.

Ah, yes. True, so in the case of folks who moved in, that's only coming up if they're already being prosecuted or something.

EBWhite
05-03-2006, 5:27 PM
Just think about people that moved here in the last 6 years. Many are unaware of the law and just think of the amount that entered the state- of course illegally.

cnyankee
05-03-2006, 9:14 PM
just curious...what is the penalty for having illegal mags...if it is too stiff then most will stop trying to get around law.

hung380
05-03-2006, 9:27 PM
felony:eek:

accordingtoome
05-04-2006, 1:13 AM
QUESTION>>?? When my brother came back from Iraq he left/gave me 3 30 round mags. Im sure he did not buy these. At the time i was not into guns and threw them in a box somewhere. So i own these right? i can take these out to the range? Also how can i tell if a mag was made before 2000? thanks all:confused:

ohsmily
05-04-2006, 9:26 AM
QUESTION>>?? When my brother came back from Iraq he left/gave me 3 30 round mags. Im sure he did not buy these. At the time i was not into guns and threw them in a box somewhere. So i own these right? i can take these out to the range? Also how can i tell if a mag was made before 2000? thanks all:confused:

When did he give them to you? Desert Storm or Iraqi Freedom? If he gave them to you before 2000, then you can keep them. If he gave them to you after 1-1-2000, then regardless of when they were made, you can't legally keep them...

why is this so difficult for everyone?

grammaton76
05-04-2006, 11:15 AM
Ok, fine, for everyone asking squirrel questions and wondering if they're going to get caught or not... or for anyone who just wants to know the history of their USGI mags...

http://www.rawles.to/AR-15_M16_Magazine_FAQ.html

phish
05-04-2006, 12:29 PM
Wow, I must've missed the sale on crystal balls back in '99 since there were a lot of mags purchased "before the ban" even if there was no rifle to go along with it.

gmafb

:rolleyes:

Can somebody tell me what the winning lotto numbers are?
I'll split it with you, seriously. :D

grammaton76
05-04-2006, 1:23 PM
Wow, I must've missed the sale on crystal balls back in '99 since there were a lot of mags purchased "before the ban" even if there was no rifle to go along with it.

gmafb

Well, if California were to declare that YOU could buy all the mags you want out of state, legally, for one week, wouldn't you buy a lot of mags for rifles you don't have yet? I know I would. It's just a matter of hedging your bets and hoping that you'll be able to buy something in the future that takes those mags.

odysseus
05-04-2006, 1:51 PM
Well, if California were to declare that YOU could buy all the mags you want out of state, legally, for one week, wouldn't you buy a lot of mags for rifles you don't have yet? I know I would. It's just a matter of hedging your bets and hoping that you'll be able to buy something in the future that takes those mags.

A LOT OF PEOPLE did this for the 2000 ban, including myself. I did this for the m14/m1a rifles even though I hadn't gotten the rifle yet at the time- it was on my "list" of rifles to buy. I remember the San Jose gun show close to the time of the ban and basically it was all about mags, everyone there was about buying or selling magazines. People got mags for all kinds of guns they didn't have yet. Essentially the ban triggered a massive importation of mags and the buying of mags as expected just before the ban.

s281c
05-04-2006, 2:37 PM
Well, if California were to declare that YOU could buy all the mags you want out of state, legally, for one week, wouldn't you buy a lot of mags for rifles you don't have yet? I know I would. It's just a matter of hedging your bets and hoping that you'll be able to buy something in the future that takes those mags.

Back in 99 I was buying mags by the case in anticipation of the ban, at the time I was unsure as to whether or not you could get parts to repair them, so better safe then sorry, and yes I did buy mags for a lot of guns I didn't own, because I knew once 2000 hit I could not legally buy anymore, and you never know what guns you might be buying in the future.

ohsmily
05-04-2006, 2:47 PM
Back in 99 I was buying mags by the case in anticipation of the ban, at the time I was unsure as to whether or not you could get parts to repair them, so better safe then sorry, and yes I did buy mags for a lot of guns I didn't own, because I knew once 2000 hit I could not legally buy anymore, and you never know what guns you might be buying in the future.

I think what he is suggesting is that who would have thought to buy AR-15 magazines in 1999 if you didn't own an AR-15 at the time. Who would have anticipated being able to buy AR-15's in CA again...

the_quark
05-04-2006, 3:13 PM
I can think of several reasons one might purchase AR mags pre-ban, without owning and AR and without necessarily expecting to own an AR in California:

1) There are many non-AR, non-assault-weapon rifles that take them that are perfectly legal in California (e.g., the SU-16). One might anticipate buying one in the future.

2) A person who believes that the 2nd amendment will eventually lead to the striking down of the California assault weapon ban might also reasonably believe that magazines are not *firearms* and anticipate that, while he might be able to purchase an AR someday, he might still also not be able to purchase normal capacity magazines for it.

3) In 2000 it was by no means obvious that the Federal ban definitely was going to expire. It wouldn't have been crazy to say, in 1999, "At some point in the future, I may live in a state where I can buy an AR-15. But, if the Federal ban on manufacture of normal-capacity magazines continues, such magazines will only get more expensive between now, and then. I should purchase several now, even though I don't yet own a rifle that can use them."

4) One might optimistically hope that the assault weapons ban in particular might get struck down or modified as vague and overbroad (as it now appears happened) and at the same time recognize that the normal-capacity magazine ban might have no such flaws. Or, one might expect that the political will to weaken the assault-weapon provisions a little (to make it more like the Federal ban and allow one evil feature with detachable magazines) might be present in the state before the political will to allow normal capacity magazines. And, besides, see point 3 - if, at some point in the future, California opens up the market on normal-capacity magazines, but the Federal ban was still in place, it'd still be chaper to buy them in 1999 than, say, in 2010.

[Edited - originally said 2000 when I meant 1999, and incorrectly stated that the Federal assault weapons ban allowed two evil features with a detachable magazine]

Major Miner II
05-04-2006, 3:16 PM
Hey. I knew in '99 that I would eventually by an M1A. I bought a whole bunch of mags to go with it.

Bought it this year.

ohsmily
05-04-2006, 3:19 PM
Hey. I knew in '99 that I would eventually by an M1A. I bought a whole bunch of mags to go with it.

Bought it this year.

Good for you....many people did what you did, nice non sequiter to the last couple of threads...The question is, would you still have bought those magazines if the M1A was banned as of 1-1-2000 in CA???

Major Miner II
05-04-2006, 3:31 PM
Good for you....many people did what you did, nice non sequiter to the last couple of threads...The question is, would you still have bought those magazines if the M1A was banned as of 1-1-2000 in CA???
No. Can't say that I would have.

s281c
05-04-2006, 3:50 PM
I think what he is suggesting is that who would have thought to buy AR-15 magazines in 1999 if you didn't own an AR-15 at the time. Who would have anticipated being able to buy AR-15's in CA again...

Not Ar mags but I bought mags for other Rifles some of which are on the banned list, because there are other guns that could use them.

The Soup Nazi
05-04-2006, 4:13 PM
Edited to not screw myself over.

ohsmily
05-04-2006, 4:24 PM
Hey, I'm 15 (almost 16), born in 1990. Which means I'm not affected by the 2000 birth date (I'm also born in San Jose, always lived here my entire life). So basically I'm totally not screwed over for owning hi cap mags? (after all, its legal to bring high caps disassembled from out of state and claim to have to repair them, and just say that someone in my family's military tradition gave em to me. But then again, my family IS a military tradition)

No, you are screwed (and not very bright either). It is against the law to bring more full capacity magazines into this state and it is also illegal to assemble (make) new ones. Your post indicates that you didn't have any before the ban. You are out of luck.

Keep it to yourself kid...

the_quark
05-04-2006, 4:30 PM
I am not a lawyer :rolleyes: , but, as a general rule, if one is planning on violating the law, it is not generally wise to publish one's intention to do so in a public forum. No matter when you were born, importing high-capacity magazines into the state of California for non-law-enforcement/military use is a crime. The fact that you've thought of a way to violate the law doesn't mean it's not, still, a crime.

accordingtoome
05-04-2006, 11:23 PM
Edited to not screw myself over.

shouldn't you be doing homework or playing PS2 or something>? At 15 you should be out trying to poke some chicks

ghostrider4evr
05-04-2006, 11:37 PM
Edited to not screw myself over.

A little too late for that

blacklisted
05-05-2006, 12:04 AM
shouldn't you be doing homework or playing PS2 or something>? At 15 you should be out trying to poke some chicks

There's nothing wrong with poking chicks and getting guns, it's just multitasking.

chickenfried
05-05-2006, 1:17 AM
Because you knew that the most awe inspiring weapon mankind has invented since the atomic bomb was being designed by the geniuses in Remington's law enforcement division and it would use AR magazines. Finally in 2005 they felt society was responsible enough to handle the awesome power that would be unleashed and they unveiled their creation.
http://www.remingtonle.com/images/rifles/m7615.jpg
Gentleman, THE REMINGTION 7615 PATROL RIFLE.

I think what he is suggesting is that who would have thought to buy AR-15 magazines in 1999 if you didn't own an AR-15 at the time. Who would have anticipated being able to buy AR-15's in CA again...

rorschach
05-05-2006, 1:31 AM
There's nothing wrong with poking chicks and getting guns, it's just multitasking.

Yup, when I was 15 I had TWO girlfriends, AND an H&R Reising.

grammaton76
05-05-2006, 2:57 AM
Because you knew that the most awe inspiring weapon mankind has invented since the atomic bomb was being designed by the geniuses in Remington's law enforcement division and it would use AR magazines. Finally in 2005 they felt society was responsible enough to handle the awesome power that would be unleashed and they unveiled their creation.
http://www.remingtonle.com/images/rifles/m7615.jpg
Gentleman, THE REMINGTION 7615 PATROL RIFLE.

And it's a very good thing that Kel-Tec came out with their SU-16 first, because otherwise I probably would have bought one of those things. :)

Side note, anyone else seen the newly C&R MAS-56 rifles? It seems that some of the Century Arms batch is converted for 308 and FAL mags, which means finally having a use for those FAL mags you can't use on a CaliFAL.