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View Full Version : Lead free shoot at Fort Hunter Liggett Aug 13th. Free ammo, you bring the guns


spectr17
08-11-2010, 10:23 PM
Lead free shoot at Fort Hunter Liggett. You bring the guns and they supply the lead free ammo.

Fri Aug 13th in Jolon CA near Paso Robles.

Great way to test out loads for free.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs301.snc4/40375_419582635778_10251505778_5284435_360300_n.jp g

mebejets
08-11-2010, 10:36 PM
who's paying for this ammo? is this the juice that jim jones used in jonestown? the lead free hype is just that, no proof that it helps anything. its is just another way for guns and ammo top be regulated!!!!!!!!!!!!!

spectr17
08-12-2010, 12:06 AM
Diane Frankenstein is buying the ammo I heard and she'll be there handing it out too. :D

The free lead free ammo appears to be coming from the sponsors listed on the flyer. That lead free ammo is spendy so iffen it were me and I lived closer I'd be snatching it up and testing it out. Some of that copper flies funny in certain guns. Depends on the caliber and barrel it seems. Many hunters are dropping down one size on grain weight to get better expansion. Guys that normally use 180 grain pills in lead are dropping to 165s.

The best part is the manufacturers and some media call lead ammo "traditional ammo" now. ;). They's taking away our traditions by god. :eek:

r3dn3ck
08-12-2010, 8:33 AM
I'm going

chris
08-12-2010, 1:49 PM
i'm playing Army this weekend FHL is too far anyways and they do not have my caliber ammo. so screw it.

Abesnake
08-12-2010, 6:55 PM
i'm playing Army this weekend FHL is too far anyways and they do not have my caliber ammo. so screw it.

Don't have my caliber either or I'd hightail it up there. Not a fan of Feinstein anyways.

davebw226
08-12-2010, 7:47 PM
Hey guys I've now hunted with the lead free stuff a number of times with great effect. I'm no Tred Barta, but i grew up hunting with my game warden grandfather and am a retired infantry officer with more range time than most. I've taken game out to 300 yards using barnes lead free 30.06 ammo with absolutely no issues. As suggested above ive heard from a number of guides to drop down in bullet weight a bit from where you previously used lead ammo. Can't speak to it's necessity, although I saw my first condor this year hunting in paso robles which was pretty damn cool. Expensive stuff regardless but only really adds up if you miss a lot ;)

r3dn3ck
08-13-2010, 9:39 PM
Shot today at the lead free event. Browning .270 lever gun, Bushnell 6-18, 50M. Hornady 130gr .270 w/ GMX bullet.

http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g164/redfodora/Other/photo2.jpg

The organizers were sufficiently impressed with that group that they let me shoot the milk jugs and ballistic gel. The jugs were 5 x 1-gallon jugs lined up full of water inside a big plastic 55gal drum. I got to shoot the water jugs (2 setups) with lead core 150gr Winchester CXP2 and the Hornady stuff I'd shot the group above with. The lead core made it into the 4th jug shedding considerable mass along the way. It ended up nicely but not overly mushroomed but had obvious areas where lead was peeled off. The hornady copper bullet penetrated all 5 jugs completely and then the drum base and continued zinging across the landscape. Both shots were dead center on the jugs.

The gel was done similarly. It was about 36"deep with a pretty small face of about 4"x6". I put the first round (lead core Winchester) on the left side. It penetrated about 28", mushroomed nicely and stopped in the gel. Lead wiping through the wound channel was obvious and apparent. The wound channel was nice from impact to about 10" in but got pretty thin in cross section after that.

The hornady copper stuff exited the top of the block after penetrating about 24" (the block had bucked up in an arc and the bullet kept going straight, neat to see). The wound channel kept maximum cross sectional size for 4"-ish further than the lead core and there was no visible fragmentation except for the polymer tip which was found in pieces at 5" 10" and 15".

I apologize for not having any other pictures but my phone was dead by the time I got there and I couldn't really take pics of myself shooting anyway.

FLIGHT762
08-13-2010, 10:07 PM
I tried some Hornady 130 Gr. GMX's. Loaded them with four different powders and my Tikka T-3 does not like them(3"+ groups). I tried The Barnes 130 TSX and the T-3 loves them.

Don't know why it didn't like the GMX's, I even tried different seating depths.

spectr17
08-13-2010, 11:02 PM
Thanks for the report r3dn3ck. I filmed some bullet gel performance at the SHOT Show in Vegas this past Feb. Need to get that edited and posted for all to see. Wish I could have been there to film you guys, that stuff fascinates me.

mebejets
08-13-2010, 11:42 PM
The deep penetration of the lead free bullets seems to be all that is talked about which equals pass through shot / wasted energy. I believe in not having a bullet pass through an animal which equals total transfer of energy to the animal.

r3dn3ck
08-14-2010, 7:52 AM
I tend to agree. I don't like over penetration... but I do like complete penetration. I'd rather that the bullet fall out of the skin on the far side after having dumped 95% of it's energy. I didn't think you guys would take it as a sales pitch.

That said, you know a deer is like 8-10" thick right? Even a .22mag makes it all the way through. ANY high power rifle (witout frangible bullets) will over penetrate so all the down-the-nose looking at copper for penetrating deeper yet seems silly. It's not like a Remington Core-Lokt is going to magically stop under the far side skin.

What interested me is that the copper kept a solid wound channel LONGER than the lead core AND still penetrated deeper. It did more damage, carried it deeper and shot as well.

Would I buy solid copper for my hunting... hellz no. It's FIFTY dollars a box for ammo whose performance on game that's not a damned bit different than a $23 box of Winchester soft points or Remington Core-Lokt. I'll be sticking with my lead core until tungsten core becomes more price competitive.

DocSkinner
08-14-2010, 9:07 PM
Always seemed to me that if hunters retrieved all their wounded animals, the condors wouldn't be eating lead from shot or bullets in the first place.

spectr17
08-14-2010, 9:37 PM
Always seemed to me that if hunters retrieved all their wounded animals, the condors wouldn't be eating lead from shot or bullets in the first place.

The odd thing is now that everyone is shooting lead free in the condor zone the condors are still ingesting lead somehow. :eek:

How can that be? The antis claimed it was us dirty hunters leaving gut piles and dead animals all over the place that was the cause. :confused::confused:

With all the lead being gone for over 2 years now in the condor zone sumpin ain't adding up. Could this be another end run to get ammo banned? Nah, them antis wouldn't stoop that low would they?

DocSkinner
08-14-2010, 10:14 PM
The odd thing is now that everyone is shooting lead free in the condor zone the condors are still ingesting lead somehow. :eek:

How can that be? The antis claimed it was us dirty hunters leaving gut piles and dead animals all over the place that was the cause. :confused::confused:

With all the lead being gone for over 2 years now in the condor zone sumpin ain't adding up. Could this be another end run to get ammo banned? Nah, them antis wouldn't stoop that low would they?

Bans are bans - guns or lead or whatever, we all know bans are useless. But then so is expecting everyone to be responsible, so my bad as well.

RacinK6
08-15-2010, 6:02 PM
So did anybody try the non lead in 223. It may preform well in the bigger rifles but I think its crap in the 223. especially out past 150yds. IMO.

DocSkinner
08-15-2010, 7:08 PM
So did anybody try the non lead in 223. It may preform well in the bigger rifles but I think its crap in the 223. especially out past 150yds. IMO.

A twist issue? I know as someone said you should drop down some grains, as equal weight lead bullets are shorter.