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Hogxtz
08-03-2010, 12:11 AM
My brother has a registered M-16 with 30 round mags. He and I want to go shooting at Peavine Ridge, (national forest) in El Dorado County. There is a great place for shooting there. Is it legal for him to shoot his M-16 in National forest? I seem to remember seeing somewhere that it may not be legal?

We have an over zealous pine cone cop up here that likes to harass folks with with guns. I process this guys arrests for him all the time where I work. I want to be sure that I wont wind up being taken in to the very place I work, or my brother also.

Besides keeping the AW flo-chart and his registration paperwork, is there anything else to have on hand to help incase we get hassled?

Also, is it not permisable for me to shoot his weapon even if he is present because its a RAW?

Thanks in advance

professorhard
08-03-2010, 12:17 AM
Is it a RAW or actual NFA machinegun?

Sounds like its just a regular RAW AR-15 so calling it an M16 is deceiving.

Hogxtz
08-03-2010, 12:21 AM
Its just a semi-auto M-16 that is not capable of 3 round bursts.

destro360
08-03-2010, 12:27 AM
i'll join you with my ar, he'll have to take us all in haha ;) i go out to pipi valley alot where is this spot at? easily accessible? i've been dying to go shooting out that way.

professorhard
08-03-2010, 12:27 AM
Its just a semi-auto M-16 that is not capable of 3 round bursts.

So its an AR-15. You can shoot it anywhere its legal to shoot any other firearms.

stan462
08-03-2010, 12:28 AM
Its just a semi-auto M-16 that is not capable of 3 round bursts.

Then it is not a M16, and most likely a AR-15. M16 are Colt full auto that the police and military uses.

elrcastor
08-03-2010, 7:27 AM
AR-15 == Semi-Auto

M-16 == Full-Auto or 3rd burst

bwiese
08-03-2010, 8:44 AM
So its an AR-15. You can shoot it anywhere its legal to shoot any other firearms.

Bzzzzz, WRONG.

[Ordinary true "shooting ranges" should not be any problem.]

However, Registered AWs have 'specific authorized destination' requirements in the law. On open "shooting land" you'd still need express permission from the property owner etc. to shoot an AW there even if you could shoot handguns and ordinary long guns, etc. there. Ask a legitimate Party In Charge FIRST before shooting (best to get it in writing).

Transporting an AW to/using an AW on (even though legally registered) could result in a 12280PC violation for unauthorized use/transport.

[Note that this does NOT apply to OLL black rifles because such rifles are NOT AWs!!!]

Now, on true BLM land administered by BLM there is a blanket approval given in summer of 2003 by the Director of Region 5 (and which does not seem to have been rescinded) to use lawfully-registered AWs. There however may be some BLM-owned lands, or portions thereof, actually administered by CA/local agency which is separate from "real true pure BLM land", and would probably require separate expresss approval.

Also, BLM land can have 'fuzzy' borders with adjoining state lands and you could easily step outside the boundaries and be in violation - make sure you know where you are! [Remember GPS can have errors, it's not infallible.]

[And I hope to hell it's not an M16 and it doesn't have a 3rd "happy hole" in the receiver etc. That's a whole 'nuther can o' worms opened up.]

cmaynes
08-03-2010, 11:46 AM
one other point to consider with your "Pine Cone Cops" Angeles National Forest is now (according to the DEA) the biggest source of CA grown marijuana. Supposedly MS13 is a part of the gang fabric which is growing there- so, any contact you have with Park Police or BLM personnel might be a little more tense than you might expect.

You might consider going to the desert to shoot to make things more streamlined- or a commercial range.

Hogxtz
08-04-2010, 9:56 AM
Bzzzzz, WRONG.

[Ordinary true "shooting ranges" should not be any problem.]

However, Registered AWs have 'specific authorized destination' requirements in the law. On open "shooting land" you'd still need express permission from the property owner etc. to shoot an AW there even if you could shoot handguns and ordinary long guns, etc. there. Ask a legitimate Party In Charge FIRST before shooting (best to get it in writing).

Transporting an AW to/using an AW on (even though legally registered) could result in a 12280PC violation for unauthorized use/transport.

[Note that this does NOT apply to OLL black rifles because such rifles are NOT AWs!!!]


Now, on true BLM land administered by BLM there is a blanket approval given in summer of 2003 by the Director of Region 5 (and which does not seem to have been rescinded) to use lawfully-registered AWs. There however may be some BLM-owned lands, or portions thereof, actually administered by CA/local agency which is separate from "real true pure BLM land", and would probably require separate expresss approval.

Also, BLM land can have 'fuzzy' borders with adjoining state lands and you could easily step outside the boundaries and be in violation - make sure you know where you are! [Remember GPS can have errors, it's not infallible.]

[And I hope to hell it's not an M16 and it doesn't have a 3rd "happy hole" in the receiver etc. That's a whole 'nuther can o' worms opened up.]

Thank you very much Bweise. His rifle is a Bushmaster that he was required to register back when the ban came into effect. It does not have "the third happy hole" It is a straight semi-auto. I didnt know the 3 round burst was indicative of the "M-16"

So on National Forest managed by the US forest service, not the BLM, I would need to get express permission from the local forest service supervisor in the Placerville office? I'll give that a try.

Thanks again

Hogxtz
08-04-2010, 10:25 AM
one other point to consider with your "Pine Cone Cops" Angeles National Forest is now (according to the DEA) the biggest source of CA grown marijuana. Supposedly MS13 is a part of the gang fabric which is growing there- so, any contact you have with Park Police or BLM personnel might be a little more tense than you might expect.

You might consider going to the desert to shoot to make things more streamlined- or a commercial range.

Cmaynes, that's a very good tip. But I won't be pushed out of using my own public lands because law enforcement personnel are tense having to deal with ms13 scum in Angels forests. Just so ya know, the pine cone cop is a term of endearment. Just like we call chp triple A with a badge, and we are called turn keys and knuckle draggers. If I wasnt in the business, I wouldnt use that term. So it wasnt meant to be disrespectful.

bwiese
08-04-2010, 10:33 AM
Thank you very much Bweise. His rifle is a Bushmaster that he was required to register back when the ban came into effect. It does not have "the third happy hole" It is a straight semi-auto. I didnt know the 3 round burst was indicative of the "M-16"

Well 3rd burst sure as hell ain't indicative of a semiauto AR ;)


So on National Forest managed by the US forest service, not the BLM, I would need to get express permission from the local forest service supervisor in the Placerville office? I'll give that a try.

Assume this is the case just to be overcautious. CA law says you need the property owner's permission.

I will note if something went sideways in a matter like this (legally-owned AW on true owned-&-operated FEDERAL land) we may start getting into legally "fun" territory but you should NOT try to be a martyr on this.